The "Not happy with PES 2012" thread

[Flaw3d Genius]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Feels like I'd be paying Konami to do their work for them.

Isnt that what the edit mode is about? So Konami can chillex for 6 months of the year

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

As has been said earlier, how did they manage to make them worse than last year? Really bizarre. I also played against a keeper who was incapable of catching a ball. I quickly realised that every shot, no matter how weak and straight at him, would see him parry or just drop the ball then stand there as if the code is not telling him the ball is near him.

Yes, i said before. There are so many situations the game throws up Konami are having a hard time programming the keepers to deal with them all. Just think about how football games program keepers: To respond to the situation and choose the correct choice in catch or parry to deal with it. There's an issue with delfections which needs sorting, too many soft goals from them, for everything else they seemed to really be struggling to cope with everything which goes on.

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I've made my mind up that I will not be buying any Pro Evo on release in future, no matter how good the demos are or how great the hype. There are just far too many quality control issues, bugs, unfinished work and a general lack of progression from the previous year.

It's best to wait a month or two after release and see how things are. I'm not happy with paying £35 to be a bug tester, nor spending hours editing the game to play properly, nor having the final product comprehensively changed from the demo I played.

thing is football games really desperatley need to start implementing dynamic sprinting and running with the ball. It's so tron like when sprinting on that game. Gab talked about this where players would have to concentrate when spritning with the ball, have a system where it's not glued to your feet like it is now.

Probably before your time but Sensible Soccer from 20 years ago is still one of the only football games I've played where the ball doesn't stick to the dribbler's feet. A quick change of direction and the player would often leave the ball behind.

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I've made my mind up that I will not be buying any Pro Evo on release in future, no matter how good the demos are or how great the hype. There are just far too many quality control issues, bugs, unfinished work and a general lack of progression from the previous year.

It's best to wait a month or two after release and see how things are. I'm not happy with paying £35 to be a bug tester, nor spending hours editing the game to play properly, nor having the final product comprehensively changed from the demo I played.



Probably before your time but Sensible Soccer from 20 years ago is still one of the only football games I've played where the ball doesn't stick to the dribbler's feet. A quick change of direction and the player would often leave the ball behind.

Yeah it was, this here was my first ever football game, and i swear i'm almost in tears remembering the hours playing this vs my brother when i was very, very young!

YouTube - World Cup Italia'90 (POL vs. BEL) (1st Half) - Mega Drive

Loved that game! Was a good game to be honest

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I remember playing World Cup 90 on my mate's Sega. To be fair it was pants compared to Sensi, which came out after that.

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I remember playing World Cup 90 on my mate's Sega. To be fair it was pants compared to Sensi, which came out after that.

I've now lost myself. Looking back at the very first console games i played. I think the first ever computer game i layed was ninja Turtles in 1992. Just on an arcade. Then Doom in 1994, when i went to my dads offince. wat.. a secound, why was Doom uploaded to a computer in my dads office? Weren't they supposed to be working

Another game i loved back in the day!
YouTube - (Sega Genesis) Super Hang-On, Career Mode, Night Track

back in the days we couldn't care less abotu simulation, inertia, etc.. etc.. back when games, where just games!

 

[sincover]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

At EA’s recent Winter Showcase event, we got the chance to learn a little bit more about the PlayStation Vita version of FIFA. Its console counter part, FIFA 12, is doing very well indeed. So well, in fact, that EA’s VP and GM for Northern Europe, Keith Ramsdale, said that FIFA 12 was outselling its main rival, PES2012, by a massive 25-1.
“When you look at Pro Evolution Soccer versus FIFA, only five years ago in the UK PES was outselling FIFA. On its first weekend like-for-like we’ve just outsold PES by 25 times” he said, noting that it now has a massive and engaged fanbase.

Good lawd! 25-1!!! That is just sad. I hope Konami realizes that you have to spend money to make money. I don't want to imagine a world with only one footy game

 

[Flaw3d Genius]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Good lawd! 25-1!!! That is just sad. I hope Konami realizes that you have to spend money to make money. I don't want to imagine a world with only one footy game

Konami sell around 6-7 million PES titles a year without spending hardly anything. They are rolling in money!

PES prints money.

