Fifa 11 Xbox 360/PS3

Placebo said:
Perhaps those games aren't as much of a cash cow so they have to keep their fans sweet? Or maybe those who develop Madden/NHL don't hold their consumers in such blatant contempt as the devs of Fifa really seem to.
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This is spot on. It must be the FIFA dev team/FIFA marketing side of EA who are taking the decision to treat their customers like they do. It must be the case, because as has already been said, other EA titles actually get very good support after release.

What I don't understand regarding anyone really defending the game, is that surely everyone must find it boring due to a lack of challenge? Some people on here have been very kind and given good advice, but surely if they have such a good understanding of how to play the game then they too must find it too easy to play? I'm an okay FIFA player, not brilliant by any stretch of the imagination, and I find that every game plays out the same, where I spend 90 minutes with almost all the possession, trying to grind down the 10 man AI defences and super quick reaction times. Sometimes I win, sometimes I draw, but I almost never lose. My first attempt at CM on World Class resulted in something like 20 wins and 18 draws, no losses. Boring as anything. Every game was either a comfortable win, or a super frustrating draw against the AI's seemingly superhuman defensive abilities that can be turned on or off like a switch.

My biggest gripe with the game is that the AI represents almost zero attacking threat, and certainly cannot keep possession due to the fact that the AI will almost exclusively only ever pass the ball forwards. This results in the incredibly limited AI trying to avoid losing by cramming 10 players within 40 yards of their own goal, with the AI on rare occasions scoring a pretty much routine, identical type of breakaway goal (long pass from the centre of the field out wide and over the head of your fullback, perfectly onto the foot of a wide player, cross, header, goal). Any time the AI bothers to attack me, you can see it trying to maneuver itself into a position to cross the ball over any other options available. How is this anything like real football? You can add all the fancy pro-passing, individuality and ball physics in the world, but if the opposition AI is limited in how it can attack you, and defends in the strange, artificial way that it does, then you have a broken offline game that offers none of the variation and unpredictability that happens in real football. Every match finishes with the same one sided stats in your favour, whether you're playing against Barcelona or Macclesfield Town.

So if people defending the game's AI know how to combat it, then surely the game offers even less of a challenge than it does to me, who is by admission, poor at breaking down the AI but still manages to win or draw most matches? I've always felt that once you learn how to crack the AI's super packed defence, then you'll win every game by an avalanche of goals because the AI is incapable of holding possession, or placing concerted attacks on your goal beyond identikit counter attacking moves.
 
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Are you playing manual controls and winning all games on WC level? You must be good if you are

Im enjoying the career mode now taking the advice of a previous poster by using longer halfs but fewer games. Im on 9 minute halfs WC level full manual and the game is good again. I think in shorter games the pressure increases especially if you are losing as you dont have much time to turn it around.
Anyway each to there own.

I think if PES can improve the goalies, animations, atmosphere and have a full manula control system intead of now having to hold a button down it will be a real contender but its just not there for me yet and yes ive played it loads afetr buying it a 2nd time
 
LTFC said:
What I don't understand regarding anyone really defending the game, is that surely everyone must find it boring due to a lack of challenge?
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Exactly the opposite, it's the challenge that keeps me coming back.

I play with fully Manual controls on Legendary, 10 minute halves, and never use either of the pressure buttons. Every match is tense and difficult and frankly I'm losing more than I win at the moment.

I keep convincing myself that I can keep getting better, and I think up something new to try that might tip the balance a little more in my favour, so I come back for more. Then when it all clicks and I win a tough game it is hugely satisfying.
 
LTFC I think the problem of CPU offense is defenitely tied in with what Drekkard pointed out regarding User Defense AI. I agree with the both of you to an extent, it seems that the lack of AI support on defense is used to counter the lack of CPU offensive AI. It seems deliberatle from EA as if they disabled some aspects of AI on either side, perhaps to provide as much action you would get in 90 minutes in 5-10 min. That sucks but I can appreciate the challenge of trying to do such a thing and the fact that also have to make a game that appeals to the masses. Nevertheless the game is still challenging and doesn't feel repetetive at all to me, especially when formations and line ups vary, and you can stop things such as excessive CPU crossing and counter attacks.

As far as clearances go, I don't think I'll be doing anything extensive any time soon. However I managed to squeeze in a game last night and saved some clips that prove to some extent the following points...


