FIFA/FC vs PES/eFootball

P34SEMM said:
Ive pre-ordered FIFA17 and it will be sent today but I'm returning unopened. PES17 has the game play this year and I just see Fifa - as amazing as it looks and sounds - frustrating the life out of me.

Played a Manc derby in the CL mode last night on PES and it was a great game.

Such a shame that PES don't have the stadiums as FIFA looks amazing on that front. But for me, the gameplay is way behind PES.

PES isn't perfect and there still some horrible animations that need to be updated but I find myself enjoying it a whole lot more than Fifa.
Click to expand...
I have to disagree with how you say FIFA is behind PES in terms of Gameplay. Can you be a bit more specific? In what areas do you think PES is ahead of FIFA?. Not trying to pick on you or anything but would love to see what you have to say about that.
 
Shallow as it is (and I'm being a hypocrite here after tearing apart those posts from EA about the Ultimate Team "pack opening" animations), because of all the stuff FIFA gets right off the pitch (the manager mode, the PL stadia etc.), I'm trying to force myself to like it.

I had some enjoyable games this morning as Middlesbrough - and I found a real difference playing against Stoke and then against Arsenal (on World Class I should add, Legendary is too robotic for me).

Stoke conceded a penalty after 20 minutes (which I totally fluffed because of the new penalty system), and that felt really good, I've got to admit. It was a midfield mess, but that's how it should have been.

Arsenal were much sharper, moved the ball better, but their passing felt fair (though the way they held onto the ball less so - see below).

It seems to feel pretty good playing as four-star-and-below teams, because the control "clunkiness" is pretty spot-on (not trying to offend anyone with that description, I just haven't got the verbal dexterity at 10 in the morning to pinpoint what I mean by it).

But every game is a real grind. It's not mentally challenging as much as it's mentally exhausting. I'm not observing patterns of play or anything, because A) there's no time (see next paragraph), and B) there's not much point (see the paragraph after).

Out of possession, my defenders give their players tons of space (whatever the tactical instructions), so I'm constantly manually pressing, but it's pointless because the AI will just do constant 180-360 turns and retain possession until it hits a bad pass (though obviously - and seeing as this is the comparison thread, I'll make the comparison - it's nice to actually see a bad pass from the AI).

Once I've got possession back, no matter who the opposition is, their defensive line is already perfect, and counter-attacking isn't usually an option because of how well they'll intercept the ball in midfield. So, no matter what team I'm playing as, I'm forced to play slow, build-up football and do the AI's trick of rotating around the ball to avoid being dispossessed. Which I want to be forced into, sometimes - but NOT every game!

With the top teams, I don't feel "free" when I give the ball to a pacey player or a fancy dribbler. There's player individuality, certainly - I'd even argue that it has more of that than PES does (I'm never concerned about whether the guy I'm controlling needs to pass with his right foot rather than his weaker left, for example). But with those more creative players, the "clunkiness" of the controls isn't loosened, the button-lag doesn't improve, and I feel like I'm dribbling with a lower-league star, not a Premier League star.

If I up the game speed to "normal", that improves marginally, but then the ball physics seem absolutely crazy to me. I've not kicked the new Premier League ball or anything, but if it's anything like the way it flies in FIFA on "normal" speed, it's half-balloon.

Bond!JamesBond! said:
sliders allow developers to put as little time into game play AI development as possible
Click to expand...
EA never mention sliders in their PR, never. You can't use them online, they don't affect Ultimate Team, and 99% (literally) of the people who buy FIFA don't even know they exist. Sliders are an afterthought. They're for the career mode guys, who they don't give a flying fuck about. They stick the sliders in to shut us up.

This idea that sliders mean they're lazy with the gameplay is utterly bizarre to me. They can't even respond to someone who says they hate the gameplay with "fix it with sliders" because it just doesn't apply unless you're playing offline, and the vast, VAST majority play online.
 
Last edited:
Chris Davies said:
Shallow as it is (and I'm being a hypocrite here after tearing apart those posts from EA about the Ultimate Team "pack opening" animations), because of all the stuff FIFA gets right off the pitch (the manager mode, the PL stadia etc.), I'm trying to force myself to like it.
Click to expand...

