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Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread

So has every LFC fan officially turned on Rafa? Never thought I'd hear that around here...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I wouldn't say we all have but the tide has definately moved and the majority are I think.

A lot of people think he deserves one more season to fix this mess as all teams have a bad season and he's shown he's a good manager. The thing is, if he's already lost the dressing room then another season won't do anybody any good.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Premiership rankings, 2004-present:

2004-05: 5th, 17W, 7D, 14L
05-06: 3rd, 25W,7D,6L
06-07: 3rd, 20W,8D,10L
07-08: 4th, 21W,13D,4L
08-09: 2nd, 25W, 11D, 2L
09-10: 6th, 14W,6D,9L

Besides the nine losses, the team is still in a decent position and there are ten games left to play. Assuming you guys don't lose any more matches, LFC is still in position to claim forth.

http://www.goal.com/en-india/news/2...l-cant-afford-to-fire-rafael-benitez-due-to-a
Did anyone catch this story?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

The problem is we're in such a poor run of form that every game is a nightmare now, even Portsmouth tonight. It SHOULD be a clear-cut win for us but I bet we struggle.

I don't think we'll sack Rafa, but I do think Madrid and Juventus will make moves for him in the summer. Everyone's happy then. Liverpool are happy at not paying Rafa any severence fee, Rafa is happy that he has saved his pride and not resigned as such, and Madrid/Juventus are happy that they got their new manager.

That's what I see happening, I'll be surprised if Rafa is still here next season either way.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Don't think it's so much Anti Rafa, but more that it's been obvious for a couple of months now, maybe the whole season, that something has been up in the team. And what can you do to change it? You can't sell 20 players, and you can't get rid of a few "trouble makers", if there are any, as the senior players are just fed up with him.

You can't go out and buy a 5 or 6 top players either so you have to do something with the current group, and that means the manager has to go.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

The thing is your club is in a worrying bad situation that next season is to late, If City nail 4th they'll then go in the Summer and secure themselves within that top 4 and you won't be getting CL Money for the considerable future which for players like Gerrard, Torres in the long term is a must.

You could end up in the Spurs/Villa pile, wandering between 5th and 8th.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

YoungGun_UK said:
The thing is your club is in a worrying bad situation that next season is to late, If City nail 4th they'll then go in the Summer and secure themselves within that top 4 and you won't be getting CL Money for the considerable future which for players like Gerrard, Torres in the long term is a must.

You could end up in the Spurs/Villa pile, wandering between 5th and 8th.
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Pretty much. I think that's how our future is going to be, for the reasons you've mentioned. City are going to strenghten their squad regardless and they'll attract most players. On the other side of that arguement, it's going to be harder for Liverpool to attract players if we're not in the CL.

New owners are absoloutely vital for Liverpool, otherwise we're just going to keep dropping down the table. To be honest I'm surprised it's taken this long for other teams to be battling so much for fourth place anyway.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

tbf all Torres has said is that he wants the club to move forward, he hasn't once said anything like "if we don't sign any big players i'm off" he was asked if he'd consider his future if we didn't finish fourth, which is a loaded question as it is, and he answered it honestly by basically saying no he wouldn't, bur that he would think about his future and the clubs future if the club doesn't show any ambition in the next year or so.

I think he's totally right to say that.


edit: shit theres a whole new page :LOL: this was in response to gerd's post at the bottom of the previous page.


btw, i haven't turned on Rafa, i don't think he's 100% to blame for the mess we're in, and think he deserves another season, if he gets sacked in the summer it will completely vindicate the owners and everyone else of blame as everyone will basically accept that it was all down to Benitez and that's why he was sacked.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

I think most people (everyone?) know that the players are at fault as much as Benitez, if not more so. Both the players and Rafa are underperforming and both need a good smack around the head to get their act together.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Watching Liverpool this season has been like watching a much-loved family dog falling ill and slowly losing the will to live; all his old joy and lust for life has evaporated. It's heartbreaking to see and you know that some time soon, he will have to be put out of his misery.

