FIFA 10

Placebo said:
Exactly the same here. I've played 200+ matches and only ever had 1 week injuries, how many have you played?
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I'm somewhere in between 150 and 200 as well, my friend however is nuts (he keeps a MM diary-like thread constantly updated over at Wegrinta!!! forums and makes like 5 videos/day of his plays...lol) and has prolly already played twice as many, he's at like his 6th or 7th season or something.
 
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I'm a bit late to the party and finally picked up Fifa 10 on Tuesday. I bought the game for the shallow reason of being a big Bundesliga fan. Quite enjoying it so far, despite the flaws. Needless to say I won't be touching manager mode.
 
Jamezinho said:
I'm a bit late to the party and finally picked up Fifa 10 on Tuesday. I bought the game for the shallow reason of being a big Bundesliga fan. Quite enjoying it so far, despite the flaws. Needless to say I won't be touching manager mode.
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How do you find it in comparison with PES2010?
 
stuartyd said:
How do you find it in comparison with PES2010?
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It's difficult to split them as they both do some things very well but both are full of flaws. Generally what I like in PES is done poorly in Fifa and vice versa. I love the slick passing in Fifa and even on semi (which I use) there is still plenty of freedom to put the ball where I want and also make plenty of mistakes (a good thing). Passing in PES is still too rigid, automated and restrictive. However I love the shooting in PES, the feeling of being able to really smack a ball and the chance of it going in from anywhere. If anything there's a lot more freedom to the shooting in PES as there are no sweet spots as such. In Fifa 10 the shooting still doesn't feel right (as has been discussed in the last few pages). It still feels a bit weak - although long shots are improved - and floaty, and snap shots just aren't as fierce as in PES. However I do enjoy the deft finesse finishes in Fifa. Goalkeepers can be just the wrong side of superhuman in Fifa but too far on the side of Heurelho Gomes in PES.

Overall Fifa 10 hasn't really addressed my problems with Fifa 09. The shooting is slightly better, the 360 movement is nice but adds little as it's still too fiddly and unnatural to take on a defender. The unrelenting pressing game of the CPU is a bad as ever and they still don't tire and can perfectly intercept every pass. But it's a different experience and a welcome change from PES. At least the referees and advantage rule work properly in Fifa 10.

Ultimately both games are too flawed to knock PES5 off it's perch, though. They've both been massively over-hyped.
 
Retri said:
Stop scaring people off with bs anchored entirely on baseless assumptions (hence the video) just because you happen to not like it (De gustibus et coloribus non est disputandum, eh) and go back to playing PES whatever instead of bitching all day about it.
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One good goal dosen't make up for the 100 'same' goals everbody always scores.

Even in FIFA 2003 you could score a rare goal like that. It was still an awful game?

The ONLY good thing about FIFA 10 is online Virtual pro because it's fun. The BEST way to enjoy fifa 10 is to play it like a kid and treat it like the arcade game that it is. Just have fun online playing with 10-20 other people Thats it. You need to underwstand this game was BUILT pretty much for Virtual pro.

I've given up with playing vs the CPU its just so boring since every player plays the same way, never mind all that custom tactics rubbish, players will still all play the same way. On legendary i been winning all my games with hamburg, some 7-2, 11-0 4-1 etc ves Bayern, Wolfsburg some of the best teams

I don't even put an effort in by sorting out my squad and leaving Elia (who's a winger for god's sake) Up front. I find it a joke tht Elia and Petric my two strikers play exactly the same way.

Online is the same as last year which was tedious. No matter if it's manual or assisted. People just look for certian places to shoot because they know they will score, no matter what player they use.

You keep saying this rather pathetic excuse 'your expectations are too high'. All i asked for was a good football sim, where at least basics such as defending, midfield play and attcking in wayy which you need to break down stubborn defences with decent plays as a basis. Why are the defences so high up?

