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eFootball (All Platforms)

The_Knight said:
Looks like FIFA'22 is no longer an option. What the hell is this garbage?




I won't even bother go deep into everything wrong with the ball physics, the passing physics and player momentum (is there even, player momentum?) The whole clip is just garbage.

So with FIFA'22 out of the way, we're either playing eFootball or modded PES 2021 (I'll call it PES 2022).
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i love how the crowd rushes to the fence (down the stairs on the ranks) when the first goal was scored (@ 2:45 min)! that looks so nice!!
 
lilicesar said:
Will we ever see something like that? (with some corrections)
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giphy-downsized-large.gif
 
The_Knight said:
Looks like FIFA'22 is no longer an option. What the hell is this garbage?




I won't even bother go deep into everything wrong with the ball physics, the passing physics and player momentum (is there even, player momentum?) The whole clip is just garbage.

So with FIFA'22 out of the way, we're either playing eFootball or modded PES 2021 (I'll call it PES 2022).
Click to expand...

It's extremely quick, it skips animations to make it as responsive as possible, it's counter attack after counter attack, you can dribble like crazy, players sliding on the pitch all over the place. Did you expect anything else, despite they claiming they changed the animation engine?

Anyone expecting improvements is deluding himself, EA is now in a monopoly, they know it and we know that is the worst possible outcome for football games.
 
vialli82 said:
(Big Edited/Re-writed)

About 2013 version, didn't liked that game that much at the time, and now. The physical engine was totally outdated, PS2.5 and it was too much year with it, i really gotted enough of that engine. 2008-2010, then some some algorithms on PES 2011 were added, i remember with 16 directions instead of 8/the dualshock 3 even with the normal 4 directionnal tooked in account 16 directions, that was one special stuff of their directionnal cross. But was better to play with the analog. Now i feel it less, weirdly, when i relaunch the game, it doesn't bother me like that time : but others things does, many others things.

That time physics was resumed by 10% physics, 90% stats. Stats maked the game, no difference if you putted 150kg or 50 kg on the pitch.
Now for example a player with 200 meters will push the ball longer because he gots longer legs, i tried on test, no change at all regarding of of that.
Or deceleration > same that's why i talk about KG influences. Now try to decelerate with a fast but big player. Stats matters, but hare handled differently due to physics who enter in the equation.
In fact, to make a player pushing longer the ball : you should've decreased both Dribbling Speed and dribbling precision, and increase Speed and Explosive power... Or something weird like that. Not interested anymore but you can try in Training sessions. When i play retro, it's FIFA and PES 11, even PES 2010 (who keeped the same system as PES PS2, with better graphics) and PES 1-3-5-6. Also Fifa 14. But no, PES 2013 i just tried with your advices : yes it's beautiful, it's cool, graphics and all, but on the pitch... And shooting was floaty and players to light (not on PES 2011 > To me the closest version regarding overall feeling to PES 5. Heavy shoot and feeling of weight for players. Globally a better feeling, but perhaps a bit less tactical and more phyisically balanced)

So no. Wasn't that better, only off the pitch if you remove magic boots of course/you can with PESEDIT patch. And no one liked that boots boots at the time, it was severely criticised. First time i read it was "fun".
PES 2013 is overrated here, i tried and retried it... No way, there's too much space, bad keepers, too uneffective to defend physically.

But yes we could've out of the pitch making tons of stuffs : even better than stadium creator to me was face importing faces. Well you gotted to make it match with the skin color and also correct face side (Ibra nose for example) but it was a big gain of time.

To me it was Fifa all over the place, even the 13, but i liked PES 2011, more feeling of inertia, better overall defense. So season 2010-11 was a good year for me, as FIFA 11 was my favorite Fifa and PES 2011 my favorite on PS3 era.
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Hi Vialli, FIFA 11 for me likewise. Probably my favorite football game of all time. I tried PES 2011, but didn’t like it. I think that was the first PES I ever played.
But I have to try PES 2013, since there is so much praise for it. The physics thing probably won’t bother me so much. As long as all the famous players feel like individuals and the gameplay is fun. Plus it’s all around the sweet spot: new enough to have nice graphics and stuff and old enough to be fun. I think 360/PS3 was the best era in gaming. Footballwise too, 2013 feels like a couple years ago to me, so many of the same players will be there, but then also stars from my childhood too, like Beckham, Riquelme, etc. I order it for Xbox 360. Hopefully datapacks/patches are still available for downloading on 360, if not I may be screwed 🤷🏻‍♂️
 
The_Knight said:
Looks like FIFA'22 is no longer an option. What the hell is this garbage?




