PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

aitken said:
much different from xbox? going to give it a bash once pc is finally set up
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It doesn't feel like a totally different game. Essentially the gameplay is very similar although Yair and Jenkey's gameplay tools tweak a few things. The main thing is the game looks and feels smoother when it can be run at 1080p and a higher refresh rate on the PC. The patches add a lot to the game.
 
spektarm said:
Has anybody else scored with a "rabona" kick (but not by going past the keeper to an open goal)? :D

Last night I was having a go with the new patch, playing the group stage of the Euro 2012 with Germany and I scored an absolute peach with Podolski. Haven't seen something like that in PES 2012 until now (maybe because I'm not playing it so often but still, a magnificent strike). The animation looked spot on too. :CONFUSE:
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YouTube - Goal with a rabona shot by Podolski [PES 2012 - PC]
 
This game is fucking brutal, pardon my french.

I started a league with the dutch this afternoon, as Ajax and fuck me i nearly put the controller through the tv.

I like the game, its got some good stuff in it, but for crying out load what is with the fucking brutal a.i in this game? Its unrelenting, crucifying and its bloody annoying.

First game i lost 2-0 to Ado. Ok so i thought bad start but ill carry on. Played Feyenoord next and lost 3-0 with their keeper being unbeatable and my defence switching off on a few corners. Two easy games next i thought so id carry on.

How wrong i was. i battered De Graftschapp and lost 1-0 when my whole defence just stopped and allowed an easy run through. Once the lead was established they just all sat back, every single one of them behind the ball. but oh thats ok they had babingida as the super human ronaldo to run 80 yards with the ball.

Then i played Nec, who had every fucker behind the ball, and lo and behold, suckered me on a corner with a header.

So i had to turn it off before the HD tv met its maker.

On the whole this game is fucking unfair. Im extremely wound up. The computer is a cheat. It cheats because it maintains its momentum throughout, has no stamina issues and can out run and out pace any of your players when it wants to. When it wants to it can make an easy pass from you turn into a nightmare, or your player mis control a simple pass.

Why cant your players move into space? Why do i need to trigger runs? Its bloody hard when you are in possesion to make players move for you, whilst the cpu trigger runs all over the shop.

And the less said about the camera angle in the corners on broadcast the better, a bloody stupid idea right there.
 
Dryzer said:
This game is fucking brutal, pardon my french.

I started a league with the dutch this afternoon, as Ajax and fuck me i nearly put the controller through the tv.

I like the game, its got some good stuff in it, but for crying out load what is with the fucking brutal a.i in this game? Its unrelenting, crucifying and its bloody annoying.

First game i lost 2-0 to Ado. Ok so i thought bad start but ill carry on. Played Feyenoord next and lost 3-0 with their keeper being unbeatable and my defence switching off on a few corners. Two easy games next i thought so id carry on.

How wrong i was. i battered De Graftschapp and lost 1-0 when my whole defence just stopped and allowed an easy run through. Once the lead was established they just all sat back, every single one of them behind the ball. but oh thats ok they had babingida as the super human ronaldo to run 80 yards with the ball.

Then i played Nec, who had every fucker behind the ball, and lo and behold, suckered me on a corner with a header.

So i had to turn it off before the HD tv met its maker.

On the whole this game is fucking unfair. Im extremely wound up. The computer is a cheat. It cheats because it maintains its momentum throughout, has no stamina issues and can out run and out pace any of your players when it wants to. When it wants to it can make an easy pass from you turn into a nightmare, or your player mis control a simple pass.

Why cant your players move into space? Why do i need to trigger runs? Its bloody hard when you are in possesion to make players move for you, whilst the cpu trigger runs all over the shop.

And the less said about the camera angle in the corners on broadcast the better, a bloody stupid idea right there.
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This is the reason I don't play the game any more Dryzer. I don't mind playing against teams playing "park the bus" defence. But when those said teams are able to double up on you and run you all over the pitch without suffering any effects on their stamina it's sickening.

I mean look at Spain against Ireland the other night. Spain kept the ball for the vast majority of the match. Playing short pass after short pass and making Ireland chase everything. By the 80th minute Ireland were dead on their feet. It's simply something I don't see in PES 2012 and I hope it's rectified in the next game.
 
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Just for the record...18 games played, drew 2, lost 16, won 0.

scored 2 goals.

Unbelievable cheating going on in every single game. Play an exhibition with the same teams and its not as apparent.

