PES 2016 News & Discussion Thread

zeus0r said:
the arcade-lovers (99% of all pes players i guess) hated it because it was soooooooooo slow und sooooo boring.

:CONFUSE:
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Exactly!

Also the ctach up bug fucked them up completely :).
But for their defence, KONAMI put a lil too much on that.

I also don´t understand why they made a 180 degree change with PES 2015 and not working on 2014´s basics.
Maybe they weren´t confident enough.

Too bad, as I didn´t like the ball physics in PES 2015 at all.
They were good in 2014. Also them through balls look so laserguided as zeus0r said. That´s actually the perfect word for it.

PES 2016 seem to have improved ball physics, but still that same ground passing thing like in PES 2015.
The high passes look great though!
I love how the ball makes that slight curve.

What I also found very positive was the atmosphere on that gameplay vids, visually at least.
It looked like there´s a lot of stuff going on in the stadium.
On PES 2015 it was quite dull, but maybe up to the fact that you had to patch away the crowd to make it more responsive.

I hope that this doesn´t have to be done for PES 2016 on PC.
 
angus said:
You've got that backwards. Similarly you also defended the shooting in PES 2105, which from a stats perspective is the absolute worst it's ever been in PES. Shot ratings mean nothing anymore, any player can easily score a goals from anywhere. Balance and positioning before shooting, which used to mean something, which used to be the heart and soul of PES gameplay, means absolutely nothing in PES 2015.

I spent a day trying to fix the broken pass % issue in PES 2015. Every CPU team completes 89-95% of its passes, every game. I lowered all players ratings to 40, including pass ratings of course. No difference whatsoever, the CPU still ping-ponged the ball around perfectly @ 90% plus. Even lowering kicking power (a trick that works in FIFA to correct the same issue) made no difference. The ball zipped around at the same speed like it was laser- guided, not even a bounce or a wobble.

Yesterday I tried the same experiment in PES 2014. Instant results. CPU pass % fell into the low 70s. The ball speed was noticeably slower, the ball bounced and bobbled across the pitch in a realistic manner, which it never does in PES 2015.

After that I decided I'm now going to wait before buying PES 2016. Konami fucked the player ratings in PES 2015, completely broke some aspects. It appears they're dumbing down the actual nuts and bolts of the game in order to make the game look pretty... give it the appearance of LOOKING like it's playing sim when it's actually not. There really is no point in buying the game if player rating effectiveness in 2016 is as broken and meaningless as it is in 2015.
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Thing is here your talking just about the passing, its true and we all knew from before about the CPU passing being too accurate, i noted also way back to lower the CPU pass accuracy, its about tactics and closing them down and presenting them easy passes.

What changed from 2014 to 2015 is yes they took away much of the balance engine and physicality was removed totally and the key which they succeed with was to create a basic game of football as a foundation. PES 2014 didn't reach any foundation of football and you could play against a team full of dummy players or Argentina on 2014 and they will all as individuals play the same way almost, because there is absolutely no dribbling on the game at all.

Like you said, PES 2015's whole point was to get right back to basics and the reason why passes are so accurate regardless of stats is because players always seem to have perfect balance to hit them.

zeus0r said:
the arcade-lovers (99% of all pes players i guess) hated it because it was soooooooooo slow und sooooo boring.

:CONFUSE:
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There was no dribbling system whatsoever in 2014 which isn't arcade but is not simulation whatsoever

Everything was passing and occasionally using the left and right sticks for tricks.
 
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klashman69 said:
we all knew from before about the CPU passing being too accurate, i noted also way back to lower the CPU pass accuracy
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Sure, but it's not about lowering passing stats. That's what I was pointing out: the pass stats in PES 2015 don't work. A player with 40 passing is as good as a player with 99 passing. All the play buildup in PES 2015, all the back and forth passing between players, is nothing more than some pre-programmed, hard-coded placebo effect Konami programmed into the game, to give it the appearance of sim football.

I don't care what these games look like, I'm not into graphics and I don't need super life-like animations. But what I do need is to know that player ratings are programmed properly, and are effective, and actually work. Looking back at those PES 2016 E3 videos, I see that nobody stopped to actually test any of that out. All we really saw were a bunch of ping-pong passes being strung together (again), and people ranting about how much smoother the controls are.
 
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angus said:
Sure, but it's not about lowering passing stats. That's what I was pointing out: the pass stats in PES 2015 don't work. A player with 40 passing is as good as a player with 99 passing. All the play buildup in PES 2015, all the back and forth passing between players, is nothing more than some pre-programmed, hard-coded placebo effect Konami programmed into the game, to give it the appearance of sim football.

