PES 2019 Discussion Thread (PS4, XB1)

[Dennis_87]

You got to admit that FIFA is shorter path than PES to this atmosphere. And you know I stand on the fence for these 2 games.

So who's watching Barca Lyon?
So jealous, your timezone would have been 6.30 pm and while we're here 6:30 am and time to go to work.

Mate,since i see that you're located in Japan and i assume you're Japanese,i want to ask you,is it true that Pes is more popular in Japan than Fifa?And is the version there any different?I think that they have the J.League in the game there exclusively,is this correct?And are there any other differences?
And in general,how is the Japanese players community receive the game?Are the majority happy with the state of the game or are they also complain to Konami?And if they are,do Konami listen more to their fellow countrymen or not?

 

[Emroth]

I have to say, like @rockstrongo said, I dont see much of it down the wings for some strange reason. But CB's are crazy.
Doesnt matter what angle and what position you have, when there is a long, high through ball. If you have Mbabbe and some Jimmy as a central defender, Mbappe should get to the ball quicker even if Jimmy had few meters head start.

Catch up bug is less obvious on 18. Fast players seems faster and Im winning some races over there. But 19 is diabolical in the middle of the pitch.

 

[PotatoCouch]

is it true that Pes is more popular in Japan than Fifa?

Definitely, considering we're all coming back from Goal Storm, International Superstar Soccer, Winning Eleven days (don't quote me on the sequence because am sure it ain't right)

And is the version there any different?

Winning Eleven what we have basically.

how is the Japanese players community receive the game? Are the majority happy with the state of the game or are they also complain to Konami?

Us, Japanese (and most Asian countries) we're passive users; we won't talk unless you probe us to. We tend to keep to ourselves (towards shy), so the short answer is no, we don't complain to Konami. Are the majority happy with the state of the game? perhaps no, but I wouldn't know about this.

 

[slamsoze]

You got to admit that FIFA is shorter path than PES to this atmosphere. And you know I stand on the fence for these 2 games.

So who's watching Barca Lyon?
So jealous, your timezone would have been 6.30 pm and while we're here 6:30 am and time to go to work.

Regarding your atmosphere question, compare the cut-scenes from the stands in PES, with this video of @rockstrongo from the FIFA topic in 00:05.
In PES, the team supporters/crowd are a mix of THE SIMS characters, GTA pedestrians and the policemen inside court are armed like Counter Terrorist SWATS, as if the game is played in war-zone.

 

[slamsoze]

The catch-up bug has been present in PES since PES 2014 or even before that. On and off. But I can't remember a PES where it wasn't there ever since 2014.

See: https://www.evo-web.co.uk/search/432249/?page=10&q=catchup&o=date&c[node]=11

It was discussed even in PES 2012.

I will always live proud to remember, i took part in a discussion in soccergaming forum, back in 2005 when the pes section was active there compared to today, where the author was stating about catch up in PES 4 : "It is unacceptable that a defender like Giannis Goumas (aka Eterno Capitano PAO FC) runs faster and catches up players like Michael Owen.
Their PES 5 counter parts : Goumas=>speed:74/acceleration:69 , Owen=>speed:91/acceleration:89/dribble speed:87.

The catchup situation was always a discussion topic as i remember, at least since 2004 that i watch/read pesforums. The clue for me is how camouflaged or not it is implemented in games. For example in PES 2010 if you controlled a player like W. Rooney fast and strong in balance, you could run for ever, cause the Balance kept the defender out of you in first body contact and then he could not catch up you, running from midfield up to penalty box.
PES 2012,14,17,18 & 19 have some of the most obvious catch-up mentality.

 

[PotatoCouch]

Regarding your atmosphere question, compare the cut-scenes from the stands in PES, with this video of @rockstrongo from the FIFA topic in 00:05.

I feel FIFA mimic the stadium atmosphere better than PES? No? Couldn't tell the difference really in that particular FIFA cutscenes.

in PES, the team supporters/crowd are a mix of THE SIMS characters, GTA pedestrians and the policemen inside court are armed like Counter Terrorist SWATS, as if the game is played in war-zone.

Hahahahaha yes i know what you mean

 

[PotatoCouch]

PES 2012,14,17,18 & 19 have some of the most obvious catch-up mentality.