Hope they sort that crap out for 13 because it ruins what could be an outstanding game.
 
Evil Heat said:
This is the reason I don't play the game any more Dryzer. I don't mind playing against teams playing "park the bus" defence. But when those said teams are able to double up on you and run you all over the pitch without suffering any effects on their stamina it's sickening.

I mean look at Spain against Ireland the other night. Spain kept the ball for the vast majority of the match. Playing short pass after short pass and making Ireland chase everything. By the 80th minute Ireland were dead on their feet. It's simply something I don't see in PES 2012 and I hope it's rectified in the next game.
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Im with you mate. i was really gonna enjoy playing a league, managing the stamina issue and trying to win the comp, but i'm afraid its just not possible. It is without doubt one of the hardest games i've ever played. my hands are like claws and my mouth is blue from swearing.
 
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What difficulty level are you guys playing on?

It's unrelentingly brutal, that's for sure. I near on had a complete game-related meltdown a few weeks back when I was seven points clear at the top of Div2 in my ML campaign, only for the game to pretty much go into overdrive for a good 15 games or so, and I think I only won something like 2 out of those 15, and finished conveniently just outside the promotion places.

Oddly, I get hammered in friendlies these days, but in my ML I restarted after a good break from the game, hammered the game in a weekend and ended up winning the league! Really, really bizarre.

Nevertheless, there were still moments where the CPU would go crazy and score at will. Even though I won the league there was never a point where I actually felt in full control of what was going on, certainly defensively.

BUT, and this will make me sound crazy as anything, but I've noticed that if you play a match, especially in ML with the formation and tactics set up in your gameplan as default, then the game becomes crazy hard. I've found that creating my own tactics/formation then not changing them until the very last moment before kick-off seems to make the CPU far less of a challenge. Sounds ridiculous, I know, but I swear the game feels easier that way.

I tried it in my ML, setting my tactics in the gameplan screen in the menu options, and the game was a nightmare. If I leave the tactics as default, then change them right before kick-off, it seems to throw the CPU. Maybe it's just a placebo but I wouldn't put it past Konami to have the game full-on read all your tactics and adjust accordingly if you play with them set to default.

Sounds crazy and it probably is, but hey, it's working for me!
 
Dryzer said:
Just for the record...18 games played, drew 2, lost 16, won 0.

scored 2 goals.

Unbelievable cheating going on in every single game. Play an exhibition with the same teams and its not as apparent.

Hope they sort that crap out for 13 because it ruins what could be an outstanding game.
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Sounds like you're playing on Top Player/Superstar.

Play on Regular or Professional for a more rounded experience.

If your PES pride won't let you play on those levels, you can't really complain about the game being at fault. You're at fault.

The game on Top Player/Superstar is what it is – brutal, as you say. You've got to do your time on Regular/Professional. Don't want to? Your choice.
 
Keith Houchen said:
Sounds like you're playing on Top Player/Superstar.

Play on Regular or Professional for a more rounded experience.

If your PES pride won't let you play on those levels, you can't really complain about the game being at fault. You're at fault.

The game on Top Player/Superstar is what it is – brutal, as you say. You've got to do your time on Regular/Professional. Don't want to? Your choice.
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Mate thats on professional!

Im ok in friendlies/exhibition.

I put it on this morning fresh and continued from my save. Played hercules from eredesvie in a league game. Battered them for the first quarter of the half, then against the run of play they hit a shot on the edge of the box, not hard, it took a soft deflection and straight to my keeper who should have just caught it, but instead, incredibly parried it RIGHT to an onrushing attacker to dive head in.

It really was blatent. You get the feeling the a.i is toying with you but once they get the ball you get anxious as they do some really buggered up crap to tip the balance.

yesterday i conceeded a penalty. I saved the penalty and it went to a corner. I said to myself as the cpu prepared to take the corner taht it would make up for the miss. And lo and behold they whipped it in and they bulleted it in!

Maybe im going mad.
 
LTFC said:
What difficulty level are you guys playing on?

It's unrelentingly brutal, that's for sure. I near on had a complete game-related meltdown a few weeks back when I was seven points clear at the top of Div2 in my ML campaign, only for the game to pretty much go into overdrive for a good 15 games or so, and I think I only won something like 2 out of those 15, and finished conveniently just outside the promotion places.

Oddly, I get hammered in friendlies these days, but in my ML I restarted after a good break from the game, hammered the game in a weekend and ended up winning the league! Really, really bizarre.

Nevertheless, there were still moments where the CPU would go crazy and score at will. Even though I won the league there was never a point where I actually felt in full control of what was going on, certainly defensively.

BUT, and this will make me sound crazy as anything, but I've noticed that if you play a match, especially in ML with the formation and tactics set up in your gameplan as default, then the game becomes crazy hard. I've found that creating my own tactics/formation then not changing them until the very last moment before kick-off seems to make the CPU far less of a challenge. Sounds ridiculous, I know, but I swear the game feels easier that way.

I tried it in my ML, setting my tactics in the gameplan screen in the menu options, and the game was a nightmare. If I leave the tactics as default, then change them right before kick-off, it seems to throw the CPU. Maybe it's just a placebo but I wouldn't put it past Konami to have the game full-on read all your tactics and adjust accordingly if you play with them set to default.

Sounds crazy and it probably is, but hey, it's working for me!
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Ill try that mate
 
Yep, that actually has worked for me since 2010. It seems to me that if you use a certain formation for too many games, the CPU will learn your formation and somehow it can outsmart you tactically. But, if you change tactics mid-game, and supposedly before the match, the CPU can't figure this out. You're not crazy LTFC...
 
Ah that's good to know! I personally use the same formation and tactics but swear the AI learns how to defend against this by learning it through the tactics screen if you set it as that team's set tactic like you say.

I pretty much view setting your tactics in the gameplan menu in the ML player hub as a gateway to the AI being able to read your tactics. I think there's something in that, the AI basically learns your tactics in that. Instead, I only load my tactics and formation in the gameplan screen immediately before going to the match, in the screen where you choose kits etc. I never, ever set my regular formation in the general menu as my team's default, I did this in my last ML and I fell straight away from top of the league to winning just 2 in 15 games.
 
LTFC said:
What difficulty level are you guys playing on?

It's unrelentingly brutal, that's for sure. I near on had a complete game-related meltdown a few weeks back when I was seven points clear at the top of Div2 in my ML campaign, only for the game to pretty much go into overdrive for a good 15 games or so, and I think I only won something like 2 out of those 15, and finished conveniently just outside the promotion places.

Oddly, I get hammered in friendlies these days, but in my ML I restarted after a good break from the game, hammered the game in a weekend and ended up winning the league! Really, really bizarre.

Nevertheless, there were still moments where the CPU would go crazy and score at will. Even though I won the league there was never a point where I actually felt in full control of what was going on, certainly defensively.

BUT, and this will make me sound crazy as anything, but I've noticed that if you play a match, especially in ML with the formation and tactics set up in your gameplan as default, then the game becomes crazy hard. I've found that creating my own tactics/formation then not changing them until the very last moment before kick-off seems to make the CPU far less of a challenge. Sounds ridiculous, I know, but I swear the game feels easier that way.

I tried it in my ML, setting my tactics in the gameplan screen in the menu options, and the game was a nightmare. If I leave the tactics as default, then change them right before kick-off, it seems to throw the CPU. Maybe it's just a placebo but I wouldn't put it past Konami to have the game full-on read all your tactics and adjust accordingly if you play with them set to default.

Sounds crazy and it probably is, but hey, it's working for me!
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Haven't you sold your PES2012 last week? :CONFUSE:
 
Was going to at one point but decided its the only football game I have to play until PES2013 so I just gotta put up with the flaws.
 
tc811 said:
Yep, that actually has worked for me since 2010. It seems to me that if you use a certain formation for too many games, the CPU will learn your formation and somehow it can outsmart you tactically. But, if you change tactics mid-game, and supposedly before the match, the CPU can't figure this out. You're not crazy LTFC...
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This.

I've been saying this since PES 2010, you have to mix it up if things are not going well. People will laugh at the whole 'Teamvision 2' thing, but I really do believe in it. Konami are not in the business of gimmicks for the most part, and if they state that they have 'code' in place, then I'm not going to dispute that.

I've had far too many instances in my ML over the years to warrant their claim in that regard.
 
Is it best to use accumalative fatique? Does that put you at more of a disadvantage than normal? what do people think?

I think theres some validity in the setup formation claims as i tried it last night. worked a little better.

Still doesnt stop stupid scripting though.
 
Accumulated fatigue is certainly the most realistic option, and the only option for me.

As for 'Scripting', it's only 'Scripting' if you convince yourself it is. Otherwise, it's just football.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Accumulated fatigue is certainly the most realistic option, and the only option for me.

As for 'Scripting', it's only 'Scripting' if you convince yourself it is. Otherwise, it's just football.
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Dont agree with that Jim. In some instances yes. in most instances the ball is 'attracted' to the cpu so to speak. But i guess opinions will vary.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Accumulated fatigue is certainly the most realistic option, and the only option for me.

As for 'Scripting', it's only 'Scripting' if you convince yourself it is. Otherwise, it's just football.
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how can you deny there is scripting in pes 2012?

it's so obvious sometimes you have to be blind to not see it

like ad75 said, many times the ball is attracted to the cpu and collision system just don't work to give cpu an advantage while dribbling through your defence
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Accumulated fatigue is certainly the most realistic option, and the only option for me.
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Accumulated fatigue is implemented quite realistically in FL modes. However, implementation in league/cup modes is beyond joke ... and it hasn't changed for the last 2 or 3 years.
 
Yep, disappointingly i had to give up on the league mode, even though i was desperate to play a league season.

It really is night and day compared to exhibition matches which are far more balanced and enjoyable. In league mode it becomes a kick n rush pressure fest, full of script like events, its really horrible.

Ah well.
 
The other day I played with Chelsea, champions league, and the game overall was very enjoyale, despite the fact that I did conceded those goals that I felt cheated, but I played nice, I had some decent space to work with the ball and my attacking plays were very creative, the game was reasonably fair. There were those brilliant moments that I thought... wow, this is one of the best games ever, so unpredictale and things made sense, it made sense why that certain pass did not reach my target player, I knew I really did this or that in a wrong way, and there were those moments where I created good attacking plays out of nothing and I surprised the CPU, and the fight for ball possession never felt so realistic at times and very fair...

But then I decided to play this game today with Man United in champions League and... omfg! What a piece of shit this game can turn to be... this is the day that i thought to myself after around 4 matches: it's not a day to play PES, I won't stress because of that garbage experience and super artificial and unfair CPU.

Man... ALL games I played today were those games that every fucking piece of space were instantly recovered, CPU players could recover instantly every gap left, in fact I think there was no space at all, my players could not anticipate to any loose ball and could not fight for the ball possession in a fair way (come on, we already have to press the stupid super cancel every fucking time to go on to the ball, unlike CPU). And the pressure... Jesus Christ, there was always a man right in front of me and another one running at my back, 2-1 challenges almost every time. I hate how CPU attacking players are always going back and pressuring from behind so quickly and easily, ALWAYS.

The middle of the CPU area was impenetrable, i was so limited to attack only through the wings to try to get a cross and there was no other way around.

And what about CPU attack ? It has never been so direct... ridiculous passing skills with stupid high accuracy and at time passes were made at a speed as if the the field had no friction (like playing on ice, only for CPU, of course), so ridiculously unalanced as I only play with 0 bar, and CPU was just passing forward and players all dribling better than Messi. My back line was ridiculous as well...

The experience today was simply disgusting to say te least. I'm getting sick of this terrible inconsistency of this game. It gives me chills to put the disc on my PS3, you don't know if the game is willing to make you feel like the worst player on earth or not... thank God this is just not me.
 
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DuduBR9 said:
The other day I played with Chelsea, champions league, and the game overall was very enjoyale, despite the fact that I did conceded those goals that I felt cheated, but I played nice, I had some decent space to work with the ball and my attacking plays were very creative, the game was reasonably fair. There were those brilliant moments that I thought... wow, this is one of the best games ever, so unpredictale and things made sense, it made sense why that certain pass did not reach my target player, I knew I really did this or that in a wrong way, and there were those moments where I created good attacking plays out of nothing and I surprised the CPU, and the fight for ball possession never felt so realistic at times and very fair...

But then I decided to play this game today with Man United in champions League and... omfg! What a piece of shit this game can turn to be... this is the day that i thought to myself after around 4 matches: it's not a day to play PES, I won't stress because of that garbage experience and super artificial and unfair CPU.

Man... ALL games I played today were those games that every fucking piece of space were instantly recovered, CPU players could recover instantly every gap left, in fact I think there was no space at all, my players could not anticipate to any loose ball and could not fight for the ball possession in a fair way (come on, we already have to press the stupid super cancel every fucking time to go on to the ball, unlike CPU). And the pressure... Jesus Christ, there was always a man right in front of me and another one running at my back, 2-1 challenges almost every time. I hate how CPU attacking players are always going back and pressuring from behind so quickly and easily, ALWAYS.

The middle of the CPU area was impenetrable, i was so limited to attack only through the wings to try to get a cross and there was no other way around.

And what about CPU attack ? It has never been so direct... ridiculous passing skills with stupid high accuracy and at time passes were made at a speed as if the the field has no friction (like playing on ice, only for CPU, of course), so ridiculously unalanced as I only play with 0 bar, and CPU was just passing forward and players all dribling better than Messi. My back line was ridiculous as well...

The experience today was simply disgusting to say te least. I'm getting sick of this terrible inconsistency of this game. It gives me chills to put the disc on my PS3, you don't know if the game is willing to make you feel the worst player on earth or not... thank God this is just not me.
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I have the same experience when i play a WC. I'm not sure whether this is due to my team being completely blue and the cpu mostly on orange/red form. But yeah it can be very inconsistent i agree
 
amier said:
I have the same experience when i play a WC. I'm not sure whether this is due to my team being completely blue and the cpu mostly on orange/red form. But yeah it can be very inconsistent i agree
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Completely blue and the other orange/red ? How's that ? How can this afect gameplay an the way CPU play ? :CONFUSE:
 
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I've been playing ML, got promoted to the Portuguese League (the top division) and the difference between that and Div2 is remarkable, in a bad way. In a really, really bad way in fact.

For starters, my previous season in Div2 felt balanced, the AI was defensive but not too defensive, and though I won promotion it was a struggle. I anticipated that in the next league up, the jump in standard would be jarring, that I'd be getting thrashed week by week, but frankly that's not happening.

What IS happening, however, is that the CPU is ten times more defensive, ten times worse for defensive pressure, and ten times worse for being lethal on the counter attack. Rather than thrash me with free flowing football, the CPU merely sits back, allows itself to take a pounding, then hits you on the break. I know this has been a common complaint with most people, but going up a league in ML takes this to bizarre heights.

The relentless pressing, for example, is now at a level I didn't even know the game could manage. Trying to build an attack with 2-3 forwards in their penalty area is still impossible because you're half the time trying to thread a pinpoint pass through an absolute sea of defenders, all crammed into a tiny area. Most of the time I end up pausing and counting at least 10 players in open play all getting back into their area, which is something I didn't see from the supposedly 'lesser' teams in Div2.

The standard of football the CPU plays is absolutely no better than the worse teams, the only difference I can tell to create the illusion of teams being 'better' is by making the better teams press harder, run faster, and take 99% of any rare chances they have in front of goal. I mean I just drew a game 2-2 in ML, and the game was a microcosm of PES' problems. The stats finished 70-30 in terms of possession, 12 shots to the CPU's 3, and it finished 2-2. I scored in the first minute of the game, only to get pinned back to 1-1 almost immediately by the CPU crashing in a header from a corner, something you can't stop. I tracked the player, but the game just made it's own player outjump yours. Nothing you can do. It then went up and counter attacked, scoring it's second attack of the game, followed by me pretty much strafing the edge of the CPU's deep and packed defence, trying to thread a ball through. It's very rare that the CPU allows you to get in behind the defence because it simply refuses to budge. And that's really unrealistic.

So I'm not sure whether to carry on with my ML, I loved the first season, winning promotion but still feeling like it was a struggle, and I don't mind then going up a level and being out-passed, pinned back, outplayed by teams with better players than my ML team I've so far managed to assemble. But it doesn't feel like that. It feels like I'm even more superior in terms of chance creation and possession than the game, but that the game frankly dicks you over with dodgy shots (seriously, I had a near open goal, I pushed down on the stick to hit it in one corner, the shot went in the complete opposite direction to where I aimed and missed), ropey deflections and overly brutal CPU finishing. Being repeatedly hit on the counter attack, over and over again, doesn't warrant the idea that this is just the way it goes in football, because this is the way it ALWAYS goes in PES. No team in the world dominates every game they play then get done over against the run of play, every single time, week in week out. That's not just the rub of the green, it's deliberate AI coding to simulate difficulty. It is a game, after all.

But I did enjoy my ML season immensely, so I can still say I've got my money's worth as one ML season racks up more game time than most single player games, and I'll give the second season a go, but I'm increasingly hoping PES2013 can really rectify a lot of these issues.
 
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