There is a yearning for the players to remove the shackles that all too visibly chain them down but clearly they are unable to do so. They seem withdrawn into themselves, bereft of creativity and excitement. As each game comes along it's easy to feel that this will be the one where they really kick on and play well, but it rarely ever is. Tonight's game against Portsmouth should be a comfortable, confidence-boosting win, but on current form that's far from likely.

Whatever team Benitez puts out plays with inhibition; a kind of rigor mortis has set in. The club is likewise atrophying. There is no vision of the future, there is merely surviving. And merely surviving is not good enough for a great old club like Liverpool.

Push is now coming to shove. With the Champions League looking to be beyond them and the Europa Cup too, if Thursday's performance is anything to go by, the club is running out of steam. Within a week or so, their season may well be over.

Its twin heart beats of Carragher and Gerrard look exhausted, shell-shocked even, as week after week they have battled to make a diamond out of the dirt. Gerrard appears not to have smiled once all season, his face set in a permanent frown. Misery permeates the club.

Poor performances are now the norm. Boring football is now the norm. Losing to the likes of Wigan and Lille is now the norm. It doesn't surprise anyone anymore. The fans loyalty to the players and to Rafa is admirable. There are too many shrill, fickle fans in football that want the world and want it now. But Anfield seems quiet these days. Hicks and Gillette seem to have sapped the fans of their passion. Like an incubus squatting on the comatose body of the club, they have drained the life out of LFC. The club and its supporters have withdrawn into themselves in a collective act of depression. This is not the noisy, vibrant Merseyside club of yore.

This weekend came the latest story of potential investors taking a 40% stake in the club. However, even if it happens, The Rhone Group will only be paying down the debt to make the club a more attractive prospect to buy. Their money may well make it easier for the club to raise the money for a new ground, but while it is a lifeline, it is not a big new future. It is a stepping stone to a new future, not the new future itself. The worry is this will act as a life support machine for the club, keeping it alive but still unhealthy.

This is a hugely crucial moment in the club's history. Liverpool, until Bill Shankly took over, were not a powerhouse of world football, far from it. They languished in the second tier, very much the poor cousins of the East Lancs road. If there isn't a major, deep, profound overhaul of the club this summer, there is no telling where the slump will end. Seriously, this is a pivotal moment.

Without Champions League money and possibly more crucially, without the bait of Champions League football to attract top players and without a new ground to maximise income on match days, Liverpool could easily slip into being a mid-table side or worse, unable to compete at the top table any more. The club stands on the verge of an era of decline.

Liverpool legend Phil Thompson launched an impressive, impassioned defence of his club on Soccer Saturday this weekend, driven, it seemed, by the very real fear that the end is nigh. This was no mere plea for more money, it was greater than that, it was a plea for the very survival of the club. Hicks and Gillett must sell up and get out or properly fund the club.

Christian Purslow appears to be trawling the world for rich people with money to spare with a degree of haste which suggests he also knows we're in end game now.

With talk of their best players being restless, with their fortunes on the pitch declining, with no vision or planning in place, Liverpool is adrift in a sea of confusion. It's just existing from day to day with owners who are divided between wanting to sell and stay but with no ability or desire to put any more money into the club and the very real possibility of not being able to service the loans they have taken out to buy it.

Surely the owners realise that this is actually decreasing the value of their asset. Surely they'd be better off selling now before it gets any worse. Christ it's a depressing mess.

The gossip about whether Rafa will stay or go is inevitable. As a long-time Rafa fan myself, even I have to admit that recently, it has started to feel like the end of an era. The energy to keep on fighting is understandably diminished. A major new investor or owner will surely want to begin a new era with a new management team, though that is still a long way away from happening.

The status quo isn't an option now. If nothing changes, the decline next season may be rapid as most of the quality players will understandably jump ship feeling they have given all they can to this cause. It will be really hard to bring in any top-quality players because Liverpool, under Hicks and Gillett, has become toxic. You need to have a future to offer new, top-notch players more than just the hope of better times at some distant, undefined point.

The coming months are some of the most important in Liverpool's history because the club is unwell and it isn't looking like it's going to recover. If it was an aged family pet, the car has been started and a blanket is being put on the back seat for that last ride. It's hard not to feel very sad.
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Depressing but true :(
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

YoungGun_UK said:
The thing is your club is in a worrying bad situation that next season is to late, If City nail 4th they'll then go in the Summer and secure themselves within that top 4 and you won't be getting CL Money for the considerable future which for players like Gerrard, Torres in the long term is a must.

