Arsenal Thread

[gerd]

Of course losong against a lower division team is a bad result. But those things happen. Wasn't even Man Utd once eliminated by Leeds who then played in League One?

There are things i don't understand (the main being why Arshavin is never playing, he is one of the only world class players Arsenal still has). And what is perhaps the weakest point of this team (for years now) is their extreme mental fragility.
So i agree that fans have reasons to complain. But give Arsenal a decent scoring CF and they will end up where they belong: fourth place.

Basically there are 3 teams who are out of reach: both Manchester teams and Chelsea. Man Utd is an enigma to me. Once again it looks like they are very vulnerable, but once again they have six point lead. Both Manchester City and Cheslea are out of reach because Arsenal can't compete financially with those clubs. As a Spurs fan, i hope to see Spurs end above Arsenal, but i can't see it happening. Everton are doing great, but imo they are too dependent upon a couple of key players (Fellaini, Baines, Pienaar). In the end Arsena will end up fourth and that will be a good logical result.

I like most people in this thread, but to be honest i think you have irrealistic expectations. If i would say that i expect Spurs to win the EPL and go as far as possible in the CL (meaning certainly beyond the group stage and preferably at least to the semi-finals), i think most of you would have a good laugh. Yet, do you honestly think that Arsenal are that much stronger than Spurs? Yes they humiliated Spurs a couple of weeks ago, but that was against 10 Spurs players and a Spurs team witout it's two most important players... I think that Arsenal are still stronger than Spurs but not much.

You people also expect too much of some players. The latest being Oxlade Chamberlain: from what i saw this season (and i have seen quite a few Arsenal matches), Walcott is till much better than Oxlade Chamberlain. The kid suffers the traditional second season syndrome. Just let him be and don't expect him to be the next World Class player and maybe he will become one.

To me that is typically English: overhyping players and then afterwards being too negative about them. It happened with Walcott, it happens with Wilshere, it happens with Sterling, it happened with Bale and it happens with Oxlade Chamberlain. All of them are very good, young promising players, but don't expect them to be the next Messi, Ronaldo, Ibrahimovic or other world stars. That is quite a burden for these young lads...

 

[BobbyBox]

I am angry at not beating a league 2 side, but I want to see what Wenger does in January,if he brings in players and who. I want to see where we end up this season and how we got there.

These things will all determine if I will start asking for Wenger to leave.

Jack and Rosicky back are big pluses and I think results will start to turn around and if we can get a couple of the signings that are being touted around, then the second half of the season should hopefully be better.

But we have Reading and Wigan away in our next two games, we got beaten by a league 2 side away, so unless our players magically play ridiculously well, then I'm not expecting maximum points from these....and we need maximum points from them.

Gervinho's miss was ridiculous and it is becoming more and more evident that he should stay out wide. But I also think he was one of our best players last night (Which doesn't say much ) when he is out wide he can take on defenders and can beat them, his final ball is cack though and I don't know if that can ever be fixed, but they need to work on it with him, if he sorts that out he could be a great asset to us. But he is one of the most frustrating players, not for me because he is hopeless, but because he does have the potential to be really good, he just lets himself down nearly every game.

I really think we should try a formation with Cazorla as one of the attacking wide forwards and put Rosicky, Arteta and Wilshere in the middle. Cazorla and Rosicky could alternate. But we need to find a place for Rosicky, whenever he has played we look much better as a team.

.........Szcz............
Sag...Mert.....Verm.....Gibbs
......Arteta.....Wilshere....
..........Rosicky............
Walcott.....Giroud.......Cazorla

That team with Podolski, Gervinho and the Ox to come on. Even to try Podolski a bit more in the centre would be good. Using The Ox and Gervinho to come on for the last 20mins would be better I think at the moment.

I really do think another defensive minded midfielder and a Striker in January (Extra to Henry) would set us up nicely and if we are feeling really extravagant, then another quality wide forward to bed in before Walcott leaves in the summer (Unless he goes in Jan).

But the thing is we could be messed up before Jan if we don't get the results in the next 4-5 games.

The clear thing is though that something needs to be changed and fast.

 

[jonneymendoza]

Of course losong against a lower division team is a bad result. But those things happen. Wasn't even Man Utd once eliminated by Leeds who then played in League One?

There are things i don't understand (the main being why Arshavin is never playing, he is one of the only world class players Arsenal still has). And what is perhaps the weakest point of this team (for years now) is their extreme mental fragility.
So i agree that fans have reasons to complain. But give Arsenal a decent scoring CF and they will end up where they belong: fourth place.

Basically there are 3 teams who are out of reach: both Manchester teams and Chelsea. Man Utd is an enigma to me. Once again it looks like they are very vulnerable, but once again they have six point lead. Both Manchester City and Cheslea are out of reach because Arsenal can't compete financially with those clubs. As a Spurs fan, i hope to see Spurs end above Arsenal, but i can't see it happening. Everton are doing great, but imo they are too dependent upon a couple of key players (Fellaini, Baines, Pienaar). In the end Arsena will end up fourth and that will be a good logical result.

I like most people in this thread, but to be honest i think you have irrealistic expectations. If i would say that i expect Spurs to win the EPL and go as far as possible in the CL (meaning certainly beyond the group stage and preferably at least to the semi-finals), i think most of you would have a good laugh. Yet, do you honestly think that Arsenal are that much stronger than Spurs? Yes they humiliated Spurs a couple of weeks ago, but that was against 10 Spurs players and a Spurs team witout it's two most important players... I think that Arsenal are still stronger than Spurs but not much.

You people also expect too much of some players. The latest being Oxlade Chamberlain: from what i saw this season (and i have seen quite a few Arsenal matches), Walcott is till much better than Oxlade Chamberlain. The kid suffers the traditional second season syndrome. Just let him be and don't expect him to be the next World Class player and maybe he will become one.

