FIFA 09 Discussion Thread (Old)

[marktruman]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I've said this before but they need to fix the long shots, very airy and feels like your kicking a beachball. crosses have no whip either or corners, they just hang in the air. if they fixed this it would be so much better, of course they wont though. Will take them about 5 years to actually fix this, instead they will just churn out 1-2 improvements each year which no one really cares about and just be oblivous to the real problems. Granted, they fixed the responsiveness but lets see how it really is when they come to play it. No mention of shooting/crossing being fixed though

 

[BobbyBox]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I've said this before but they need to fix the long shots, very airy and feels like your kicking a beachball. crosses have no whip either or corners, they just hang in the air. if they fixed this it would be so much better, of course they wont though. Will take them about 5 years to actually fix this, instead they will just churn out 1-2 improvements each year which no one really cares about and just be oblivous to the real problems. Granted, they fixed the responsiveness but lets see how it really is when they come to play it. No mention of shooting/crossing being fixed though

Not everyone is like Konami mate.

You have no basis for what you are saying - we will all just have to wait and see what they come up with. It sounds to me that they have fixed more than a couple of things.

 

[marktruman]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I loved fifa 08 a lot, until I realised how crap the shooting/responsiveness was, so now im back playing pro evo 6 because the shooting has more power in them, even if the game generally isnt as good. Fifa 08 should be called Fifa 08 Beachball edition. I have no basis to what im saying as I havent played the game, but everytime i see the producer give an interview, he parps on about the same things all the time which is formations/responsiveness/bepro, which leads me to believe they are the major changes. Im sure he would of mentioned better shooting if they had tweaked it

 

[BobbyBox]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I loved fifa 08 a lot, until I realised how crap the shooting/responsiveness was, so now im back playing pro evo 6 because the shooting has more power in them, even if the game generally isnt as good. Fifa 08 should be called Fifa 08 Beachball edition. I have no basis to what im saying as I havent played the game, but everytime i see the producer give an interview, he parps on about the same things all the time which is formations/responsiveness/bepro, which leads me to believe they are the major changes. Im sure he would of mentioned better shooting if they had tweaked it

Shooting and crossing were not a big problem for me - The resposiveness was a real factor why I don't play it anymore. If that gets a bit better then the game will be much better for me.

Cross field balls could be better - you should be able to do a long mid height pass - instead of long loopy ones.

I guess different people have different ideas - thats what makes the world go round

 

[marktruman]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

true, the cross field balls were also loopy, but that was my major gripe, everything was too high and loopy. Id like somthing to go mid-height with a bit of power in it, nice and flat cross, not a tall and airy slow cross, its just so unrealistic imo

 

[BobbyBox]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

true, the cross field balls were also loopy, but that was my major gripe, everything was too high and loopy. Id like somthing to go mid-height with a bit of power in it, nice and flat cross, not a tall and airy slow cross, its just so unrealistic imo

Yeah I definately agree with that - that would make the game alot better.

 

[evacuate]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Have you even played Euro 08? They improved the shooting to be less floaty and it seems like they have worked even more on it to FIFA 09.

 

[Trance_Allstar]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

true, the cross field balls were also loopy, but that was my major gripe, everything was too high and loopy. Id like somthing to go mid-height with a bit of power in it, nice and flat cross, not a tall and airy slow cross, its just so unrealistic imo

If they incorporated being able to decide height of longballs with the angle you tilt the analog stick like in ISS98, they would allow for users to decide the height they want on longballs. I suppose it's yet another suggestion for improvement to add to the list.

To be honest I feel PES6 is a bad example of more powerful shooting. Since the PES6 gameplay is alot faster in general than FIFA08, you can'ty really compare the shooting between the 2 games on an "absolute" scale. Rather, you need to compare the shooting to the overall pace of each game.

And, FIFA's shots are more powerful when considering the pace of the rest of the game. PES6 had really quick gameplay, but many times after turning or being in awkward positions, the resulting shot would be horribly slow.

What I mean is, that while a FIFA shot might reach 80km/h and a PES6 shot might reach 85hm/h (PES shots being faster), the foot/leg movement that led to the FIFA shot might've been around 70km/h, whilst in PES6 it was 95km/h. Slowing PES6 animation speeds down to more realistic FIFA08 tempo, PES6 shots would sometimes be unbelievably floaty.