I won't even bother go deep into everything wrong with the ball physics, the passing physics and player momentum (is there even, player momentum?) The whole clip is just garbage.

So with FIFA'22 out of the way, we're either playing eFootball or modded PES 2021 (I'll call it PES 2022).
Click to expand...

That looks absolutely dreadful. Just goes to show that for all the buzzwords & hype E.A spew our each year they are not interested in making a game that resembles football in any way, shape or form.
 
PRO_TOO said:
not sure if this was posted before...

eFootball Next-Gen Visuals Will Feature Major Upgrades​


https://www.operationsports.com/efootball-next-gen-visuals-will-feature-major-upgrades/amp/
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“Expect to see major visual enhancements on PS5 and Xbox Series X” but confirmed that “there is no 120Hz support on console.”
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Hmmm, I had run the NFG beta at 120hz on the Xbox Series S, so I'm thinking if it's really a Cors platform all the time, to play the game on the Xbox, because it was far smoother and responsive there than on the PS5 which was 60 fps or even lower on cutscenes...

Now that you think about it, if there are no more OF and you can't edit the game ... Xbox Series S is a great choice for eFans. The game will be digital-only, 120hz, free online for F2P games, and the console are much cheaper and easier to find.
 
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༺Ƥeຮ༻ said:
Hmmm, I had run the NFG beta at 120hz on the Xbox Series S, so I'm thinking if it's really a Cors platform all the time, to play the game on the Xbox, because it was far smoother and responsive there than on the PS5 which was 60 fps or even lower on cutscenes... Now that you think about it, if there are no more OF and you can't edit the game ... Xbox Series S is a great choice for eF fans. The game will be digital-only, 120hz, free online for F2P games, and the console are much cheaper and easier to find.
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there is already a term for "those users"!? :THINK:
:LOL:
you sure the test run at 120hz or your tv just interpolated the 60hz image?!
dont forget the tv thats needed... i can think of the majority of tv's in households still being at 1080p...
 
The_Knight said:
I'm feeling more and more pessimistic as we move forward. I feel that this eFootball will just be a mobile game that looks better on consoles, that's all. They have hundreds of millions of players on mobile, and Konami is officially now a mobile game company, not a console game developer. We'll see, I guess.
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Same. Otherwise how would the cross platform element even work with mobile?

Unless the online gameplay is significantly simplified or different gameplay on next gen and mobile.

That is the make or break point for me…
 
PRO_TOO said:
there is already a term for "those users"!? :THINK:
:LOL:
you sure the test run at 120hz or your tv just interpolated the 60hz image?!
dont forget the tv thats needed... i can think of the majority of tv's in households still being at 1080p...
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:D Yeah.. well we know all PES fans will try eF... so they fan base for now is still the PES fanbase, for now.

This " secret LG OLED Menu " shows the input information. The console has options to run everything on 120hz because of VRR! I'm not sure that the game is 120hz native or the console interpolated from 60hz to 120hz, but it all comes from the console, not from the TV. PS5 still doesn't have these options, you can't do that there!
Yes just 1440 or 1080p, the TV upscaling to 4K, but for me is enough.
 
The_Knight said:
Looks like FIFA'22 is no longer an option. What the hell is this garbage?




I won't even bother go deep into everything wrong with the ball physics, the passing physics and player momentum (is there even, player momentum?) The whole clip is just garbage.

So with FIFA'22 out of the way, we're either playing eFootball or modded PES 2021 (I'll call it PES 2022).
Click to expand...