And this can only mean unrealistic ? Don't get me wrong , i don't think Aubameyang should win 100% against Vincent Kompany every single time. However, 90% chance Auba should win the race if its straight clear line. Ok acceleration on ball and off ball surely make a difference but if Auba double tap R1 (because double tap means he kick the ball forward and then when he runs, technically his acceleration should be back to his off the ball, which essentially faster than on the ball) , he should still win the race regardless. No?

 

[slamsoze]

I feel FIFA mimic the stadium atmosphere better than PES? No? Couldn't tell the difference really in that particular FIFA cutscenes.



Hahahahaha yes i know what you mean

Yes it does, PES has only some "extra" details, like pyros in Latin America games, but the complete atmosphere is very dull. A new bug? this year was when scoring in my home ground the crowd silences as the away team scored. At first im thought it was just me , but i read it in reddit also. The atmosphere in PEs keeps a recycling/regressing cycle but is to unevolved through years. The presentation does not help too,to build up a TV atmosphere at least.

And this can only mean unrealistic ? Don't get me wrong , i don't think Aubameyang should win 100% against Vincent Kompany every single time. However, 90% chance Auba should win the race if its straight clear line. Ok acceleration on ball and off ball surely make a difference but if Auba double tap R1 (because double tap means he kick the ball forward and then when he runs, technically his acceleration should be back to his off the ball, which essentially faster than on the ball) , he should still win the race regardless. No?

That's where a better formula for stats/egnine/possible outcomes, should be invented.

 

[Gale Kast]

I think the issue stems from.underating defenders speed. They could eliminate a lot of the problems if they rated players realistically. I remember pes 2013 where by I think there was maybe one 90+ speed defender in the game and a heap of uber fast attacking players. Its not too much better this year. But there are fast defenders in real football, they just aren't rated as such in PES so they artificially balance it for some reason with the catch up rather than going for the realistic option.

Part of me understands it, they don't want another van der mirch situation where players just spam pace through balls. However it could easily be negated in a natural way if they just rated the defenders speed properly in my opinion. Oh and stopper overstating attackers pace, especially with those player of the week cards, up their skills, shooting etc if they did well but no one suddenly gets a +10 speed boost in real life!

 

[PRO_TOO]

Only this: When chasing a fast AI striker (and he’s really fast), the player controlled by myself can’t catch him sometimes. When I do switch off him to another player and let the computer control my mate he’s getting a speed boost to chase down the attacker sometimes. This speaks volumes. It’s there.
Enough said in that regard. We all know.

 

[philla]

I believe the catch-up bug is (a still necessary?) leftover from previous PES, when players were agile as pilotfish resulting in an overeffective dribbling. At the time of PES2014 i was really grateful for that, despite you can think of better solutions of course.

As player agility has been toned down to halfway reasonable values, the chance is there to build a believable attack/defence balance without using cheap tricks. But at the moment, i think there are still too much inconsistancies in AI and positioning to let it run free.

It should be largely the same with CPU attack scripting, by the way. Before the last patch you saw a lot less AI perfection, resulting in an noticable easier difficulty level (speaking of legend level). Both solutions don´t make me 100% happy, but that seems to be the current limits of AI programming and EA doesn´t solve it really better overall.

 

[Madmac79]

It's 2019, catch up bug is still an ugly cop out that dumbs down individuality, it was maybe acceptable in the generation prior to this, now it's time for them to develop a serious defense system or at least for us to stop excuse them for such
negligences.

Seriously, why should I pick up a world class faster player if a random second division defender just pick him back up like nothing in open field? Depth goes all down the trash like this.

I will always live proud to remember, i took part in a discussion in soccergaming forum, back in 2005 when the pes section was active there compared to today, where the author was stating about catch up in PES 4 : "It is unacceptable that a defender like Giannis Goumas (aka Eterno Capitano PAO FC) runs faster and catches up players like Michael Owen.
Their PES 5 counter parts : Goumas=>speed:74/acceleration:69 , Owen=>speed:91/acceleration:89/dribble speed:87.