But since the defences are a joke, and midfielders again non existant i'll sticck top 20 player online fun :)
 
Jamezinho said:
It's difficult to split them as they both do some things very well but both are full of flaws. Generally what I like in PES is done poorly in Fifa and vice versa. I love the slick passing in Fifa and even on semi (which I use) there is still plenty of freedom to put the ball where I want and also make plenty of mistakes (a good thing). Passing in PES is still too rigid, automated and restrictive. However I love the shooting in PES, the feeling of being able to really smack a ball and the chance of it going in from anywhere. If anything there's a lot more freedom to the shooting in PES as there are no sweet spots as such. In Fifa 10 the shooting still doesn't feel right (as has been discussed in the last few pages). It still feels a bit weak - although long shots are improved - and floaty, and snap shots just aren't as fierce as in PES. However I do enjoy the deft finesse finishes in Fifa. Goalkeepers can be just the wrong side of superhuman in Fifa but too far on the side of Heurelho Gomes in PES.

Overall Fifa 10 hasn't really addressed my problems with Fifa 09. The shooting is slightly better, the 360 movement is nice but adds little as it's still too fiddly and unnatural to take on a defender. The unrelenting pressing game of the CPU is a bad as ever and they still don't tire and can perfectly intercept every pass. But it's a different experience and a welcome change from PES. At least the referees and advantage rule work properly in Fifa 10.

Ultimately both games are too flawed to knock PES5 off it's perch, though. They've both been massively over-hyped.
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Well put, I agree entirely. Although overall I enjoy FIFA, when I tried PES2010 something just brought a smile to my face but the bloody keepers are awful.

If PES sort the keepers, get some box nets, introduce proper 360 movement and manual passing/shooting options and of course make big improvements on the animations, it could be very interesting next year.

Alternatively, if EA start focusing on what is happening on the pitch (gameplay & graphics) rather than wasting time on gimmicks and useless modes then perhaps we could be in for a treat next year.

I just wish both parties would copy the best bits from each others games.
 
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stuartyd said:
Well put, I agree entirely. Although overall I enjoy FIFA, when I tried PES2010 something just brought a smile to my face but the bloody keepers are awful.

If PES sort the keepers, get some box nets, introduce proper 360 movement and manual passing/shooting options and of course make big improvements on the animations, it could be very interesting next year.

Alternatively, if EA start focusing on what is happening on the pitch (gameplay & graphics) rather than wasting time on gimmicks and useless modes then perhaps we could be in for a treat next year.

I just wish both parties would copy the best bits from each others games.
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I feel the same. PES is just plain and simple fun, even against the CPU, but Fifa is great online against friends.

I think PES is on the right track again, although a long time coming and the progress has been far too slow. If anything Fifa has stagnated to a certain extent, despite some nice new innovations like 360 degree movement. Next year will be really interesting as EA have allowed PES to gain ground on Fifa, but had EA delivered on their promises over the last two years then they could have killed their rival.

If Konami pull their finger out and work on those issues you mentioned then I think PES can be a proper bona fide next-gen sports game. But as it stands Fifa is closer to perfection as an all-round product. If EA can improve the shooting, introduce more player individuality and swing the defensive pressure mechanic more in favour of the man of the ball (so that your player is not brushed off the ball so easily) then Fifa 11 could be really special.
 
The question is whether EA have hit a ceiling with their current dev team, or if they've hit a ceiling with their current engine and need to overhaul a lot of the key stuff - Marcel Kuhn seems insistent that the MM problems were because the existing code was FUBAR and he couldn't rewrite everything in one year. The same may be true of certain gameplay aspects, such as ball physics (which does seem like their improvements have been painted over the fundamental problems rather than ripping out the old and putting in the new.
 
Cammey said:
So we went from....

"The best simulation of football to date"

to

"It's shit"

In the space of a month.

:))
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Glad people are finally coming around at least. This forum, relative to the guys on EA's forums and the mainstream audience, is far more knowledgeable about what makes a realistic soccer game and is generally much more discerning but just before release and shortly after there were an alarming number of positive reactions labeling FIFA 10 as "the game we've all been waiting for."

I don't wanna act like I was ahead of the curve or some shit because I wasn't (there were more than a few who had a bad feeling about FIFA 10), but I really wasn't feeling this game at all from the very beginning. Hopefully things change...

romagnoli said:
The question is whether EA have hit a ceiling with their current dev team, or if they've hit a ceiling with their current engine and need to overhaul a lot of the key stuff - Marcel Kuhn seems insistent that the MM problems were because the existing code was FUBAR and he couldn't rewrite everything in one year.
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...and that change needs to start with getting David Rutter the fuck out. I was talking with a buddy of mine and a point on which I agree with him deals with the way that Rutter really seems like sort of a "yes man," and not really a true footy fan. Not sure if any of the "Community Day" guys got to speak with him or anything and saw it differently, but I think that in order to even begin to move in the direction of a realistic footy sim, you need a guy who genuinely loves the game and Rutter doesn't give me that impression. Seems like he's there to simply sell copies. I understand that's the objective of any company but there are devs that actually have the community's interest at heart because they themselves are crazy about the sport. Ian Cummings, dev for Madden 10, comes to mind. Yes the game has it's issues and bugs but in following with him along the game's development, you wouldn't believe the passion he has for the sport. The way that he went nearly step by step through people's complaints, told them what they were doing to fix them, and along the way released videos showing the new animation or mechanic in comparison with the old. He actually wanted to make Madden 10 a game in which cheesing doesn't work, which seems to be the exact opposite of what Rutter and Co. want to do. He didn't succeed entirely but at least in his case it was down to execution and not blatant lies about his intentions.

As for that emboldened point, Marcel is full of shit. See Placebo's reply PM to him. I'm no developer but I'd imagine that code has a higher probability of being fucked up when you add shit that you didn't need to in the first place. It's always the code that they point to and it's gotten to the point that now whenever there's a problem with any of the FIFAs the majority of the community have this idea stuck in their head that it's ALWAYS because they had to rewrite the code from scratch (specifically regarding the engine). Yeah they had to do it for some modes but this "don't complain about bugs because every year they start over with a new engine" meme is seriously stopping people from actually getting on EA's ass as much as they should.
 
Just played FIFA 10 for the first time in over a week... lasted one match and then switched it off. Urgh. An exercise in frustration.
 
http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/...97121-manager-mode-questions-answers-240.html

EA_MarcelKuhn said:
Manager Mode improvements.
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What are the manager mode improvements? Because there certainly are not the 50 promised improvements, and even stuff that was added such as assistant manager, dynamic board expectations are completely flawed to the point of ruining the game, not to mention the dozens and dozens of manager mode bugs and glitches that were left in the game when it went gold and then were not fixed afterwards, manager mode is broken and unplayable, and if you disagree with that I can easily give you 2.5bn reasons why, as I said in my last PM to you that you haven't replied to. You made the excuse that all the problems with manager mode are due to inherited buggy code, well why not fix that code instead of adding even more new buggy code such as with the assistant manager or the way the dynamic board expectations work (or rather don't), not to mention the lack of any kind of remotely authentic finance system (despite this supposedly being one of the mythical 50 improvements).

And yes I know this post will never see the light of day will it? Well Marcel you know and I know I posted it.
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Screw it, decided to re-post this here, why should our voices be cut off by the censorship of a pre-moderated forum? We bought the game, we should have the right to get feedback on our complaints.
 
Placebo said:
Oh dear BIS are in trouble :(

In principle the law is a good idea, the problem is that in actuality the main result from it would be a complete lack of ambition in future games, gone will be the likes of ArmA 1/2, Stalker, Boiling Point, The Witcher, ambitious games from small independent devs, all you'll see are endless corridor shooter COD clones. No developer wants to release a buggy product, unfortunately it's sometimes a necessity for the sake of the long term future of a developer to release first, patch later, at least what's released is a game with ambition/depth/scope (when it works ;)), of course a dev the size of EA really has no excuse IMO to not do proper QA before release and to hold back a product if it's full of bugs (as Fifa10 was).
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exactly, this will stifle creativity and ingenuity, this is a fucking horrible idea. Who would determine what is a buggy game or just a shitty one? And honestly how does this effect EA, it wouldnt it would effect the retailer you would think
 
Jamezinho said:
It's difficult to split them as they both do some things very well but both are full of flaws. Generally what I like in PES is done poorly in Fifa and vice versa. I love the slick passing in Fifa and even on semi (which I use) there is still plenty of freedom to put the ball where I want and also make plenty of mistakes (a good thing). Passing in PES is still too rigid, automated and restrictive. However I love the shooting in PES, the feeling of being able to really smack a ball and the chance of it going in from anywhere. If anything there's a lot more freedom to the shooting in PES as there are no sweet spots as such. In Fifa 10 the shooting still doesn't feel right (as has been discussed in the last few pages). It still feels a bit weak - although long shots are improved - and floaty, and snap shots just aren't as fierce as in PES. However I do enjoy the deft finesse finishes in Fifa. Goalkeepers can be just the wrong side of superhuman in Fifa but too far on the side of Heurelho Gomes in PES.