These are my own examples of shotpowers/ball hits being completely disconnected from the actual movements that lead up to the shot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qJX0Nb7VuE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ee93uNYbM6E

THe quick movement of the game and the animations are rarely transfered properly into the correct power for the shot.

FIFA08's shot powers need some improving, but for PES6's shot powers to correspond to the overall pace of the game and the much faster movements of players legs when running, shooting etc, the balls should be propelled with alot more power than they are. PES5 had it more spot on, though shots needed slowing down just a tad in that one.

Just my personal opinion.

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

true, the cross field balls were also loopy, but that was my major gripe, everything was too high and loopy. Id like somthing to go mid-height with a bit of power in it, nice and flat cross, not a tall and airy slow cross, its just so unrealistic imo

I find using the early cross (LB + cross button.......I think) results in some quite dangerous crosses that arc a bit lower than the standard cross.

 

[evacuate]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Anyone knows how the new curled passes will work?

"For intelligence, we’ve massively improved positioning,goalkeeping, reducing the frequency the ball is intercepted in certain situations,, through-balls and enabling skilled players to curl passes and crosses."

I find this very interesting because playing on manual I really like the idea to be able to curl a long through pass. Because as it is now you always have to pass in a straight line when you in real life would pass the ball on one side of the defender and curl it towards your teammate.

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Anyone knows how the new curled passes will work?

"For intelligence, we’ve massively improved positioning,goalkeeping, reducing the frequency the ball is intercepted in certain situations,, through-balls and enabling skilled players to curl passes and crosses."

I find this very interesting because playing on manual I really like the idea to be able to curl a long through pass. Because as it is now you always have to pass in a straight line when you in real life would pass the ball on one side of the defender and curl it towards your teammate.

I'm guessing they will use the same model as PES where by the curl is automated and determined by the individual stats of the players.

 

[marktruman]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

trace_allstar brought up some good points. In pro evo I feel like I have more control over the shots in a way, even if they do go over a bit too much Also in pro evo, if you double tap the cross button it does a flat cross, triple tap and it goes along the floore. one tap and its a normal nice weighted cross, would like to see that implemented into fifa, but I have a feeling it will take 2-3 years for them to fix that :p If they fixed everything then theyd have nothing to improve

 

[BobbyBox]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

trace_allstar brought up some good points. In pro evo I feel like I have more control over the shots in a way, even if they do go over a bit too much Also in pro evo, if you double tap the cross button it does a flat cross, triple tap and it goes along the floore. one tap and its a normal nice weighted cross, would like to see that implemented into fifa, but I have a feeling it will take 2-3 years for them to fix that :p If they fixed everything then theyd have nothing to improve

The double triple tap thing is in Fifa for crosses already.

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Yep, FIFA copied that from PES. The triple-tap low cross is in, too.

 

[evacuate]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I doubt the curl on passes would be automatic. Why would he say it is there for the more skilled players to use? If it just happens randomly there is no skills involved, like in PES.

Edit: I just realised that players in his sentence might mean the players in the game. That would be really disappointing because every football player in the world can hit curled passes and crosses. Hopefully he means players as in the ones that holding the controller.

 

[Trance_Allstar]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I doubt the curl on passes would be automatic. Why would he say it is there for the more skilled players to use? If it just happens randomly there is no skills involved, like in PES.

Edit: I just realised that players in his sentence might mean the players in the game. That would be really disappointing because every football player in the world can hit curled passes and crosses. Hopefully he means players as in the ones that holding the controller.

Yeah, I thought the same thing. It's a bit too much of a game-feature and not a realism feature if curl on passes and crosses is only available to the Ronaldinhos and such.

For me personally I can't wait until they figure out some way to introduce curl control in the game. It would probably have to be some type of aftertouch curl like in ISS98, but for me personally it would be worth the slight sacrifice in realism for the very rewarding feature of being able to choose curl direction.
Obviously it should be done in a way where you cannot choose exactly what curl to get, the more off balance or pressured the less control etc, and in certain cituations it wouldn't be possible to get topspin, and misshits would ruin any curl you might have had in mind etc.