The catchup situation was always a discussion topic as i remember, at least since 2004 that i watch/read pesforums. The clue for me is how camouflaged or not it is implemented in games. For example in PES 2010 if you controlled a player like W. Rooney fast and strong in balance, you could run for ever, cause the Balance kept the defender out of you in first body contact and then he could not catch up you, running from midfield up to penalty box.
PES 2012,14,17,18 & 19 have some of the most obvious catch-up mentality.

You (strangely ) forgot 11 mate, which was the worst of them all. I'm stil having fun with it just in these days but man, it's been almost 9 years ago now. It's time for them to take a less lazy road than this.

 

[slamsoze]

It's 2019, catch up bug is still an ugly cop out that dumbs down individuality, it was maybe acceptable in the generation prior to this, now it's time for them to develop a serious defense system or at least for us to stop excuse them for such
negligences.

Seriously, why should I pick up a world class faster player if a random second division defender just pick him back up like nothing in open field? Depth goes all down the trash like this.


You (strangely ) forgot 11 mate, which was the worst of them all. I'm stil having fun with it just in these days but man, it's been almost 9 years ago now. It's time for them to take a less lazy road than this.

Nice call mate!! I did n't mention 11 , cause i was not 110% sure if it suffers from, i am still 100% sure by the time i played and by everyone's posting experience, but i still miss this extra 10%.

My personal dream about possible solution in catch up, is to combine speed effectiveness with physicality. So the attacker has pace as his weapon but defender has his body mass, like it happens in reality. It just needs much more awareness from the AI about where the ball is played and the opponent is going to head. Or at least the current catch-up effect, to just be toned down a lot.
They have proved over the years, that they can make more agile or more physical version, if you assume PES 5/15/17/19* are based on more physicality while PES 6/16/18* focus on agile movement, or are "more arcade" if we could say. In my opinion, it is time to make a game that will combine both agile moves and collisions effects.

Spoiler

*P.S.: For conspiracy lovers (like me), there is a routine here:
odd number versions=>5/15/17/19= physicality
even number versions=> 6/16/18= agility

 

[Chuny]

I knew I was not alone fighting this battle

It's 2019, catch up bug is still an ugly cop out that dumbs down individuality, it was maybe acceptable in the generation prior to this, now it's time for them to develop a serious defense system or at least for us to stop excuse them for such
negligences.

Seriously, why should I pick up a world class faster player if a random second division defender just pick him back up like nothing in open field? Depth goes all down the trash like this.


You (strangely ) forgot 11 mate, which was the worst of them all. I'm stil having fun with it just in these days but man, it's been almost 9 years ago now. It's time for them to take a less lazy road than this.

Exactly.
They came up with this way of handicapping attackers and punishing the speedsters and people who like to counter-attack all the time with a silly method which is the so called catchup bug. But when you watch Class A teams in real life DEPENDING on fast players to make a difference, that's when PES stop making sense.

And, like Madmac heere said, what's the point in trying to play Master League and get some money to buy a great fast winger, if he'll run as fast as the cheapest lad in the game? Just to have a player with a nicely created face?.

There are other ways to punish people that only want to sprint all the time. Like a proper fatigue system?. Like losing control of the ball easily? (unless you're Messi, of course). Like having a better defence system in which you can wait for fast players sitting deeper in the back? Or having defenders actually trying to track those players so they won't have a lot of space to turn and start running?. ETC.

*P.S.: For conspiracy lovers (like me), there is a routine here:
odd number versions=>5/15/17/19= physicality
even number versions=> 6/16/18= agility

PES 2018 had whole heap of ketchup too, mate!

 

[slamsoze]

I knew I was not alone fighting this battle



Exactly.
They came up with this way of handicapping attackers and punishing the speedsters and people who like to counter-attack all the time with a silly method which is the so called catchup bug. But when you watch Class A teams in real life DEPENDING on fast players to make a difference, that's when PES stop making sense.

And, like Madmac heere said, what's the point in trying to play Master League and get some money to buy a great fast winger, if he'll run as fast as the cheapest lad in the game? Just to have a player with a nicely created face?.

There are other ways to punish people that only want to sprint all the time. Like a proper fatigue system?. Like losing control of the ball easily? (unless you're Messi, of course). Like having a better defence system in which you can wait for fast players sitting deeper in the back? Or having defenders actually trying to track those players so they won't have a lot of space to turn and start running?. ETC.