I don't care what these games look like, I'm not into graphics and I don't need super life-like animations. But what I do need is to know that player ratings are programmed properly, and are effective, and actually work. Looking back at those PES 2016 E3 videos, I see that nobody stopped to actually test any of that out. All we really saw were a bunch of ping-pong passes being strung together (again), and people ranting about how much smoother the controls are.
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You're right what you said about Pes 2015. . have you read Asims latest review on Pes 2016? It sounds like the greatest game ever. If it's half as good as he makes out we're laughing.. .but then again he did say something similar for last years. Just have to wait for the demo.
 
angus said:
Sure, but it's not about lowering passing stats. That's what I was pointing out: the pass stats in PES 2015 don't work. A player with 40 passing is as good as a player with 99 passing. All the play buildup in PES 2015, all the back and forth passing between players, is nothing more than some pre-programmed, hard-coded placebo effect Konami programmed into the game, to give it the appearance of sim football.

I don't care what these games look like, I'm not into graphics and I don't need super life-like animations. But what I do need is to know that player ratings are programmed properly, and are effective, and actually work. Looking back at those PES 2016 E3 videos, I see that nobody stopped to actually test any of that out. All we really saw were a bunch of ping-pong passes being strung together (again), and people ranting about how much smoother the controls are.
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This is the reason why Stoke plays as good as Barcelona when keeping possession. I have a bad feeling about PES 2016. I hope they actually work on the stats.
 
angus said:
Sure, but it's not about lowering passing stats. That's what I was pointing out: the pass stats in PES 2015 don't work. A player with 40 passing is as good as a player with 99 passing. All the play buildup in PES 2015, all the back and forth passing between players, is nothing more than some pre-programmed, hard-coded placebo effect Konami programmed into the game, to give it the appearance of sim football.
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There is a difference, Passing is not how accurate a player passes, its they types of passes the player is capable of. I mean again we are talking about the CPU here in regards to what the stat does but this is the new interpretation for 'low pass'.

There is no doubt, its not even a question in regards to human controlled players There is a gigantic difference in passing. Playing with PSG even i can see that. There is certain goals i can only score if i have Ibra there laying the ball off, other players just aren't capable of performing.

When it comes to the CPU, the passing stats just changes what types of passes they are capable of.

So what i'm saying is, in your tests, you looking specifically for pass accuracy, instead of that look at the difference between the types of attacking passes certain players make. Compare guys like Xavi, Pirlo, to passers in the mid 80's to average players.

You won't see any or little difference in accuracy on higher levels, but you should see difference in regards to the vision, the types of passes and where each player puts the ball.

In short Xavi will see and try a pass other playrs just wouldn't try.

I hope you see my point because we all know passing accuracy for the CPU doesn't really exist in 2015 on higher levels if you set 'short pass' o every team, they will pass around like Barca with their center backs and midfield regardless of ability. Because we all know how basic the game is.
 
klashman69 said:
There is a difference, Passing is not how accurate a player passes, its they types of passes the player is capable of. I mean again we are talking about the CPU here in regards to what the stat does but this is the new interpretation for 'low pass'.

There is no doubt, its not even a question in regards to human controlled players There is a gigantic difference in passing. Playing with PSG even i can see that. There is certain goals i can only score if i have Ibra there laying the ball off, other players just aren't capable of performing.

When it comes to the CPU, the passing stats just changes what types of passes they are capable of.

So what i'm saying is, in your tests, you looking specifically for pass accuracy, instead of that look at the difference between the types of attacking passes certain players make. Compare guys like Xavi, Pirlo, to passers in the mid 80's to average players.

You won't see any or little difference in accuracy on higher levels, but you should see difference in regards to the vision, the types of passes and where each player puts the ball.

In short Xavi will see and try a pass other playrs just wouldn't try.

I hope you see my point because we all know passing accuracy for the CPU doesn't really exist in 2015 on higher levels if you set 'short pass' o every team, they will pass around like Barca with their center backs and midfield regardless of ability. Because we all know how basic the game is.
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That's a good point. I think the Passing stat should be replaced with the Vision stat and we should have a new stat called Passing Accuracy or something along those lines. Do you know any other stats that does not work or function the way it's suppose to?

Edit: Since PES is now working on the stats, we should send them all the stats that does not work/function properly.
 
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I read these articles and sometimes I wonder if any of them actually play the game consistently. They probably play it a few times from E3 until the game's released and that's it. No consistent full game time, no patches experience. It's like I've been playing a different game. It's all more talk than actual gaming time.
 