To me that is typically English: overhyping players and then afterwards being too negative about them. It happened with Walcott, it happens with Wilshere, it happens with Sterling, it happened with Bale and it happens with Oxlade Chamberlain. All of them are very good, young promising players, but don't expect them to be the next Messi, Ronaldo, Ibrahimovic or other world stars. That is quite a burden for these young lads...

Sorry but Us Arsenal fans dont have high expectations for our club. no one here is expecting arsenal to compete for a title and CL. what we are expecting is to fucking beat a league 2 side for fucksakes.

We are a Premier league side for fucksakes and to lose to a league 2 side is disgraceful, shocking and unacceptable.

Yes it happens with the likes of united losing to lower league sides in the cups but United time and time again always wins something in the season for united.

i rather arsenal lose to leeds, get knocked out in group stages of the CL but win like 5 titles in 7/8 years.

I'd take that within a heartbeat.

It is unfair for u to compare us to united when united have won trophies back to back for a laugh. Arsenal have won fuck all

Wenger is to blame for soo many of this bullshit

We are going backwards BIG TIME.

I am angry at not beating a league 2 side, but I want to see what Wenger does in January,if he brings in players and who. I want to see where we end up this season and how we got there.

These things will all determine if I will start asking for Wenger to leave.

Jack and Rosicky back are big pluses and I think results will start to turn around and if we can get a couple of the signings that are being touted around, then the second half of the season should hopefully be better.

But we have Reading and Wigan away in our next two games, we got beaten by a league 2 side away, so unless our players magically play ridiculously well, then I'm not expecting maximum points from these....and we need maximum points from them.

Gervinho's miss was ridiculous and it is becoming more and more evident that he should stay out wide. But I also think he was one of our best players last night (Which doesn't say much ) when he is out wide he can take on defenders and can beat them, his final ball is cack though and I don't know if that can ever be fixed, but they need to work on it with him, if he sorts that out he could be a great asset to us. But he is one of the most frustrating players, not for me because he is hopeless, but because he does have the potential to be really good, he just lets himself down nearly every game.

I really think we should try a formation with Cazorla as one of the attacking wide forwards and put Rosicky, Arteta and Wilshere in the middle. Cazorla and Rosicky could alternate. But we need to find a place for Rosicky, whenever he has played we look much better as a team.

.........Szcz............
Sag...Mert.....Verm.....Gibbs
......Arteta.....Wilshere....
..........Rosicky............
Walcott.....Giroud.......Cazorla

That team with Podolski, Gervinho and the Ox to come on. Even to try Podolski a bit more in the centre would be good. Using The Ox and Gervinho to come on for the last 20mins would be better I think at the moment.

I really do think another defensive minded midfielder and a Striker in January (Extra to Henry) would set us up nicely and if we are feeling really extravagant, then another quality wide forward to bed in before Walcott leaves in the summer (Unless he goes in Jan).

But the thing is we could be messed up before Jan if we don't get the results in the next 4-5 games.

The clear thing is though that something needs to be changed and fast.

Wenger wont do fuck all and u know it. he wont buy anyone or change tactics.

Gevinho will still fucking play. Ashavin will still be at home relaxing during a game. Ramsey will be played as a fucking winger etc etc.

nothing will change i guarantee it. We dont have a RVP that wil bail us out anymore so we are totaly fucked.

the best Change for arsenal is to sack wenger.

I have had enough of his bullshit. he wont fucking change at all and u fucking well know it mate.

 

[cfdh_edmundo]

This is the trouble when the board (and Arsene) say stuff like, "4th is a trophy", "winning isnt everything". Set low standards and eventually the club will be decline.

This result is horrendous, yet the reality is it's not that much of a shock simply because Arsenal have become so brittle. It's light years from the side that went a season unbeaten, and it's even a shadow of the team it was 3-4 years ago. The worst thing was this was almost a first choice team for Arsenal, in the olden days the Carling Cup teams would be made up of fringe players, but there aren't that many obviously fringe players anymore. The squad has been depleted of so much talent year after year that the notion of a first team player and a squad player has just merged into one big mess. Is Sezchecney first choice or Mannone? is Sagna first choice or Jenkinson? Coquelin or Ramsey? Giroud or Chamack?

 

[BobbyBox]

Sorry but Us Arsenal fans dont have high expectations for our club. no one here is expecting arsenal to compete for a title and CL. what we are expecting is to fucking beat a league 2 side for fucksakes.

We are a Premier league side for fucksakes and to lose to a league 2 side is disgraceful, shocking and unacceptable.

Yes it happens with the likes of united losing to lower league sides in the cups but United time and time again always wins something in the season for united.

i rather arsenal lose to leeds, get knocked out in group stages of the CL but win like 5 titles in 7/8 years.

I'd take that within a heartbeat.

It is unfair for u to compare us to united when united have won trophies back to back for a laugh. Arsenal have won fuck all

Wenger is to blame for soo many of this bullshit

We are going backwards BIG TIME.




Wenger wont do fuck all and u know it. he wont buy anyone or change tactics.

Gevinho will still fucking play. Ashavin will still be at home relaxing during a game. Ramsey will be played as a fucking winger etc etc.

nothing will change i guarantee it. We dont have a RVP that wil bail us out anymore so we are totaly fucked.

the best Change for arsenal is to sack wenger.

I have had enough of his bullshit. he wont fucking change at all and u fucking well know it mate.

I Think he has to to keep his job frankly, if he doesn't get anybody in and results continue he will be out. So he is a clever man and I think he must think by now he needs something extra.

Giroud has been scoring quite often now, but is out at the moment. Wenger should have got another Striker no doubt and we are paying for that now.