No that's not shallow, I am exactly the same with football gaming now. The huge amount of detail and depth in FIFA is what always keeps me going back.

There's simply so much to do. I've been watching guy's Career Mode on FIFA 17 (YouTube) and it's lightyears ahead of PES 2017's ML in terms of player signings, contracts, brand development etc. It represents modern football so well.

PES just feels and looks archaic now. It resembles a Serie A match in the 90s. Slow, methodical and tactical. Which is fine. But I want the Premier League action, the glitz, the stadia, the presentation, the visuals - I want the whole package.

Master League is, in my opinion, a dated load of crap. There's just not enough to do. The Premier League matches don't feel like PL matches, they look/feel like an Eastern European match from the 90s. As do the menus and horrible sound effects.

There simply isn't enough in PES 2017 for the modern gamer - this is why I worry for the series, especially as (apparently - I have read this at another forum) it hasn't done as well as Konami woud have liked sales-wise this year.
 
As for sliders, I never use them. When I've tinkered with them in the past, they make one thing better but break another element.

And I play a lot of co-op 2v2 so it's pointless spending hours messing around with sliders.
 
Sliders, Yeah I have seen those and I get the point of them BUT it only affects Offline modes as Chris Davies said so thats fine and dandy if it helps with some of the games shortcomings from an Offline perspective but won't do jack squat if Online the game isn't to your liking.

Personally to sum up FIFA 17 (Demo) I like it. It could do with being a little bit slower on the Normal speed and the AI could maybe make a few more mistakes than it does like with passes but on the whole I like the experience FIFA gives me this year.

PES for me is sluggish, clunky, cumbersome and inconsistent. Don't get me wrong I am not saying its a bad game far from it. Its issues gameplay wise bug me more than FIFA's gameplay issues which is why I haven't touched PES for days now through utter frustration at how cumbersome it feels on Superstar Difficulty in the Master League. Its getting there but it still needs work I think with the physics and movement of the players. Shooting is better but doesn't feel context sensitive (right wording? probably not) so shots don't feel varied enough for me.
 
I've been playing Fifa for the first time in years without sliders in FUT SP and whilst there are things I'd like to tweak when playing I think it's the first time I've played default Fifa since sliders were introduced and I've still really enjoyed the gameplay, got a FUT draft token when the full game unlocked so cashed that in and that was a lot of fun, Ronaldo on the left wing, Messi on the right, Rashford and Sturridge up front, obviously when you have players of that calibre the player individuality is mind blowing, especially as I'm used to only playing with Sheffield Wednesday players!
 
Final Pass said:
There's simply so much to do. I've been watching guy's Career Mode on FIFA 17 (YouTube) and it's lightyears ahead of PES 2017's ML in terms of player signings, contracts, brand development etc. It represents modern football so well.
Click to expand...
I do agree with this to a degree, but it takes me back to the bad old days to even think about playing the worse game on-the-pitch for the sake of having players putting in a transfer request, for example (not that I'm saying FIFA is factually the worse game - it isn't, no matter what anyone says - but in my absolute personal opinion, comparing gameplay-to-gameplay, I find it maybe 25% less enjoyable).

I'm trying to get the most out of it, and I'm appreciating it a little more each time I boot it up, but I feel so creatively stunted (almost like the pitch is half the size).

I'll keep messing about in the career mode and see if something clicks.
 
Dunno how people can be so critical about PES 2017's graphics? I find them really crisp, the players look human like, especially so with some players faces. They also have emotions in their faces. Sometimes they do look a bit freaky, but at least it moves. The way the individual blades of grass are flattened when the ball rolls across it. The actual football is a thing of beauty aswell. I find FIFA 17 a dark and dingy place, the players faces look like cartoons to PES in comparison. The players show a real lack of emotion. I like the licensed stadiums, the lighting and shadowing in some matches, in others though it looks like you're playing in a cave. But to me it looks so dead visually. However the audio and presentation is still very good, even if the commentary is getting a bit boring now.

One thing I noticed on FIFA 17 is how the shirt "bounces" on the player when he moves. At first it looks pretty neat, but then it looks pretty strange when you look again aswell. Although it shows good cloth texture and clothes sitting on a player model rather than just stuck on. It seems very exaggerated. BOUNCY KITS FTW!!!
 
TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
PES for me is sluggish, clunky, cumbersome and inconsistent. Don't get me wrong I am not saying its a bad game far from it. Its issues gameplay wise bug me more than FIFA's gameplay issues which is why I haven't touched PES for days now through utter frustration at how cumbersome it feels on Superstar Difficulty in the Master League.
Click to expand...
Just to chime in on this point, I find Superstar difficulty makes the AI play ridiculous first-touch first-time-pass perfection football. If Top Player becomes too easy I'll be a bit stuffed, but it's a much better game on that in my opinion (you see the AI jogging with the ball and looking for a pass, for example, instead of instinctively knowing where the best pass is and hitting it straight out to the guy).

But I feel the same with FIFA - World Class is playable (though frustrating with this won't-give-you-back-possession stuff), Legendary is ridiculous, particularly when you score. That's when they bring out the laser-guided weapons...

TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
Shooting is better but doesn't feel context sensitive (right wording? probably not) so shots don't feel varied enough for me.
Click to expand...
Can't argue with you really. Every long shot seems to miss - almost as if their answer to "every long range shot goes in" is "every long range shot will miss", as opposed to actually fixing the problem via attribute observation and contextual data, like you say.

I just love being able to properly counter-attack against the right team, and having to keep an eye on everyone's positioning. That, for me, adds a whole new layer to the game, whereas I never feel like I have to engage tactically when it comes to FIFA.

It's all personal preference... I just wish I could take the, well, everything of FIFA, and add the tactical detail of PES whilst keeping player individuality.

craney91 said:
I find FIFA 17 a dark and dingy place, the players faces look like cartoons to PES in comparison.
Click to expand...
If we're talking graphics, I've got to disagree - I played as Middlesbrough this morning and instantly recognised a lot of the players, including the non-scanned ones, whereas Pro Evo's "face builder" faces look really weird next to the scanned faces. The scanned ones are remarkable, truly brilliant, but when a photo-realistic Gareth Bale is running out of the tunnel next to a referee with a face that looks drawn-on, it's a real immersion-killer.

(Not as much as the international matches, though - when the players "sing" their national anthem, the words always seem to be "maaa ma ma, maaa ma ma, maaa ma ma, maaa ma ma, maaa ma ma". When people say the game "looks like a PS3" game or whatever, I think it's a massive overreaction and it makes me roll my eyes - except in this one area. It looks MENTAL.)
 
Last edited:
Chris Davies said:
Just to chime in on this point, I find Superstar difficulty makes the AI play ridiculous first-touch first-time-pass perfection football. If Top Player becomes too easy I'll be a bit stuffed, but it's a much better game on that in my opinion (you see the AI jogging with the ball and looking for a pass, for example, instead of instinctively knowing where the best pass is and hitting it straight out to the guy).

But I feel the same with FIFA - World Class is playable (though frustrating with this won't-give-you-back-possession stuff), Legendary is ridiculous, particularly when you score. That's when they bring out the laser-guided weapons...


Can't argue with you really. Every long shot seems to miss - almost as if their answer to "every long range shot goes in" is "every long range shot will miss", as opposed to actually fixing the problem via attribute observation and contextual data, like you say.

I just love being able to properly counter-attack against the right team, and having to keep an eye on everyone's positioning. That, for me, adds a whole new layer to the game, whereas I never feel like I have to engage tactically when it comes to FIFA.

It's all personal preference... I just wish I could take the, well, everything of FIFA, and add the tactical detail of PES whilst keeping player individuality.


Got to disagree - I played as Middlesbrough this morning and instantly recognised a lot of the players, whereas Pro Evo's "face builder" faces look really weird next to the scanned faces. Those scanned ones are remarkable, truly brilliant, but when that photo-realistic Gareth Bale is running out next to a referee with a face that looks drawn-on, it's a real immersion-killer.
Click to expand...

