kilay
International
- 11 November 2016
To be clear i'm talking about CPU tactics not players tactics.
After a week of test i think this about PES 2017 and tactics. Thnks to Royce, Papinho81, Tinker and dmendenhall_9 for their advices
If anyone have some experience to share about movement, placement, behavior and particular style of players, please post here.
The key of all the formation are the interpreters like the real football, in my advices there are change of position ,player style and ability to match the real style of certain players and their movements on the field.
Starting from a default tactic without make any change probably the team adopt the WM tact or the Pyramid , ok, is a tactic like another, but is really old and not have good point in this era of football. Try to see the placement of the player on the field while changing from offensive to defensive and you can see the gap from attack to defence, no-one cover the midfield this open space for counter attack and place 5 players in the box or just before, this usually create a great confusion. Some players not seems to understand where should stay, those behaviors are forced by preferred positions and Player Style, so i acted on those things.
This is my personal idea of tactics applied to PES 2017
To explain how the game consider the different role sometimes I compared them to some old style football role
the secondary position has ever A grade
I removed Trickster,,Mazing Run,Speeding Bullet from all the player and Hole player for the most of them. I have yet to figure out what they do except run the players without a sense, or dribble in front of the opposite without success loosing opportunity for key pass. (If someone find something of useful in those player style please tell me what
)
KO is Kick Off
IN is In possession
OP is Out of Possession
GK
I would like to remove all the defensive goalkeeper style from the game (thnks royce), because The CPU will almost never come off their line even when it absolutely calls for it (cit Royce).And basically make the keeper less reactive (check Buffon, with or without)
CB
I've to do more test, but removing the Extra Frontman Style from almost all CB in the game,could be a fix for the no-sense last bar of the offensive prowess, used by someteam in knock-out match like european qualifications,cup final or any important match or derby.
Set Build Up for CB with playmaking duties (Bonucci,Boateng,Sammer) adding weighted pass ability if needed
FB
Set him to FB in all trhee fluid formation, just add him defensive fullbacks( or build up
(adding also the DM role secondary position (B)) if you want a more smart player that sometimes push up.
WB (FB/SL)
This is the real problem BTW i think this tricks could fix the strange setting added for standard WB. Make all of them Offensive Fullbacks
,in the Out of possession set them SL in the last position before they become FB and as close as possible to the side line; in the IN possession and Kick off set them FB in the last position before they become SL and as close as possible to the side line. This works well with some teams (barca,chelsea,bayern) but with other with centered attack and press(liverpool over all)i preferred use this settings
Finally Liverpool with a good formation, something of different in the setting of FB (I leave them FB in all three scheme), i think center\wide setting in attack\defense influence too much the positions.
DM
I recommend to remove also the anchor-man style from the most of DM that have it, that make the DM an half-back (in italian language centromediano metodista), a role of Old football formation not used anymore in modern football. So just few player needs this style (Javi Martinez, Mascherano) other classic DM fit better with Build Up (Busquets),Box-to-Box (Kantè,Khedira) or Destroyer(Sturaro, Khedira).
CM
Hole player is a weird style, It put the midfielder constantly inside the penalty area when in possession, this make the teams less compact and open space for the opposite counter-attack (i could compare it with a inside forward in the old style formations).So atm i removed it from all the CC. Anyway a midfielder without any style is too much offensive in the same way, so my advice is put for all the base midfielder (CC) the destroyer style(Rakitic,Marchisio,Ramsey) that make them a little bit disciplined. If the player is more creative make it Old Style N.10 (Fabregas,Iniesta,Pjanic) or Build up adding him the DM role in alternative positions if you need some kind of deep-lying playmaker Pirlo,Xabi Alonso (setting DM in KO and OP and CC lower possible in IP)
SL
Really few player that fit this position
The SL is not intended how a less offensive winger, is another role that put the player on the side with playmaking and covering duties (like Beckham). My advice is N.10 Old style or Creative Playmaker, with the same positions in all three fluid formation or if you don't like it try set AM on IN possession to put him a little more advanced.
If you need a player that run up and down on the side line (some kind of tornante like Florenzi,Angelo Di Livio)set him SL in all position with box-to-box role and trackback, remove
WF
ATM Winger doing the right things but there are a tons of style in the real football so, go ahead to edit them., I'm testing dummy runner in alternative to prolific winger and for Walcott fits well, he sometimes is centering a bit and I wanted this. For William i have added to him the CM alternative position also adding Box-to-Box Role (but removing Trackback). So now he is cover a little more and develop some defensive duties.
If you need a more creative and unpredictable player(Reus,Ribery,Robben,Douglas Costa,Bale)who stay wide, set his preferred position to WF with alternative role SS,add Prolific Winger and put him as WF in kickoff and in IN possession and as SS in out of possession
If you need he stay a little more in the center make him SS secondary WF Creative Playmaker(Messi,Hazard)In IN Possession 'and kickoff with their preferred position and in OUT of Possesion with their secondary position.
or WF secondary CF Prolific Winger(Ronaldo,Martial,Griezmann 2014) In OUT Possession 'and kikcoff with their preferred position and in IN of Possesion with their secondary position.