My RB, who has a defense arrow infield, pressuring the Forward and forcing a bad first touch (this strategy is dependent on high def. workrates from my mids and forwards). This happened several times throughout the game.
YouTube - 60' Marchisio

clearance to my centre back (who's drifted wide b/c of outward def. arrows) I had anticpated prior to the game based on Udinese's formation that this situation would occur.
YouTube - clearance 2

my cm and winger pressuring, my lb coming slightly infield (arrows), bother the passer and force a bad pass(cm & winger)/bad run(lb). Notice how my DM follows his man. My LB, DM, CM, LM are all on the same side of the field behind the ball. its 4 on 3 to me.
YouTube - misplaced pass

note that if that even if the ball is passed backwards, My Forward is close enough to close down, and if I'm quick enough to anticipate I can switch control and pressure the ball. Difficult to execute but this is where practice would go a long way.

CPU clearance that fell to my CM.
YouTube - clearance

notice here the wayward clearance, it went from right field to left and barely got 25 yards up the pitch

My CB aggresively attacking the ball without my input. He actually sticks his leg out (by that point i was controlling him) in front of the Forward. Love the tenacity.
YouTube - 71' Marchisio

I know their is not much in these videos but the point is that they show potential.

I can appreciate that probably none of those clearances would have happened against a human, something which ought to be fixed. However, this should be something that should somehow require a lot skill and footablling intelligence to apply, not something that occurse simply as a reward for keeping possession high up the pitch.

good website, 1 dimensional analysis but that's the point of it.
http://www.zonalmarking.net/
 
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All i have to say is that playing fifa11 on manual/slow multiplayer offline with my friends, is an absolutely joy and the perfect footy sim ever. Dont care about the details. Its all for fun after all...

Bring on fifa12 EA...

Me, an old PES/WE fan...
 
polakis said:
All i have to say is that playing fifa11 on manual/slow multiplayer offline with my friends, is an absolutely joy and the perfect footy sim ever. Dont care about the details. Its all for fun after all...

Bring on fifa12 EA...

Me, an old PES/WE fan...
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my thoughts exactly
 
Crikey. Bit of a bump to this thread.

I've just had a blast on this for the first time in probably 2 months. Bought a Live Season for the Premiership, chose Spurs and played about 10 games. Love it. I remember it did frustrate me originally but it was still excellent overall. Feels just as good if not better now. The break did it well.
I really enjoy live season, seems to be a bit of a neglected mode, IMO.
 
Picked a 360 copy of this up last week (as can't always get on my PS3 on weekends as my nipper confiscates it to play Wrestling :) ).

Anyway, add me if anybody wants a game.

I much prefer playing on Manual but will play other styles if I have to as long as it's NOT full Assisted with Pro Passing turned off! F'kin despise that style. Not a lover of the others really but less pingpong so if worst came to the worst I'd play against it.
 
AUDIO IN GAME...

- Do crowd chants sound realistic for your region? Are you hearing something at the wrong time? Whats good? What aren't you hearing? (English, German, Spanish, Dutch etc etc) With that, I don't think we have a lot of Spanish, Italian or German etc. people here. Could someone get feedback from those types or are there already people with access to this forum that have intimate enough knowledge to give feedback?

- Are there any missing songs/chants for your club or clubs in your fav league/country? Keeping in mind license restrictions we have, it would still be good to know and I know there's a few generic chants that we don't have that we can look into. List them, possibly some links to hear them to if you want to be a keener

- Crowd reactions sound realistic for your region? Hearing things at wrong time? Hearing wrong reaction? Not hearing the "GOOOOOOOOL" if you're in Spain? I want to know!

Chance for some feedback guys, keep it to the point rather than general moans and monologues and we'll do our best to get the feedback back to the Dev's...;))
 
Crowds are all far too quiet and there's not enough of them, in any match, when the away team fluffs a chance they get jeered, when an away player does something naughty such as hurting a home player for example, they get booed throughout the match, this should be in the game (hell I suggested this back at GCA in 2007).

Also they need to make sure chants for players are removed when that player moves on, I'm dreading Fifa12 arriving and Wednesday having the "Ole, Ole Ole Ole Ole, Tudgay" chant....
 
Placebo said:
Crowds are all far too quiet and there's not enough of them, in any match, when the away team fluffs a chance they get jeered, when an away player does something naughty such as hurting a home player for example, they get booed throughout the match, this should be in the game (hell I suggested this back at GCA in 2007).

