VAR is destroying my soul

Isslander

Isslander

Gordon's alive!
3 August 2003
Iceland
Liverpool
OK not really but man, I hate that damn thing. Never mind the call last night for a handball penalty when the ball was heading over the goal, that might not matter, I don't know the rules for handling the ball that well, that may have been the right call. Also, screw PSG.

A much better example was the Tuesday night incident between RM and Ajax where a goal was almost called off because of the ball possibly going out of play on the other side of the pitch, way before the goal was even scored. Here is the problem, every bloody thing that happens in a football match can lead to a goal. In the last World Cup, France had a free kick early in the final because of Griezmans dramatic prowess. The 'foul' was shown back countless times, every angle confirming that Griezman had taken flight on his own. Because of the VAR rules, the decision could not be reversed. France got a goal from the free kick.
Now, what exactly is the difference between these two separate instances? Both led to goals, but only one could be reviewed.

To maybe take a more obvious, fictional scenario, a Neymar dive (hardly fictional, I know) inside the box can be reviewed. The very same dive outside the box, can not be reviewed. Both can very easily lead to goals.

The ball going off an attacker behind the goal and is wrongly called as a corner that ends with a goal - can't be reviewed.

This picking and choosing certain elements of the game for reviewing is absurd.

Another thing is that celebrating a goal has been completely destroyed both for players and fans. It used to be enough to see the ref pointing towards the center ring and the linesman holding his flag down but not anymore. What if a player from the scoring team squeezed an opponents balls a minute earlier? Time to review that for two minutes I guess. Oh no, it was merely a harmless caress of the bollocks, the goal stands. And also, the ref will now add 4 minutes extra to the playing time for no reason (see PSG - United).

I am not done with this but will have to do something else for a bit, please tell me what you think of this system and why it's bad or good.
 
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For me, it's essential. If you give footballers the opportunity to cheat, they will cheat - and for how many years has the response to this cheating been "meh, what can we do" or "it's part of the game now"?

Horseshit. If football is so expensive now - in every respect, not just in ticket prices but in wages - then a game shouldn't be allowed (or accepted) to devolve into "who can roll around the most convincingly". They're paid for skill - we pay to watch skill - and this attitude enables a culture of 90 minutes of foppery. You don't have to have any skill to pretend your leg is broken because someone's shirt brushed your arm.

Some of the dives (from both sides) in that PSG v United game last night were fucking pathetic, people rolling around, flailing limbs, SCREAMING. How the bollocks can a referee know what's real and what isn't?

Aside from the diving and the cheating, you have the prospect of (for example) a club being relegated because of a penalty being given against them that clearly wasn't a penalty. Say, for example, when Stirling LITERALLY KICKED THE FLOOR and fell over, and was given a penalty. Very, very few will refuse it.

That can't be allowed to happen in this day and age. You could argue "well they should have accrued enough points by that point to stay up, it's their own fault" - but that's the worst, most bullshit argument in the world. What, in a world without VAR, if they lost to an offside goal the week before, and went down to ten men because someone dived the week before that, etc. etc. etc...

For me, VAR absolutely categorically has to happen and has to exist.

However - in its current format, where handball is being given for A) the ball hitting someone's ARM and B) something where watching the replay in real-time (NOT SLOW-MO) clearly shows how there's no intention whatsoever... Then it's shit, I agree with that much.

I would say "it's making things worse" because of this, but I would say 8/10 decisions are correct using VAR. It's just the other 2/10 - and what's most galling is when they sit and watch something in slow-motion for five minutes and STILL get it wrong.

But a lot of this comes down to how open to interpretation the rules are. Lars Sivertsen makes the point in the most recent Guardian football podcast that, in a recent match, the referee made a decision that a professional referee (employed as a pundit by the broadcaster) disagreed with, while a different referee said it was the right decision.

If the rules are so broad that two professional referees can watch the same replays, see the same things and come to two entirely different conclusions, how is the ACTUAL REFEREE supposed to make a decision.

I think the next step for officiating should be streamlining the rules and making them much more black-and-white. Starting off by punishing things that you want to eradicate much more harshly one-by-one.

It is a fucking joke how we start every season with a new "clampdown" - like this season, it was supposed to be the season of "if you surround the referee, you get a card" - and after one week, it's back to normal. WHY?
 
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Isslander said:
OK not really but man, I hate that damn thing. Never mind the call last night for a handball penalty when the ball was heading over the goal, that might not matter, I don't know the rules for handling the ball that well, that may have been the right call. Also, screw PSG.

A much better example was the Tuesday night incident between RM and Ajax where a goal was almost called off because of the ball possibly going out of play on the other side of the pitch, way before the goal was even scored. Here is the problem, every bloody thing that happens in a football match can lead to a goal. In the last World Cup, France had a free kick early in the final because of Griezmans dramatic prowess. The 'foul' was shown back countless times, every angle confirming that Griezman had taken flight on his own. Because of the VAR rules, the decision could not be reversed. France got a goal from the free kick.
Now, what exactly is the difference between these two separate instances? Both led to goals, but only one could be reviewed.

To maybe take a more obvious, fictional scenario, a Neymar dive (hardly fictional, I know) inside the box can be reviewed. The very same dive outside the box, can not be reviewed. Both can very easily lead to goals.

The ball going off an attacker behind the goal and is wrongly called as a corner that ends with a goal - can't be reviewed.

This picking and choosing certain elements of the game for reviewing is absurd.

Another thing is that celebrating a goal has been completely destroyed both for players and fans. It used to be enough to see the ref pointing towards the center ring and the linesman holding his flag down but not anymore. What if a player from the scoring team squeezed an opponents balls a minute earlier? Time to review that for two minutes I guess. Oh no, it was merely a harmless caress of the bollocks, the goal stands. And also, the ref will now add 4 minutes extra to the playing time for no reason (see PSG - United).

I am not done with this but will have to do something else for a bit, please tell me what you think of this system and why it's bad or good.
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VAR is a phenomenal thing mate. Don't just post a thread to rant about a few bad decisions. This is the tech evolution of soccer
 
Chris Davies said:
Aside from the diving and the cheating, you have the prospect of (for example) a club being relegated because of a penalty being given against them that clearly wasn't a penalty. Say, for example, when Stirling LITERALLY KICKED THE FLOOR and fell over, and was given a penalty. Very, very few will refuse it.
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My problem with that is that I don't see a difference between a wrong decision on a penalty on one hand, or a wrong decision on a free-kick. Both can end with the same result. Both can unfairly relegate a team, as per your example. Yet only one can be reviewed, under the current rules.
 
Loopy said:
Hilarious. Too bad your favorite clubs got knocked out of Champions League.:LMAO:
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Don't know what you mean mate, unless Liverpool played their second match without telling anyone, I'm pretty sure they are still in there.
No doubt waiting to be sent home by some VAR bullocks, to be fair, so you might be right anyway
 
Isslander said:
Don't know what you mean mate, unless Liverpool played their second match without telling anyone, I'm pretty sure they are still in there.
No doubt waiting to be sent home by some VAR bullocks, to be fair, so you might be right anyway
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You know what mate this is getting out of hand. I definitely believe that Liverpool won't win any silver ware this year, but I'm certainly not here to attack your beliefs or your club. Liverpool are a really great team mate, and have one of the best attacks in the world. In fact they are one of my two favorite EPL teams. Let's just call it all good and forget about all this. What do you say mate?
 
VAR is completelly necessary for the game and should have been introduced since many years now.
You simply can't expect from a single referee to be able to see every little thing in a 120 meter field and whistle correctly,no matter how good positioning he may have.
Especially when there are plays that you can watch 5 times in replay and still have different people have different opinions about it.And we expect from a referee to have it correct in a matter of seconds in real speed and without any replay??That's just impossible.
Yes it needs to have some improvements but it's just begun and is in an early phase still.I'm sure that as time passes they'll find ways to make it better and more practical,less time consuming etc.But even now it has a near 100% correct decision making when it's been used.
I don't give a f if it can ruin players' or crowd's celebrations..it's even funnier when it does lol.
I care so that we have as less wrong calls as possible in a game.We should reach a point where every match will have not less that 99-100% correct decisions.It should be almost robotic and artificial.Only then we'll have real justice.
Just think about how many results have been altered in the past by wrong decisions.Wrong offsides,penalties,handballs etc.If all these things could be reviewed then we would literally have different teams winning trophies from the ones that did win them.
Not the best example because it's very old,but just think of Maradona's ''hand of god'' bullshit..the fuckin cheater..lol
 
Chris Davies said:
It is a fucking joke how we start every season with a new "clampdown" - like this season, it was supposed to be the season of "if you surround the referee, you get a card" - and after one week, it's back to normal. WHY?
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This infuriates me. The ref's get no back up from the governing organisations. They could stop the surrounding of the ref and pressuring him in no time at all. Anyone surrounding him or pleading for a decion etc, is an automatic yellow card, continue and it's another one. One weekend of that being applied and it would stop. Just like the VAR penalties given from corners in the group stages of the world cup, by the knockout stages it barely happened because players knew they could no longer get away with it.