To reproduce the Raumdeuter role (muller,sterling, volland) set him CL Hole Player secondary WF + trackback with this setting
KO IP OP
WF CL WF
AM
Need more time to test, anyway my preferred settings atm are CAM Classic n.10 or CAM Box-to-Box or CAM Creative playmaker(not tested yet)
with Class. N.10 AM in KO and OP and SS in IP (Ozil)or
Creat. PM AM in KO and OP SS in IP (Rooney+Trackback) or
Class. N.10 AM in KO and IP and CC in OP (Ganso,Riquelme, could be right also for David Silva)+ Inserimento
SS
For people like Dybala, SS creative PM in all KO OP IP
For False-9 (Firmino rulez) same settings and lower the position in all three scheme.
For people like T.Henry i think CF Dummy Runner secondary SS , SS in KO and OP, CF in IP.
For Fantasista like Maradona, Baggio SS Old N.10 secondary AM, SS in KO e IP, AM in OP (give him all the passing ability)or Maradona SS Creative Playmaker secondary AM, SS in KO e IP, AM in OP (give him the most part of the passing ability).
CF
Leave him CF in all three fluid scheme
Give him trackback only for box-to-box CF like Mandzukic (for Diego Costa for example is too much)
Anyway here all the settings are fine, be creative
Other impressions
Mark Man and Fighting spirit make the player more aggressive and he of course make more fouls, try to with and without.
Anyway sometime Fighting Spirit put the player a little more out of position (WB FB\SL)
Track-back is a way to make less offensive a player.
Other advice is to improve the compactness.
And keep lower the midfield to balance the whole team.
Here you can see the difference between the movement of Barça fullbacks (WB) I forgot to set a Style of Playing to Sergi Roberto (Build up i putted) so he is a little bit centered and not cover well, instead Jordi Alba do the rights movement and cover his position .
Here another video thnks to dmendenhall_9.
To understand the difference with and without hole player see pogba at 3.50 so at 26,30 and finally at 46,00.
Some edit are different from mine but this video highlights well the global change of the assets of the team (MAN UTD)
cit from dmendenhall_9.
The changes in my starting post about Player Style positon, Ability and position IMO are required to match the real player's behaviors.[/QUOTE]
here the premier league tactics
Middlesbrough, southampton, stoke, sunderland and watford require a fix, will be in the next video
After a week of test i think this about PES 2017 and tactics. Thnks to Royce, Papinho81, Tinker and dmendenhall_9 for their advices
If anyone have some experience to share about movement, placement, behavior and particular style of players, please post here.
The key of all the formation are the interpreters like the real football, in my advices there are change of position ,player style and ability to match the real style of certain players and their movements on the field.
Starting from a default tactic without make any change probably the team adopt the WM tact or the Pyramid , ok, is a tactic like another, but is really old and not have good point in this era of football. Try to see the placement of the player on the field while changing from offensive to defensive and you can see the gap from attack to defence, no-one cover the midfield this open space for counter attack and place 5 players in the box or just before, this usually create a great confusion. Some players not seems to understand where should stay, those behaviors are forced by preferred positions and Player Style, so i acted on those things.
This is my personal idea of tactics applied to PES 2017
To explain how the game consider the different role sometimes I compared them to some old style football role
the secondary position has ever A grade
I removed Trickster,,Mazing Run,Speeding Bullet from all the player and Hole player for the most of them. I have yet to figure out what they do except run the players without a sense, or dribble in front of the opposite without success loosing opportunity for key pass. (If someone find something of useful in those player style please tell me what
)KO is Kick Off
IN is In possession
OP is Out of Possession
GK
I would like to remove all the defensive goalkeeper style from the game (thnks royce), because The CPU will almost never come off their line even when it absolutely calls for it (cit Royce).And basically make the keeper less reactive (check Buffon, with or without)
CB
I've to do more test, but removing the Extra Frontman Style from almost all CB in the game,could be a fix for the no-sense last bar of the offensive prowess, used by someteam in knock-out match like european qualifications,cup final or any important match or derby.
Set Build Up for CB with playmaking duties (Bonucci,Boateng,Sammer) adding weighted pass ability if needed
FB
Set him to FB in all trhee fluid formation, just add him defensive fullbacks( or build up
(adding also the DM role secondary position (B)) if you want a more smart player that sometimes push up.
WB (FB/SL)
This is the real problem BTW i think this tricks could fix the strange setting added for standard WB. Make all of them Offensive Fullbacks
,in the Out of possession set them SL in the last position before they become FB and as close as possible to the side line; in the IN possession and Kick off set them FB in the last position before they become SL and as close as possible to the side line. This works well with some teams (barca,chelsea,bayern) but with other with centered attack and press(liverpool over all)i preferred use this settings
Finally Liverpool with a good formation, something of different in the setting of FB (I leave them FB in all three scheme), i think center\wide setting in attack\defense influence too much the positions.
