FIFA 23 Discussion Thread (Console Versions)

[Chris Davies]

did pes 2008 have free ball and tackle physics?

Actually, yeah, it does. Genuinely. When you tackle the player, more often than not it will roll out of play or to the opponent. You won't magically stop the ball dead and run off with it, which EA have stated is part of the gameplay to (paraphrasing) "reward correct gameplay decisions". Want to drop the attitude now?

You like it, that doesn't make it as much of a simulation as the older games. Simulation meaning, rigid rules based on reality that create challenging scenarios and require decision-making; rules that aren't broken for the sake of "fun".

Mate, all I (and many others) want as a starter is the option to turn "1v1 mode" OFF, and have my/the opponent's AI act as a team (providing resistance) - and the option for physics not to take people's feelings into account.

Is that not understandable?

 

[Anth James]

No-one seems to play NBA 2k23 and complain that your 4 other teammates help you defensively? Or in Madden? Or NHL? I don’t really understand why in football this 1v1 issue is even a philosophical debate.

It’s a team sport, the AI is supposed to be doing something. It’s not complicated. If they’re not, and we complain about it then it’s completely valid and logical in my opinion.

I can deal with lots of other shortcomings in games if I have to, we’re used to it. But 1v1 is a giant problem that cannot be overcome. It changes everything.

 

[Flipper the Priest]

subjective enjoyment has to trump objective analysis

Ooh, I Iike that one. 👏

 

[FShas]

No-one seems to play NBA 2k23 and complain that your 4 other teammates help you defensively? Or in Madden? Or NHL? I don’t really understand why in football this 1v1 issue is even a philosophical debate.

It’s a team sport, the AI is supposed to be doing something. It’s not complicated. If they’re not, and we complain about it then it’s completely valid and logical in my opinion.

I can deal with lots of other shortcomings in games if I have to, we’re used to it. But 1v1 is a giant problem that cannot be overcome. It changes everything.

Of all the joints in the all the towns these bastards had to roll into, it just had to be ours...

 

[Redhat]

It is categorical, in my opinion. Football games are now dumber than ever before, and less of any kind of interpretation of football (and let's not forget, IT'S SUPPOSED to be a football game).

If this was FIFA Arcade 23, I'd be fine with it. But it's SUPPOSED to be a game about football, and it's the only one we've got. You might be able to make the best of that (along with the sliders guys) but they fix nothing. They slow it down, they make the 1v1 defender more aggressive, but they don't fix the midfield resistance, team defending, attribution-importance...

Agreed, which ties into my argument with the following:

is there a football game that didnt do that with tackles? did the best pes games 4-6 have an entirely free ball and free physics?

No, because they were released on hardware that's over 22-years old. The PS2 was released in the year 2000. You'd have an applicable argument if PES 4-6 were released within the last few years on similar hardware to FIFA 23. Think about it; we've seen the PS2, PS3, PS4, and now PS5 since the golden era of PES. A game can absolutely be constructed upon a foundation that leans or strives towards core principles despite being unable to perfectly imitate or recreate said principles due to the hardware/software limitations of the day. This is a large reason why those halcyon days of PES resonated so much with fans of football.

I get it; the term "simulation" can be a rather nebulous descriptor, especially when applied to highly venerated football games of yesteryear which one could argue aren't "true simulations." For me, and this is subjective and arbitrary, it's more about if the football game in question represents its real-world counterpart seeing as football is a spectator sport that we can watch. Does it pass the eye-test to a reasonable degree. Last I checked, training cone teammates and opposition defenders aren't what I'd consider true-to-life.

Pitting the AI of the aforementioned PS2 classics against a contemporary foe that is FIFA 2023 should only result in one outcome; complete and total annihilation in favor of the latter. Comparing the two should result in a "no-contest." Night and day disparity. Yet, despite all of FIFA 23's technological glitz and glamor that's powered by the latest and greatest console hardware, here we are measuring its merits within the pantheon of football games throughout the ages. Seeing as how much time has elapsed and the advancements in technology within that period in terms of CPUs, GPUs, game development, and machine learning, we could have should have seen a quantum leap in progression in regards to said fundamentals.

There are certainly aspects of modern football games that are significantly more advanced, but again, in terms of replicating the sport of football and AI behavior, we've actually regressed. That's a conscious choice and it's by design, much to the dismay of many football enthusiasts around the world. Let me reiterate; that's a conscious decision on EA's behalf. It's not due to technological constraints or insurmountable boundaries, but a paradigm shift in focus over the years (ie:online gaming, micro-transactions, broader audience, yada-yada-yada). Konami and Seabass were working within the confines of what was feasible in the early 2000s. EA doesn't get the same benefit of the doubt.



It's not a 1:1 comparison seeing as EA are making money hand over fist, but I always reflect upon Steve Job's take on product people versus marketers when it comes to modern entertainment in general.

 

[mei]

This is what I wrote back in July:

I've always thought that fifa as they 'iterate' on it year by year under the hood is moving more towards fifa streets 3 and away from a sports sim (if it ever was that).

With skill moves being the most exciting announcement for them. No real defending or mechanics for actual defending or tactically defending. Plus with them emphasizing what the elite players can do (like a nobody outside of the elite can't fake a shot) and with a lot players looking more like a caricature of the real player in essence its fifa street on a full size pitch.

Even the language they use around the star players and how FUT is used to hype up the top players and legends.

I wish that someone would make a sim that showed the human element of football because at the end of the day we love watching football because its 22 humans on the pitch and they can do things ranging from the sublime to the god awful to the most boring.

I think its pertinent to the current discussion. On a basic level the hot potato style dribbling looks so alien and off putting.

 

[marthchyld]

The old and humble design of mine(was designed a few years ago) came across my mind after reading these sim talks.

For Fifa to become a sim in Pro Club, then the design of mine above should already be available in Fifa. But is it at the moment?

Hectically pressing A, B, X, Y, RB, RT, LB, LT...with fingers is nowhere near a football sim but a quick response test.
AI and proper build-up play based on tactics are the most important thing to be a sim in this broadcasting view game IMO.

 

[Pagi84]

Yes probably. There's nothing concrete right now. I believe there's been an inquiry or something. The guy was right when he informed me about the new 2k golf game and that a reboot of Top Spin is in the works so I generally trust him. Either way there's a goldmine right now in football videogames. I'll be surprised if some big companies won't try to take advantage of it.

Reboot of Top Spin is definitely happening? I love TS4!

 

[fear]

https://www.operationsports.com/fifa-23-review-sorry-ted-i-dont-believe/

Oops. Finally someone that says exactly the same things many of us posted here.

 

[Matt10]

And when I can see it’s tamed, because to me there is no fixing of the fundamental flaws anymore, I can’t get over those transitions! May it look better now (with the sliders) when moving with a player overall, when receiving a ball or just turning (the close quarter stuff) it looks so off to me. Can’t unsee this and it looks worse than in 22, imo.
And I have another fifa game that does it so well and keeps me reminding how off this one here is playing out.

man, how I wish it would play more like football and I still dig all your efforts… 👏

That's completely understandable. For those of us that are enjoying the game, and want to play on slow-pace, that's the solution. Confirmed throughout and enjoyed many. We're having a blast with everything right now. FIFA 23 has so much of what previous iterations were missing. It also has a lot of little things off the ball that happen that are just unheard of. The way the CPU plays with that 51/51 acceleration as well just takes it to another level. Teammate AI is awake, CPU recognizes that and change how the play. Could not ask for more right now. Shut off the network and hunker down.

 

[Antoine]

I don't get this game.

When I first installed it yesterday I thought, "yeah its not bad". Seen some nice stuff from teams, nice action.

Today its been horrific to play. Skatey players, ball with no bounce, cpu players hitting the ball at 100mph, too many cutbacks. Ive just wiped it and will reinstall. I also had all my settings change by themselves which was weird on xbox series x.

So the big questions...

On fuma, why is my passing so fast and hard, where's the spinning pass with a bit of bounce back?
Where's the deft through balls you can play?
On fuma the through ball is like a normal pass
Why is the shooting so random and always powerful?
How can I get more inertia into my players? The skating is really grating on me.
Where's my defence and my AI. Why do my players stand still in both defence and attack?
Why is there acres of space on each wing?

Crazy, crazy game.

 

[Antoine]

That's completely understandable. For those of us that are enjoying the game, and want to play on slow-pace, that's the solution. Confirmed throughout and enjoyed many. We're having a blast with everything right now. FIFA 23 has so much of what previous iterations were missing. It also has a lot of little things off the ball that happen that are just unheard of. The way the CPU plays with that 51/51 acceleration as well just takes it to another level. Teammate AI is awake, CPU recognizes that and change how the play. Could not ask for more right now. Shut off the network and hunker down.