The easiest thing might be to do like ISS. If you hold LT just before or just when the pass/shot/cross is struck, then the way you rotate or hold the analog stick would influence the spin on the ball. If you are in a position where you need to have only player control on the left analog stick and not unintentionally influence curl while you are trying to move the player receiving the ball etc, then you'd just not hold LT.

LT doesn't do anything currently other than control the pace for on and off the ball movements, and activate the trick stick. The curl feature could be seen as another "trick" feature, or, holding LT activates both the trickstick and the curl systems.


I'd implement it if it was my game.


Obviously, in ISS it was possible to influence the curl quite a long time after the ball left the boot. And you could also curl in two directions by changing curl direction mid-air. More restrictions would be needed, and the curl feature would only be available a certain timeframe after the ball is struck.

 

[Placebo]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Gameplayvideo:

http://www.fifasoccerblog.com/

Old video that I mirrored about 50 times 2 pages back.......

 

[Placebo]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

boring its all the same

90% of it is, but this isn't:

we’ve addressed the need for Manual v Semi or Full assisted in online play.

Don't remember reading that in any of the previous previews?

Problem with that interview, as the problem is with most inexperienced interviewees (as I tried to stress in the suggested Fifa09 question thread), ask vague, softball questions and you give them the opportunity to simply rehash the same old PR speak we already heard before. 1st and 3rd questions in that interview are perfect examples, complete waste of time considering he only answered 7 questions.

Also noticed this on the site:

A Must for FIFA 09

Referee on the Pitch (37%)
Stadium Editor (34%)
Kit & Face Editor (28%)

Total : 1762 votes

Shows this site is clearly visited by cockmonkeys, ref on the pitch is more important than a stadium or Kit and Face editor? Perlease.

 

[PESV]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

"slight sacrifice in realism"

Balls do not curl out of themselves. You have to do it. That is for me the main point. So every way in which the user gets control over the ball means it is more realistic then the other way around. Even if you have to jump up three times and do a headstand to make it curl to the left, it would still be more realistic then no curl at all, or having no control over it. In a way, despite the fact that the curl can still be added the second the ball is released, the passing game of Sensible Soccer 'feels' more realistic at a gut level then the much more sophisticated plug and pass of many other games. The bounds of realism are within the domain of this 'feeling', what meets the eye is important but secondary.

For me it is always a matter of translating the initial idea that pops into your brain as precisely into the game as possible. The translating means, may it be your own leg or a controller, is irrelevant. As long as this mediator is potentially as intuitive to become nearly invisible. In many cases a controller might be better suited for this then your own legs .

So I totally agree that they should add curling to the passing system. In the end it is your idea that is most important. Not the programmers idea. But it would be good if the flexibility depends on the type of player. With Ronaldhino for example you just need to tap the stick, with a lower league player you need to hold the stick firmly to the side for a second. Cause I am totally fine with that kind of friction. I want to get mad at my player for being such a ass that he cant cross it like I wanted it. I do not want to be pissed at the game itself that it will not allow me to perform a certain action.

 

[jeblo05]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

we’ve addressed the need for Manual v Semi or Full assisted in online play

-> could be a major step in online gaming

Only people willing "to play football" are using manual. Kids with the intention to be the best on a COMPUTER GAME are using assisted (while controlling Barca, Inter, Chelsea FC, etc...)

 

[sweetkilla]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

The whole point of playing online is to win win win and claim your awesome

thats why they have unranked for those who don't like been owned by competitive gamers

 

[Lami]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

I don't like playing people who abuse exploits. Total waste of my time.

 

[jeblo05]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

The whole point of playing online is to win win win and claim your awesome

thats why they have unranked for those who don't like been owned by competitive gamers

that's why I don't play any kind of ranked matches. I don't have any problem losing an exciting match.

unfortunately I've got owned by exploits too often, even in friendlies....
...as Lami said: total waste of time

 

[gomito#10]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

i like the fact that if your player has a higher cross attribute that it would be effected in his crosses. this to me is simulation... the opposite that say a player like Vidic can have a great curling cross as long as you hit the right buttons or move the stick in a certain way, is arcadey... i think i might be in the minority with that view, not sure but i loved it in pro evo when players of better attributes would dominate games... it made the game fun. Also one think i donit hink i have seen anyone mention. Left footed players. In pro evo i noticed left footed players alot more, say giggs go the ball, he would pass, dribble and shoot with his left. I dont see this in fifa...