Everybody is going back to Arshavin again, whenever we are doing shit. He came on a couple of games ago and did shit, he isn't a great player anymore.

It will turn around, but hopefully it will be now and not in the new year, because by that time it will be too late.

This is the trouble when the board (and Arsene) say stuff like, "4th is a trophy", "winning isnt everything". Set low standards and eventually the club will be decline.

This result is horrendous, yet the reality is it's not that much of a shock simply because Arsenal have become so brittle. It's light years from the side that went a season unbeaten, and it's even a shadow of the team it was 3-4 years ago. The worst thing was this was almost a first choice team for Arsenal, in the olden days the Carling Cup teams would be made up of fringe players, but there aren't that many obviously fringe players anymore. The squad has been depleted of so much talent year after year that the notion of a first team player and a squad player has just merged into one big mess. Is Sezchecney first choice or Mannone? is Sagna first choice or Jenkinson? Coquelin or Ramsey? Giroud or Chamack?

I still think we have the talent, just not enough of it (obviously not as good as the Arsenal of the late 90's early 2000's).

Your questions at the end are exaggerated as well, Szcz is first choice, Sagna is first choice, Coq and Ramsey are squad players and Giroud is First Choice. So I disagree with what you are saying there.

I think the over riding thing for me is that the players we have aren't shit, they should be playing a lot better than they are and can play a lot better than they are. We don't have a shit team in my opinion and shit players, we are just playing shit at the moment, it just so happens the moment is quite long

I really think with a couple of additions in January we will have, squad wise one of the strongest squads we have had in a long while (yes we have had better individual players, but our squads have always been week), Wenger just needs to come up with something to make it harmonious and click together. If he doesn't and he can't get the best out of this team, then obviously he needs to think twice if he should still be at Arsenal and so do the board.

 

[gerd]

There is something wrong on the mental side.
Once Arsenal loose a match, they tend to have a series of losses, no matter how good or bad the teams are.

To give an hypothetical example: mid-week they can loose narrowly against Barcelona and this affects the squad that much that a couple of days later they are useless against very weak opposition. Arsenal is one of the only big clubs who has that very season for quite a time now.

IMO Wenger protects his players too much. Maybe i'm wrong, but i'm quite sure that this is something Wenger should solve one way or another (i honestly wouldn't know how). IMO it's ashame that Arsenal hasn't won silverware for all that period. At times they still played smashing football, but the last match i saw them (WBA) apart from one fantastic attack i wasn't impressed at all. IMO Arsenal were not good against WBA.

What is worrying is that most fans here thought they played excellent. They won deservedly, but IMO that was not a good performance.

Although i admire Wenger (he changed English football IMO he is the most influential manager of the EPL, Ferguson was the most succesfull but Wenger changed English football), i'm beginning to think that maybe it would be better if Arsenal let him go or give him another function in the club (which might not work, but how can a club separate elegantly from a person who did that much for the club ?).

PS: i hope this doesn't infuriate you guys, but personally i would like to see Arsène manage Chelsea...

 

[cfdh_edmundo]

You say that Arshavin "did shit" but he's leading the assists in the Carling Cup:

2012–13 Football League Cup - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He's only started 2 games for you this season, both in the League Cup, and he's got 5 assists in those games. In the premier league he's been brought on in 6 games usually been brought on in around the 80th minute (the earliest he's been brought on was in the 73 minute against Norwich) if you sum up his Premier League minutes this season you only get around one hour of mintues on the pitch. Also he's always been brough on when the team has been losing or drawing matches they should be winning (eg Villa away or QPR and Fulham at home). Even in those brief minutes he's still made some contributions. In the QPR game he put the cross in that led to the Arteta goal (he crossed the ball, Giroud headed it back, Cesar got a touch but Arteta scored it). In the Fulham game he put in the cross that Reither handballed, giving the last minute penalty that would have made it 4-3 if Arteta had scored it. In the Man Utd away game Arshavin controlled the ball and passed it back for Cazorla to score.

 

[BobbyBox]

There is something wrong on the mental side.
Once Arsenal loose a match, they tend to have a series of losses, no matter how good or bad the teams are.

To give an hypothetical example: mid-week they can loose narrowly against Barcelona and this affects the squad that much that a couple of days later they are useless against very weak opposition. Arsenal is one of the only big clubs who has that very season for quite a time now.

IMO Wenger protects his players too much. Maybe i'm wrong, but i'm quite sure that this is something Wenger should solve one way or another (i honestly wouldn't know how). IMO it's ashame that Arsenal hasn't won silverware for all that period. At times they still played smashing football, but the last match i saw them (WBA) apart from one fantastic attack i wasn't impressed at all. IMO Arsenal were not good against WBA.

What is worrying is that most fans here thought they played excellent. They won deservedly, but IMO that was not a good performance.

Although i admire Wenger (he changed English football IMO he is the most influential manager of the EPL, Ferguson was the most succesfull but Wenger changed English football), i'm beginning to think that maybe it would be better if Arsenal let him go or give him another function in the club (which might not work, but how can a club separate elegantly from a person who did that much for the club ?).

PS: i hope this doesn't infuriate you guys, but personally i would like to see Arsène manage Chelsea...

Definitely something wrong mentally with the team and I agree Wenger needs to be more critical of the team in public when we have results like that. Defeat does seem to effect us greatly.

I don't think anybody thought we were fantastic/excellent? against WBA, but we played much better than before and there were a lot of positives to take from it,which obviously haven't been taken into last nights game. We were not great against WBA but we were better than WBA and deserved to win imo and we had a few more chances than you suggest imo

We have a team though in my opinion when they can play well that can match Chelsea (When they were playing well) and Man City. So there is still hope there, at the moment it all rests with Arsene though, he needs to make this team work and make it consistently work, otherwise he will definitely go, the fans will make sure of it sadly, especially because of all he has done for us, it will be a sad end.....unless he sorts it all out.