Bale on FIFA looks spot on. Must admit. I think its the eyes. The eyes are better in FIFA. Some of the generic faces in PES are way off. Mane and Ihenacho for instance. (same goes for FIFA generic faces)

But then you have the likes of De Gea and Ibrahimovic, compared with FIFA, PES is in a different league. The player models also. But they're not just, taller, wider, longer legs, arms or whatever, the models have an effect in gameplay. Fellaini in PES plays totally different in FIFA for example. The distinctive player model isnt just a visual in PES it actually influences how that player plays on the pitch. A long ball up to Ibrahimovic, utilizing his size and strength in PES is not something that you would really try on FIFA.

But this debate is very subjective. Some will prefer how another game looks etc etc
 
craney91 said:
Dunno how people can be so critical about PES 2017's graphics? I find them really crisp, the players look human like, especially so with some players faces.
Click to expand...
My issue is the game is WAY too colorful and over saturated as a result. At times my eyes feel like they are going to bleed. Everyone has banged on about the Pitch Texture and I agree with that too.

What I like about PES from a graphics perspective is the Player Models. They look like Footballers. FIFA's are still hit and miss with some players looking as you would expect... some look like wrestlers.
 
Problem i have with fifa is the sense that everything is so flat and dull.

I' d say i like ball physics in fifa and shooting. but player models, individuality and momentum is all wrong. Also not sold on their animation, don't get me wrong, animations are smooth as hell but they just look damn wrong when players are stopping the ball or making turns, it does feel very arcadish and scripted. Also headers are still not good enough.

Think pes is just brilliant this year, i'd say ball physics could be a better (sometimes i feel i am hitting the stone) and despite an embarassing lack of variety, i take pes stadium texture over fifa any day. Fifa also get the distance between stands and the pitch remarkably wrong. PES is shit in night games though, their lighting is way off.

Fifa truly shines in presentation. Pes can't even get decent replays...

I really don't feel anything for fifa, which is exactly what happened to me for pes in the last few years. But this year the feelnig is back in pes.

PES needs to catch up in presenation, fifa needs to rethink their gameplay and get player model right...
 
TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
The game plays exactly the same on PS3 and PS4 from what I can tell. The only main difference I can see? The PS3 version runs at 720p and seems to run at a lower texture level. PS4 1080p and the textures are higher as you would hope and expect from the PS4.
Click to expand...

That doesn't surprise me when it comes to Konami these days. I haven't tried it on PS3 so can't comment.

I'm considering taking PES 2017 to CEX today, they are offering £30 cash at the moment.
 
klashman69 said:
Both games are literally the opposite this year.

PES brilliant gameplay, absolute farce everywhere else off the pitch.

FIFA, incredible atmosphere and The Journey looks so good i might even buy fifa, absolute disgrace on the pitch.

Crying out for both to work together!
Click to expand...

This basically.

Fifa has everything nailed until you kick off. Theres a known speed burst bug in 17 that enables any player to sprint past another. On Matt10 website they are trying to see if sliders fix it.
I don't hate FIFA I love most of it I just feel that PES has its magic back but theres still work to be done with it.
 
TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
This post made me lol :) Man stop being so defensive over a game. I get you like it but you need to appreciate other people don't like it as much as you and have issues with it.
Click to expand...

Yep, it's just opinions at the end of the day. If you love PES 2017 Craney, good for you. I'm envious because I wish that I felt the same.

PES had it's day in the sun for me. I wish another company would come along and make a good football game.
 
TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
My issue is the game is WAY too colorful and over saturated as a result. At times my eyes feel like they are going to bleed. Everyone has banged on about the Pitch Texture and I agree with that too.

What I like about PES from a graphics perspective is the Player Models. They look like Footballers. FIFA's are still hit and miss with some players looking as you would expect... some look like wrestlers.
Click to expand...

For me its the presentation and glitter of FIFA which is confused with graphics. From a far it looks decent at times. But zoom in.

No way is Pro Evo as bad graphically as some people are making out. Trouble is people compare the presentation with FIFA and the lack of shiny things, the lack of licenses and what not. Right off the bat they're in a negative mindframe about the game before they've even kicked the ball. A real shame.
 
TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
What I like about PES from a graphics perspective is the Player Models. They look like Footballers. FIFA's are still hit and miss with some players looking as you would expect... some look like wrestlers.
Click to expand...
Up until this year I felt the same, not because PES's player models were particularly great but because FIFA's were poor. This year I think FIFA's are better. They're not bad by any means, but for me there's something off about PES models. I don't know if it's the huge shorts, wide hips, thick ankles, or that many of them seem to walk and run pigeon-toed, which is quite strange. Looking back, I much prefer the PES player models from the PS2 era really, which is quite strange too considering how much more advanced graphics are now. Personal preferences, hey.:)
 
TroyDeeneyScoredAPenal! said:
This post made me lol :) Man stop being so defensive over a game. I get you like it but you need to appreciate other people don't like it as much as you and have issues with it.
Click to expand...


If you can get £30 back on a game you know you aint ever gonna enjoy and are gonna play the alternative more. You might aswell get it. Konami wont lose any sleep over it, they're only interested in the right players.

Thats where the strategy has changed. They're confident and believe in their product so much now, so are aiming it at the right audience.

For what its worth I may find myself doing the same with FIFA after a week.

Its not defensive. I just play games for what they are, I look at them exactly how and what they are without emotion or any of that. The only issue I have is when someone will say what they are not, when they are and when they are and they are clearly not.

Its like me saying Liverpool play in blue. People will debate that, believe it or not.
 
Final Pass said:
Yep, it's just opinions at the end of the day. If you love PES 2017 Craney, good for you. I'm envious because I wish that I felt the same.

PES had it's day in the sun for me. I wish another company would come along and make a good football game.
Click to expand...

I hope you do sell it for 30. The game will be glad to see the back of you. A loving owner will come along and rescue it. PMSL
 
Final Pass said:
Yep, it's just opinions at the end of the day. If you love PES 2017 Craney, good for you. I'm envious because I wish that I felt the same.

PES had it's day in the sun for me. I wish another company would come along and make a good football game.
Click to expand...


Well Final Pass, given the number of posts You make daily regarding PES, I can only conclude that You have had Your day in the sun on that topic,and any further multiple daily postings with the same grind will be deemed as spamming and removed.
Because now that is exactly what it is.
 
Interesting opinions. For me it comes down to this. PES, while giving you variety in team gameplay is too assisted. I know some people don't see it or think that's how it should be but I can't get over it and that's number 1 reason why I can't play it (along with a million others people have named).

Base FIFA is too generic - most teams play perfectly and feel the same. However, no matter how much people think that sliders are "cheating", it makes the game the best football game I can get for the last couple of years. Put everything on manual (except shooting on semi) and for me I feel like I'm in control and if I make a mistake it's my mistake. In PES I always feel I'm not totally in control.

I can't play online with sliders, sure, but I treat online as an arcade mode, kind of like Ultimate team. I'm fine with it, I mostly play offline anyway. Actually AI plays much better and more varied than real people.

Overall, just enjoy the game you like and try to get most of it. I can get more out of FIFA than out of PES. If PES had sliders and had less assisted controls, I'd ignore the atrocious ML mode and still play it, but unfortunately it ain't so.
 
superleeds1 said:
Well Final Pass, given the number of posts You make daily regarding PES, I can only conclude that You have had Your day in the sun on that topic,and any further multiple daily postings with the same grind will be deemed as spamming and removed.
Because now that is exactly what it is.
Click to expand...

And the same rule applies to Craney?
 
Final Pass said:
And the same rule applies to Craney?
Click to expand...

Why should it? I've kept it game related and partial throughout. I haven't made ridiculous comments about your game FIFA either. Everything I've said has been reasonable and with years of experience behind it.

But that bit about PES being a PS3 game takes the biscuit...

Thats just flame dude and I think you should be locked up for it. A 10 year stretch inside with a cellmate that plays PES 2017 on loop 24 hours a day should suffice.
 
superleeds1 said:
Whats this,finger pointing?
Still want to mix it up dont You.If craney91 was out of line he would know by now.
Click to expand...
So because I have given my opinion on PES, in a FIFA v PES thread, I am 'spamming'.

Yet Craney can consistently keep saying why he doesn't rate FIFA (which is fine) yet he doesn't get the same treatment?

Hmm.

Anyway, I acknowledge your warning.

Won't say anything else on the matter - seems there are too many sensitive souls around here.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom