Fifa 11 Xbox 360/PS3

romagnoli said:
The reason for a lack of vids is apparently cos they just couldn't get hold of the kit manufacturers etc for approvals. They kept chasing but didn't get an answer. That's what Dave Rutter said anyway...
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I don't trust him as far as I could throw him.

The season has started, so most kits have been seen? so why would kit manufactureres have a problem?

Isn't the kit being shown, more advertising for the kit?

were there not kits in the official promotion videos?

Obviously it is bad project management on Rutters part (or whoever deals with it). Surely all the marketing strategy should have been sorted? so that would have included showing videos of the game before it came out? so permissions should have been sought a long long time ago.

So whatever way you look at it they have fucked up, they can blame the 'Kit manufacturers' as much as they want, but it is their fault.

I hate all these excuses they bring out.
 
romagnoli said:
The reason for a lack of vids is apparently cos they just couldn't get hold of the kit manufacturers etc for approvals. They kept chasing but didn't get an answer. That's what Dave Rutter said anyway...
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Sounds odd to me. We have PES videos all over the place showing the very same kits (well, the licensed ones).
 
romagnoli said:
The reason for a lack of vids is apparently cos they just couldn't get hold of the kit manufacturers etc for approvals. They kept chasing but didn't get an answer. That's what Dave Rutter said anyway...
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Quite greedy on the part of the manufacturers. New kits are out and about now, seems odd that if they've obviously approved the use of said kits in the retail copy of the game, that they'd make a fuss about early videos of the game.

If it's true. I don't really believe anything Rutter says.
 
The simbols u guys see beside the player names arent the Traits.. those are so called SHIELDS.. a player gets a shield when they have a atribute over 90... for instance Messi has a dribling shield... the max it shows its 3(if a player has more than 3 atributes on the 90's, it will show the 3 best atributes).

About the traits i still dont know if they will be visable, i really hope so.
 
Still better then Seabass saying he needed approval from Greenpeace for showing the dog and bear heads.
 
BobbyBox said:
I don't trust him as far as I could throw him.

The season has started, so most kits have been seen? so why would kit manufactureres have a problem?

Isn't the kit being shown, more advertising for the kit?

were there not kits in the official promotion videos?

Obviously it is bad project management on Rutters part (or whoever deals with it). Surely all the marketing strategy should have been sorted? so that would have included showing videos of the game before it came out? so permissions should have been sought a long long time ago.

So whatever way you look at it they have fucked up, they can blame the 'Kit manufacturers' as much as they want, but it is their fault.

I hate all these excuses they bring out.
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I'm pretty sure a dev said not long ago that they can't release any promo, demos, images, or anything, with kits that have yet to be approved by the manufacturer. Logically, PES wouldn't have as big a problem with this because they have far fewer kits to worry about.

Take that for what it is, I"m not defending them. And if this is the actual reason behind it, then the kits should friggin be all accurate in the final release, which they never are.
 
mfmaxpower said:
I'm pretty sure a dev said not long ago that they can't release any promo, demos, images, or anything, with kits that have yet to be approved by the manufacturer. Logically, PES wouldn't have as big a problem with this because they have far fewer kits to worry about.

Take that for what it is, I"m not defending them. And if this is the actual reason behind it, then the kits should friggin be all accurate in the final release, which they never are.
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That's fine, but they have hundreds of teams, they must have two they can show a game between?
 
winston said:
But it seems to be only Barca v Real matches - that's 2 kits
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Maybe they want to include various teams in promo vids. I dunno, I can't really think of a way this make total sense considering they've released a couple vids already, so they could just use those teams again.

It's really hard to defend the FIFA guys right now, on anything.


romagnoli said:
It's not as fast as those videos. Other than that I'm only going to say this as I'm on my phone in the pub. Rod said it, and I agree - it's better than FIFA 10/WC in every way... but not enough, in every way.
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It sure sounds to me like the WC game def had an impact on FIFA development between 10 and 11. FIFA 11 may prove to be a good game but the advances made seem very underwhelming.
 
mfmaxpower said:
It sure sounds to me like the WC game def had an impact on FIFA development between 10 and 11. FIFA 11 may prove to be a good game but the advances made seem very underwhelming.
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If it's better than the world cup game then I will be pleased. You also have to bear in mind that EA sports is still a business so they going to treat there products the same way. What i mean by this is that Fifa 11 will be an improvement on Fifa 10, and as you say the results maybe underwhelming. However think of it from there point of view i.e if they were to improve it with so many features being mentioned here, what would they do for fifa 12? It's like any other product. Basically improve the game a bit, but make sure there is room to improve it the next time as well. They are very confident Fifa 11 will sell lots and I think we all know it will. So next year they will be saying "we been listening to the fans, we r gonna get rid of 180 passing in fifa 12"...and in fifa 13we will improve on fifa 12 and so on and so on etc.
 
romagnoli said:
First.

Met Rod and Nick today, very nice chaps. Shame I only saw Rod for 5 mins really.
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Yeh - should have come to find you guys really. I loved sitting there when Nick spoke up - instantly realised who it was from his question. Couldn't think of any especially relevant questions (having been forced to sit through a seemingly endless presentation of stuff-I-already knew when frankly I'd have preferred to be playing.

It's not as fast as those videos. Other than that I'm only going to say this as I'm on my phone in the pub. Rod said it, and I agree - it's better than FIFA 10/WC in every way... but not enough, in every way.
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To reiterate - those videos do not show the game in a fair light. In those videos I'd struggle to pick out the differences from 10/WC, and in reality, the differences are clear. Oddly enough, if anything is really improved - if anything has been fixed it's the one thing which all those videos would contradict.

The pressure is... a -hell- of a lot less effective than in previous games. It no longer seemed particularly worthwhile as a tactic, and that was for a lot of reasons.

The worst thing, undoubtedly, was the defensive lines. Again, they are better, undoubtedly, but there is far too much of the same old same old defender standing off his man. It's one thing if the whole line drops back to compensate, but all too often you'd have a straight line with one defender 3-5 yards further back because a striker was standing there. There were multiple occasions where I did find my defensive line doing some really bizarre things - usually all on the same theme, dropping back to cover, whilst the other defenders stayed up.

If anything was surprisingly poor - it was the analog sprint. Found very little use for it really. Not sure if anyone had a different experience of that - and I was struggling with the PS3 controllers as it was, don't like the sticks, don't like the triggers, and desperately wanted to play on a 360 controller to make a fairer comparison on certain things. In terms of analog sprint - I really like the concept but because the difference between jogging and sprinting is relatively low in terms of pace, there doesn't seem a huge amount of difference between half press and full press. I also found that it crucified your stamina and turning circle as if it would if you were fully sprinting. Analog speed is a great idea - but I'm not sure about this particular implementation.

A continual feature of the game I felt was a bit off was the contextual error on passes - which is all too often expressed as slow, bounciness, rather than misdirection. It just looks kinda wrong - and I would have hoped for more variety. To see a pass for which error has been applied which was too fast, too slow, too left, too right, curving away from the player, and yes, bobbly - as opposed to the consistent slow, bouncy thing which does occasionally seem very odd.

It does however, to a decent enough extent, neuter the worst of pingpong passing. It's surprising how ruinous a slow, bouncy pass can be to an attack. For me, with the contextual error, it's much more a feeling of it looking wrong and not quite being true to real life than anything.

What I was underwhelmed with in the passing sense was the Pro Passing. I was gobsmacked at how good a completely underweighted pass could be (ie, where the white marker would be 2/3 of the way along and I tapped it). It does have an affect, but as a manual enthusiast I find it far too forgiving.

On the manual side of things - unsurprisingly it is nothing like the changes which would satisfy me, and frustratingly it still has a tendency for direct passes on manual to be too short to do really short passes - and too weak to do the longer passes. It means that you have this bizarre need to use throughball for the really long and really short passes, and direct pass for everything else.