The next two away games are crucial, if we lose them then the fans will go MENTAL!!!

 

[Damjan]

I'm praying that we get Wilfried Bony in January.

 

[BobbyBox]

You say that Arshavin "did shit" but he's leading the assists in the Carling Cup:

2012–13 Football League Cup - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He's only started 2 games for you this season, both in the League Cup, and he's got 5 assists in those games. In the premier league he's been brought on in 6 games usually been brought on in around the 80th minute (the earliest he's been brought on was in the 73 minute against Norwich) if you sum up his Premier League minutes this season you only get around one hour of mintues on the pitch. Also he's always been brough on when the team has been losing or drawing matches they should be winning (eg Villa away or QPR and Fulham at home). Even in those brief minutes he's still made some contributions. In the QPR game he put the cross in that led to the Arteta goal (he crossed the ball, Giroud headed it back, Cesar got a touch but Arteta scored it). In the Fulham game he put in the cross that Reither handballed, giving the last minute penalty that would have made it 4-3 if Arteta had scored it. In the Man Utd away game Arshavin controlled the ball and passed it back for Cazorla to score.

He did shit in the game I was referring to.

I think he does well against lesser opposition, so might have been a good option yesterday I will agree with that. But overall he isn't the answer imo, if he played the whole game (talking in general) I don't think he would be very effective, it suits him to come on late in the game. We brought on Rosicky and The Ox Yesterday and dominated Bradford from that point really, so I don't think bringing on Arshavin was the problem, it was getting the ball in the net.

He isn't a shit player, but he isn't the answer either.

To be honest I still like him, but people forget he was just as frustrating as Gervinho is now, at least Gervinho gives his all in matches (all in my opinion obviously).

But also it is Wengers fault that people are crying out for a player like Arshavin, we should have better options.

 

[bebo]

Arshavin is the only player that could put a cross in the box, and Sagna attempt to put a cross to Gervinho is just having a laugh. The boy can`t even tap the ball into an open net.

Wenger couldn`t beat a League 2 side w/ a starting XI FFS! Stop saying let see what he does in January and then the summer and then back to January! I think Wenger is a clone w/ no soul!!! Where is Wenger and What have they done to My beloved Arsenal.

 

[Benni]

the reality is, Arshavin and Gervinho would do well to get in a midtable side let alone a team with Top 4 aspirations.

its a simple thing football. Bigger clubs buy better players to compete for higher league places and trophies.

But Arsenal are confused to their identity at the moment. They want to be big club but are not signing the best players despite being very wealthy.

The board and Wenger both have to share the blame. Arsenal need to invest in 3 or 4 world class players.

Season ticket at Arsenal is expensive and the supporters deserve better. Would Gervinho and Arshavin get near any of the top sides like Man City, Man Utd or Chelsea? I'm not so sure.

 

[BobbyBox]

Arshavin is the only player that could put a cross in the box, and Sagna attempt to put a cross to Gervinho is just having a laugh. The boy can`t even tap the ball into an open net.

Wenger couldn`t beat a League 2 side w/ a starting XI FFS! Stop saying let see what he does in January and then the summer and then back to January! I think Wenger is a clone w/ no soul!!! Where is Wenger and What have they done to My beloved Arsenal.

I think quite a few crosses are going in, but nobody is finishing them at the moment. Aiming a high ball at Gervinho is less than useless. but we have had quite a few really good low crosses that have been fucked up by the receiving players. Not saying our players are great at crosses, but it isn't a bad.

So you just want Wenger out Bebo? who to replace him? or you don't care at the moment?

I am saying lets see, because I really do think that if we get another striker and midfielder in, we will have a good set of players to do well with.

The team has changed a lot over the last season and a half, it takes time to get things together. Arguably we shouldn't be in this situation where a lot of players have changed but we are and that is reality.

It is the first time Wilshere has played with a lot of these players since his injury, he is getting a better understanding now with the players around him, Rosicky is back and looking good, Giroud was on a great run of form goal scoring wise. If it clicks and we can get a psychiatrist in for all of our players then I know this team can beat the teams in the league and do well....it's just when this is going to happen? which is the big question!

 

[gerd]

@ bobby: i wasn't referring to chances (of course Arsenal had various chances to score against WBA) but to attacks that came from 'good football' (that is very subjective, i know). I saw only one attack that was a consequence of good football (Arsenal's trademark and the reason why i like Arsenal). But i have to admit that 'good football' should not be the priority right now. Winning is the priority, no matter how...The question is if with Wenger's and Arsenal's philosophy of good football, the players have the ability to win ugly (Man Utd is the typical example of a team that wins ugly most of the time, and i don't mean this as being negative, it is their main strenght). IMO it is very well possible that this is becoming Wenger's tragedy: he became succesfull with a very attractive, open type of football. Slowly the better players left andthe replacements were young promising players who were brought up in this tradition, i fear that this type of players can only play that sort of open, "attractive" football. The big Arsenal sides had players who played atractive football, but could win very ugly and cynical too (look at Pires' diving for example).

To Benni: IMO Arshavin is still a class player. It's not because he doesn't succeed with Arsenal, that he can't be a succes with another big club. But it could be that is problem is homesickness (relatily few good Russian players succede outside of Russia) and then the best thing he can do is returning to Russia...

It's such a shame for both Arshavin and Arsenal.

 

[Rantboy]

Arshavin is the biggest scape goat I've seen in years. The guy didn't do 10% wrong to deserve all this vitriol from Arsenal "fans".

They label him lazy or uninterested or whatever. Well, he's almost 32 now, so you won't see him racing up and down the flank like Oxlade-Chamberlain does. Walcott is still young but not even he does it (but of course he is English and he gets away with it).