- The best pes iterations had skipping animations also. This made the gameplay feel crisp. Realistic animations take long and result in unresponsiveness and a laggy feeling. The same goes with player momentum. It's ok to have some, but ultra realistic momentum is something you don't want in a game in my opinion. It just add to the unresponsiveness.
- The passing physics in this fifa clip look decent too me. Maybe a little to fast, but I rather have it this fast than like how it is in pes. Like the ball is floating in butter.
- The shooting physics in this fifa clips looks still a little floaty to me, it could be more crisp and tight.
I didnt analyse this clip extensively, but I don't think it's garbage at all. Maybe fifa is going into the right direction. That's is making a u turn from ultra realistic and going back to balancing arcade and sim gameplay.
 
The_Knight said:
Looks like FIFA'22 is no longer an option. What the hell is this garbage?




I won't even bother go deep into everything wrong with the ball physics, the passing physics and player momentum (is there even, player momentum?) The whole clip is just garbage.

So with FIFA'22 out of the way, we're either playing eFootball or modded PES 2021 (I'll call it PES 2022).
Click to expand...

I'm sure the game will be great with realistic sliders.
Dillion said:
- The best pes iterations had skipping animations also. This made the gameplay feel crisp. Realistic animations take long and result in unresponsiveness and a laggy feeling. The same goes with player momentum. It's ok to have some, but ultra realistic momentum is something you don't want in a game in my opinion. It just add to the unresponsiveness.
- The passing physics in this fifa clip look decent too me. Maybe a little to fast, but I rather have it this fast than like how it is in pes. Like the ball is floating in butter.
- The shooting physics in this fifa clips looks still a little floaty to me, it could be more crisp and tight.
I didnt analyse this clip extensively, but I don't think it's garbage at all. Maybe fifa is going into the right direction. That's is making a u turn from ultra realistic and going back to balancing arcade and sim gameplay.
Click to expand...
I've watched both games and so far for me ef22 looks more natural. The player's movements and ball physics are better. Shooting in ef22 also better than pes21 where the ball didnt fly like a bowling ball. Inside a football is air so it must have some degree of floatiness. But in ef22 it needs more variety and shooting error
 
Sovereign Hope said:
I'm sure the game will be great with realistic sliders.

I've watched both games and so far for me ef22 looks more natural. The player's movements and ball physics are better. Shooting in ef22 also better than pes21 where the ball didnt fly like a bowling ball. Inside a football is air so it must have some degree of floatiness. But in ef22 it needs more variety and shooting error
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Sure, but looking better is something different than playing better.
I think we all wanted that pes became visually realistic. I think it all started with us wanting 360 degree movement.
Since Konami introduced that, the game looked more realistic for sure, but the sluggishness also came.
I'm not saying we shouldn't have realistic movements. I'm just saying they should be implemented when they are sure they will not affect the responsiveness of the game.
Because in my opinion the unresponsiveness of pes has a big part of killing the fun of the series.
 
Dillion said:
Sure, but looking better is something different than playing better.
I think we all wanted that pes became visually realistic. I think it all started with us wanting 360 degree movement.
Since Konami introduced that, the game looked more realistic for sure, but the sluggishness also came.
I'm not saying we shouldn't have realistic movements. I'm just saying they should be implemented when they are sure they will not affect the responsiveness of the game.
Because in my opinion the unresponsiveness of pes has a big part of killing the fun of the series.
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I'd take realistic animations over super responsiveness any day, any time
 
The "unresponsiveness" is actually a part of what makes the game more realistic. In real football you can't pass the ball in a split second, you actually need to wind the foot up and connect with the ball, the further it is supposed to go, the longer it takes.
 
Isslander said:
The "unresponsiveness" is actually a part of what makes the game more realistic. In real football you can't pass the ball in a split second, you actually need to wind the foot up and connect with the ball, the further it is supposed to go, the longer it takes.
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Thats my point. The question is does that make the game more fun or playable. Everyone his own opinion or taste of course, but for me it ruins the fun of the game. In real football players can't sprint for as long as they do in pes and fifa. Should they adjust that too? No of course not because that kind of realism doesn't contribute to the fun factor.
A game is a game and doesn't need to reflect real life 100%. Imagine a fight game to be 100% realistic. One punch and the opponent would be knocked out or injured.
A shooter would't be fun if the player was shot dead each hit or couldn't sprint for more than 1 minute.
It shouldn't be black or white, realistic or arcade, but a good mix of both. And I think it now too much focused on animations and stuff.

