Manchester United Thread

Moyes is still way too conservative. Imagine a side with RvP, Rooney, Mata, Januzaj/Kagawa as the front 4 with Cleverly and Carrick behind (or a better DMF). That way the team have a nice passer in the middle and the front 4 can constantly change positions to mess with the other team's defensive tactics. Very nice free flowing football to be played.

But regardless, it is always nice to get a win. Just felt we could've won better. Still very shaky in the middle of the park (well, Giggs and Jones is part of the reason) and even though Young scored a cracker, I still think most of his play last night was horrible. Poor Passes, not tracking back to defense....
 
It's interesting - Ole set his team out to play quite similar to Swansea and Sunderland in their recent successes at OT. And that largely involves 'taking the sting' out of the game to the highest degree I've ever seen.

I'll try to dig out a heat map, but basically Cardiff passed between the back 4 and Medel for at least 2 minutes before even trying to venture over their own half way line. All match, even when down 2-0. Swansea did that too, and then scored from one of their two attempts. And then Sunderland of course scored from their one and only shot on target in 120 minutes.

It's a very interesting tactic, not one I've seen before. Basically teams set up to bore United and the fans into making a defensive mistake. And it seems to be working.

There was a point in the first half when Cardiff had had 65% of posesssion, but not a touch in United's final third. It's all very strange to me, seems like the anti-premier league!
 
It would have probably worked if we didn't have Van Persie and our shiny new signing.

Spurs dropping points did us some good today.
 
WxkN
:LMAO:

Looking forward to todays game.
 
One really has to just wonder what poor David Moyes did to deserve his luck.

- Lose both centre backs in the first half, meaning your only midfielder has to play there
- Concede from Stoke's first attack, much less shot, on a huge deflection
- Concede a second from Arnautovic having an air shot, then perfectly setting up Adam when the ball richoet's off his standing leg

I don't know what to say. Stoke weren't terrible, but they basically defended and fouled the whole time. And the weather meant playing actual football was almost impossible - couldn't even take corners cause the ball would roll away in the wind.

But still, David Moyes - why does God hate you?
 
RvP one chance: one goal, and in some ways our best defender during the time he was on the pitch. Mata was the only one creating anything worthwhile..or tried to. Everybody else was crap..especially Rooney unfortunately. Moyes is frustrating to watch on the sideline..i wouldnt feel motivated to perform with that depressed face standing on the sideline like a sack of potatoes.
 
I'm done with Evra. Great servant for the club, but the sheer lack of effort he is putting in this days makes me want to see us try a reserve player or something.

Evra was caught offside 3 times. The left back. We all know he basically stopped defending 2 seasons ago, but to be so lazy in attack and break down our momentum is unforgiveable.

Our record now reads 11W 1D 1L.
 
If a manager at any other club lost 6 of 9 matches he'd be fired.

We're somewhat admirable, but we're doing it with the wrong man.

We have some phenomenal talent in the squad (RVP, Rooney, Mata, Janujaz etc) and we're not nearly as bad as people are saying. But Moyes has us playing worse every week.

I mean, it's almost an achievement to have 3 of the world's best footballers look that clueless. Mata, RVP and Rooney should be absolutely loving it together.
 
Manchester United manager David Moyes: "I don't know what we have to do to win.
"I thought we were extremely unlucky. We played well in difficult conditions but we have lost to one wicked deflection and one worldy.
"But we should have been out of sight with the amount of opportunities we had today and we only have ourselves to blame."
Click to expand...

good.
 
My working theory is Moyes is a massive Liverpool fan, and has orchestrated one of the most brilliant wind ups in history.

This season is a write off.
 
I wonder having so many attacking players on the pitch was not the best decision. Jones goes off and Welbeck comes in :DOH: . I normally see an all attacking force towards the last 10 minutes.
 
beachryan said:
My working theory is Moyes is a massive Liverpool fan, and has orchestrated one of the most brilliant wind ups in history.

This season is a write off.
Click to expand...

But wait.. Liverpool is having one of its best seasons since forever? Lol.

The saddest argument to be made against the man is that Everton also has a new coach and lost one of its "best" players to.. Yup, us. We won the league last year w more or less the same team an now added Mata. And yes we've had a ridiculous amount of injuries w key players but so did we 2 years ago and only lost the league on the last freaking day. Losing 2 cbs in one game due to injury is bad freaking luck and in a way so was that fluke of a deflected first goal for Stoke. Even then why on earth do we bring in Welbeck and drop Rooney who had an awful game down to the middle? Mind boggling really.
 
And why Januzaj in bench ? He has been best player in many matchs this season and now you keep him out and start with young? Oh well why should I worry ? Just enjoy Saturday with united and Barca losing this morning , my day it's going to be awesome :)
 
Did United really have that many chances though? I watched the last 10 minutes of the first half and the entire second half but United really wasn't dominant. Looking at the statistics and United had four shots on target while Stoke had six.
 
We were really poor, but the match followed the pattern of so many this season.

We utterly control it for 20 minutes - but fail to create clear chances - and then the opponents get a single sniff of goal and it goes in. This is the 4th match this season that an opponent has scored from their first attempt on target. It's almost unfathomable that an experienced player like Michael Carrick would deflect an otherwise harmless free kick from about 55 miles out into his own net from a full 18 yards. But that's the way it's going.

Our confidence is so utterly shot that we barely resemble football players. Even experienced pros like Carrick are reduced to bumbling second-raters. Rooney's completion was a shade above 70%. That's about 15% less than he averages. That is appalling.

Everything is falling down. We can't defend in open play, we can't defend set pieces, we're giving away own goals, our passing is slow and woeful and we're not creating anything. I can blame individual players for mistakes, or a lack of bravery but every thing is wrong. Not one player today looked good, and Welbeck, Evra and Cleverley did not even resemble Manchester United players.

We've lost a third of our matches this season. That is unheard of for a 'top' team.

There is only one single figure that can influence a downfall this grand - it has to be Moyes. Great players don't become crap in 6 months. A team spirit that was possibly the most reslient and stubborn in world football cannot just fall apart in 6 months. But it has.

He has to go. There is nothing in his history as a manager, in the performances of teams he has managed or in the performances he is getting out of our players to suggest that he can turn this around. Nothing. He is not only unproven at this level - he is proving that he is not good enough. There's no shame in that, the only way to find out if you're good enough is to be at that level. And he is not. We're not miles off 1 year of his reign. Cut him loose.
 
Hodgson never got a fair chance at Liverpool.
Like i already said a dozen times: Manchester United became what they are by having patience with a good manager.
Is Ferguson a better manager than Moyes ? We will never know, but i have a feeling that if Moyes gets the backing, the money and the patience by the board that Ferguson got, he will be as good.

Ferguson is some kind of untouchable for Man Utd fans (just like Dalglish for Liverpool fans). But if you look at it from outside, Ferguson left Moyes a moisoned chalice. He bought one player who almost singlehandedly made a pretty average team (except for Rooney and De Gea, Januzaj didn't play last season) champions. On top of that he had the luck that this extremely injured proned player wasn't injuried...

And then there are the refs. Refs are supposed to against Man Utd from this season. Let's suppose that is true. Isn't Moyes in that aspect also the victim of Ferguson. For years Ferguson has terrorised all the refs with his mind games (and i'm not talking about mind games directed at other managers, i'm talking about mind games directed at refs, linesmen and fourth official, Mourinho doesn't even comes close to what Ferguson did vis à vis officials). Well now the untouchable Ferguson isn't there any more and refs fianlly have the feeling that they can act freely without being criticised by the untouchable saint sir Alex Ferguson....

Moyes is primarily Ferguson's victim....

Oh and if Ferguson would mean well with Moyes he would not show up for the home matches for some months...that is what 95% would do in those situation, avoiding to be considered as some sort of mother in law, always there to watch the misfortunes ofhis successor.

If you stop with something there is some sort of cooling down period where you watch things from a distance...that happens in every profession. Look at former US presidents, you seldom see them in around the White House after theyhave left their office...
 
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We have been more injured and still came second. The team has lost it and not much seems like changing. Constant get to the byline and whip crosses in. No plan B.

Unless Moyes changes his tactics I can't see us improving what so ever. as of that I don't see the point in keeping him anymore, making the club worse and Ive stood by him. But when he says he does't know how to win and blames "a fluke deflection and wonder strike then I give up with him.

The thing that you have to realise is that no matter how many good players Moyes gets in. I don't see how the style he is using is going to get us any better. It needs changing.

The centre backs randomly hoofing aswell, what the fuck? keep the ball down. Wing play stop it, if its not working after 45 mins, play narrow and try to break stoke down.

Oh and Moyes said we played well yesterday but didn't put away our chances? what chances?

BFqWOPh.jpg
 
Well that blows even more: with pool drawing, and the Spurs and Newcastle results this was a perfect oopportunity to inch mighty close to the top 4. The fact that the only other team we d be competing against is Everton, a team that out of that entire bunch actually won.. Is once again depressing. Wonder what Hiddink is doing these days of Van Gaal after the WC?
 
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I would absolutely LOVE to be in the 'give him time' camp. That's what all of my instincts tell me I should say as a United fan.

But.

Moyes has never won anything. We gave SAF time because he'd won the European championship, with Aberdeen. Not to mention the league titles. He also made a clear difference in his first season, gutting the drinking culture, making us more professional and moving United half the way up the table.

Moyes is showing me nothing. There's not a single bright spot from the performances that indicate we're getting better in any facet of football. I expected us to be dull but really hard to break down. We're not, we concede with a higher % of chances than any other team in the league. We've only had 2 clean sheets away from home, and it's February.

Our attack is creating half the chances of last season. Same players, with added Janujaz and Mata.

We're worse at football, in every way football is measured. After almost 8 months.

@ Gerd - why would you give Moyes time? The only answer seems to be 'for giving times sake'. Nothing is getting better, it's all getting worse.
 
It is very easy to talk about the managers of clubs you dont support and say that they should be given more time. The reality is that Moyes should have never been the manager of Manchester United and Hodgson should have never been the manager of Liverpool. The sooner Manchester correct Ferguson´s mistake the better for them. Although I do hope you keep giving him time.
 
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