DM
I recommend to remove also the anchor-man style from the most of DM that have it, that make the DM an half-back (in italian language centromediano metodista), a role of Old football formation not used anymore in modern football. So just few player needs this style (Javi Martinez, Mascherano) other classic DM fit better with Build Up (Busquets),Box-to-Box (Kantè,Khedira) or Destroyer(Sturaro, Khedira).
CM
Hole player is a weird style, It put the midfielder constantly inside the penalty area when in possession, this make the teams less compact and open space for the opposite counter-attack (i could compare it with a inside forward in the old style formations).So atm i removed it from all the CC. Anyway a midfielder without any style is too much offensive in the same way, so my advice is put for all the base midfielder (CC) the destroyer style(Rakitic,Marchisio,Ramsey) that make them a little bit disciplined. If the player is more creative make it Old Style N.10 (Fabregas,Iniesta,Pjanic) or Build up adding him the DM role in alternative positions if you need some kind of deep-lying playmaker Pirlo,Xabi Alonso (setting DM in KO and OP and CC lower possible in IP)
SL
Really few player that fit this position
The SL is not intended how a less offensive winger, is another role that put the player on the side with playmaking and covering duties (like Beckham). My advice is N.10 Old style or Creative Playmaker, with the same positions in all three fluid formation or if you don't like it try set AM on IN possession to put him a little more advanced.
If you need a player that run up and down on the side line (some kind of tornante like Florenzi,Angelo Di Livio)set him SL in all position with box-to-box role and trackback, remove
WF
ATM Winger doing the right things but there are a tons of style in the real football so, go ahead to edit them., I'm testing dummy runner in alternative to prolific winger and for Walcott fits well, he sometimes is centering a bit and I wanted this. For William i have added to him the CM alternative position also adding Box-to-Box Role (but removing Trackback). So now he is cover a little more and develop some defensive duties.
If you need a more creative and unpredictable player(Reus,Ribery,Robben,Douglas Costa,Bale)who stay wide, set his preferred position to WF with alternative role SS,add Prolific Winger and put him as WF in kickoff and in IN possession and as SS in out of possession
If you need he stay a little more in the center make him SS secondary WF Creative Playmaker(Messi,Hazard)In IN Possession 'and kickoff with their preferred position and in OUT of Possesion with their secondary position.
or WF secondary CF Prolific Winger(Ronaldo,Martial,Griezmann 2014) In OUT Possession 'and kikcoff with their preferred position and in IN of Possesion with their secondary position.
To reproduce the Raumdeuter role (muller,sterling, volland) set him CL Hole Player secondary WF + trackback with this setting
KO IP OP
WF CL WF
AM
Need more time to test, anyway my preferred settings atm are CAM Classic n.10 or CAM Box-to-Box or CAM Creative playmaker(not tested yet)
with Class. N.10 AM in KO and OP and SS in IP (Ozil)or
Creat. PM AM in KO and OP SS in IP (Rooney+Trackback) or
Class. N.10 AM in KO and IP and CC in OP (Ganso,Riquelme, could be right also for David Silva)+ Inserimento
SS
For people like Dybala, SS creative PM in all KO OP IP
For False-9 (Firmino rulez) same settings and lower the position in all three scheme.
For people like T.Henry i think CF Dummy Runner secondary SS , SS in KO and OP, CF in IP.
For Fantasista like Maradona, Baggio SS Old N.10 secondary AM, SS in KO e IP, AM in OP (give him all the passing ability)or Maradona SS Creative Playmaker secondary AM, SS in KO e IP, AM in OP (give him the most part of the passing ability).
CF
Leave him CF in all three fluid scheme
Give him trackback only for box-to-box CF like Mandzukic (for Diego Costa for example is too much)
Anyway here all the settings are fine, be creative
Other impressions
Mark Man and Fighting spirit make the player more aggressive and he of course make more fouls, try to with and without.
Anyway sometime Fighting Spirit put the player a little more out of position (WB FB\SL)
Track-back is a way to make less offensive a player.
Other advice is to improve the compactness.
And keep lower the midfield to balance the whole team.
Here you can see the difference between the movement of Barça fullbacks (WB) I forgot to set a Style of Playing to Sergi Roberto (Build up i putted) so he is a little bit centered and not cover well, instead Jordi Alba do the rights movement and cover his position .
Here another video thnks to dmendenhall_9.
To understand the difference with and without hole player see pogba at 3.50 so at 26,30 and finally at 46,00.
Some edit are different from mine but this video highlights well the global change of the assets of the team (MAN UTD)
cit from dmendenhall_9.
The changes in my starting post about Player Style positon, Ability and position IMO are required to match the real player's behaviors.[/QUOTE]
here the premier league tactics
Middlesbrough, southampton, stoke, sunderland and watford require a fix, will be in the next video
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