In terms of assisted/semi/manual overall... well I'd say that in general terms the balance is still ordered the same. Assisted tends to be the most effective, followed by semi, followed by manual - but it's definitely contracted a lot. Unfortunately, my hope that semi would become more effective than assisted doesn't seem to be a reality - and I think that's because generally, by design, semi is a harder assisted. The pros of manual, really don't exist in semi (ie, the freedom). I still feel to a large extent that EA's mentality when it comes to adding these features is backwards. The new assistance settings I'd need more time with to really say much about.

The R1+Lob modifer was interesting, didn't get as much use of it as I should because to be honest I forgot about it for quite a few matches. Definitely a nice addition to the repetoire.

And, though not many of the people in here care, the goalkeeper controls feel solid - I only played it in arena, but they work well and i actaully think it could be a pretty fun setting for something completely different.

I tried out as many exploits as I could think of - didn't find any working - but obviously without a serious amount of time, there is a limit to how stringently you can test everything.

There were a few really BS moments - the jumping-over-players and losing ball crap still exists clearly. Skilled dribbling still has all the same quirks, and I often found my player just totally losing the ball at his feet when using it, especially when transitioning in/out of it. This would be maybe understandable (not really) except that the most prominent ecase occured with Messi.

Another occasion, I played a lovely manual throughball to Villa, and he was running alongside the other player (physical interacaction is definitely better btw), and I just managed to tap the ball ahead into the area, and the defender took me out from behind. Their player got a yellow - not even debatable that he was last man and that I would have got a shot off.

Overall I'm focusing on the negatives here and this is brief - I'll get round to answering the questions in the thread soon enough. Just wanted to put some quick (!) thoughts here. Don't get too depressed from the negatives in here - I'm just trying to gt everything bad down unless I forget. I realise i haven't mentioned Personality+ - not because it's bad or not noticeable, but because I'm tired, and it's not really a negative.
 
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MindlessDrugHoover said:
If it's better than the world cup game then I will be pleased. You also have to bear in mind that EA sports is still a business so they going to treat there products the same way. What i mean by this is that Fifa 11 will be an improvement on Fifa 10, and as you say the results maybe underwhelming. However think of it from there point of view i.e if they were to improve it with so many features being mentioned here, what would they do for fifa 12? It's like any other product. Basically improve the game a bit, but make sure there is room to improve it the next time as well. They are very confident Fifa 11 will sell lots and I think we all know it will. So next year they will be saying "we been listening to the fans, we r gonna get rid of 180 passing in fifa 12"...and in fifa 13we will improve on fifa 12 and so on and so on etc.
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Sorry but there's no such thing as a perfect game, thus there is ALWAYS room for improvement, whether it's core gameplay, visual graphics, game modes, etc. The idea that you don't want to improve something too much for worry of having no room to grow in the future is NOT a successful business strategy - that's a strategy that allows competitors to overtake you.

For the first time in a few years I - and quite a few others based on the forums - will being buying PES in addition to FIFA. There once was a time I only bought PES, and if EA aren't careful that could become the case again.

It's not so simple as comparing the WC game to FIFA 11 because they have different game modes. It's not all about gameplay, so maybe there's an argument to be made that those folks who worked on developing the WC game modes would in a normal year be working, say, on improving Career Mode. If I'm going to buy a new version of FIFA every year, then I expect, in addition to improvements across the board, substantial advances in either gameplay or the game mode I play.
 
Xaor, have you tried using the weaker teams and was the difference really noticeable? If it was, what exactly was it noticeable in? Did you play against ai and if you did, did it feel different playing against different teams or was it all the same like FIFA 10? Also, how about ai using skill move: did it feel like it was overdone or were they performed only by skilled players at appropriate times?
 
Rodelero said:
Yeh - should have come to find you guys really. I loved sitting there when Nick spoke up - instantly realised who it was from his question. Couldn't think of any especially relevant questions (having been forced to sit through a seemingly endless presentation of stuff-I-already knew when frankly I'd have preferred to be playing.



To reiterate - those videos do not show the game in a fair light. In those videos I'd struggle to pick out the differences from 10/WC, and in reality, the differences are clear. Oddly enough, if anything is really improved - if anything has been fixed it's the one thing which all those videos would contradict.

