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PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

sincover said:
So EA takes Konami's defense mechanics and makes sense of it: http://fifasoccerblog.com/blog/fifa-12-tactical-defending/

I really hope Konami steps it up in this department this year.
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Yes, EA have stolen it and made it look ridiculous. It's like watching a alien perfectly mimic someones moves with to the point precision.

Where Konami have to be worried is the impact engine. Only in that it's going to force them to really step up and deliver something on par with that in the future because people will soon grow accustom to expect this to be the standard tech for this gen.

Rest of what i've seen I'm not impressed to be blunt.
 
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kobayashi said:
Yes, EA have stolen it and made it look ridiculous. It's like watching a alien perfectly mimic someones moves with tot he point precision.

Where Konami have to be worried is the impact engine. Only in that it's going to force them to really step up and deliver something on par with that in the future because people will soon grow accustom to expect this to be the standard tech for this gen.

Rest of what i've seen I'm not impressed to be blunt.
Click to expand...

Yeah so true, looks so freaking stupid!
 
kobayashi said:
Rest of what i've seen I'm not impressed to be blunt.
Click to expand...

The impact engine does look mighty impressive, no doubt about that. But think back to the past few years where EA have introduced flashy new animations and collisions. After a couple of weeks you've seen them all and the novelty wears off. Then it's over to the underlying football game to keep you interested. That's where FIFA has always fallen flat on it's face.

I'm hoping this year is different and EA pay more attention to the basics, but I'm not holding my breath.
 
I'll drop some info though, seeing as I'm here. The collision system in FIFA 12 is very impressive, but feel response by many is a tad extreme. Visually wonderful, and tech wise a revolution, but I fear it's implementation will be overstated - much like it's animations in general.

PES 2012 won't have anything that extreme, but what it will have is a collision system that will impress. The way players fall and spin will be in colloration to where they were caught. Simply the most advanced PES has been in this generation regarding this element, but less bells and whistles.

Animations will be also be impressive, focusing on linking more than anything. Get ready to control the ball instantly, and never worry about delayed responsiveness in any situation.

To the pace of the game, and what's odd is that the screen behind Seabass in the video was weirdly quick. PES 2012 is no quicker than PES 2011. The pace element has been addressed too, quick players won't be caught. What's weird though is that quick players feel similar to PES 2011, but now slower players are just represented more believably.

Finally, last info, is that my wish has come true. The game is alive. Meaning the players respond to everything instantly, formations and positions are kept, and the feeling of everything working consistently is back.

Now, there's actually tonnes more secrets yet to be announced, some key gameplay additions changes Konami have yet to announce. I would love to hint at them, but seriously I feel E3 will be the perfect time to let these new additions be announced.

Really, really can't wait!
 
Originally Posted by kobayashi View Post
Yes, EA have stolen it and made it look ridiculous. It's like watching a alien perfectly mimic someones moves with tot he point precision.
Click to expand...

_anderson said:
Yeah so true, looks so freaking stupid!
Click to expand...

I don't get the animosity. Obviously I was referring to the implementation of the mechanic rather than how it looks. If it's consistent and easy to use (but difficult to master), then it's already far ahead of what Konami did in PES 2011. Once again I'm talking about how the mechanic is implemented so fifa's trademark superhuman animations are irrelevant.

yair12 said:
I'll drop some info though, seeing as I'm here. The collision system in FIFA 12 is very impressive, but feel response by many is a tad extreme. Visually wonderful, and tech wise a revolution, but I fear it's implementation will be overstated - much like it's animations in general.

PES 2012 won't have anything that extreme, but what it will have is a collision system that will impress. The way players fall and spin will be in colloration to where they were caught. Simply the most advanced PES has been in this generation regarding this element, but less bells and whistles.

Animations will be also be impressive, focusing on linking more than anything. Get ready to control the ball instantly, and never worry about delayed responsiveness in any situation.

To the pace of the game, and what's odd is that the screen behind Seabass in the video was weirdly quick. PES 2012 is no quicker than PES 2011. The pace element has been addressed too, quick players won't be caught. What's weird though is that quick players feel similar to PES 2011, but now slower players are just represented more believably.

Finally, last info, is that my wish has come true. The game is alive. Meaning the players respond to everything instantly, formations and positions are kept, and the feeling of everything working consistently is back.

Now, there's actually tonnes more secrets yet to be announced, some key gameplay additions changes Konami have yet to announce. I would love to hint at them, but seriously I feel E3 will be the perfect time to let these new additions be announced.

Really, really can't wait!
Click to expand...

Sounds good but where are you getting your info? Source?
 
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For me, Impact engine looks really impressive! Reminds me the Euphoria Engine, which in all PES sites speak from years for it. Well, apparently EA read more PES sites, Konami.. not :D Impatc engine looks great.
 