A vision stat, would it be a CPU only stat? Because if I see a passing lane, regardless of whether I'm controlling Xavi or some League 2 player, I saw it, my vision for it was there. The vision is provided by the human controlling the player, so that stat would be null for human controlled players. Or does the vision stat limit my ability, regardless of whether I can point the joystick correctly towards the spot I meant to make the pass?
 
banbenbin said:
A vision stat, would it be a CPU only stat? Because if I see a passing lane, regardless of whether I'm controlling Xavi or some League 2 player, I saw it, my vision for it was there. The vision is provided by the human controlling the player, so that stat would be null for human controlled players. Or does the vision stat limit my ability, regardless of whether I can point the joystick correctly towards the spot I meant to make the pass?
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It will play a minor role when it comes to the User and the accuracy of the passing for both the user and the cpu should be determined by the passing accuracy and the vision of the passer with passing accuracy being more influential.

For only the CPU, it should work something like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWTTIwphjz4
 
Lami said:
I read these articles and sometimes I wonder if any of them actually play the game consistently. They probably play it a few times from E3 until the game's released and that's it. No consistent full game time, no patches experience. It's like I've been playing a different game. It's all more talk than actual gaming time.
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Exactly, that´s the problem I have with all those articles.
They should be written by someone who´s playing PES for years and is aware of the positives and negatives of the former releases.
 
I thought the gameplay looks pretty good (as good as ever), but presentation wise the game is still dull.

Replays after goals are still long, slow and boring (it just makes no sense to me). And can we finally get an option to disallow replays after every fould/offside?
Also Stadium texture looked very poor (san siro) for a ps4.

I never got sold on the 3d crowd either, a solution ala tennis elbow mod where you put high quality 2d crowds (in tennis elbow a real world picture) would definitely make the crowd look more realistic. they always look like flashy water mellons.

And i really wanna know how many real world stadia are in, i expect a lot of new stadia. And better chants/commentary, atmosphere is always so bad, you just don't feel much!

I think for me the master league would be the critical issue. I am fed up with on line games, so if i get a good, simple bs free master league i am gonna have a blast.

If the master league is tasteless and repetitve with a lot of silly stuff i might give the game a pass.

As i grow older i have less and less friends to play pes with (off line) so game modes and presentation become really important to feel the gamw!

greetings!
 
Mehtab said:
This is the reason why Stoke plays as good as Barcelona when keeping possession. I have a bad feeling about PES 2016. I hope they actually work on the stats.
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I'm still playing PES 15 since I bought it in November, there's no other PES that comes close to me, been playing a lot of master league and haven't experienced stoke playing as Barcelona, against me they play a lot of long balls, sure they have a few players that love to dribble like krkic and arnautovic, to me that's individuality kicking in, awesome game, hopefully they can sort out a few of the faults the game has, looking forward to this demo.
 
Jimi_Zuko said:
I'm still playing PES 15 since I bought it in November, there's no other PES that comes close to me, been playing a lot of master league and haven't experienced stoke playing as Barcelona, against me they play a lot of long balls, sure they have a few players that love to dribble like krkic and arnautovic, to me that's individuality kicking in, awesome game, hopefully they can sort out a few of the faults the game has, looking forward to this demo.
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He said when keeping possession, and he's correct.
 
lucagian said:
He said when keeping possession, and he's correct.
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Depends on how many assists you have active, remember konami have implemented teamvision which is ment for the AI to mimick on how you play, it's not 100% but it works, if you have assisted passing then they aren't gonna stray and you yourself will be playing like Barcelona not matter which side u have, but when u play full manual, the AI also makes mistakes whether it's passing or shooting but as I said its not 100% but it works, come pes16 hopefully they will have refined it even more
 
Jimi_Zuko said:
Depends on how many assists you have active, remember konami have implemented teamvision which is ment for the AI to mimick on how you play, it's not 100% but it works, if you have assisted passing then they aren't gonna stray and you yourself will be playing like Barcelona not matter which side u have, but when u play full manual, the AI also makes mistakes whether it's passing or shooting but as I said its not 100% but it works, come pes16 hopefully they will have refined it even more
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I still think they should revamp the A.I quite a bit more. I have watched AI play on PES 6 and then watch on PES 2015 and realize how predictable the A.I is on PES 2015. The A.I needs to be more dynamic and follow their stats, trait and team tactics rather than having scripted/pre-defined behaviors. Once you know the scripted behaviors of the A.I, you can easily win 6-0, 5-0 against any team on Superstar.
 
cRoNoSHaCk said:
I found a info says PES 2016 gonna have new stadiums:

New San Mamés
Stade Velódreme
Borussia Park
Bournemouth
National Stadium of Varsovia (this is already on PES 2015)

Source: http://www.pasionlibertadores.com/n...s-que-estaran-en-el-PES-16-20150630-0009.html
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BOURNEMOUTH? As in, the team just promoted to the Premier League?

Considering the team isn't licensed I highly doubt this (I guess they could be licensed in the new game, but of all the teams to pick, why would you pick a team that's just been promoted and is likely to get relegated again?).
 
My guess is that obscure website is bullshitting, seems very strange indeed.