Overall Fifa 10 hasn't really addressed my problems with Fifa 09. The shooting is slightly better, the 360 movement is nice but adds little as it's still too fiddly and unnatural to take on a defender. The unrelenting pressing game of the CPU is a bad as ever and they still don't tire and can perfectly intercept every pass. But it's a different experience and a welcome change from PES. At least the referees and advantage rule work properly in Fifa 10.

Ultimately both games are too flawed to knock PES5 off it's perch, though. They've both been massively over-hyped.
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I disagree about fifa 360, at least vs a human that shit is implemented very well. You can slow your man down, size up the defender and choose four paths depending where you are on the pitch

1.)pass(including crossing)
2.)shoot
3.)beat your man with combo of rb(slow dribble) and sprint
4.) beat your man with the silled moves and sprint

if you slow the game down and play this way down the flanks againt a human the 360 dribbling shines... now against the cpu all of this is impossible(i think) but 1 v 1 vs a human, pretty effective and in this respect i think fifa is revolutionary, but what kills me for fifa is this

1.)player stamina
2.)constant pressure
3.)the pitch is not big enough
4.)not enough differences amongst players
5.)playing vs the cpu is simply not fun by yourself, it gets better with 2 or three vs ai
 
nerf said:
Just played FIFA 10 for the first time in over a week... lasted one match and then switched it off. Urgh. An exercise in frustration.
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I'll elaborate, now that I feel more inclined. It might be cathartic:

-

For starters, why does the game have such confusion with manual through balls and player selection?

So often I'll have the ball with my defensive midfielder and use manual through pass to spread the ball wide into the path of my fullback, encouraging him to push forward on that flank. But no, my winger has to take control instead. Even though he's further away and his momentum is heading in the opposite direction, he has to automatically turn around and run back ten yards to collect a pass that my fullback could have easily strolled onto, completely halting the passing move.

It's extra fun when my winger then gets whistled for coming back from an offside position to take control. I clearly wasn't even passing to you! :RANT:

-

Don't you love that corner routine the CPU often does at least once per match, the one where the corner-taker just passes the ball along the ground to the feet of your nearest defender? Most generous :FAIL:

-

What's the point in me trying to defend as a team or hold any sort of shape when, with great ease, the CPU midfielders/defenders can casually pass forwards to their striker's feet at any time they like?

I take control of the player nearest the ball, trying to jockey sensibly just inside my own half, but behind me it's a free-for-all. AI teammates lurch about in various directions, the midfield shows no interest in holding any shape, and at any point the CPU player can just slide an easy forward pass to their attackers while my defenders back off.

Defending is so, so un-rewarding and always relies on scrambling desperately around the penalty area, constantly battling against heavy inertia, sluggish acceleration and clumsy player selection. In reality it should be more about maintaining shape and organisation, defending as an entire team from front to back, adjusting to close down passing lanes, jockeying and forcing the opponent to play sideways or backwards in order to retain possession... you get almost none of that. You even got more of it in 09.

-

Yet another problem caused by the excessive player inertia is how easy it now is to beat a fullback down the wing. Simply run forwards at him then nudge the right thumbstick - you have all the forward inertia, the fullback has none, he can't turn quick enough, he can't accelerate quick enough to intercept, and you have yet another easy crossing opportunity without even trying :BORED:

-

Why do outfield players now push up so painfully slowly when you have a goal kick?

Your goalkeeper is stood waiting to take it, everyone else shuffles backwards away from him as slowly as possible, barely exiting your penalty area. This didn't happen in FIFA 09 and doesn't in real life. Make them turn and jog into position!

I launched a goal kick long toward my striker, who was the only one to have pushed up anywhere near the halfway line. He lost the header and it bounced to a CPU midfielder, who immediately sent the ball forwards. My tardy defenders had been so slow pushing out that they were still staggering forwards as the through ball flew past them in the opposite direction, giving the CPU striker an entirely free run on goal. Once I'd lost that initial header on the halfway line, there was nothing else I could do to influence play. Of course, my 'keeper automatically comes blundering out and the 2.Bundesliga-level striker executes another immaculate chip to score - quelle surprise.