So you are saying disconnect from the internet when playing? Where are your latest sliders because the ones I looked at in operation sports didn't have 51/51 acceleration on them...

 

[Chris Davies]

So you are saying disconnect from the internet when playing?

To avoid the incoming patches, that's what he means. Only a matter of time before it's made faster, easier and somehow dumber based on FUT player feedback.

 

[Gazinio]

Stupid question but if you have the disc version and updates do then happen and ruin it, can you delete it and reinstall and play without updating or does the system force you to do the update before allowing you into the game? I just don't fancy having my xbox completely offline just for fifa

 

[Chris Davies]

Stupid question but if you have the disc version and updates do then happen and ruin it, can you delete it and reinstall and play without updating or does the system force you to do the update before allowing you into the game? I just don't fancy having my xbox completely offline just for fifa

If you have the disc, you can install v1 and cancel the update(s) from downloading on PlayStation and (as far as I can remember) Xbox.

However, after this point, you'd either have to keep your console offline, or cancel the update from downloading every single time you turn your console on.

And you could never put the PlayStation in "rest mode" or the Xbox in "always-on mode", because it would download the updates during the downtime.

One day, I pray we get an option in the settings menu to select which gameplay version we want to use offline (and to enable/disable each "live tweak"). You can do this in the likes of the NHL games.

Sadly, I think it's more likely we'll get an "always-on" EAFC, where gameplay will change overnight and there won't be a thing we can do about it (on consoles).

 

[Gazinio]

Cheers, that was my fear. Never tried to stop updates before, I always thought there was a chance EA could actually listen to feedback and improve things, but after the last couple of years I've learnt my lesson. If the game is as playable as I'm hearing on matt10s sliders then I'm gonna want to avoid updates like the plague as I think it's only going to change one way, and it won't be in our favour

 

[hitmanuk]

Is there a patch incoming?

 

[Chris Davies]

Is there a patch incoming?

There hasn't been a FIFA released in the past ten years or so that hasn't had a patch - and don't forget, they do "Live Tuning Updates" or "LTUs" now too (which don't require a patch to download). There's no specific details yet, but it's coming.

I'm seeing nonsense like this already (and it seems like the majority of tweaks come from Twitter complaints) so it's only a matter of time.

"I lost a couple of games today" = "lololol this game sux":

 

[manmachine]

I'm seeing nonsense like this already (and it seems like the majority of tweaks come from Twitter complaints) so it's only a matter of time:

Oh I love the comment just below that one:



This poor guy thinks they're going to patch a midfield in!

 

[vialli82]

https://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-5/fifa-23

80 overall FFS. "We finally found a real football ground this year after FIFA 22" etc. lol. One giving it even "100"
But i know some good website, no more than 60 or 70 (even IGN France which give relatively high notes)
And another French website gives him 50, Netherlands aren't kind with that game with 50 too.

The thing is i saw exceptional games with 75 or less. Ghost of Tsushima got less (even if it's different) and plenty of other relatively good games.
But i think or they played 5-6 games or they were paid by EA lol. 75 is what i would gives to FIFA 17, 50 for FIFA 23.

I'm taking a look at the most "purist" about football website i know since i'm youth, GameKult. But it's paid now...
JeuxVideo.com you should know them has changed their policy and gives higher notes / there's a player's note giving him 11.5, even applauding some add like the bad commentary and made an article for it "You're bad at Fifa? We got the solution for you" like if it would change something

So GK rate it... 12/20 (6/10). Let's say it's fair from the content in game even if it's title with Title "In Fifa 23 le ballon dort" (dort mean the ball spleep, d'or mean golden / ball, it's a wordplay) well, just meaning overall what you may guess.


Now that's a second thing regarding one FUT issue which pisses players. https://www.jeuxvideo.com/news/1646...uverte-les-joueurs-n-en-peuvent-deja-plus.htm
I don't know if there's a similar articles in others languages.
They said that duplicates players appeared way later in the game (one "bug" from the first FUT version) now they're appearing more than ever.
Some players said that "it's an EA strategy to push player to buy more and more loot-boxes"... If that issue is re-appearing without reason after X years, i think it's a big probability.