I doubt it is true, but if it is, i would like it. PES needs smaller stadiums.
 
Mehtab said:
I still think they should revamp the A.I quite a bit more. I have watched AI play on PES 6 and then watch on PES 2015 and realize how predictable the A.I is on PES 2015. The A.I needs to be more dynamic and follow their stats, trait and team tactics rather than having scripted/pre-defined behaviors. Once you know the scripted behaviors of the A.I, you can easily win 6-0, 5-0 against any team on Superstar.
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I can see that if your using 3 bar passing on PES 2015

But how on earth can you not find PES6 extremely predictable also?




Every match since i dominate, regardless if its Real Madrid or Celta Vigo i use Sevilla against and they only score with a cheesy goal against the run of play.

For PES 2016 to move forward PES 6 is not the awnser!
 
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Chris Davies said:
BOURNEMOUTH? As in, the team just promoted to the Premier League?

Considering the team isn't licensed I highly doubt this (I guess they could be licensed in the new game, but of all the teams to pick, why would you pick a team that's just been promoted and is likely to get relegated again?).
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Well, that webpage is important web on South America, and I see promotioned on the Copa Libertadores, so I don't know if are real info or not. :THINK:
 
cRoNoSHaCk said:
I found a info says PES 2016 gonna have new stadiums:

New San Mamés
Stade Velódreme
Borussia Park
Bournemouth
National Stadium of Varsovia (this is already on PES 2015)

Source: http://www.pasionlibertadores.com/n...s-que-estaran-en-el-PES-16-20150630-0009.html
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Someone can ask the source ?
Velodrome, why not the EURO 2016 are coming.
Borussia Park, Borussia Monchegladbach are probably under licence.
Nuevo San Mamés, new Spanish stadium maybe not on EA licence.
and about Bournemouth, typically the style of stadium people want too see in PES, but certainly not under licence.
 
klashman69 said:
I can see that if your using 3 bar passing on PES 2015

But how on earth can you not find PES6 extremely predictable also?




Every match since i dominate, regardless if its Real Madrid or Celta Vigo i use Sevilla against and they only score with a cheesy goal against the run of play.

For PES 2016 to move forward PES 6 is not the awnser!
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none of the today's PES games AI plays great, maybe the really older ones mean challenge only. play pvp. thats the real deal
 
Lami said:
Actually just give us the stadium editor back and I'm happy. It was good enough for me.
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Stadium editor but with more options, yes. The old stadium editor was pretty basic and very limited. I want to be to create any size stadium, including 1000 seat county pitches, something these games never have.
 
klashman69 said:
I can see that if your using 3 bar passing on PES 2015

But how on earth can you not find PES6 extremely predictable also?




Every match since i dominate, regardless if its Real Madrid or Celta Vigo i use Sevilla against and they only score with a cheesy goal against the run of play.

For PES 2016 to move forward PES 6 is not the awnser!
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I am saying PES 2016 is predictable not PES 6. I want PES 2016 to follow the A.I of PES 6 or PES 5. PES 2015 is the best with two-player but with A.I, it's really predictable. There are few good things they should keep. For example, if you keep playing the same, they will figure it out and block that way of attacking.
 
Mehtab said:
I am saying PES 2016 is predictable not PES 6. I want PES 2016 to follow the A.I of PES 6 or PES 5. PES 2015 is the best with two-player but with A.I, it's really predictable. There are few good things they should keep. For example, if you keep playing the same, they will figure it out and block that way of attacking.
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It's pretty much documented most people consider the AI in PES 2015 a huge step backwards. It looks like simulation football when the CPU is passing the ball around, sure. But it's all for show, there's nothing of actual strategic substance going on in the game at that point. Also, CPU shots and goals are all the same, CPU attack logic is all the same, User GK lets in the same low corner shots every time, and User goalscoring feels empty because player balance and positioning means nothing. It's the most simplistic and predictable AI in any football game put out by either company in the past several years.

I still love the game for many reasons, but the AI is not one of them. Konami needs to fix it along with the (still very weak) GK AI or I won't be buying PES 2106, that's make or break for me.
 
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angus said:
It's pretty much documented most people consider the AI in PES 2015 a huge step backwards. It looks like simulation football when the CPU is passing the ball around, sure. But it's all for show, there's nothing of actual strategic substance going on in the game at that point. Also, CPU shots and goals are all the same, CPU attack logic is all the same, User GK lets in the same low corner shots every time, and User goalscoring feels empty because player balance and positioning means nothing. It's the most simplistic and predictable AI in any football game put out by either company in the past several years.

I still love the game for many reasons, but the AI is not one of them. Konami needs to fix it along with the (still very weak) GK AI or I won't be buying PES 2106, that's make or break for me.
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Exactly how I feel. Hope they know it's a problem that needs to be fixed in PES 2016.
 
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