People forget how Arshavin played all 120 minutes against Reading and kept running at their defence (with purpose, unlike Gervinho) creating goals that led to our comeback. He had the energy that day probably because he was rested before. But regardless of that, he has talent which is not present in the players Wenger has been picking.

A classic example of irrational hatred towards him is what edmundo posted. The guy leads the competition in assists, but fans don't see that. Not even the manager, I guess, as he didn't even get a look to be seating on the bench.

In all fairness Arshavin has more magic and class in his injured left foot than Gervinho.
I give the example of an injured foot because people who acuse the Russian of lack of dedication/professionalism forgot how he once played an entire half with a nasty cut on his foot.

I'd pick him ahead of Gervinho any day.

But I think he has not enough "mental strength", as they say. That explains a lot, because his form truly dipped after fans began the hostile treatment towards him. He is devoid of confidence and belief (not only in himself, but the whole team). Also, he lost a lot of ambition because he knows he is in a team that will win fuck all.

Some players like Arteta fight til the end, even knowing that they're part of a shit team. That is the stuff captains are made of. But Arshavin, whilst a gifted footballer, doesn't have this in him, I think he has a negative disposition. That is my only criticism of him.

The rest is greatly due to Wenger not replacing lost quality in our squad, let alone making it better compared to previous seasons!

We're going downhill, it's very clear to see.

It's a sad state of affairs, but the Capital One Cup was our only shot at silverware this season and it's gone before Xmas, to a League 2 side. That's how low we got.

Wenger won't be axed before the end of the season, as we're not Chelsea. Nor it would be beneficial to us in any way. In such a short term, only he can fix the problems we hope he is aware of.
Problem is, when insisting so hard on Gervinho down the middle, Ramsey on the wings, etc, one wonders if Wenger is really aware of the problems.

 

[BobbyBox]

Arshavin is the biggest scape goat I've seen in years. The guy didn't do 10% wrong to deserve all this vitriol from Arsenal "fans".

They label him lazy or uninterested or whatever. Well, he's almost 32 now, so you won't see him racing up and down the flank like Oxlade-Chamberlain does. Walcott is still young but not even he does it (but of course he is English and he gets away with it).

People forget how Arshavin played all 120 minutes against Reading and kept running at their defence (with purpose, unlike Gervinho) creating goals that led to our comeback. He had the energy that day probably because he was rested before. But regardless of that, he has talent which is not present in the players Wenger has been picking.

A classic example of irrational hatred towards him is what edmundo posted. The guy leads the competition in assists, but fans don't see that. Not even the manager, I guess, as he didn't even get a look to be seating on the bench.

In all fairness Arshavin has more magic and class in his injured left foot than Gervinho.
I give the example of an injured foot because people who acuse the Russian of lack of dedication/professionalism forgot how he once played an entire half with a nasty cut on his foot.

I'd pick him ahead of Gervinho any day.

But I think he has not enough "mental strength", as they say. That explains a lot, because his form truly dipped after fans began the hostile treatment towards him. He is devoid of confidence and belief (not only in himself, but the whole team). Also, he lost a lot of ambition because he knows he is in a team that will win fuck all.

Some players like Arteta fight til the end, even knowing that they're part of a shit team. That is the stuff captains are made of. But Arshavin, whilst a gifted footballer, doesn't have this in him, I think he has a negative disposition. That is my only criticism of him.

The rest is greatly due to Wenger not replacing lost quality in our squad, let alone making it better compared to previous seasons!

We're going downhill, it's very clear to see.

It's a sad state of affairs, but the Capital One Cup was our only shot at silverware this season and it's gone before Xmas, to a League 2 side. That's how low we got.

Wenger won't be axed before the end of the season, as we're not Chelsea. Nor it would be beneficial to us in any way. In such a short term, only he can fix the problems we hope he is aware of.
Problem is, when insisting so hard on Gervinho down the middle, Ramsey on the wings, etc, one wonders if Wenger is really aware of the problems.

I don't think anybody hates Arshavin? and I haven't heard any vitriol towards him at all recently? He is a likeable fellow, but he isn't as good as you and others make out imo.

I don't think he was a scapegoat, a lot of players when he wasn't playing as well were not playing as well and got blasted for it as well. Just he had more responsibility on his shoulders because he was seen as one of our best players and more senior at the time. I think the criticism was justified, if he can take all of the plaudits when he had good games, he has to take the ones when he is playing bad.

Theo Walcott we have seen this season tracks back quite a lot and helps the team out more and more, so I can understand why he isn't being treated the same, he is also having quite a good season as well.

His lack of mental strength and motivation is a major flaw in him, he has the talent etc no doubt, but with his mentality it just doesn't work out. He had a couple of good seasons with us and even then he was inconsistent, you didn't know what Arshavin would turn up to a game and you could never count on him really.

Your only criticism of him is major and has stopped him becoming a great player for Arsenal (I think it has been the major reason, but you will probably say Arsene is the main reason?)

Gervinho isn't as talented as Arshavin, but he still runs and runs and runs and is still a threat to defences. I really don't think his commitment can be questioned, just an important part, his final ball and finishing which if he doesn't sort out soon will break him.

Anyway, we have had many arguments over Arshavin before so to dredge up another one that goes round in circles isn't appealing to me, you know my thoughts and I will be quiet on the subject from now on.

Arshavin isn't going to solve our problems, we need another striker, defensive midfielder and a new 'Arshavin' that isn't mentally fragile

 

[Rantboy]

Our squad is nowhere near good enough. A player like Arshavin (turns up on some games, annonymous on others) isn't exclusive to Arsenal. Many top teams have great but inconsistent players, who sometimes don't come with the goods, but at other times they combine with other great players to a devastating effect.

I agree he is not the answer, but we cannot bring in new players before January, and until then he is one of the most talented guys in the squad. Not to mention the fact they're paying him 70 or 80k a week, so you might as well use the guy, FFS!

I can't watch a second more of Gervinho. Yesterday he had me screaming for Eboue to come back!
I think it's down to personal opinions and preferences. I for one will always prefer an unstable quality player to a headless chicken who will show little more than effort.

One way or another, we will need reinforcements in January - who should have been brought before August, and for that I hold Wenger responsible.
The fact that we go into a season counting on the fitness of Diaby and Rosicky is another issue where Wenger is at fault.

Enough is enough, Wenger has to be held accountable for our situation. There's a lot of noise and miscommunication in the board, for instance Gazidis saying there is money available for the manager to spend, while Wenger's actions in the transfer market suggest otherwise. Not only we break even almost every transfer window, we also fail to expand our salary ceiling.

Now if the club is content in finishing 4th as a "trophy" then don't tell us we can compete with the clubs that pay their top players over 150k a week. And especially, don't charge the most expensive tickets in world football. For the quality of football on display, it's a bloody rip off.

Some have pointed out how not all tickets are the most expensive, just the main tier, which are derbys and matches against the top teams. Great. You spend more of your hard earned pounds to watch us get battered by the teams we can no longer compete with.

Arsenal has to solve this identity crisis. In some cases the club behaves as if it was one of the biggest clubs in the world (namely the ticket prices and the manager and board saying we can compete for major trophies). In other cases, the club behaves like an upper mid-table team (the salaries we pay for our stars and the willingness to accept 4th place as success).

Maybe we should just accept we are a mid weight team and stop fretting about these things. The empty seats at the Emirates will increase until the board realises it's not on par with the club's stature.

 

[gerd]

There is much to do about ticket prizes at the Emirates.
That is either greed or a sign that Arsenal have financial "difficulties".
It is very well possible to ask less for season tocket holders.

 

[BobbyBox]

This ticket pricing thing is such a crock in my opinion.

For everyday people the ticket prices aren't that bad, for rich people for better seats and better service etc they pay more. Who cares if a rich person can pay £100 for a ticket and they want to, then let them do it. If there were not people willing to pay it, then there wouldn't be tickets at that price.

I just think it is another stick to beat them with, yes maybe they shouldn't have those top prices. Maybe the average house price in Chelsea shouldn't cost 2million pounds or whatever it is, but if people are willing to pay it, then they will stay that price.

But the everyday fan still can get tickets from £25-35 pounds which is comparable to most clubs in the prem I would imagine and it is around the price I have been paying for a good few years when I have gone to games.

It's getting to be one of those things that keeps getting banded around and people say it like all of our tickets are the most expensive tickets around, but they simply aren't.

We have one of the newest stadiums in the world with world class facilities and the people that pay the top price get to use those facilities and get food drink etc

when you use the phrase 'most expensive tickets in the world' on it's own it implies a lot, but when you look into it a bit deeper then it really isn't as crazy as it seems.

 

[bebo]

I think quite a few crosses are going in, but nobody is finishing them at the moment. Aiming a high ball at Gervinho is less than useless. but we have had quite a few really good low crosses that have been fucked up by the receiving players. Not saying our players are great at crosses, but it isn't a bad.

So you just want Wenger out Bebo? who to replace him? or you don't care at the moment?

I am saying lets see, because I really do think that if we get another striker and midfielder in, we will have a good set of players to do well with.

The team has changed a lot over the last season and a half, it takes time to get things together. Arguably we shouldn't be in this situation where a lot of players have changed but we are and that is reality.

It is the first time Wilshere has played with a lot of these players since his injury, he is getting a better understanding now with the players around him, Rosicky is back and looking good, Giroud was on a great run of form goal scoring wise. If it clicks and we can get a psychiatrist in for all of our players then I know this team can beat the teams in the league and do well....it's just when this is going to happen? which is the big question!

I was at crossroads in the summer...I too waited and waited! It`s easier waiting for the return of Jesus. This lack of accountability is what really get my tits in a twist. Too many excuses Bob. I`m grateful for your celestial patients and your influence kept me positive for a long time. I`m afraid I have to turn to the darkside and take the tour.

 

[jonneymendoza]

This ticket pricing thing is such a crock in my opinion.

For everyday people the ticket prices aren't that bad, for rich people for better seats and better service etc they pay more. Who cares if a rich person can pay £100 for a ticket and they want to, then let them do it. If there were not people willing to pay it, then there wouldn't be tickets at that price.

I just think it is another stick to beat them with, yes maybe they shouldn't have those top prices. Maybe the average house price in Chelsea shouldn't cost 2million pounds or whatever it is, but if people are willing to pay it, then they will stay that price.

But the everyday fan still can get tickets from £25-35 pounds which is comparable to most clubs in the prem I would imagine and it is around the price I have been paying for a good few years when I have gone to games.

It's getting to be one of those things that keeps getting banded around and people say it like all of our tickets are the most expensive tickets around, but they simply aren't.

We have one of the newest stadiums in the world with world class facilities and the people that pay the top price get to use those facilities and get food drink etc

when you use the phrase 'most expensive tickets in the world' on it's own it implies a lot, but when you look into it a bit deeper then it really isn't as crazy as it seems.

Dont forget where Arsenal are based.

We are based in London, not up north when income and expenses are much lower then in London.

up north u can get a nice 3 bedroom house for like 160k.

in london? LMAO no fucking chance.

Average wage for a decent payed person here in london is around 30k.

People up north earning 30k's are seniors/managers.

senior and managers over here earn 60k+

 

[gerd]

To be honest and fair, when i talk about high ticket prices, i only repeat what i read everywhere. I haven't got the faintest clue how they are compared to other clubs ticket pricing.

 

[BobbyBox]

I was at crossroads in the summer...I too waited and waited! It`s easier waiting for the return of Jesus. This lack of accountability is what really get my tits in a twist. Too many excuses Bob. I`m grateful for your celestial patients and your influence kept me positive for a long time. I`m afraid I have to turn to the darkside and take the tour.

I understand mate, I understand all Arsenal supporters feeling frustrated and let down.

If I hadn't seen this team play well against Man City and Chelsea earlier in the season, then I would be at the same point I think. But I know that this team of players can perform much much better.

I think one of our main problems (From many) is that our squad isn't full of players Arsene has faith in, so he is mainly using a selection of players too much. He needs to and should have done in the summer, get rid of players like Arshavin and Chamakh if he wasn't going to use them and get in new players that he is willing to use.

I think with Jack becoming fully fit again and Rosicky, we have enough to get through the next few games and get to January and reinforce. This is if they can all get their heads together.

In January if we don't get players in, then I will highly question Wenger (If he didn't go for players, as we know it is difficult to get players in january). If he doesn't get players in and we are still doing badly then he will definitely go imo.

I think our first team of players are a match for anybody (If they have the confidence to do it) and if Arsene can get them playing together properly, then we are in business. Then we need to beef out the bench and get players he is willing to rotate with and not afraid to put on the pitch.

No Doubt Wenger is treading a fine line, these next couple of months I think will make or break him.

 

[bebo]

I guess spewing out nonsense about Wenger puts some pressure on him and players. We look so strong at the start of the season too, I agree.

 

[Rantboy]

Ultimate proof regarding ticket prices:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/may/22/premier-league-ticket-prices-2012-13

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/14367608

I'm not questioning whether you can pay 35 quid to watch a match. You can pay that to watch a fixture against Southampton. But if you want to watch Arsenal vs Chelsea or United, from a good seat, your ticket will cost as high as 100 pounds. And that, I repeat, to watch your team get battered, it just adds insult to injury.

I had a quick read on Arseblog today and he talks about the scouts. I complained about our scouts here a while ago and my comments were quickly dismissed.
But check this piece from Arseblog, as he puts it way better than I did:

Worryingly, Arsene’s eye for a bargain, or a player who comes to the club on the cheap and improves immeasurably, seems gone. Chamakh, for example, is a miserable flop, despite his purple patch at the start of his Arsenal career. It seems that is as much down to his character as his footballing ability, but nevertheless it’s true. The signing of Park will always, always baffle me. Never good enough, a waste of everyone’s time and money. Our chief transfer negotiator spent the best part of 10 days trying to sign a kid from Costa Rica, getting the run-around from amateurs and semi-professional football people, and all for a player who still hasn’t kicked a ball for us.

Gervinho must have been watched countless times. Did nobody notice that he has a fatal flaw in his game, his shocking technique when it comes to the most basic of footballing skills – kicking the ball? It’s like a cricket team signing someone who can only bowl underarm. Wenger’s knowledge of the French league and the hidden gems is gone. That advantage has disappeared, and it’s not as if the talent hasn’t been there. Newcastle have plundered Ligue 1 to much greater effect. We have scouts in Germany telling us players aren’t good enough for the Premier League only for them to rock up elsewhere and set the place alight with wonder goals.

 

[aitken]

Originally Posted by Arseblog
Worryingly, Arsene’s eye for a bargain, or a player who comes to the club on the cheap and improves immeasurably, seems gone. Chamakh, for example, is a miserable flop, despite his purple patch at the start of his Arsenal career. It seems that is as much down to his character as his footballing ability, but nevertheless it’s true. The signing of Park will always, always baffle me. Never good enough, a waste of everyone’s time and money. Our chief transfer negotiator spent the best part of 10 days trying to sign a kid from Costa Rica, getting the run-around from amateurs and semi-professional football people, and all for a player who still hasn’t kicked a ball for us.

Gervinho must have been watched countless times. Did nobody notice that he has a fatal flaw in his game, his shocking technique when it comes to the most basic of footballing skills – kicking the ball? It’s like a cricket team signing someone who can only bowl underarm. Wenger’s knowledge of the French league and the hidden gems is gone. That advantage has disappeared, and it’s not as if the talent hasn’t been there. Newcastle have plundered Ligue 1 to much greater effect. We have scouts in Germany telling us players aren’t good enough for the Premier League only for them to rock up elsewhere and set the place alight with wonder goals.

that post highlights someone to me who doesn't have a clue about football outside the pl. someone who only watches motd highlights. chamakh is a good player, how can someone expect him to be doing well when he started well for use but automatically dropped and never really to be seen til rvp was sold then giroud came in with never really been given the trust of the manager for games. park was a very good player in ligue 1 with him doing great with monaco and when he was at the world cup, joel campbell(true arsenal fan he is, only knowing his nationality) if he took the time to actually watch what he is doing then he'd know then he's got very good player for his age

thing is, players like chamakh, park, arshavin who aren't out and out scorers, get criticized alot more because they aren't as greedy as the average joe, who play different to your average player in that position.
if/when wenger goes, i think it won't take long to see why he was so special. maybe he has lowered the clubs ambitions recently but at the start and mostly through his career, he was the one who set arsenal fan's ambition's alot higher.

 

[BobbyBox]

Ultimate proof regarding ticket prices:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/may/22/premier-league-ticket-prices-2012-13

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/14367608

I'm not questioning whether you can pay 35 quid to watch a match. You can pay that to watch a fixture against Southampton. But if you want to watch Arsenal vs Chelsea or United, from a good seat, your ticket will cost as high as 100 pounds. And that, I repeat, to watch your team get battered, it just adds insult to injury.

I had a quick read on Arseblog today and he talks about the scouts. I complained about our scouts here a while ago and my comments were quickly dismissed.
But check this piece from Arseblog, as he puts it way better than I did:

As high as £100 pounds exactly or quite a bit lower as well? all teams put the prices up for bigger games. We didn't get battered by Man City, Chelsea or Man United, I suggest you go back and watch them again.

I think you have this thing where you want to be proved right all of the time, like some kind of prophet? because a lot of what you say seems to be 'I was slammed' 'I said this..' 'my comments were dismissed..' etc etc

and then you post an extract from a blogger who like the rest of us has an opinion, his opinion is no more right than mine or yours. But because he has a successful blog you think that everything he says is correct? or is it that he agrees with you in some part, so he must be correct?

I agree that Arsene and the scouts aren't picking up the bargains that they used to. But as I have said a million times it isn't an exact science and finding those bargains is very hard this day and age.

Just because Newcastle found a couple of good players, doesn't mean they have amazing scouts, just means that they did their jobs well and luckily the players performed well. But where are Newcastle now? what have they done in the last 8 years?

You get a player based on how well they play in Chamakh and Gervinho's cases they were the best players in the league they were participating in, scoring goals, assisting goals etc etc we bought them and they haven't done well for us, it happens.

We also got Podolski, Cazorla, Arteta and a few others that aren't looking too shabby.

Anyway, you concentrate on the expensive tickets, that you weren't going to buy anyway (£100 ones) and the players that are not succeeding and I will concentrate on the fact that I can go and watch games for £30 odd quid and enjoy the likes of Cazorla etc

We are two different people, you like to see all of the shit and I like to see the positives and hope we build on them

 

[Rantboy]

No, not quite a bit lower. I remember paying 88 pounds to see a match against Chelsea a couple of seasons ago.

I don't like to look at the shit, I look at facts.
Analyse the info in the Guardian link and you will see how the cheapest season ticket at Arsenal is more expensive than the top season ticket for Manchester United.

The scouting problem is something screaming at us. When we had so many problems to sort in the short term we sent out our main transfer guy to Costa Rica to sign Joel Campbell, a teenager who didn't play a single minute in our colours. And this process took 10 days during a much troubled tranfers window. We're not even getting our priorities right.

The thing about Gervinho is sad but true. He may have had good stats in Ligue 1, but how come nobody saw how he's so erratic, how he cannot kick a football.

Wenger's main strength was his knowledge of the French league. How could Newcastle unearth talent such as Demba Ba, Papiss Cisse and Yohan Cabaye right from under Wenger's nose?
Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting Arsenal to grab all the good players. But it's hard to take when all we've got recently from Ligue 1 was Chamakh, Park, Squilaci and Gervinho (I'm not judging Giroud just yet).

I don't have a "thing" about being proved right, I am more self-assured than that
It's just that I post some things that are laughed at or thoroughly rebuffed, only for it to appear later in more 'credible' sources.

Arseblog doesn't own the truth or anything. But they have access to privileged information - that's this guy's job after all - so he knows more than me and you.
Plus, we're talking about a blog that has an optimistic agenda overall. So if you start reading stuff like that over there, this is a sign that things aren't as good as you think.

 

[aitken]

Arseblog doesn't own the truth or anything. But they have access to privileged information - that's this guy's job after all - so he knows more than me and you.
Plus, we're talking about a blog that has an optimistic agenda overall. So if you start reading stuff like that over there, this is a sign that things aren't as good as you think.

Doesn't mean he's good at his job.

he may know more about arsenal as a club more likely but when it come's to actual football and player's, i highly doubt he know's more about them than majority of people on this forum.

 

[gerd]

Totally agree with Aitken. The guy may have inside information, but that doesn't mean it can use that to form a good and valuable opinion.

Park was great in Ligue 1 and in a WC. I can't remember i've ever seen him play a single match for Arsenal. The fans will tell me he did start matches, but he certainly didn't play 5 league matches in a team with Arsenal's best players. IMO you can't judge a player if he never got a decent chance (could well be that he is hopeless in training...but even then).

Chamakh was great in Ligue 1 and outstanding in one CL campaign. When he was first at Arsenal he started regularly, since then never with the best team. Wenger should use him or sell him.

Arshavin: together with Cazorla and (maybe) Wilshere the only world class player Arsenal still has. Might be that he doesn't perform because he is unhappy or home sick, but sell him then...

Gervinho: the year LOSC became champions in France he was their most important player, not Hazard, no Gervinho. I see him play and it's true that he isn't exactly a big success, but he's constantly played out of position...

All these players seemed outstanding buys because they were top players for club and country. Since they arrived at Arsenal they don't perform anymore. That is strange.

But there is more.

Take a look at some of the players who aren't criticized.
Is Arteta betten than with Everton ? Maybe.
Is Cazorla better than with Villareal and Malaga ? He is a joy to watch, but to be honest, i think he is not as good.

And what about Vermaelen. How much progress has he made since his first season ? To me it seems he hasn't. His first season with Arsenal was his best IMO.

Wilshere. Did he make big progress ? No. The jury is still out on him because he was injured.

Oxlade Chamberlin ? The bright new young star. He is in his second season now, is he any better than last season. IMO he isn't. Of course those things happen.

There might be excuses for all those individual players and i'm not saying players like Cazorla, Arteta, Wilshere and Vermaelen are suddenly failures. Not at all. But it seems that one can see a pattern. Players should approve when being with Arsenal. They don't. That is problematic.

I see a similarity with another club who is going downhill: Liverpool. They buy promising players but it seems the player become worse at Liverpool (except for Suarez).

IMO there is something wrong at Arsenal. I don't know if anybody is to blame, and maybe i'm exagerating, but i know one thing. The guy from Arseblog may have inside information, his assessment of these players is totally wrong.