 

[fear]

https://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-5/fifa-23

80 overall FFS. "We finally found a real football ground this year after FIFA 22" etc. lol. One giving it even "100"
But i know some good website, no more than 60 or 70 (even IGN France which give relatively high notes)
And another French website gives him 50, Netherlands aren't kind with that game with 50 too.

The thing is i saw exceptional games with 75 or less. Ghost of Tsushima got less (even if it's different) and plenty of other relatively good games.
But i think or they played 5-6 games or they were paid by EA lol. 75 is what i would gives to FIFA 17, 50 for FIFA 23.

I'm taking a look at the most "purist" about football website i know since i'm youth, GameKult. But it's paid now...
JeuxVideo.com you should know them has changed their policy and gives higher notes / there's a player's note giving him 11.5, even applauding some add like the bad commentary and made an article for it "You're bad at Fifa? We got the solution for you" like if it would change something

So GK rate it... 12/20 (6/10). Let's say it's fair from the content in game even if it's title with Title "In Fifa 23 le ballon dort" (dort mean the ball spleep, d'or mean golden / ball, it's a wordplay) well, just meaning overall what you may guess.


Now that's a second thing regarding one FUT issue which pisses players. https://www.jeuxvideo.com/news/1646...uverte-les-joueurs-n-en-peuvent-deja-plus.htm
I don't know if there's a similar articles in others languages.
They said that duplicates players appeared way later in the game (one "bug" from the first FUT version) now they're appearing more than ever.
Some players said that "it's an EA strategy to push player to buy more and more loot-boxes"... If that issue is re-appearing without reason after X years, i think it's a big probability.

Game journalism is a joke nowadays. I don't want to discriminate and bash the younger generation of reviewers but sports titles should be reviewed by 40+yrs old journos. The review I posted yesterday by KG at OS is spot on. It reads like a 4 or 5/10 at best which is fair for FIFA 23.
I respect others opinions, like Matt's who is trying his best with the sliders, but he's also too lenient criticising the game (sorry Matt). I've watched all his streams and even with the heavy editing of the sliders this is not football. Putting the broadcast camera to get the feel of real football, slowing the game intentionally to become a slug fest of misplaced passes while players hit invisible walls of absent AI coding, it's not fixing the game.

 

[Peter Withe]

I was so disgusted with how bad this was last week that I quit the game and instantly uninstalled. But I was in a bad mood. Today, with a clear head and in a great mood I thought I would give this a fair crack of the whip. I have 8 hours left on my trial apparently so what the hell - this costs nothing to try:

This is the first FIFA game since the PS2 days when the series was (IMO) at its worst where I get ZERO joy from scoring.

I actually quite like the feeling of the passing and the pace is fine on slow with some slider changes but that’s where the praise begins and ends.

* Goal keepers are still terrible. Why is Ederson still letting in soft shots at his near post? Why does Allison Becker still behave like he’s the second coming of David James?

* Bugs. Lots of them. This weird visual glitch on replays and close ups. Also, my settings keep ‘resetting’ themselves to default (might be a trial issue on the Series X version?)

* Visually it’s so underwhelming. FIFA 22 looks gorgeous on PS5. FIFA 23 has ridiculously bright kits for too many teams. Is this done on purpose for the kids? I just played a Career match against Man Utd and their BRIGHT RED ILLUMINOUS jerseys look ridiculous. I’ve had to play with the colour settings on my TV so I don’t get a headache. Pitch textures are dreadful. It just doesn’t represent a modern day Premier League pitch (EA - for the love of god, just hire the FIFA modders who know how to make realistic looking pitches.)

* Career Mode menus are now a mess. And how do I quick save? Do I really need to tab over to settings every time?

* Lack of player individuality. Every player can hit the same rocket top bins. Again, there’s no satisfying feeling when you do anything in front of the opponent’s goal.

* THE GOD AWFUL power shot or whatever that BS is called when the camera zooms in and the player shoots. What is this crap? Can it be turned off? I’ve searched high and low in settings.

* THE GOD AWFUL Hypermotion2.4.1.2 replays. Just…NO. EA, no.

* It’s boring. The game is boring. When you boil it all down, it’s boring. Sliders, no sliders. World Class or ultimate. FUMA or assisted. Pass - pass - goal. Rinse, repeat. The game rewards you for nothing. I don’t need to think about what I’m doing. I just, again, pass - pass - shoot. Goal. Yawn.

* My recent full time results (Legendary, assists on Semi): 4-3, 5-5, 3-2. Nothing else needs to be said here.

TLDR;

The best football games were good straight out of the box. FIFA 23 requires so much tweaking with sliders and settings to even remotely resemble anything like football.

Some people claim slow speed is broke. Some claim that slow speed is fine. Some claim that 51 Acceleration allows the game to be played on slow. Some claim that FUMA allows the game to ‘come to life’.

It’s ridiculous. None of the above is true in my experience. The 51 Acceleration ‘trick’ just makes my players zoom around from a standing position and looks hilariously bad.

FIFA 23 at its core is designed for FUT players who want goals, goals and more goals and they don’t want anything getting in the way of this. No amount of sliders and tweaking can ever change the fundamental code.

This is the worst FIFA game for decades. And I’m not even exaggerating.

 

[vialli82]

Same for me @fear
I agree about 40's + even 60, they've got more recoil and followed the video game evolution since the beginning. Gamekult got the same guys behind, specialised in their own style... But they're often too harsh with some video games for the sake to be called "purist", they push too much the button. Well since years, they changed their policy too taking people remark as "pessimistic/people who knows better" by increasing their notes and gives more argument. Since, that website is paid lol.

About Matt is more the optimism type of person and not the critic type that much, he just watch and see what he can do, that's all.
Even some sliders saved me... 2 weeks before an update fucking everything.

I hate the concept of sliders (my own opinion) the game should adapt from your configuration / i see people saying well but when we try on Fuma it's a different game etc / BUT the issue is the game changes at every update. You have to set sliders for each "version". Well i won't say he's crazy but he likes it, and try to make the game playable even if sometimes he said like for the 21 that there's nothing to do, sorry.

Now why i hate it 1st: something which trying to hide their flaws, well flaws designed for FUT and all online gaming.
2nd: It's to become crazy, and some are not the one we need.
I remember myself changing every 20 seconds and see the differences instead of playing what they purposed, but to me which was trying to fix for example FIFA 18 or 19 it drived me crazy. And one setting may fuck up another etc., for in the final, get back to the basic and put it in slow lol, as the game feeling, AI and the rest as became nothing as a football game should feel.

I may add a 3rd, but it doesn't rectify at all the core issues (Chris said it a thousand time, and he's a thousand times right). Inertia, ball weight, AI more than all getting closer, Midfield battle etc. are not stuff you can change with numbers on 100.
There's an amount of parameters which can't be numbered, and needs different settings. Differences of styles can't be.

Never liked it since the start : and i loved FIFA 11 and 14 VANILLA / The way to play it balanced was that way to me, i only tolerate slow/medium/fast like it's been since 16 bits games... Even that i don't like and never too much changed : FIFA 22 for example pushed me to set it on Slow.

But for someone who likes to switch between Seasons online and matches VS CPU, and i like to be competitive as much, got 2 settings of gameplay speed gives an handicap in reactivity. Well it wasn't annoying when pace was at least OK offline, now it's way too fast. Can't make a compromise any more.
I don't talk about assistances : it was a very good idea since i don't know, FIFA 07 or 08 where i discovered it. I smashed people playing on Semi, as my passes was less predictable. Fuma is a another game in the game, so it should have their own online setting like in the past (no idea if you still could)

 

[Matt10]

Game journalism is a joke nowadays. I don't want to discriminate and bash the younger generation of reviewers but sports titles should be reviewed by 40+yrs old journos. The review I posted yesterday by KG at OS is spot on. It reads like a 4 or 5/10 at best which is fair for FIFA 23.
I respect others opinions, like Matt's who is trying his best with the sliders, but he's also too lenient criticising the game (sorry Matt). I've watched all his streams and even with the heavy editing of the sliders this is not football. Putting the broadcast camera to get the feel of real football, slowing the game intentionally to become a slug fest of misplaced passes while players hit invisible walls of absent AI coding, it's not fixing the game.

I'm one of the more outspoken about how much I disliked the beta. Hated it. Didn't expect to like this year's game, but gave it a chance. As KG said without sliders it's crap. With sliders, well - it's a FIFA game that is challenging and fun. It has moments that are football, moments that is FIFA. You have to accept that. There was no indication in any type of beta, trailer, pitch notes, that proved otherwise.

I think a lot here have this idea of their ideal footy game, and go into FIFA knowing that it's not going to meet that desire. Buy it, watch streams on it, and say for sure - exactly what they were thinking. I'm not as critical of FIFA because it's FIFA. I mean, come on, we're on a forum called Evo-web. We're PES first here. I'm PES first in all footy-game approaches. I don't try to make FIFA into PES, so I don't set that expectation. I keep an open mind, try my best with what tools we have set before us, and get as close to what resembles a football first video game.

The work being done on sliders is actually enjoyable because we've gotten to a point it's as good as any FIFA that we've played on next-gen. As I've mentioned we're seeing things that we have been pushing for years (almost 10 years) in the slider community:

• Defenders meeting attackers,
• 50/50 challenges,
• interceptions with anticipation,
• pressure off the ball towards the intended receiver,
• covering goal-side,
• defensive team variety,
• defensive animation variety,
• defenders scoring on corners after the play is recycled,
• off-the-ball incidents, off-the-ball mannerisms and emotions,
• keepers saving resulting in deflections out of bounds,
• goal-mouth action and scrappiness,
• brilliant goals,
• terrible goals

But, it's FIFA, and it lacks in many areas:

• Midfielders not tracking back,
• Passing variety,
• Midfield battles,
• CPU Match scenario recognition (park the bus vs all-out attack),
• Physics,
• Ball clipping through players,
• Occasional Illogical warping back to default positions (hypermotion2 impact),
• Legendary CPU doesn't cross often

All of that, and possibly a bit more, have been achieved. That's a lot of football-type things. Even if it was just half of that, I'd be ecstatic for FIFA. The fact that we've all experienced that is just a solid win all-around. Which is why I said to turn off the network so the updates don't ruin it because it's the best it's ever been right now...for FIFA.

 

[vialli82]

Well, prefers to play retro, even Efootball than that "representation".
There's different journalism opinions and you have to accept it too, even the ones who gived him 50, or below 70 (and they're a lot).

Now, to be honest i'm less FIFA than PES in terms of feeling and global gameplay direction and choice Vanilla by far on PS4 gen, i retain only 2 versions so...
Never touched any mods, sorry but it's the even worst than sliders to me in terms of rectify the balance.

While you, Matt, is more FIFA, a game which is offensive oriented with sliders to try to fix it. But when it becames almost impossible to do something fun right now.
Just a bit balanced, and forced to play in Fuma.

About the 23 : the best thing to do is waiting for a big update. FTM, from what i saw : it's unplayable when the CPU run away from you on every difficulty.
What's the point setting to World Class or Legendary then. I hope it's just a bug / for you, to me Fifa is just the shadow of itself so i given up : even got more much more hope in Efootball or, no joke, last 2 vids i saw from UFL as it looks fun. Whatever the overpower keeper, that's a way to balance an Action-Football game.

Sorry for those who like it, but when you replay FIFA 14 PS4 you just brought, and put FIFA 22 after, then check FIFA 23 videos...
There's BIG reasons to be mad against that shit.

And saying is good, fun, and we got to admit it is to me just showing how low some of you and your expectations were reduced by 80%.... For not saying zero.

 

[Chris Davies]

Which is why I said to turn off the network so the updates don't ruin it because it's the best it's ever been right now...for FIFA.

From a "realism" standpoint and a "fun" standpoint respectively (because they are independent of each other), do you really think this FIFA is better than e.g. FIFA 14 through FIFA 18?

That looks like I'm being sarcastic - I'm not, it's a genuine question, because... Well, all of this is obviously subjective, but literally all those negatives you mention are better in FIFA 16, for example (in my opinion, though I could easily back this up with some screenshots/videos). In-fact, I'd go as far as to say all those negatives are better in 2010 FIFA World Cup (!), where I can beat San Marino 10-0 but lose to France 5-0 on the same difficulty setting...

Of course, that doesn't mean those "fixed" negatives outweigh 23's positives, if you really love the positives. But... Considering how game-breaking those negatives are... I'm so surprised at this statement.

Maybe you think 23 is more fun because of the tweaks from last year, and I can understand that (though I don't agree with it, it's understandable). Maybe you don't want to "live in the past" and you want a more responsive game with more new features, for example. I get that, and all football games are some kind of balance between the two worlds of "fun" and "realistic" / "restrictive".

But personally, I think to call this "the best FIFA has ever been" because of e.g. "off-the-ball mannerisms and emotions" is... honestly, crazy talk. We're on Evo-Web because of our passion for a game that put gameplay first, so I'm really surprised you rate this FIFA more highly than those of the post-PS2, pre-Frostbite era.