Also they need to make sure chants for players are removed when that player moves on, I'm dreading Fifa12 arriving and Wednesday having the "Ole, Ole Ole Ole Ole, Tudgay" chant....
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Love that chant :WORSHIP:
 
http://forum.ea.com/uk/posts/list/219545.page#1784975

Just posted another bible's worth of stuff about various cookie cutter phrases people tend to fall back on whenever someone asks for realism in a football game and it sounds like it might possibly be maybe a bit in-depth, perhaps. Phrases like "it's just a game", or "if you want 100% realism then go join a football club", or "it's not FIFA's fault, it's the community's fault".

It's a bloody hard sell I know! Not expecting a huge number of replies but I hope it's useful to anyone who faces the same sort of anti-progressive, overly conservative approach.
 
romagnoli said:
http://forum.ea.com/uk/posts/list/219545.page#1784975

Just posted another bible's worth of stuff about various cookie cutter phrases people tend to fall back on whenever someone asks for realism in a football game and it sounds like it might possibly be maybe a bit in-depth, perhaps. Phrases like "it's just a game", or "if you want 100% realism then go join a football club", or "it's not FIFA's fault, it's the community's fault".

It's a bloody hard sell I know! Not expecting a huge number of replies but I hope it's useful to anyone who faces the same sort of anti-progressive, overly conservative approach.
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Great piece Rom, tough crowd.
 
Well, that info is interesting. But what makes it more interesting to me is that it's a deja vu for 2 years now, so I've heard the same questions and answers over and over.

The fundamentals of the game are wrong and I don't have any hope they will change them. I've been playing clubs for some time to see what it was like. And it's terrible. The frentic pace and stupid pressure and tackling turns any match into a run and tackle fest. Plus, 99% of the people will never pass back or try to be creative because it's not necessary in the game. Just run the line, drible and cross/shoot. There's little teamwork and build up to be find there.

I really hope PES can improve their technology and shine again, I have no confidance left in EA.
 
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Could you summarise what your trying to say please.
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:LOL:

I only visit that forum when linked from here. Since they took away the dedicated Feedback forum and created the private GameChangers thing, it's clear that they're not interested in hearing suggestions from the great unwashed. So what would be the point.
 
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Nick Cave said:
AUDIO IN GAME...

- Do crowd chants sound realistic for your region? Are you hearing something at the wrong time? Whats good? What aren't you hearing? (English, German, Spanish, Dutch etc etc) With that, I don't think we have a lot of Spanish, Italian or German etc. people here. Could someone get feedback from those types or are there already people with access to this forum that have intimate enough knowledge to give feedback?

- Are there any missing songs/chants for your club or clubs in your fav league/country? Keeping in mind license restrictions we have, it would still be good to know and I know there's a few generic chants that we don't have that we can look into. List them, possibly some links to hear them to if you want to be a keener
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'A keener'? Sounds like a type of boat.

Chants I'm not hugely bothered about. I suppose all I'd add is to ensure that the generic chants are properly generic, rather than sharing ones that are clearly player/club specific (the aforementioned 'Keano' etc). Pretty sure I've heard a Jermain Defoe chant at other clubs too. Maybe the audio guy is a Spurs fan.

Nick Cave said:
- Crowd reactions sound realistic for your region? Hearing things at wrong time? Hearing wrong reaction? Not hearing the "GOOOOOOOOL" if you're in Spain? I want to know!
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I think the crowd could still respond more directly and more obviously to what is happening on the pitch. This sort of instant feedback is undervalued in games. If something happens to the player or by the player, any direct reaction within the gameworld increases immersion. That's more valuable than authentic chants, I feel.

- More of an emphasis on the difference between home and away crowds. Responses to home team 'events' overwhelmingly positive and encouraging, to away team 'events' negative and hostile. Would bring more of a sense of occasion, sense of place, variation. Half the time I have to figure out from the scoreboard or the kits to remind myself whether I'm home or away - should be obvious from the moment-by-moment crowd response.
- Expression of outrage when a home team player is floored by a hard sliding tackle (foul given or not).
- A showboaty backheel flick by an away team player might be whistled mockingly by the home crowd, or cheered if it's by a home team player.
- More expressive response to shots that narrowly miss the goal/woodwork/saved. Away team striker might be jeered/whistled when he misses a shot.
- More vociferous response to a penalty award, cheering if it's for the home team.
- Encouraging the team to get forward when there's a counter-attack opportunity developing.
- Applause/appreciation for a visionary crossfield ball.
- 'Handball!' claim? Language issue I suppose.
- Overall changes in enthusiasm/noise depending on match context. E.g. home team losing by a goal but piling on the pressure would pump up the crowd to drive them to an equaliser. Rival crowds (derbies) more aggressively encouraging.