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Good lawd! 25-1!!! That is just sad. I hope Konami realizes that you have to spend money to make money. I don't want to imagine a world with only one footy game

I noticed when i brought PES for the PS3, how PES was number 2 compared to FIFA in sales,thats fine but for the Xbox it's as if the game dosen't exist

PES really stuggles badly on Xbox these days.

Also ironic how the worst ever PES (PES 2008) was the best selling! A game which you will constantly still find for 50-99 in the pre-owned section.

This could be seen as a sign for Konami to finally let someone like UEFA buy up the interface so from then on thegame is called 'UEFA soccer' etc.. or some big cororate name, which could provide big marketing and most importanlty really super enhance he ashetics and database also. Get a 'european based' team to handle the sound and the database.

When i say european team, i CERTIANLY do not mean just europeans, i mean have a stuido in europe where hoefully you can employ people from all over the world, Or somewhere like London, a very multicultural city.

Although we must not lose track that Konami will never outsell FIFA, it can't match FIFA in terms of sales! It will be a gigantic acheivement just to get remotley close to it.

 

[Suuuuupertalk]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I noticed when i brought PES for the PS3, how PES was number 2 compared to FIFA in sales,thats fine but for the Xbox it's as if the game dosen't exist

PES2008 really stuggles badly on Xbox these days.

Also ironic how the worst ever PES (PES 2008) was the best selling! A game which you will constantly still find for 50-99 in the pre-owned section.

This could be seen as a sign for Konami to finally let someone like UEFA buy up the interface so from then on thegame is called 'UEFA soccer' etc.. or some big cororate name, which could provide big marketing and most importanlty really super enhance he ashetics and database also. Get a 'european based' team to handle the sound and the database.

When i say european team, i CERTIANLY do not mean just europeans, i mean have a stuido in europe where hoefully you can employ people from all over the world, Or somewhere like London, a very multicultural city.

Although we must not lose track that Konami will never outsell FIFA, it can't match FIFA in terms of sales! It will be a gigantic acheivement just to get remotley close to it.

I think PES probably sold better due to the fact that most of us were crazy excited about seeing the first 'next gen' PES, also one that was the immediate follow up to PES6 on PS2 (I know 360 already had a version of PES6 but was more of a conversion).

Oh how wrong we were!

It'd be interesting to know the sales region that EA guy was talking about. Maybe 25-1 sales in Europe, but to my knowledge PES is still huge in Japan. I'd be amazed if they were worldwide stats, but I can even see the sales in the UK as being worse than this. Last year I stepped into my local supermarket on midnight of release for FIFA11 and there must have been 3-400 people in line. Crazy. With PES2012, I went to the same store and at midnight, and I was the only one buying the game. No-one else was there.

It's a shame because Konami had PES5 and 6 as a starting base, then they had new next gen technology, but they've clearly struggled with it from day one. I remember PES2008 was released on PS3 and immediately needed a patch because if you played it on a non-HD TV the game juddered to the point that it wouldn't run properly, and even in HD replays were shockingly juddery.

Still doesn't explain why nearly 4 years on from that, keepers have actually got worse. At least in PES2008 they actually recognised that the ball was two feet away from them.

 

[sincover]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Konami sell around 6-7 million PES titles a year without spending hardly anything. They are rolling in money!

PES prints money.

Sure it does, but I have to imagine that they look at that ratio and wonder how to take a bigger piece of that pie. In any business, when your only competitor is outselling you 25:1, it probably means your doing something wrong.

It'd be interesting to know the sales region that EA guy was talking about. Maybe 25-1 sales in Europe, but to my knowledge PES is still huge in Japan. I'd be amazed if they were worldwide stats, but I can even see the sales in the UK as being worse than this.

Japan is a relatively small market. The big ones are EU and NA, which is why EA has focused their efforts in those regions. Properties like Monster Hunter and Yakuza are huge in Japan, but don't sell much anywhere else. Capturing the Japanese share is not nearly as important as it used to be.

 

[Flaw3d Genius]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Sure it does, but I have to imagine that they look at that ratio and wonder how to take a bigger piece of that pie. In any business, when your only competitor is outselling you 25:1, it probably means your doing something wrong.

Isnt it the case EA could be spending 25x more money on Fifa which nullifies any profits?

 

[Suuuuupertalk]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Sure it does, but I have to imagine that they look at that ratio and wonder how to take a bigger piece of that pie. In any business, when your only competitor is outselling you 25:1, it probably means your doing something wrong.

Exactly. I'd accused EA in the past of being lazy with their title, but to be fair this year in my opinion, FIFA has made a gigantic leap forwards in many ways.

While the gameplay for PES is fantastic this year, PES has still been irritating me. The horrible sound, dated graphics and animation, buggy release code with awful keepers, patches that screw with core gameplay, and the fact that you even need to piss around formatting memory sticks and transferring 600 files to a stick just to have a game with proper kits etc must be having a huge effect on the fanbase now.

 

[Northzzz]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Maybe 25-1 sales in Europe, but to my knowledge PES is still huge in Japan. I'd be amazed if they were worldwide stats, but I can even see the sales in the UK as being worse than this. Last year I stepped into my local supermarket on midnight of release for FIFA11 and there must have been 3-400 people in line. Crazy. With PES2012, I went to the same store and at midnight, and I was the only one buying the game. No-one else was there.

Yeah i'm in no doubt that it's based on the European sales. PES was top of the Japanese chart the week it came out, avoiding competition from second place 'If I Loved An Idol In Guam'.

As Sincover said the market is tiny now though. The thing is though the culture is completely different and most of us forget that. Sincover alluded to games like Monster Hunter and Yakuza and no doubt he could have referred to a large amount of other games too that don't seem to take off in the West. These games differ from Western games because they don't follow the Hollywood type structure of releasing games. That is to aren't supposed to be blockbusters (i.e don't spend obscene amounts of money on their game). That in turn directly affects the quality of the graphics/animations etc as we have spoke about many times on this forum. Have you ever played Yakuza? It looks like a last-gen game at times. I still think it's revered very highly amongst a certain minority, who've actually heard of it, in the West. I'm really in doubt at all that games like Monster Hunter and Yakuza don't take off in the West because they don't look graphically appealing so they fail to sell them. Another great example is the refusal to sell Xenoblade Chronicles in NA. Now i've played that game and even for a Wii game the graphics are pretty poor. It seems obvious that the publishers of that game understand that the market in NA just doesn't go for this type of game and in my mind i can't help but think part of the reason why they wouldn't is the graphics (indeed the game opts for sound design over graphics, i think that's part of why the textures are bad).

The problem with PES is the way that ties in to expectations in modern day NA/EU. It's a sports game that is trying to appeal to the west who in essence now see sports games as synonymous with delightful tech design and high-end graphics/animations. PES doesn't really offer this at all. I'm not sure how they see it in Japan but judging by the fact that a lot of Japanese specific games tend to fail to really look stunning (indeed one can say they put gameplay over graphics) i'd be surprised if they really thought that tech design/graphics/animations/style above substance was as important a factor as it appears to be to most people in the West.

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Still doesn't explain why nearly 4 years on from that, keepers have actually got worse. At least in PES2008 they actually recognised that the ball was two feet away from them.

Again, LTFC. It must be all down to how they are programmed to deal with situations. I mean PES 2008 was a disaster! Very arcadey and very 'scripted' the same shit happened over and over again, so it's easy to program keepers to respond to those situations.

I think the programming flaw is that keepers are taking simply too long to adapt to a change in situation. Take the soft deflection goals. Keepers take too long to react. The processing is taking to long to finish.

I watched your video when the goalkeeper dropped the ball, and just ran into the ball instead of picking it up (1st video) The process took too long to execute and he ended up just behaving stupidly.

Same thing with when keepers sprint madly past the ball for 1 on 1s.

Keepers need to be balanced to fit in with the gameplay, it's not a case of one set of keeper programming fits all.

This still needs to be fixed as soon as possbile though. I have a good feeling this could be sorted by 1.02 patch, once Konami get a healthy scope of how the game runs and all the situations. I'm basically trying to make sense of it all because i do not believe for a secound konami are making keepers shit for the sake of it.

 

[Flaw3d Genius]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Exactly. I'd accused EA in the past of being lazy with their title, but to be fair this year in my opinion, FIFA has made a gigantic leap forwards in many ways.

While the gameplay for PES is fantastic this year, PES has still been irritating me. The horrible sound, dated graphics and animation, buggy release code with awful keepers, patches that screw with core gameplay, and the fact that you even need to piss around formatting memory sticks and transferring 600 files to a stick just to have a game with proper kits etc must be having a huge effect on the fanbase now.

Yeah i do agree with you PES is completely stagnant, but while the game receives scores of 7's and 8's from reviewers and 9's by fansites Konami Japan will always be thinking "job well done"

 

[Suuuuupertalk]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Yeah i'm in no doubt that it's based on the European sales. PES was top of the Japanese chart the week it came out, avoiding competition from second place 'If I Loved An Idol In Guam'.

Snappy title!

But that kind of reminds me of how out of touch with the rest of the world PES really is. If it sells well in Japan then I don't think they really care that much. With all the stunning presentation EA cram into their title, then Konami are shooting themselves in the foot with regards to Europe.

I think if Konami were that concerned about breaking the European market again, then they'd put a little more effort into their conversion. I mean no company can claim to fully take Europe seriously when they give a known western football commentator a script that doesn't even make sense because it's a direct Japanese to English translation, with no effort to correct it. What commentator has ever said "the order of the boot applied" FFS.....

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

After the crapy PES6 on xbox 360 and the rather meh PES 6 on C and PS3, i knew 2008 would fail baldy, they were releasing the same game every year but worse and more arcadey while EA where innovating.

Happy i didn't buy it and simply played FIFA 08 all year!

 

[Suuuuupertalk]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Again, LTFC. It must be all down to how they are programmed to deal with situations. I mean PES 2008 was a disaster! Very arcadey and very 'scripted' the same shit happened over and over again, so it's easy to program keepers to respond to those situations.

I think the programming flaw is that keepers are taking simply too long to adapt to a change in situation. Take the soft deflection goals. Keepers take too long to react. The processing is taking to long to finish.

I watched your video when the goalkeeper dropped the ball, and just ran into the ball instead of picking it up (1st video) The process took too long to execute and he ended up just behaving stupidly.

Same thing with when keepers sprint madly past the ball for 1 on 1s.

Keepers need to be balanced to fit in with the gameplay, it's not a case of one set of keeper programming fits all.

This still needs to be fixed as soon as possbile though. I have a good feeling this could be sorted by 1.02 patch, once Konami get a healthy scope of how the game runs and all the situations. I'm basically trying to make sense of it all because i do not believe for a secound konami are making keepers shit for the sake of it.

Sure, they're not making keepers shit for the sake of it, it's just incompetence and poor developing. I don't really see why any situation in a game is more complicated in PES2012 than say 2011 though, and keepers are far, far worse this time around.

By contrast FIFA's keepers are immediately believable. They're beatable and yet can pull off some really realistic saves. You are guaranteed that FIFA goalkeepers won't stand and watch the ball on the goal line then half heartedly try and kick it, or repeatedly drop the ball etc.

That's the bizarre thing in PES. The odd mistake can happen, sure, but in some games this year the keeper is incapable of holding shots every time. The Switzerland goalkeeper in one game wasn't seemingly able to pick up the ball, hold a shot or react to a slow moving ball for the whole 90 minutes.

 

[Northzzz]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Snappy title!

But that kind of reminds me of how out of touch with the rest of the world PES really is. If it sells well in Japan then I don't think they really care that much. With all the stunning presentation EA cram into their title, then Konami are shooting themselves in the foot with regards to Europe.

I think if Konami were that concerned about breaking the European market again, then they'd put a little more effort into their conversion. I mean no company can claim to fully take Europe seriously when they give a known western football commentator a script that doesn't even make sense because it's a direct Japanese to English translation, with no effort to correct it. What commentator has ever said "the order of the boot applied" FFS.....

That's true. Which in essence makes it actually sound like Fifa has a complete rule over football games in the West. PES is still a niche game at heart that masquerades as a big player. The gap between them (by that i mean appeal) is moving further and further apart due to the dominance of blockbuster games that have emerged in the this last console generation. PES in it's current stage cannot keep up.

To me PES doesn't feel like a game released in 2011 at all. I fail to believe that a game in 2011 can have such a lack of options for online play and though i rarely play online it's indicative of the main problem with PES really. I'm not talking about modes because Community and MLO are great concepts IMO but it's just the sheer lack of being able to set your intended style of preference (i.e speed, pass assistance etc) and search for similar players. When did Fifa sort that out? 3 years ago? How many other online games have such a lack of options for controlling online play. It just seems odd.

 

[sincover]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Isnt it the case EA could be spending 25x more money on Fifa which nullifies any profits?

Could be but that would be a very shitty business model. They are definitely outspending Konami for sure, but their profit margin is probably huge.

 

[Srider]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I've made my mind up that I will not be buying any Pro Evo on release in future, no matter how good the demos are or how great the hype. There are just far too many quality control issues, bugs, unfinished work and a general lack of progression from the previous year.

I'm really sad about it, but I have come to the same conclusion as well. Is it really too much to ask for them to fix unknown issues and just update the rosters? I don't see the reason why they need to drastically change the gameplay each year introducing even more bugs.

Way back in demo1, it was clear that for a game with less than 1 month to go, the amount of unfinished gameplay does not bode well for the full game. It is amazing that people like me who were vocal about the game's problems were actively discredited and even banned from forums claiming to provide feedback to Konami. Look at the result of such fanboyism and diplomatic apologists defending a clearly flawed product. What a mistake it is for Konami to work with certain blogs brimmed with such fanboyism that the hard criticisms are filtered out.

We have provided enough feedback as a community all these years, and it is even more ridiculous basic gameplay problems are not caught during development nor testing. Konami repeatedly offered unsubstantiated reassurance, but it should be clear to everyone now what is going on with the state of the dev team and the series as a whole.

What a waste of time this year, Konami.

 

[Flaw3d Genius]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Snappy title!

But that kind of reminds me of how out of touch with the rest of the world PES really is. If it sells well in Japan then I don't think they really care that much. With all the stunning presentation EA cram into their title, then Konami are shooting themselves in the foot with regards to Europe.

I think if Konami were that concerned about breaking the European market again, then they'd put a little more effort into their conversion. I mean no company can claim to fully take Europe seriously when they give a known western football commentator a script that doesn't even make sense because it's a direct Japanese to English translation, with no effort to correct it. What commentator has ever said "the order of the boot applied" FFS.....

Haha but weve all came to love "demo scene chat"

 

[Srider]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

That's true. Which in essence makes it actually sound like Fifa has a complete rule over football games in the West. PES is still a niche game at heart that masquerades as a big player. The gap between them (by that i mean appeal) is moving further and further apart due to the dominance of blockbuster games that have emerged in the this last console generation. PES in it's current stage cannot keep up.

I live in Japan, and the generous consensus among players here is that more and more are moving on to FIFA. It's not a matter of culture anymore, the gap between the games is getting too big to ignore, and the gap between the sales even in Japan is getting smaller and smaller each year. FIFA was never in top 10 before, yet this year they are just a bit behind WE. It wouldn't surprise me that Konami will lose even Japan in less than a few years time.

 

[Northzzz]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I live in Japan, and the generous consensus among players here is that more and more are moving on to FIFA. It's not a matter of culture anymore, the gap between the games is getting too big to ignore, and the gap between the sales even in Japan is getting smaller and smaller each year. FIFA was never in top 10 before, yet this year they are just a bit behind WE. It wouldn't surprise me that Konami will lose even Japan in less than a few years time.

That's interesting. Can i ask you then if Japanese attitudes towards gaming are changing? Whether they're adopting a more Western set of expectations when it comes to games in general?

 

[Flaw3d Genius]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I live in Japan, and the generous consensus among players here is that more and more are moving on to FIFA. It's not a matter of culture anymore, the gap between the games is getting too big to ignore, and the gap between the sales even in Japan is getting smaller and smaller each year. FIFA was never in top 10 before, yet this year they are just a bit behind WE. It wouldn't surprise me that Konami will lose even Japan in less than a few years time.

Wow!

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Sure, they're not making keepers shit for the sake of it, it's just incompetence and poor developing. I don't really see why any situation in a game is more complicated in PES2012 than say 2011 though, and keepers are far, far worse this time around.

i said it 3 times now. Everything in a computer is a program responding erforming a command. Goalkeepeing is something which we all know in real life requires human perception! Something a computer cannot do. It only does what it's programmed to do. Something a human will find extremly easy, a computer may struggle or fail to do because it can't adapt it's calculations

What i saying is it seems as if there are situations where the keepers are having big issues calculating responses to unique situations. It seems yes, because the game is now more complicated and more randomness happens is why the keepers aren't good enough at the moment to deal with how the game is balanced. I said before i think Konami would have just been better of making them super human to compensate.

Again, not saying it's good enough, but it just makes sense thats all.

By contrast FIFA's keepers are immediately believable. They're beatable and yet can pull off some really realistic saves. You are guaranteed that FIFA goalkeepers won't stand and watch the ball on the goal line then half heartedly try and kick it, or repeatedly drop the ball etc.

That's the bizarre thing in PES. The odd mistake can happen, sure, but in some games this year the keeper is incapable of holding shots every time. The Switzerland goalkeeper in one game wasn't seemingly able to pick up the ball, hold a shot or react to a slow moving ball for the whole 90 minutes.

This year at the moment FIFA keepers seem better all round. Suprising since last year they where only better in animations but in programming just lazy really.

Although from what i've played over the weekend at my mates FIFA keepers have some big programming issues with crosses and free kicks.

They seem fine on normal shots though, bit too super human at times but i didn't test them vigorusly with sliders.

There's a problem with them for corners though. When you bring them out they are really awful, they don't even look at the ball, just magically know where the ball will land, they sprint there without looking at the ball and if they don't get there stand like a lemon and watch the header go past.

Then again if someone could tell me how you active manual keeper switch on FIFA?

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I'm really sad about it, but I have come to the same conclusion as well. Is it really too much to ask for them to fix unknown issues and just update the rosters? I don't see the reason why they need to drastically change the gameplay each year introducing even more bugs.

Way back in demo1, it was clear that for a game with less than 1 month to go, the amount of unfinished gameplay does not bode well for the full game. It is amazing that people like me who were vocal about the game's problems were actively discredited and even banned from forums claiming to provide feedback to Konami. Look at the result of such fanboyism and diplomatic apologists defending a clearly flawed product. What a mistake it is for Konami to work with certain blogs brimmed with such fanboyism that the hard criticisms are filtered out.

We have provided enough feedback as a community all these years, and it is even more ridiculous basic gameplay problems are not caught during development nor testing. Konami repeatedly offered unsubstantiated reassurance, but it should be clear to everyone now what is going on with the state of the dev team and the series as a whole.

What a waste of time this year, Konami.

Whhooah, rememeber it's all about balance. I mean we got to find a balance between positivity and a blind fanboy just praising anything in the game. We also need to find a balance betwen genuine negativity and critizizum and people bashing the game becasue of it's reputation and doing it for the sake of it.

I mean i know whats wrong with the game but it dosen't annoy me as much as others, it's different for everyone, depends on so much stuff, each persons expectation, what you want to do with the game.

I get called to being on Konami's payroll when i simply suggest people to make a few changes to the settings.

Also i think PES in it's current form just isn't compatable as being a mainstream game anymore. It's too community relaint, lifestyle game. Hypothetically if a 1.02 patch comes out fixing all the little annoyances and kleepers. People will still moan, i don't think a magic formula exsists where eveyone will be happy.

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

The problem with PES is the way that ties in to expectations in modern day NA/EU. It's a sports game that is trying to appeal to the west who in essence now see sports games as synonymous with delightful tech design and high-end graphics/animations. PES doesn't really offer this at all. I'm not sure how they see it in Japan but judging by the fact that a lot of Japanese specific games tend to fail to really look stunning (indeed one can say they put gameplay over graphics) i'd be surprised if they really thought that tech design/graphics/animations/style above substance was as important a factor as it appears to be to most people in the West.

Exactly, and in the PS2 era, with the tech available back then and the money needed to produce games being much less than it is now this wasan't an issue for PES like it is now.

 

[Ameppe]

Re: PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I live in Japan, and the generous consensus among players here is that more and more are moving on to FIFA. It's not a matter of culture anymore, the gap between the games is getting too big to ignore, and the gap between the sales even in Japan is getting smaller and smaller each year. FIFA was never in top 10 before, yet this year they are just a bit behind WE. It wouldn't surprise me that Konami will lose even Japan in less than a few years time.

i always said i'm glad they start to lose sales, if they are losing sales in Japan then it's even better. This will show them they have to improve the game in a drastic way