Why are PES 5 & 6 so highly regarded?

Reason why those older games on PS2 were superb is because the developers knew the game of football, and what a player should feel during the gameplay. As the old developers retired from their projects, new blood came in and have no clue how to proplerly create a soccer game. I think Seabass and Dino Dini mentioned this once. Reason why PES/Kick Off had that great feeling is because arcade was mixed with simulation where today they try so hard to implement full simulation, which takes away the fun from the gameplay.
 
rockstrongo said:
nope, they try to make it as easy as possible for the online crowd, not one inch of simulation these days
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Agree.... todays there are only good and more animations,but with a totally unrealistic implemention in gameplay (Eg skating/glide on fifa/FC).

Old pes with less features, were more accurate football's depictions than nowdays games. Has more animations,360 dribbling,power bar even on passes.... doesn't make the game more realistic. It makes it more advanced,but if fundmentals are gone forever you can put in the game all the good animations you like and the game will keep suck.

New FIFA/FC catch just few thing about a real football match, the highlist you can see on reels and stuff.. basically fifa is a reel simulator now.

Speaking about the overrated pes2020/21 it just catch inertia,and weight feeling,but in a really exaggerrated way. There is no midfield, shooting sucks, body collisions suck, fouls count sucks, dribbling sucks,A.i sucks, players individuality sucks...i can't really find something that game handles good. It's bad as a sim and bad as a Arcade. Efootball is worse.

Old pes do less, but they do great what they are doing. They try to simulate less things,but these things are on point.
Due hardware limitations they have an arcade feeling,but in a good way.
8 directions, auto passes are simplified features in comparision of modern games,and make the game feel more arcade,but actually what happens on the pitch is way more realistic than all modern games and even than mostly good fifas (from 09 to 19) too..
 
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simogto90 said:
Agree.... todays there are only good and more animations,but with a totally unrealistic implemention in gameplay (Eg skating/glide on fifa/FC).

Old pes with less features, were more accurate football's depictions than nowdays games. Has more animations,360 dribbling,power bar even on passes.... doesn't make the game more realistic. It makes it more advanced,but if fundmentals are gone forever you can put in the game all the good animations you like and the game will keep suck.

New FIFA/FC catch just few thing about a real football match, the highlis you can see on reels and stuff.. basically fifa is a reel simulator now.

Speaking about the overrated pes2020/21 it just catch inertia,and weight feeling,but in a really exaggerrated way. There is no midfield, shooting sucks, body collisions suck, fouls count sucks, dribbling sucks,A.i sucks, players individuality sucks...i can't really find something that game handles good. It's bad as a sim and bad as a Arcade. Efootball is worse.

Old pes do less, but they do great what they are doing. They try to simulate less things,but these things are on point.
Due hardware limitations they have an arcade feeling,but in a good way.
8 directions, auto passes are simplified features in comparision of modern gamers,and make the game feel more arcade,but actually what happens on the pitch is way more realistic than all modern games and even than mostly good fifas (from 09 to 19) too..
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Very true my friend, limitations but realistically implemented
 
the new games miss something, because the build play in PES is second to none, the way pass go out of the player legs, it s something fifa can t make, and has to do with the engine of pes aswell, in fifa when u pass the ball it doesn t feel rewarding, i don t know why, in pes WHEN U MAKE A GOOD PASSING RUN AND YOU ARE ON GOAL, IT FEELS DIFFERENT, IF ONLY FIFA CAN MAKE IT FEEL LIKE THIS, i don t know if anyone agrees with me, but PES problem is when u are close to penalty area, the game becomes really rigid and one dimensional, because ai becomes super over powered physically hampering the way u want to score leaving you to rely on tried and tested moves of turning and shooting etc.... something fifa does much better is the probability of pass in and around the area and more probability to score goals from tight angles and such, i don t know if anyone also agrees with me on this.
 
millossobek said:
As for me, I've always liked the pass weight and stats influence in PES 5/6 with default settings.

Love the different outcomes of the shots and passes, the waywardness or accuracy affected by the players' stats, in my opinion it really creates a lot of enjoyable variety between players. :TU:

I think PES 5/6 are some of the best editions in terms of reflecting real stat-based differences. You can really feel it.
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this is exactly why new pes isn t fun and repetitive, becayse of the different outcome of the shots and passes
 
i really need a football fix, and it has to be PES and not fifa, i ve played fifa 16 modded, but it just doesn t have the passing of the build up play feel like PES, but my problem with pes i said it before, is the automatic shooting mechanics and not enough variety and shot outcomes....inside the area and such, which is the best PES from 2013 onwards that offers the gameplay and varied shooting mechanics like the old PES....thanks
 
Here's the thing: For a lot of us, there's nothing casual about football gaming.
Sure, for a lot of people (or new players), PES and FIFA are nothing more than a game to pass time and play random exhibitions, but the beating heart of football games, at least for a lot of us, remains Master League and Career Mode.
This is something PES 5 and 6 did masterfully, with the points system, you really had to think about what players to purchase, how to avoid bankruptcy, how to grow your players, etc.. The points system really made every win, draw, or loss count.
Even in newer PES, I really enjoy Master League. There's nothing like seeing the story of a team unfold right in front of your eyes, actually playing the games and seeing the step by step progress of your teams.
And this is not taking into account the storytelling and immersion aspect of Master League, which is fantastic.
Most games, even RPG's or story based ones, have a scenario where you play them and then you "beat the game" or complete all missions/unlockables.
But Football games are neverending. They are truly infinite. The stories and scenarios that you can create in your head and recreate in the game are, in my opinion, unmatched in the gaming experience. You can try to win everything, or just create a story where you are a perennial mid-table team, or avoid relegation, or wallow in second division. It can last 1 season or 20, the possibilities are limitless. This sense of progression and immersion offer, IMO, a deep, enjoyable experience that no other game can match.
And with the tons of patches being released EVERY MONTH for PES 5 and especially PES 6, the amount of scenarios/leagues are constantly expanding.
Same could be said about PES 2017 and PES 2021, which are constantly being updated with new patches, gameplay mods, and add-ons.

I guess this is not just a "what makes PES 5 and 6 classics" post only. It's an ode to offline football gaming in general.
 
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These games were great dus to respecting player stats and the way the game felt in comparison to the competition. Shooting, passing, receiving the ball, shifting body weight all felt like they had weight. FIFA couldn't offer that until about FIFA 12 (in my opinion)
 
koningfrikandel said:
These games were great dus to respecting player stats and the way the game felt in comparison to the competition. Shooting, passing, receiving the ball, shifting body weight all felt like they had weight. FIFA couldn't offer that until about FIFA 12 (in my opinion)
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And what fifa never was able to reproduce are how players individuality impact on the pitch.
This Is why i put old Pes above masteripieces like fifa 14,16,19
 
simogto90 said:
And what fifa never was able to reproduce are how players individuality impact on the pitch.
This Is why i put old Pes above masteripieces like fifa 14,16,19
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For sure! I thought vanilla fifa 15 came close however...modded 16 and 19 on PC came even closer (but modded, so that's not a fair comparison)
 
koningfrikandel said:
For sure! I thought vanilla fifa 15 came close however...modded 16 and 19 on PC came even closer (but modded, so that's not a fair comparison)
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Dont know why people doesnt recognize FIFA 15 more, brilliant game, to me superior to 16-17-18-19, cpu is very varied etc
To me the only Fifa game that comes close to PES 5-6
 
Hi all new to the forum so sorry if I’m all over the place I’m not very savvy with laptops etc pes 4,5,6 were absolute gems to play enjoyed everyone was just wondering as I’m completely crap at computing could anyone point me in the right direction to download any of them on a laptop and play I’m not bothered about patches or anything just the base game bear with me aswell as like I’ve said I’m not very good with computers 😂 any help much appreciated also sorry if this is in the wrong discussion just seen Pes 5,6
 
MysticReverie said:
It obviously must be down to gameplay, but what aspects particularly shine?
Bearing in mind it was only an 8-way control system and the 360 degrees control wasn't brought in until 2010.
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You're making a mistake, you're looking at it with the optic of today's football games standard. But for the standard of the times when it came out, the game was simply great and felt an incredible game.

Many of us obviously became much more demanding, to the point where the same type of gameplay but with today's standards into it (360º and so on) would not be enough, and a modern PES 6 would be too much arcade for our likings. To the point that we want a complex, much more simulation grounded gameplay, and even a PES 21 with all the scripting out, would not sufice for us, since it is too easy to score a goal compared to a realistic match.

I won't say that all of us wants a game leaned towards playing 90 match minutes, but probably a lot of people wants to play 30-45 minutes and not have too many goals, and have at the same time a realistic gameplay, and there's not too many gameplays that provide that, if any. We actually want changes of pace, having to move the ball around, and be able to do it calmly, having to observe the big picture... I repeat, is not easy to explain but the whole point is that the game needs much more effort into it to be revolutionary, needs to seem much more a real life match to actually like it.


We didn't have that level of exigence back in the '00s, also cause we never dreamt of the technology to do so, so we were ok with a game were you had to use your brain a bit, and did not put so much attention to detail. You gotta understand something. The exigence of the people comes tailored by what industry show that can do. Back in the '90's, games were not that good technically and graphically speaking, but the PS2 game, proved that there could be a new level of graphic fidelity. From that on, graphic fidelity started to be a standard. I think that way of seeing videogames, of putting attention to detail, being much more realistic physics wise and such, came at the end of '00s and start of '10's and that's when we started to be much more exigent with gameplay, further than not bein sluggish, and became a standard to have a more polished and realistic gameplay. Don't get me wrong, there was also a gameplay leap from the '90's to 00's, but the graphical leap was so big that it outshined it. But PS3, while being graphically superior than it's predecessor, it was not that big of a change, and on the opposite, most of the changes came in attention to detail, even when we speak about graphics. How water deform when a helicopter is over it, how the ball gets that sweet curve and deforms the net at the impact, how a football player behaves when jostling with another... And that last thing exactly is where it started to get interesting, when detail affects gameplay and playability itself and changes it completely. When the games started to be more realistic wise in a physics term, we adopted that mentality of emulating the reality much more into us. Mid '00s is when first driving hardcore simulation game started appearing (cause before that there was only rally games and GT as driving simulators, and were not even that close). RBR, iRacing, RFactor 1... it was a lot of them that started appearing mid '00s, and got grounded in the market as the time passed and reached the '10s and simulation became a goal for the industry. Once they decided to add that to the videogames it became something else to care about, also for the consumer. So it was then when we became to be more demanding in that way.

So you look now at PES 6 and obviously it looks quite meh, both graphically and in gameplay, but for it's epoque it was an extremely refined game that played really, really great, and that's what made it a legend.
 
rockstrongo said:
Dont know why people doesnt recognize FIFA 15 more, brilliant game, to me superior to 16-17-18-19, cpu is very varied etc
To me the only Fifa game that comes close to PES 5-6
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Fully agree. I got it for free with a Dutch football magazine subscription and played the hell out of it. If i remember correctly PES was very subpar that year so that helped me give it more playtime as well.
 
DTM said:
PES 6 was decent in many ways but the shooting was incredibly irritating. PES 5 is still by a distance the best football game ever made even after nearly 20 years. It was also made at a time when football was still proper football.
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I also think that PES 5 was more interesting than PES 6. Memory may be failing after so many years, but I have the impression that in PES 5 the matches were more unpredictable and exciting, and shots from any position could result in a goal. I remember the greatest emotions in football games from PES5. PES 6 was more balanced, with fewer spectacular goals and more frequent low match scores.
I will never forget the season in which my team was the leader of the table from the beginning. With the round before the end I was in 2nd place, 1 point behind the leader. In the last match I played with the leader. I was leading 2-0 at halftime. I conceded an accidental goal in the 75th minute. The nightmare occurred in the 87th minute when the opponent ran one-on-one with the goalkeeper and led to a draw, thus depriving my team of the league championship. I experienced emotions like during a real match. I was 19 years old then, beautiful times :D
 
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One thing that few mention... The gameplay has few scripts that cause the terrible cheats. There is almost no Handicap in this version, although unfortunately the PES6 version already has some applications for this annoying and frustrating phenomenon.

There is a lot of respect with Stats, you can vary your gameplay by changing Stats. In PES6 a player who runs a lot, he will be a good enough runner most of the time, a striker who shoots poorly, he will shoot poorly, the game engine does not overwrite players' values absurdly like they have done since PES2010.
 
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