Lami said:
Are you playing on -1 gamespeed by any chance? Because for some odd reason it hinders with response time. For that reason alone I'm back on 0, even though I prefer -1 overall.
Click to expand...

I'm on 0. I even tried +1, but same effect.
PES 2011 had it's moment for me, but the lot of shortcomings made me frustrated. Stamina system and response time were the worst.

But inconsistent shooting, passing, bad refereeing, bad graphics on PS3, bad sounds and atmosphere stopped me to enjoy it.

Fingers crossed for a PES 5-6 HD as PES 2012 this year.
With square nets and unlimited slots for editing ;)
 
_anderson said:
He's quoting Adam.
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That's what I figured.

bonyi said:
I'm on 0. I even tried +1, but same effect.
PES 2011 had it's moment for me, but the lot of shortcomings made me frustrated. Stamina system and response time were the worst.

But inconsistent shooting, passing, bad refereeing, bad graphics on PS3, bad sounds and atmosphere stopped me to enjoy it.

Fingers crossed for a PES 5-6 HD as PES 2012 this year.
With square nets and unlimited slots for editing ;)
Click to expand...

At least we know we finally have the nets ;)
 
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Impact engine my ass, put a name on it and everyone looks at it as if it's a new feature. Seriously it is like taking the same product and saying, Oooooh did you see this? It is our supercalifragilistic engine which makes the players react in a super realistic fashion followed by a short video slowed down to the nth degree.

It almost makes as much sense as showing a players eyeball in super high resolution when it doesn't even feature once the action is underway.

I have enough hair on my nuts to say that I have seen all EA and Konamis tricks. Talk gameplay, talk football not daft catch phrases because, as Jamez stated once you get over the tickbox features and played the game days on end what keeps you hooking up for more?



That's right FOOTBALLL
 
To be honest I've seen EA do the same with Madden year after year. They add new features, throw in a load of new animations and collisions, polish up the presentation (overhauled this year apparently) - but year after year they still neglect to improve on many of the basics of American football - pretty much because they have no competition in the market since they killed off the 2K Sports rival by grabbing the exclusive licence.

I'm seeing the exact same thing happen with Fifa, so fans of that game should be thankful PES is still alive and well.
 
Jamezinho said:
To be honest I've seen EA do the same with Madden year after year. They add new features, throw in a load of new animations and collisions, polish up the presentation (overhauled this year apparently) - but year after year they still neglect to improve on many of the basics of American football - pretty much because they have no competition in the market since they killed off the 2K Sports rival by grabbing the exclusive licence.

I'm seeing the exact same thing happen with Fifa, so fans of that game should be thankful PES is still alive and well.
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+1

Anyone with some basics knowledge in economics knows competition is sometimes very necessary for us, consumers.

When Konami started PES 2008, they behave as though they were a monopoly (atrocious game, much elements took off the game etc.). They thought they could do whatever they want with the game, people would still buy it.

It can't imagine what PES 2011 would have been if there was no Fifa, and reciprocally.
 
Very well said, all three of you above.

I've stood by the same philosophy for years, I dont play Fifa, but I sure as hell dont want it to go anywhere. And regardless of what some may believe, I want Fifa to improve as much as possible year-on-year, hence the reason I actively follow the related threads on here.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Very well said, all three of you above.

I've stood by the same philosophy for years, I dont play Fifa, but I sure as hell dont want it to go anywhere. And regardless of what some may believe, I want Fifa to improve as much as possible year-on-year, hence the reason I actively follow the related threads on here.
Click to expand...

We all want FIFA to improve, even if it seems very unlikely it will, we try anyway to give them advice.
 
Hopefully one day we'll have much more football titles for more competition just like the old days. Tbh its becoming a bit boring this dual-monopoly.
 
Both have such solid base for their respective philosophies, and long-standing experience in the genre though Lami. I struggle to see anyone coming along and being able to match either Konami or EA in their current specific areas of expertise. I personally dont believe we need another company, we have the best of both worlds at present for the most part.
 
Still you never know what other companies can bring to the table mate. New people, new ideas, even if they don't turn out to be as competitive. Their ideas might be a fresh addition to us customers and probably add something both Konami and EA never thought of.
 
Lami said:
Hopefully one day we'll have much more football titles for more competition just like the old days. Tbh its becoming a bit boring this dual-monopoly.
Click to expand...

I have to agree, this duopoly is not an optimum situation in a long-term horizon. I don't think there would be any sort of collusion between them, but the fact there's only two competitors is already a problem for stuff such as licenses.

As for the innovation part, the risk is both firms develop a tacit armistice due to the rigidity and stability of their respective market share over the years.
(by rigidity I mean no possibility to grab a significant share from their competitor)
 
Lami said:
Still you never know what other companies can bring to the table mate. New people, new ideas, even if they don't turn out to be as competitive. Their ideas might be a fresh addition to us customers and probably add something both Konami and EA never thought of.
Click to expand...

Yep, very true. Good point.
 
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