The pressure is... a -hell- of a lot less effective than in previous games. It no longer seemed particularly worthwhile as a tactic, and that was for a lot of reasons.

The worst thing, undoubtedly, was the defensive lines. Again, they are better, undoubtedly, but there is far too much of the same old same old defender standing off his man. It's one thing if the whole line drops back to compensate, but all too often you'd have a straight line with one defender 3-5 yards further back because a striker was standing there. There were multiple occasions where I did find my defensive line doing some really bizarre things - usually all on the same theme, dropping back to cover, whilst the other defenders stayed up.

If anything was surprisingly poor - it was the analog sprint. Found very little use for it really. Not sure if anyone had a different experience of that - and I was struggling with the PS3 controllers as it was, don't like the sticks, don't like the triggers, and desperately wanted to play on a 360 controller to make a fairer comparison on certain things. In terms of analog sprint - I really like the concept but because the difference between jogging and sprinting is relatively low in terms of pace, there doesn't seem a huge amount of difference between half press and full press. I also found that it crucified your stamina and turning circle as if it would if you were fully sprinting. Analog speed is a great idea - but I'm not sure about this particular implementation.

A continual feature of the game I felt was a bit off was the contextual error on passes - which is all too often expressed as slow, bounciness, rather than misdirection. It just looks kinda wrong - and I would have hoped for more variety. To see a pass for which error has been applied which was too fast, too slow, too left, too right, curving away from the player, and yes, bobbly - as opposed to the consistent slow, bouncy thing which does occasionally seem very odd.

It does however, to a decent enough extent, neuter the worst of pingpong passing. It's surprising how ruinous a slow, bouncy pass can be to an attack. For me, with the contextual error, it's much more a feeling of it looking wrong and not quite being true to real life than anything.

What I was underwhelmed with in the passing sense was the Pro Passing. I was gobsmacked at how good a completely underweighted pass could be (ie, where the white marker would be 2/3 of the way along and I tapped it). It does have an affect, but as a manual enthusiast I find it far too forgiving.

On the manual side of things - unsurprisingly it is nothing like the changes which would satisfy me, and frustratingly it still has a tendency for direct passes on manual to be too short to do really short passes - and too weak to do the longer passes. It means that you have this bizarre need to use throughball for the really long and really short passes, and direct pass for everything else.

In terms of assisted/semi/manual overall... well I'd say that in general terms the balance is still ordered the same. Assisted tends to be the most effective, followed by semi, followed by manual - but it's definitely contracted a lot. Unfortunately, my hope that semi would become more effective than assisted doesn't seem to be a reality - and I think that's because generally, by design, semi is a harder assisted. The pros of manual, really don't exist in semi (ie, the freedom). I still feel to a large extent that EA's mentality when it comes to adding these features is backwards. The new assistance settings I'd need more time with to really say much about.

The R1+Lob modifer was interesting, didn't get as much use of it as I should because to be honest I forgot about it for quite a few matches. Definitely a nice addition to the repetoire.

And, though not many of the people in here care, the goalkeeper controls feel solid - I only played it in arena, but they work well and i actaully think it could be a pretty fun setting for something completely different.

I tried out as many exploits as I could think of - didn't find any working - but obviously without a serious amount of time, there is a limit to how stringently you can test everything.

There were a few really BS moments - the jumping-over-players and losing ball crap still exists clearly. Skilled dribbling still has all the same quirks, and I often found my player just totally losing the ball at his feet when using it, especially when transitioning in/out of it. This would be maybe understandable (not really) except that the most prominent ecase occured with Messi.

Another occasion, I played a lovely manual throughball to Villa, and he was running alongside the other player (physical interacaction is definitely better btw), and I just managed to tap the ball ahead into the area, and the defender took me out from behind. Their player got a yellow - not even debatable that he was last man and that I would have got a shot off.

Overall I'm focusing on the negatives here and this is brief - I'll get round to answering the questions in the thread soon enough. Just wanted to put some quick (!) thoughts here. Don't get too depressed from the negatives in here - I'm just trying to gt everything bad down unless I forget. I realise i haven't mentioned Personality+ - not because it's bad or not noticeable, but because I'm tired, and it's not really a negative.
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Thanks for the comments.