-

Why does my goalkeeper just love to punch over-hit, non-dangerous crosses over his own bar? It wasn't anywhere close to going in the goal or near an attacker, just catch it or leave it! :CURSE:

-

I could go on, but you probably get the picture of why that one match was my first and last of the week.
 
I've been playing this since release date and I'm still enjoying it. That said, all I do is play ranked match. I've never once played MM, even on 08 and 09. :SMUG:
 
Nerf,

do you wanna put that in Chris's thread so it gets sent on to EA? Maybe touch it up a bit so they have solutions rather than just the problems - if you aren't literal with EA they'll likely quick fix it rather than make sure it stays fixed.
 
romagnoli said:
Nerf,

do you wanna put that in Chris's thread so it gets sent on to EA? Maybe touch it up a bit so they have solutions rather than just the problems - if you aren't literal with EA they'll likely quick fix it rather than make sure it stays fixed.
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Sure, I'll try and pick the bones out of my rant some time. Right now, I've just taken FIFA 10 away from the console and stored it high on the bookcase amongst other games I might not touch again.

Had another go tonight (I do try to persevere). A snowy game against a team in an all-white kit with a white ball was never going to end well, was it? Apparently that was a cup competition I'm eliminated from, so the newspaper after the game informed me. I had no idea it was a cup game to start with, another triumph for Marcel's atmospheric MM.
 
nerf said:
So often I'll have the ball with my defensive midfielder and use manual through pass to spread the ball wide into the path of my fullback, encouraging him to push forward on that flank. But no, my winger has to take control instead. Even though he's further away and his momentum is heading in the opposite direction, he has to automatically turn around and run back ten yards to collect a pass that my fullback could have easily strolled onto, completely halting the passing move.

It's extra fun when my winger then gets whistled for coming back from an offside position to take control. I clearly wasn't even passing to you! :RANT:

-

What's the point in me trying to defend as a team or hold any sort of shape when, with great ease, the CPU midfielders/defenders can casually pass forwards to their striker's feet at any time they like?

I take control of the player nearest the ball, trying to jockey sensibly just inside my own half, but behind me it's a free-for-all. AI teammates lurch about in various directions, the midfield shows no interest in holding any shape, and at any point the CPU player can just slide an easy forward pass to their attackers while my defenders back off.

Defending is so, so un-rewarding and always relies on scrambling desperately around the penalty area, constantly battling against heavy inertia, sluggish acceleration and clumsy player selection. In reality it should be more about maintaining shape and organisation, defending as an entire team from front to back, adjusting to close down passing lanes, jockeying and forcing the opponent to play sideways or backwards in order to retain possession... you get almost none of that. You even got more of it in 09.

-

Yet another problem caused by the excessive player inertia is how easy it now is to beat a fullback down the wing. Simply run forwards at him then nudge the right thumbstick - you have all the forward inertia, the fullback has none, he can't turn quick enough, he can't accelerate quick enough to intercept, and you have yet another easy crossing opportunity without even trying :BORED:
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Agree with this.

I have not played FIFA for around a month, I came on here to see if anything has been fixed in a patch yet(HA!), started thinking about giving the game another go, read this post and now have no desire to touch the game.

Thanks EA, 25 quid for around 10 or so hours of frustrating football gaming. Just for some contrast I am still playing PES 5 after what? 4 years is it? I will never buy another EA game again.
 
For those who don't know EA are now backtracking with the promised fixed audio DLC :(

EA_Jeff_MacP said:
Hey everyone. Thank you so much for all your help!

I have pages and pages of both existing bugs and great improvement ideas for the future.

We've addressed a good deal of the existing bugs and hope to implement most of everything else as we move forward.

As far as this little update is concerned it's looking like it's going to be a lot more difficult to release this than I had anticipated. (Both due to circumstances we control and some we do not.)

I'm not sure when we're going to be able to put out a commentary fix. I know it's not a very high priority for anyone (except me) but I really wanted to do this. I'm sorry if I insinuated that this was a "for sure" thing. I only mentioned that I hoped to get it out.

We're still working on it and looking at options, but please don't expect anything soon. Thanks again for all the valuable feedback (I wish some of you guys were testing the game before it came out!)

I am truly sorry - let the flame-fest begin!

Jeff.
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http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/...851024-we-need-your-help-16.html#post11973209

Disappointing but one can say it's not a huge surprise considering they were happy to release a game so blatantly riddled with bugs :(
 
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