You could end up in the Spurs/Villa pile, wandering between 5th and 8th.
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So could Man Utd at the moment. This is the "worst" Man Utd since Ferguson took over.
IF Man Utd wins the title, then the other big clubs have spoiled a unique occasion.
And you can't really say that United are fiancially healthy...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

We haven't won in the last nine Monday night games! :SHOCK:

The last one was McAllister scoring against Everton!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

It's not all about money though. This idea that throwing money at megastars is the only route to success is flawed. Look at Arsenal, they can realistically win the league this season and they hardly spend anything on transfers. Most of the time the best transfers are the midrange ones that blossom at the club they sign for. Look at the top 3 British transfers. Robinho - Flop. Berbatov - A lot of people would say he was a flop. Shevchenko - Flop.

United's best signings of the last few years (arguably) have been Vidic and Evra who cost less than £15m for both, so this idea that you need a load of big name players to compete is pure gash. Benitez needs to motivate his players and inspire them, they're more than capable as they showed last season. He has made a lot of average signings but that's irrelevant really when he's got rid of a perfectly capable right back for peanuts and made his replacement the most expensive fullback in the country despite him not being able to defend and forked out on a flair player he refuses to play. This on top of the complete mess he made of the Robbie Keane situation.

What I'm getting at is the owners are not causing all this, I read something saying that the players can't concentrate on football with all the turmoil behind the scenes!! Bollocks, our club is in a worse mess than yours financially and our players are coping admirably I'm sure you'll all agree. The players are playing without confidence and belief, and this has been evident from pre-season, as I said then after you didn't win the first 5 or so matches. That's Rafa's job to sort out, blaming the owners is just a bullshit excuse which has become typical of Rafa's tenure. If he hadn't fluked that CL in the first season he'd have no support at all.

That's a bit of a ramble but whatever..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I don't believe it. Completely shocked.

Kuyt has been dropped! :SHOCK:

Aquilani starts! :SHOCK:

Babel starts! :SHOCK:

Got to be the most attacking team Rafa has ever picked?!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

He must be desparate, looks like he's been reading the forums for team selection help. :D

Just watch now, Babel and Aqui will probably be the worst players on the pitch :P
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

No, they'll be the best.

But get dropped for Kuyt and Lucas against Lille.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Really impressed with our play so far tonight. Lots of movement, nice passing, a good attacking mentality. Maxi and Aquilani particularly standing out :)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Yeah I am actually enjoying your football tonight, which is rarer than rocking-horse shit.

Nice quick interchanges around the box, short and snappy is pleasing on the eye. Torres is playing well and Aquilani too. Obviously Portsmouth are about as close as you'll get to whipping boys in this league but the way you've played this season that was far from certain.

The only negative is your defence looks a bit shaky. Reina flapping, Carragher hoofing, Insua and Johnson out of position and Piquionne looking like he could get a goal with his persistence but other than that I'm actually impressed. Looks like the shackles are off.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Hopefully we'll keep going at Portsmouth in the second half, although I noticed that the play slowed down quite a lot towards the end of the half so I imagine Rafa has told them to slow the game down now and take their time.

All well and good as we've got such a lead but it'd be nice to improve our goal difference, and hopefully Maxi will get the goal he deserves from his play tonight :)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I may be reading too much into it, but I got the distinct impression that with the choice of playing Babel and Aquilani the players were told to go out and attack. I'm not sure hoe much you can read into the scoreline against Poortsmouth, but the players actually looked like they wanted to play, Gerrard actually sprinting again.......

Really seemed like they were finally allowed to play again without all the defensive crap and are really enjoying it.

We will quickly see in the 2nd half, if the tempo drops down and it turns to crap again we will know it's Benitez reigning them in again.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Exactly, Tik. The players chosen tells a lot and it does seem like he told them to go out and just play.

Was it this time last season that he let the shackles off as well?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

It's not Torres job to moan about the quality of his team mates.
All he has to do is saty fit and play good matches. He wasn't that brilliant this season either.
He should shut up.
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can you slag eduardo too please :COOPZ: all joking aside I love It! take this top drawer performance and beat every team especially you know too!! I admit Pool have the best fans I love the song before every match and how the camera shows in details having babies w/ their rattlers singing
 
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:LOL:

Very pleased with that performance, I just hope Rafa puts out the same team against Lille now!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Aquilani....was.....sensational. Maxi and Babel had great games. Maxi is so much better than Kuyt on the right for games against these sorts of teams.

Aqualini was maurading through midfield, playing 1 touch interchanges, nicking the ball away from opposition player, turning on a six pence and sprayed some Alonso esque passes down the flanks. His movement was outstanding, he demanded the ball, and more importantly everyone else trusted him with it (the signs were there when he came on against Wigan, he looked really sharp) and he is starting to gel.

Special mentions to Babel, Maxi, Torres (involed in all the goals) and Glenn Johnson too, getting back to match fitness me thinks.

That pass for Torres's 2nd. Stunning.

Yes Portsmouth are bottom of the league, but we struggled against them before, and they were on a mini run of form, boosted by their forthcoming wembley appearance.

I expected a win tonight, but not so comftable as that was. I think ive said it before, but with Aquilani, Johnson, Torres, Gerrard, Maxi and Benayoun in the team we look a much slicker outfit. Kuyt has his uses and is a very under-rated CF, but how can we seriously continue to play him at RM every game?
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

I was thinking about something thismorning;

Does the DM player next to Masch pretty much determine how the whole team plays?

Alonso: Patient play, possesion football and the attacking 4 can stay upfront and run into space knowing that even over a distance of 60 odd yards they will still get the ball to feet. Opposition can't put a lot of pressure on Alonso because they know he has the speed of thought and pass that he will always find a teammate. This means the attackers can push up and keep the game stretched and open.

Lucas: Has a very limited passing range, looks to be tidy and keep possesion but nothing more. Attacking 4 have to come back to get the ball leaving the striker isolated. Opposition can push up and pressure the defenders/DM's as they know they have a decent chance of winning the ball. You'll never see a pass over 60 yards meaning the defense can be comfotable with Torres and Gerrard isolated.

Aquilani: Good passing range, is always looking to go forward and plays more forward, between Masch and the attacking 4. Plays short quick passes and is always looking for space. Enables the now DM player (Masch) to play simple short passes upfield with Aquilani and Gerrard combining and keeping possesion higher up the field. This enables the attacking 4 to stay higher up the pitch meaning the opposition has to sit deeper, making more space in midfield. More time on the ball for Gerard and Aquilani with killer passes far more frequent.

Gerrard: Doesn't have the tactical insight or patience so ends up trying to force the attack. Loss of possesion with hollywood balls, running with the ball gets crowded out as Torres is still isolated and attacking play movement has to start earlier on the pitch. Opposition can manmark Gerrard as it isn't his game to spray quick passes about in midfield like Alonso and wants to retain possesion. Again enables the opposition to press higher up.

Now I may be reading too much into last nights performance, but Aquilani's performance seemed to be pretty much what Ben described. I'm not sure if, for now, he will be able to cope in a game with a more aggressive defensive midfield but give him games to get up to speed and he should be fine. You could see the difference, more attacking position he is naturally quick thinking/quick passing as he needs to be and settles into the rhythm. Play him more defensive as Alonso and he looses it, taking too much time on the ball as he knows he can't be looking for killer passes.

Also you can see what having two fast attackers does to a defense. The midfield got as much time as it didi last night because Portsmouth knew that with both Torres and Babel they couldn't pressure as much as it would be too dangerous.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

No mention of the elbow? Just seen it, Gerrard runs over, speeds up and then thumps brown in the face, off the ball. Fortunately it's the FA, as in, do sweet FA unless it's a non top-four player. Or Rio Ferdinand.

I'd be upset, except that it was against Michael Brown. Harder next time please Stevie, break the dirty c*nts face.

(if anyone wonders why, youtube Michael Brown and Ryan Giggs)
 
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