But i'm curious, what do you think konami needs to improve than in pes or efootball, to get it back to the 'old' level. Or maybe you think that think pes didnt go downhill the past few years?
 
Dillion said:
Sure, but looking better is something different than playing better.
I think we all wanted that pes became visually realistic. I think it all started with us wanting 360 degree movement.
Since Konami introduced that, the game looked more realistic for sure, but the sluggishness also came.
I'm not saying we shouldn't have realistic movements. I'm just saying they should be implemented when they are sure they will not affect the responsiveness of the game.
Because in my opinion the unresponsiveness of pes has a big part of killing the fun of the series.
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360 movement is what caused football games to get worse imo. No football game with the introduction of 360 movement is better than Pes 1 to 6. Those games you felt 100% in control. No one can say the same for modern day Fifa. Pes you still feel in control as im pretty sure its got less movement than Fifa? Possibly 32 directions compared to 64?
 
Madmac79 said:
For all I care, Fifa 22 could turn in an action rpg and honestly it still wouldn't make me more excited or more inclined to play Pes 21 or the Ething 22.
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Exactly my feelings. PES 2021 is a hideous game and I don’t want to play it ever again.

I’ve seen people here say it’s the best PES ever - and they’re more than entitled to their opinion of course. But - really? Jesus Christ. I can think of 5 PES games straight away which are much better. Then you can arguably make a case for games like PES 2014 and PES 4 being better (two games which I didn’t rate at the time).

FIFA is on another planet to PES now. Someone at the soccer gaming Reddit summed up modern PES - it was their first experience with the series and they said it was like those old arcade games where you just press a button to score. Strip down PES and it’s an arcade game and has been for ages. It’s archaic - when I score a goal in PES 2019 onwards it doesn’t feel like I’ve scored it - feels like the CPU has done it for me and I’ve just pressed a button to make it happen (yes I know essentially that this is exactly what has happened but you get my point).

FIFA, even when it’s shit - is still far deeper than PES and has been for years, both on and off the pitch. So it doesn’t surprise me that Konami have said “F**k it, let’s just make a free myClub game for the masses, they only focus on player faces and hoarding classic Totti and Beckham player cards anyway.”

And here we are: an even more simplified version of PES, called eFootball - dumbed down, end-to-end, tap-shoot-to-score arcade soccer.

It’s over for PES but it has been for years if you really think about it.
 
Mikhail said:
Exactly my feelings. PES 2021 is a hideous game and I don’t want to play it ever again.

I’ve seen people here say it’s the best PES ever - and they’re more than entitled to their opinion of course. But - really? Jesus Christ. I can think of 5 PES games straight away which are much better. Then you can arguably make a case for games like PES 2014 and PES 4 being better (two games which I didn’t rate at the time).

FIFA is on another planet to PES now. Someone at the soccer gaming Reddit summed up modern PES - it was their first experience with the series and they said it was like those old arcade games where you just press a button to score. Strip down PES and it’s an arcade game and has been for ages. It’s archaic - when I score a goal in PES 2019 onwards it doesn’t feel like I’ve scored it - feels like the CPU has done it for me and I’ve just pressed a button to make it happen (yes I know essentially that this is exactly what has happened but you get my point).

FIFA, even when it’s shit - is still far deeper than PES and has been for years, both on and off the pitch. So it doesn’t surprise me that Konami have said “F**k it, let’s just make a free myClub game for the masses, they only focus on player faces and hoarding classic Totti and Beckham player cards anyway.”

And here we are: an even more simplified version of PES, called eFootball - dumbed down, end-to-end, tap-shoot-to-score arcade soccer.

It’s over for PES but it has been for years if you really think about it.
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last couple of PES years... in pictures...



...final pic says it all!
 
FIFA, even when it’s shit - is still far deeper than PES and has been for years
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sorry mate but your opinion... iam playing a lot PES 2021 full manual against a friend and that game can be really good. if we talk about simulation or arcade then it is for one of the best games in PES history. and scoring on full manual can be really satisfying!

Fifa for me was the last years a big mess with ridiculous animations, ping pong passing and awakened skills... i cant even get my 10 hours origin trial full, because it was absolutely not my game. if you want fun on the pitch fifa could be right but if you want play football then pes on full manal is still its own class for me...

Kids opening FUT packs and showing ridiculous goals with 100 skill moves, that's what I connect with FIFA... and i try it year for year... :SNACK:

"Time change but Fifa never" - Abraham Lincoln 1809-1865
 
elloco said:
sorry mate but your opinion... iam playing a lot PES 2021 full manual against a friend and that game can be really good. if we talk about simulation or arcade then it is for one of the best games in PES history. and scoring on full manual can be really satisfying!

Fifa for me was the last years a big mess with ridiculous animations, ping pong passing and awakened skills... i cant even get my 10 hours origin trial full, because it was absolutely not my game. if you want fun on the pitch fifa could be right but if you want play football then pes on full manal is still its own class for me...

Kids opening FUT packs and showing ridiculous goals with 100 skill moves, that's what I connect with FIFA... and i try it year for year... :SNACK:

"Time change but Fifa never" - Abraham Lincoln 1809-1865
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Oh don’t get me wrong, I’m not a lover of FIFA in its current form.

But for me, there are so many different ways to score, so many different things happening on and off the pitch (Career Mode, let’s forget FUT and myClub for a minute because I don’t go near those modes).

Master League in PES is just playing matches. You don’t ‘manage’ a club. It’s boring arse.

And then on the pitch - the way the CPU plays in higher difficulties is just so tedious and unrealistic. They sit deep, let you pass pass pass to the 18 yard box and then BAM the CPU defender will assault my player. No foul given, no penalty or free kick - the CPU will counter attack with a super scripted manoeuvre and score the same kind of goal every single time.

PES 2021 with its yellow pitches, terrible sound mixing, oversaturated graphics, monotonous gameplay and shallow Master League was the final nail in the coffin for me and it’s why I play PES 5 and FIFA 16 now.
 
Mikhail said:
Exactly my feelings. PES 2021 is a hideous game and I don’t want to play it ever again.

I’ve seen people here say it’s the best PES ever - and they’re more than entitled to their opinion of course. But - really? Jesus Christ. I can think of 5 PES games straight away which are much better. Then you can arguably make a case for games like PES 2014 and PES 4 being better (two games which I didn’t rate at the time).

FIFA is on another planet to PES now. Someone at the soccer gaming Reddit summed up modern PES - it was their first experience with the series and they said it was like those old arcade games where you just press a button to score. Strip down PES and it’s an arcade game and has been for ages. It’s archaic - when I score a goal in PES 2019 onwards it doesn’t feel like I’ve scored it - feels like the CPU has done it for me and I’ve just pressed a button to make it happen (yes I know essentially that this is exactly what has happened but you get my point).

FIFA, even when it’s shit - is still far deeper than PES and has been for years, both on and off the pitch. So it doesn’t surprise me that Konami have said “F**k it, let’s just make a free myClub game for the masses, they only focus on player faces and hoarding classic Totti and Beckham player cards anyway.”

And here we are: an even more simplified version of PES, called eFootball - dumbed down, end-to-end, tap-shoot-to-score arcade soccer.

It’s over for PES but it has been for years if you really think about it.
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It's because EA moved towards systems-based design a decade ago whereas Konami stuck with the old school "brute forcing" method. Brute forcing being where they predefine or "script" a finite set of possibilities and interactions in an attempt to create an illusion of simulation, vs systems based which tries to replicate the underlying real life physical systems resulting in "emergent behavior" that leads to vastly more possible outcomes but also greater unpredictability (plus likely greater development complexity). Because the technology hasn't really been there for one approach to vastly outmatch the other, Konami have been able to maintain a style of gameplay that is preferred by some due to various characteristics like its weightiness, but the problem with that is once the technological gap gets big enough you will likely be left in the dust, just as happened at the start of the PS3 era when EA had moved to animation sets built with motion capture resulting in far more fidelity and variation whilst Konami were still hand-crafting each animation. The same thing is going to happen again with things like greater involvement of AI/machine learning in animation and player behavior, full match captures etc. FIFA 22, while there is a lot of things I don't like about it so far, looks like a fairly solid base for future development, especially if they were one day persuaded to make a realism/sim mode resulting in things such as fouls and defensive urgency.
 
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