PES 2018 had whole heap of ketchup too, mate!

Yes it sure has/had. Did i misspelled anywhere the catch up as ketchup? or is it a side joke of yours?
For the speed discussion, my opinion is : There are players faster in speed terms , others slower in speed but faster in dribbling or even faster in thinking, decision making, player with low speed and better vision inside the match. Many many variables, that i do not know if our current technology has to capture the whole momentum, instead of the flat situations we have now.

 

[Chuny]

Yes it sure has/had. Did i misspelled anywhere the catch up as ketchup? or is it a side joke of yours?
For the speed discussion, my opinion is : There are players faster in speed terms , others slower in speed but faster in dribbling or even faster in thinking, decision making, player with low speed and better vision inside the match. Many many variables, that i do not know if our current technology has to capture the whole momentum, instead of the flat situations we have now.

Nah, just a bad joke of mine

 

[rockstrongo]

You who play online (competitive) how many of you use wired controllers ?
And if,how much difference does it make?
Guess this question could be asked in any game thread

 

[Chris Davies]

You who play online (competitive) how many of you use wired controllers ?
And if,how much difference does it make?
Guess this question could be asked in any game thread

I connect my PS4 controller up via the USB cable (and enable "communication via USB cable" in the PS4 settings) for a game called The Golf Club (and The Golf Club 2).

Without that I find myself skewing shots wide more often, because it's a game that relies on milliseconds of timing - and connecting your controller via a cable decreases latency.

However, for games like PES and FIFA it makes absolutely no difference, because any input lag isn't a hardware thing - it's the game, 100% of the time (either because your player isn't in the right position to kick the ball immediately, or because the AI needs to cheat - simple as that).

You can always experiment - you just need one of the latest PS4 controllers and a USB cable that connects it to your PS4 (the older models don't support it, you need the CUH-ZCT2 model).

To enable USB communication, just go to Settings > Devices > Controllers > Communication Method and select USB. After that, your controller is connected via USB and not Bluetooth.

(Until you unplug the cable!)

Spoiler

 

[rockstrongo]

I connect my PS4 controller up via the USB cable (and enable "communication via USB cable" in the PS4 settings) for a game called The Golf Club (and The Golf Club 2).

Without that I find myself skewing shots wide more often, because it's a game that relies on milliseconds of timing - and connecting your controller via a cable decreases latency.

However, for games like PES and FIFA it makes absolutely no difference, because any input lag isn't a hardware thing - it's the game, 100% of the time (either because your player isn't in the right position to kick the ball immediately, or because the AI needs to cheat - simple as that).

You can always experiment - you just need one of the latest PS4 controllers and a USB cable that connects it to your PS4 (the older models don't support it, you need the CUH-ZCT2 model).

To enable USB communication, just go to Settings > Devices > Controllers > Communication Method and select USB. After that, your controller is connected via USB and not Bluetooth.

(Until you unplug the cable!)

Spoiler

So outside Pes/fifa (where I really wanted to know even though I asked here) it's important? Gives you less lag?
Great Chris
Btw I'm on Xbox
But I I'm sure it's the same procedure.
Thanks pal

 

[Alx1234]

….

However, for games like PES and FIFA it makes absolutely no difference, because any input lag isn't a hardware thing - it's the game, 100% of the time (either because your player isn't in the right position to kick the ball immediately, or because the AI needs to cheat - simple as that).

You can always experiment - you just need one of the latest PS4 controllers and a USB cable that connects it to your PS4 (the older models don't support it, you need the CUH-ZCT2 model).

i'll second this....and this is where pes lost me somewhere in 2018.

because any PES fan like me used to think there was always something fixing on MY side - e.g. fast internet, good hardware, wired controllers etc....

pes has been an expensive experiment in terms of time and money...a post like chris' above wasn't around for reference so I had to find out the answers for myself.

cannot speak for 2019 or any other future iterations but will I go to those lengths I used to go to with pes? I highly doubt it


ps tried xb and ps4 and pc 2018 back in 2018 - all delayed crap. 360 version feels better than current gen.

 

[Emroth]

There are other ways to punish people that only want to sprint all the time. Like a proper fatigue system?. Like losing control of the ball easily? (unless you're Messi, of course). Like having a better defence system in which you can wait for fast players sitting deeper in the back? Or having defenders actually trying to track those players so they won't have a lot of space to turn and start running?