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

we’ve addressed the need for Manual v Semi or Full
Only people willing "to play football" are using manual. Kids with the intention to be the best on a COMPUTER GAME are using assisted (while controlling Barca, Inter, Chelsea FC, etc...)

Just look at the FIFA 08 tournaments on x-league tv.

 

[gomito#10]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

guys i suck at manual. should i try using that from now on... i just dont seem to get it. I guess i will get more mileage out of the game if i go to manual

 

[proxi]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

that's why I don't play any kind of ranked matches. I don't have any problem losing an exciting match.

unfortunately I've got owned by exploits too often, even in friendlies....
...as Lami said: total waste of time

Yep, it's the old Online Gaming Chestnut ™

First 1-3 months a game with online competition in it is released, it's still fine to play whoever, with maybe the odd exception every so often, bumming you balls deep. I laugh at these now.

Following that honeymoon period, it'll be friends-only or the odd drunken fumble with an few unknown opponents because you're wasted and "can beat anyone", and / or you won't have the reflexes to see they're exploiting / cheating

It's been like that with every single competitive online game so far for me, and it will be the same no doubt with FIFA 09. FIFA 08 & GTA4 have lasted the longest in honeymoon periods though, probably the full 3 months. COD4 lasted around two, as did Everybody's Golf PS3. However, Postal 2 & Mario Strikers Charged Wii lasted less than a month, fucking elitist swines.

 

[YoungGun_UK]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Manual passing is EXTREMELY hard from when i've tried it, pass's going behind players etc or to powerfull etc, i find Semi fine for me.

 

[Placebo]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

Everything's hard until you've learned to do it........

 

[Trance_Allstar]

Re: FIFA 09 Discussion Thread

"slight sacrifice in realism"

Balls do not curl out of themselves. You have to do it. That is for me the main point. So every way in which the user gets control over the ball means it is more realistic then the other way around. Even if you have to jump up three times and do a headstand to make it curl to the left, it would still be more realistic then no curl at all, or having no control over it. In a way, despite the fact that the curl can still be added the second the ball is released, the passing game of Sensible Soccer 'feels' more realistic at a gut level then the much more sophisticated plug and pass of many other games. The bounds of realism are within the domain of this 'feeling', what meets the eye is important but secondary.

For me it is always a matter of translating the initial idea that pops into your brain as precisely into the game as possible. The translating means, may it be your own leg or a controller, is irrelevant. As long as this mediator is potentially as intuitive to become nearly invisible. In many cases a controller might be better suited for this then your own legs .

So I totally agree that they should add curling to the passing system. In the end it is your idea that is most important. Not the programmers idea. But it would be good if the flexibility depends on the type of player. With Ronaldhino for example you just need to tap the stick, with a lower league player you need to hold the stick firmly to the side for a second. Cause I am totally fine with that kind of friction. I want to get mad at my player for being such a ass that he cant cross it like I wanted it. I do not want to be pissed at the game itself that it will not allow me to perform a certain action.

The way I see this working would be that better players have higher curl stats, and thus can get more curl on the ball (when talking about the maximum amount of curl possible).


This system coupled with analog stick tilt control for height of longballs gives many possiblities. You could lean the stick 50% in the direction of a teammate that is very far away from you, and strike a low-ish hard longpass (PES2008 longpass if you will... . But at the same time, as soon as the ball leaves your boot, you pull the stick from pointing 50% in the direction of the teammate to pointing full away from him, and holf LT. This puts backspin on the ball, so that it gets a long majestic soaring trajectory.

Also this would be applicable to longshots, so it would be possible, not having to rely on the shooting dynamics being programmed just right, to pull off a low longshot (tilting 50-60% forward on the stick and giving lots of power) that also has lots of backspin and stays up longer.

Perfect example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5fP2z7lZcw

1:08 in, Chevanton. In FIFA08, that shot would have put the ball several meters above the bar in a much higher arch. Notice on the reverse angle that the ball has a backspin that you would be able to induce yourself, just like in reallife by how you strike the ball.




And I dream of the day this would be possible: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTdO4CdSors&feature=related