Don't get me wrong, sometimes I do think FIFA 16 is praised too highly (honestly, I think the animation speed and ball speed are both far too fast, even on slow, whether on v1 or any of the updates). But even with its flaws in mind... There are far fewer than there are with 23. In my opinion.

I'm not saying 23 has nothing good about it - and believe it or not, I'm bored of being so negative too. But I'm so surprised at this statement from a champion of realism, given how realism has proveably worsened year after year after year.

 

[manmachine]

But, it's FIFA, and it lacks in many areas:

• Midfielders not tracking all the way back,
• Passing variety,
• Consistent midfield battles,
• CPU Match scenario recognition (park the bus vs all-out attack),
• Ball clipping through players,
• Occasional Illogical warping back to default positions (hypermotion2 impact),
• Legendary CPU doesn't cross as often

Ball clipping can be seen in most footy games to some degree but everything else is not Fifa in general, it's specifically Fifa post Fifa 19 (18/19 made some steps in the current direction and sit in a special grey area, you can enjoy them or hate them). That's why I'm playing older ones.

When I was 5 yo I used to play with some round checkers and a tiny ball on the carpet, pretending they're footballers kicking the ball around and I was moving both teams pretending it was football. That's what any attempt to fix or play this game looks to me now, except I'm not a so easily immersed 5 yo kid anymore and I just expect something good out of the box for the ridiculous price of $70.

I just don't think there's any list of positives that can make up for these 2 huge elephants in the room:
1: 1v1s make the game a completely brainless affair. My 5 yo me probably used his brain more moving the checkers.
2: In the year 2022, basic player movement with the ball looks more laughable than ever with hypermotion.

 

[vialli82]

Who said it's the best Fifa ever made? Needs to call a old friend named "Ray". He's chasing Ghosts as a job with his 3 teammates.

You can like the game, okay. But well, when it's something based on reality and vanted as "realistic", you got to check what's that something and the reality around, if it's well reproduced and at least fun to play. It's a game, but it was also a game in the past with much much more fidelity to the sports he should represent. Now it's a bit like a parody. Said "Arcade" or "Inspired by" but don't lie by calling it with some totally wrong adjectives. It's false advertising.

And, don't think i'm a Fifa hater. I only switched the 21 and 23 : as i got the same feeling in worst on FIFA 22 by watching vids, i feel an even worst sensation by watching FIFA 23 + the overall mood and review about the game here didn't make me brought it. As i place the 22 as the worst i've played, with the 20 Fifa 20 was better overall but i never feel so less challenge in a Fifa to do what i want. so i didn't played more than 10-15 games.

So just a disappointed Football game fan. It was my "switch" game with PES, now there's no switching, nothing new. So i play and edit retro and discover a lot of hidden gem. FIFA 14 PS4 was the biggest i found, i mean in "modern" games (there's no such thing as Next-gen football, 23 is far from enhancing the game overall, just some animations system but ALL the rest have became dumber)

More in FIFA 22 as it was the total opposite : at first challenging and on a new console : the only thing keeping me in front of my TV. Then i realised why it was "challenging" bit by bit.

 

[Emroth]

When I was 5 yo I used to play with some round checkers and a tiny ball on the carpet, pretending they're footballers kicking the ball around and I was moving both teams pretending it was football. That's what any attempt to fix or play this game looks to me now, except I'm not a so easily immersed 5 yo kid anymore and I just expect something good out of the box for the ridiculous price of $70.

Wow, what a great comparison!!
I used to "play football" on the carpet with all my toy soldiers, a marble and Duplo made goals. And now that I think of it - it was exactly like Fifa since 1v1 was implemented - I had (and still have ) only two hands, so I could move only two "players" at the time, while the rest stood still.

This and above mentioned old "Assassins Creeds" fighting gameplay, where one enemy attacks you at the time, are the best illustrations of how the new Fifa games are designed. Bravo!

 

[vialli82]

Got a subbuteo-like but not the real lol, in paper-like / well not solid, more in frigolite but the ball was in plastic. But before i played with my finger and a small ball to shoot on stuffs where the ball entered on
Like round thing and small squared stuff (toys you know from that time, tons of stuff for making a Goal without nets)

But was more a mix football/basket. I admit you both killed me with your comparison