This.

If we had proper defenders, with stats that actually matter, it wouldnt be a big issue and it wouldnt give too much of an advantage.

Positioning Stat should matter much more. Defenders should track other players, mark them better.
Add to it awake Goalkeepers, who would come out more often.
And some more meaning to physicality stat. Smaller, agile strikers should fly away like leaves, when a big defender gives them a little shoulder push.

On top of that, stamina should be dynamic.
When you go full whack it should deplete, to allow you for a short(ish) distance sprint bursts only. Then, once you stop it should recover, but not fully. And throughout the match, as players get more tired, it should recover less and less. Kinda like in rpg games.

Off topic, but that would also solved the problem of Overpowered skill move spammers, especially on the other game. if stamina was depleting and allowed you to do only that much of running or dribbling, we wouldnt have goals (especially in the other game), where Ronaldo "Jackie Channing" his way through half of the pitch

 

[xicpanad]

Back to PES 2017 and it is by far the most satisfying right now. I´m playing SS, PA0 and it still feels playable, fair and with lots of fouls. It´s a winner for me.

 

[Emroth]

Back to PES 2017 and it is by far the most satisfying right now. I´m playing SS, PA0 and it still feels playable, fair and with lots of fouls. It´s a winner for me.

Waiting for delivery.
You're making me all hyped. Im looking forward to pes17 more than pes20..

 

[Chris Davies]

Waiting for delivery.
You're making me all hyped. Im looking forward to pes17 more than pes20..

Careful now, overhyping will ruin it! It's still PES!

Did you happen to download the demo (assuming you're on PS4 or Xbox One)? If so, you can go into your download history (PS4: Library > Purchased) and download the demo again...

 

[PRO_TOO]

Yes it sure has/had. Did i misspelled anywhere the catch up as ketchup? or is it a side joke of yours?
For the speed discussion, my opinion is : There are players faster in speed terms , others slower in speed but faster in dribbling or even faster in thinking, decision making, player with low speed and better vision inside the match. Many many variables, that i do not know if our current technology has to capture the whole momentum, instead of the flat situations we have now.

 

[Emroth]

Careful now, overhyping will ruin it! It's still PES!

Did you happen to download the demo (assuming you're on PS4 or Xbox One)? If so, you can go into your download history (PS4: Library > Purchased) and download the demo again...

No, I missed the fecking thing altogether.
Id rather get it from PS Store as it would save me changing the discs around, but it doesnt seems to be there anymore.

I know its still Pes, but its different to get hyped from Adams promises and Evo-Web Elitists. By now I more or less know who has similar taste to me when it comes to footy games. And its not Adam..

 

[xicpanad]

Waiting for delivery.
You're making me all hyped. Im looking forward to pes17 more than pes20..

Yeah don´t get to hyped, but for sure is a better game than 2019. Against 2018 might miss some details here and there, ball physics and overal pace, but still, in my opinion, the best option gameplay wise. also, ML main menu is better, with more usefull information on the screen.

I don´t know why but I feel a much better balance on 2017. My strong players are, well, strong. Manual is good, once you get the hang of it, controls are responsive, dribling is responsive (love to walk with the ball and win fouls all over the place). Took two matches today on my old spanish D2 save. Had about 7 fouls and 3 yellow cards for CPU on my first match. Second one is still running as I had to get to work...

It´s a game that is resisting time pretty well.

 

[rockstrongo]

Careful now, overhyping will ruin it! It's still PES!

Did you happen to download the demo (assuming you're on PS4 or Xbox One)? If so, you can go into your download history (PS4: Library > Purchased) and download the demo again...

Game speed gentleman?
I'm on -2
It's pretty much as 0 on 18/19 ish

 

[xicpanad]

-2 here. At first I thought it was slow and slugish, but I´m on SS so I need some time for thinking my next move and -2 helps me on that. After a while, I guess it feels natural.

 

[philla]

Waiting for delivery.
You're making me all hyped. Im looking forward to pes17 more than pes20..

I am aware the hype train will will collide hard with reality now, but you better get some picture about this "gem of soccer gaming" before you waste your time: