PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Konami have completely ruined the graphics this year. The PC version looks terrible in comparison to last years. Everything's a horrible blurry mess. I thought it might be sorted in Demo 2, but clearly not
 
The PES Messiah said if you liked demo 1 you will be blown away by demo 2. I played 2 games and found it to be worse. The thing where you pass into space for a player and it will select the wrong man happened more frequently. The dribbling was strange, I would be jogging along and all of a sudden the controlled player would use a quick spurt of R1 by himself. Defending feels more automated with players sticking out a leg to tackle by themselves... ALOT.
Obviously need to play more but at the moment I will be playing Demo 1 for a year :CONFUSE:

Tried out FIFA yet Jimmy?
 
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Maybe with the amount of coding that goes into the superlative AI, they had to sacrifice some memory for the graphics side. Frankly, I'll take it if it means better gameplay.

Its just like racing games for anyone who plays simulations. The like of Forza and Gran Turismo look amazing, but in terms of physics, they don't compare to the likes of iRacing, the SIMBIN games, rFactor etc., whose graphics are poorer in comparison.
 
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Jimmy G-Force said:
I've not had much time to play it Rod, only managed two games so far. :(

Quick Impressions -

A.I. is even better, no question. Movement off the ball is up another notch.

Passing on Zero is much better, much more contextual error with lesser players, especially defenders. You need to be very precise but even that isnt guaranteed for even the simple 10 yard passes along the deck.

Shooting has been improved again, more zip. My first goal with America Club was a stunning 30 yard strike. Fundamentals were perfect, flight of the ball stayed low but still dipped. Class.

Agility has been toned down across the board, much better, but I expected that.

Dribbling is better with contextual error for lesser players. I'm sure you alured to that, and I'm positive it's coded that way. If it is, I'm very happy. I tried a dribble with slight movements of the stick and R2 with the Americas striker, and he screwed it up. But the way he screwed it up looked like classic mis-control.

It's more fluid everywhere and alot tighter as mentioned.

Keepers have pulled off some amazing saves in just those two games.

1-2's are alot better it seems, although not enough to prove glitchy.

Pace feels better at '0'.

Individuality improved compared to Demo 1, DMF took a big touch to turn, not Oil-Tanker-esque, but just right so the feeling was defined.

I like how the '0' Passing assist requires power for the pass, much like PES 11 but better. It feels more free and natural as the ball isnt always stroked directly to feet, but a yard either side on occasions. Much more realistic.

Hopefully the PES Demo 2 will be out later, I like to know who the players are for reference. Only then so I do totally start to feel the bond and association. Also, it's too tricky for me to create my set-up as I like it in Jap.

Also, the Presets last night I added Preset 3, All-Out-Defend with a 4-2-2-1. Outstanding for a quick change on the fly when required, and with all the players taking their pre-specified roles. This will be massive.
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Excellent read, and you wrote all this after 2 games!!
Thanks dude
 
Ern Dog said:
Defending feels more automated with players sticking out a leg to tackle by themselves... ALOT.
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It's the defensive AI which is stat related. Remember when I said the X button is no longer a tackle button but a 'force pressure' button, and you manually control the pressure with the left stick.

I found it to be strange at first that the cpu was auto-tackling, but understood this is part of the revolutionary AI. It gives you the freedom to control the positioning and timing, and then the defence stat takes into account when to stick its leg out, with additional elements coming into play such as momentum, inertia, body balance, player speed, ball physics. You cal also notice the individuality in the sense that those with a higher defence stat are much more likely to win the ball, or at least disrupt the opponent's flow.
 
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shorty alien said:
Maybe with the amount of coding that goes into the superlative AI, they had to sacrifice some memory for the graphics side. Frankly, I'll take it if it means better gameplay.

Its just like racing games for anyone who plays simulations. The like of Forza and Gran Turismo look amazing, but in terms of physics, they don't compare to the likes of iRacing, the SIMBIN games, rFactor etc., whose graphics are poorer in comparison.
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In consumer POV though. Sorry, i have to say LEGO pirates of carribien games is much clearer. :JAY:

I still there should not be any reason for this blur widecam to exist :RANT:
 
Play it more - there is no way the second demo is worse!

Except for one thing - there does seem to be a bug, at least on the 360 (you on the 360? or PC?) which causes this weird random movement of its own accord. I've found a workaround (hardly idea) by plugging in a second controller and pressing start on the menu with that - cuts out a few weird little issues I'd noticed actually. Rather big bug.
 
twoodster said:
Konami have completely ruined the graphics this year. The PC version looks terrible in comparison to last years. Everything's a horrible blurry mess. I thought it might be sorted in Demo 2, but clearly not
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Just wait for the inevitable LOD config to emerge, problem solved.
 
Rodelero said:
Except for one thing - there does seem to be a bug, at least on the 360 (you on the 360? or PC?) which causes this weird random movement of its own accord. I've found a workaround (hardly idea) by plugging in a second controller and pressing start on the menu with that - cuts out a few weird little issues I'd noticed actually. Rather big bug.
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Is this what I was talking about? Where the player will suddenly R1 automatically? I am on PS3 by the way.
 
Need to somehow numb the pain in my thumb so I can keep playing...

By the way, how is it the referee still doesn't go back to a foul after the advantage has been played and book the player?
 
Maybe Konami felt the player individuality wasn't clear enough in the first demo and ramped it up so far that the controlled players override the input. Wouldn't be the first time they "fix" something by taking it too far in the opposite direction :P
 
Not bothered with FIFA Tom, I read things that put me off even bothering to download it. Not my particular brand of vodka, never will be.
 
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Just finished my first two games and yes the second demo is far more polished, passing on one bar takes a bit of getting used to after being tweaked from demo 1, before you tapping the pass button still gave you a full power, full speed pass to whomever, now, it's far more consistant, i have to fill up the meter considerably to reach a target with decent speed.

My only gripe however, is that 'keepers still feel unreliable in relation to shots close to thier body, so frustrating to concede knowing full well that your keeper should have dealt with it.

A.I on top player is frightningly sophisticated.
 
Historically Winning Eleven is different to PES with WE being a tweaked & better version; more measured and better pacing. One can set themselves up for disappointment thinking one is like the other.

Getting my first taste of PES 2012 with this demo 2, on PS3 - intriguing.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Not bothered with FIFA Tom, I read things that put me off to even bother downloading it. Not my particular brand of vodka, never will be.
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No offense but that's pretty silly mate. FIFA has gotten better as time has gone on and it's not that different from PES these days. It's certainly not the arcade-fest that it used to be and it's well worth a try at the least.
 
shorty alien said:
It's the defensive AI which is stat related. Remember when I said the X button is no longer a tackle button but a 'force pressure' button, and you manually control the pressure with the left stick.

I found it to be strange at first that the cpu was auto-tackling, but understood this is part of the revolutionary AI. It gives you the freedom to control the positioning and timing, and then the defence stat takes into account when to stick its leg out, with additional elements coming into play such as momentum, inertia, body balance, player speed, ball physics. You cal also notice the individuality in the sense that those with a higher defence stat are much more likely to win the ball, or at least disrupt the opponent's flow.
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Im going to try this demo again and give it a fair go but I could not disagree more with this statement if indeed it is true..auto-tackling is not revolutionary AI. I don't want the computer tackling for me. That was one thing terrible in FIFA 11 as well as a many more things. Thankfully gone in FIFA 12
 
That's not the case though. The player sticks his foot into the tackle automatically so to speak, but all the other aspects described, like positioning, timing etc are all key to whether the tackle is successful or missed. It's far more sophisticated than the tackling in the FIFA12 demo. Far, far more.
 
DagsJT said:
No offense but that's pretty silly mate. FIFA has gotten better as time has gone on and it's not that different from PES these days. It's certainly not the arcade-fest that it used to be and it's well worth a try at the least.
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It's just not me Dags, never been a fan. I'm very happy with what I have. The whole inertia thing put me off, and it's not a philosophy I subscribe to. I genuinely hope the fans of the series love it though, that's all want, people to enjoy football with whatever floats their own preferred boat. :)
 
Turn all the auto stuff off problem solved...
Such a shame I aint got no time for pes and fifa demo gonna be busy over the next four days :(, can't even do a late one tonight got to be up proper early...