It sounds pretty shit. I'm going to bed.
 
Rodelero said:
On the manual side of things - unsurprisingly it is nothing like the changes which would satisfy me, and frustratingly it still has a tendency for direct passes on manual to be too short to do really short passes - and too weak to do the longer passes. It means that you have this bizarre need to use throughball for the really long and really short passes, and direct pass for everything else.
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Man it pisses me off to no end that again they show no love to manual controls.

Sounds like there's general reason to be optimistic again - your comments are similar to what others have been saying, esp about game speed. In addition to game speed though, plenty of others have registered their disappointment with pro passing - many comments that the power gauge marker is pointless because passes still reach their target despite error in pass power.

I am amazed though such "little" things, like players jumping over players and losing the ball and skilled dribbling quirks, don't get hammered out between editions. It's bad enough these errors make it into the games but they should be first thing addressed before making improvements, so there's really no excuse for errors carrying over to FIFA 11 from 10.

Sounds good though - pretty big relief after GC. Still doesn't sound like enough has been done since WC/10, and I especially want more info about CM, but at least now I'm excited again to get my hands on the demo.

Nice reporting!
 
The user skill part of the pro passing feels toned right down. The maximum passing speed seems much closer to the ideal speed; the lower end feels brought way up. The end result is, whether you min or max your pass, it just seems to be fine. I fiddled with switching the power bar dependency off and on, and didn't notice a significant difference at all.

It is improved over WC2010 and is incredibly polished in most regards but the passing directional accuracy is negligible and the weight of the passes isn't really varied anymore (except when pingponging beyond the third pass or so). Pressing is definitely toned down in effectiveness... But to me the passing speed is actually too slow if anything!

There genuinely are some very good points and a lot of interesting things in there; just echoing Rod's POV really.
 
romagnoli said:
The user skill part of the pro passing feels toned right down. The maximum passing speed seems much closer to the ideal speed; the lower end feels brought way up. The end result is, whether you min or max your pass, it just seems to be fine. I fiddled with switching the power bar dependency off and on, and didn't notice a significant difference at all.

It is improved over WC2010 and is incredibly polished in most regards but the passing directional accuracy is negligible and the weight of the passes isn't really varied anymore (except when pingponging beyond the third pass or so). Pressing is definitely toned down in effectiveness... But to me the passing speed is actually too slow if anything!

There genuinely are some very good points and a lot of interesting things in there; just echoing Rod's POV really.
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Toned down because the powers at be at EA demanded it be toned down u think?
 
romagnoli said:
The user skill part of the pro passing feels toned right down. The maximum passing speed seems much closer to the ideal speed; the lower end feels brought way up. The end result is, whether you min or max your pass, it just seems to be fine. I fiddled with switching the power bar dependency off and on, and didn't notice a significant difference at all.

It is improved over WC2010 and is incredibly polished in most regards but the passing directional accuracy is negligible and the weight of the passes isn't really varied anymore (except when pingponging beyond the third pass or so). Pressing is definitely toned down in effectiveness... But to me the passing speed is actually too slow if anything!

There genuinely are some very good points and a lot of interesting things in there; just echoing Rod's POV really.
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Hi Rom, seems like pro passing is more gimmick than anything else. Shame. Did they ask for feedback from you and was the general consensus the same re pro passing. Surely they can tweak this to make the gauge less accurate. This is why everybody gets so irate with EA. They get so close and then seem to drop the baton on the home straight.
 
So what are the real differences from Fifa 10?

If the personality + is crap, and the pro passing makes almost no effect, what have they done all the Fu$%&$g year? Just marketing?

The ones who played it, does it fell like your getting into something, lets say not new but innovative? Or we get the feeling we are playing a FIFA 10.5?


How about the shotting, is the ball heavier? Are the players heavier? They seem pretty floaty in the videos.

And what about difference between players? Does it feel like you are playing Messi or its just the same thing like having a fast tinny winger?
 
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