Just basically any event, however small, that happens on the pitch and can have a discernable response, should have one and should be exaggerated/defined more.

And re-write the entire Custom Audio feature... I gave up on it after a while, with its life-sappingly fiddly set-up, repeated freezes and playing the wrong chants. Messy :BLEH:
 
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romagnoli said:
http://forum.ea.com/uk/posts/list/219545.page#1784975

Just posted another bible's worth of stuff about various cookie cutter phrases people tend to fall back on whenever someone asks for realism in a football game and it sounds like it might possibly be maybe a bit in-depth, perhaps. Phrases like "it's just a game", or "if you want 100% realism then go join a football club", or "it's not FIFA's fault, it's the community's fault".

It's a bloody hard sell I know! Not expecting a huge number of replies but I hope it's useful to anyone who faces the same sort of anti-progressive, overly conservative approach.
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Forum link is still dead man :(

i keep getting this error:
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Yeah, I seem to have killed the forum. Someone has anyway.

I found I could look at the forum if I wasn't signed in and even get to press the reply button and type a retort to Canuck (who certainly isn't interested in realism from conversations I've had of late - who in a position of responsibility would be suggestion Indoor Football as a topic of discussion with FIFA in the state it's in?!) but was unable to post it.

Nerf, I did try to reply to you actually. In short, I was trying to say I think it's bollocking stupid that there isn't a feedback forum as a lot of great ideas were posted in there along with the typical dross. I made the thread though because we are still middle men who can pass stuff on or bring stuff up for discussion. Plus you can still PM devs as far as I know. As such my thread is basically just meant to be a list of repeatable answers to feckless anti-realism phrases. This was made because I still want people to talk and think stuff up, and not have what little enthusiasm for debate or indeed FIFA quashed by the sheer banality of some others on the forum - especially since you are having to post in the general thread and bump into such people more frequently.
 
Hello,

This is my first post for a long time. My love for Pro Evolution died long ago when the switch to next gen came along, but the problems inherent in FIFA 11 combined with the lack of support led me to visit here to see what the overall feel for PES was.

I also post in the official FIFA forum (under the name Richegroover). I didn't realise this place had a FIFA sub-forum (see, told you I hadn't been here for a long time!) - I recognise a lot of you guys from the official forums. :)

It saddens me to find out SmartCanuck is prioritising an indoor mode over bringing the series back on track in terms of simulation. Things have gone off track a little since 08, which I thought was pretty excellent.

I felt compelled to write because I too am still scratching my head trying to understand why the official forums don't have a feedback sub forum anymore. I asked PWride why in a PM and his response was that 'it wouldn't send the right message at this moment in time' or words to that effect, the basic feeling that I got was that they didn't want to add a feedback forum because it would give the impression that general feedback was important or that they were listening - and that was something they didn't want to convey?!?! I thought that was ridiculous but there you go.

Riche :)
 
Hi mate.

Once the forum is sorted, don't mention indoor football!! He'll know it was me. I'm not saying he was trying to put it forward as his number 1 request, but to me even thinking about it at this point in time is ludicrous.
 
romagnoli said:
Hi mate.

Once the forum is sorted, don't mention indoor football!! He'll know it was me. I'm not saying he was trying to put it forward as his number 1 request, but to me even thinking about it at this point in time is ludicrous.
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You've got nothing to worry about.

I try my best to only contribue to worthwhile posts in the forum, which means I post about 3 times a month!

You are spot on as well. Get 11 a side right first then worry about other things. While I noted that point, my main reason for writing was the feedback forum issue. :)

Riche
 
They removed the feedback section? That's funny. Was it a lot of abuse in it that could have been the reason? If it's "all" up to the gamechangers I can't see me play fifa 12 either. It's a shame, because it's not really that much that needs to be implemented to make it actually play like football and not just a weird football themed gamers game.
 
A short while before the release of FIFA 11 a new forum was setup, but not in the same place as 09, 10 etc.

They simply neglected to put a feedback forum in it, the old feedback forum was hardly a place of abuse as I remember it, in fact im sure it was one of the few places you could go to have a sensible discussion about the game.

To be fair to the gamechangers im sure they feedback the feelings/ideas/comments from the community (as far as I am aware). At the end of the day it is up to EA to listen to them.

Riche :)
 
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