Another thing anyone does the personal data reset after every game?
 
I played only one match and then i went bed last night. Very hard to judge from just one game, things that had been improved will be more evident the more i play.

I noticed that long ground passes are improved significantly, you have much more control over the power of the passes, ball physics are lot less floaty. I made just one long air ball pass but it felt great. Shooting is clearly improved as well. I din't shoot too much, so i couldn't see how improved are the keepers, but shooting is fantastic from what i saw so far.

I beat inter playin as Bayer (1 x 0), i dominated the game and it was easier thean it used to be tbh.

As i said, i played just one match. I noticed that the AI was improved defensively in the midfield. At least playing with bayer i love how good they position themsleves in the midfield
 
Sabac Red said:
Turn all the auto stuff off problem solved...
Such a shame I aint got no time for pes and fifa demo gonna be busy over the next four days :(, can't even do a late one tonight got to be up proper early...

Another thing anyone does the personal data reset after every game?
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Yup, pretty annoying, that in this day and age, with everyone having thier own personal preferences, that they can't at least give us the option of saving our settings.

Same goes for EA and thier FIFA 12 demo, they did it last though, can't understand leaving it out this time..
 
Got around the weird turning-90-degrees-on-its-own bug issue, assuming it's not in the final build (surely it can't be, that would be ridiculous) and just enjoying myself. Keepers are definitely still not good enough - they are around the level of PES 2011's keepers which frankly feels worse than they were in the preview code I played. Fingers crossed (word is there will be a patch to improve them further).

Keepers really need a trio of changes - first I think their reactions need to be increased just a tiny bit - second they need to stop palming it straight back out, ruddy hate that, they aren't holding it enough and when they don't hold they should be attempting to parry it around the post or at least away from the central part of the penalty area.

Playing some great football
Scoring some great goals

Can't wait to play it come Oct 14th.
 
Speaking of keepers, I was the keeper pull off a brilliant looking save earlier. Shot flying into the top corner and he jumped and looked like he arched his back and flung his palm out last second to push it around the post. Looked so realistic :D
 
Not seeing this foot-in issue of which people refer. The defenders have always put a foot in when using R2 and X if the ball-carrier move's in range. Better defenders win the back easier and fairer. Lesser defenders and strikers seem to concede niggly free-kicks. I like that.

Just playing my 3rd game now. I will write as I find. Loving how you need to weight your passes with these Copa Teams on '0' Pass Assist. Little touch-off's and subtle flicks around the back from close range feel great. As does long passes along the deck when judged right. Better passes have more assistance in this regard to. Alot better than Demo 1.

The A.I keeps doing me with this very subtle drop of shoulder, not seen that animation before, so deft, yet so realistic and relevant. The CPU Ai has also just attempted to score via a back-heel. But this is a new animation to, I can tell by the body posture and arm placement. It's spot on. It's not the heel-flick backheel that Ibra scored, but one that's known in the game as a 'Help it on' Backheel. The animation nailed it for me. They didnt score from it, but it looked more realistic because of that due to the fact in real-life you need to be fully aware of your line, it's harder with those type as you cant alter the direction. It's a straight forward-back technique, no twisting of the ankle. Very impressed with it. Love how he bends his arm as well for the balance in technique, perfect.

YouTube - CPU Ai 'Help It On Backheel'

Not come across any issues yet, the game plays like a dream for me.
 
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Sabac Red said:
Turn all the auto stuff off problem solved...
Such a shame I aint got no time for pes and fifa demo gonna be busy over the next four days :(, can't even do a late one tonight got to be up proper early...

Another thing anyone does the personal data reset after every game?
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No it saves now, thank fuck. I have an avatar and everything. :SMUG: :LOL:

I cant believe how many new and relevant animations have been added to Demo 2, I've seen so many new ones in all area's but especially passing in just 3 games. Its reminding of those old PS2 days when something new seemed to pop-up every 5 minutes.

I loved Demo 1, but this is an entirely new animal altogether. With the Copa Teams on '0', this is the best passing system I have ever had the pleasure to experience. I love the way the ball isnt always hit direct to player, sometimes arcing in, or dropping short with the bounce. Truly brilliant.
 
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