The other thing that needs to be addressed is the cynical deliberate foul to stop a break away. Taking one for the team as they call it. Or cheating if you want to be correct. The counter attack is stopped, absolutely no advantage is had by the team who were on the attack as now all the other teams players are back behind the ball. I think they should award a free kick outside the other team's box, anywhere they want it, that would soon stop it.

It seems rules like the clampdown you mention seem to come in then get ignored, like every single goalkeeper rule does (does the 7 second rule even still exist?)

They brought that one in a few years back about stopping a free kick being taken (or was it arguing about it? can't remember now) meant the ball was moved forward 10 yards. What happened to that?

No what we'll do is change the kick off rule so you can kick off backwards. Well that's f*cking great, well done, that really helped.

Anyway back to VAR I see the benefits of it but it needs a lot of work to improve it. It's taking way too long, if it takes a long time then it's not clear and obvious is it? It's a very difficult sport with a continuous flow (apart from the time wasting but don't get me started on that) with many grey areas in terms of what is a clear foul and what isn't. I agree it's needed but let's face it if players weren't cheats then it would only need to be offsides and the goal line technology. So do something about the cheating and there won't be many contentious VAR decisions. Why not have a 3 game ban for diving no matter where on the pitch? If they want to eradicate it do something drastic to make it not worth the risk. Also do it like rugby and let the physios on while the game continues unless it's a head injury, they'll soon get up then.

I suppose the answer would be to do away with penalties and have indirect free kicks, then refs would give all those fouls that are given outside the box.
 
Isslander said:
My problem with that is that I don't see a difference between a wrong decision on a penalty on one hand, or a wrong decision on a free-kick. Both can end with the same result. Both can unfairly relegate a team, as per your example. Yet only one can be reviewed, under the current rules.
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It's the rules that are the problem, not the technology. You're absolutely right in this - the way it's currently implemented means certain "types" of foul are ignored or even (as I said about the United penalty) made worse by the ridiculous slow-mo analysis that makes an easy decision into a "should I or shouldn't I" for referees - but that's the rules, not the tech.

I've read that VAR comes to the Premier League next season and that they've spent the last year or so trying to come up with a ruleset for it that makes games flow and makes it so that VAR is only consulted when there is a "clear and obvious error". IF THEY ACTUALLY STICK TO THAT (which they may not, as with all other early refereeing initiatives) it should be a good thing.

But there's nothing stopping VAR from being hugely beneficial to football - you just need (as @mattmid alluded to earlier) some STRICT refereeing, and some common sense in the operation of it.

Sadly, common sense doesn't seem to exist at FIFA.
 
Dennis_87 said:
You simply can't expect from a single referee to be able to see every little thing in a 120 meter field and whistle correctly,no matter how good positioning he may have.
Especially when there are plays that you can watch 5 times in replay and still have different people have different opinions about it.And we expect from a referee to have it correct in a matter of seconds in real speed and without any replay??That's just impossible.
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I don't remember asking for that.

I don't give a f if it can ruin players' or crowd's celebrations..it's even funnier when it does lol.
I care so that we have as less wrong calls as possible in a game.We should reach a point where every match will have not less that 99-100% correct decisions.It should be almost robotic and artificial.Only then we'll have real justice.
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So a fundamental part of the game (celebrations) can be thrown out the window for a laugh. Also, refereeing should be robotic and artificial. Not really selling me on this, sorry.

Just think about how many results have been altered in the past by wrong decisions.Wrong offsides,penalties,handballs etc.If all these things could be reviewed then we would literally have different teams winning trophies from the ones that did win them.
Not the best example because it's very old,but just think of Maradona's ''hand of god'' bullshit..the fuckin cheater..lol
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In life, not everything is fair and not everything is 100% accurate. People still have to deal with it.
Refs get things wrong, they still get them wrong after watching a screen for 2-3 minutes, I'm pretty sure this VAR thing is stressing them out more than it helps them. Hard enough to make a mistake in a match, but making a mistake after watching it for minutes, that's rough. Going back to my first point, I have not asked for every call in every game to be perfect, as long as the ref is unbiased, I could live with stuff going wrong, it was (and amazingly, still is) a part of the game. Just with added layers of technology.

NBA and NFL have constant stops in play anyway, so video assistance makes a bit of sense there, dumb AF as it can still be (see the Saints exit in the last NFL semi finals) but football is a free flowing sport that only gets slowed down with added technology (nothing against goal line tech, btw, as it seems to be infallible)

Before continuing, I would like someone to answer me this:

Why can't a video ref tell a ref to reverse an obviously wrong call, like the ball going off the wrong player, say for a corner instead of a goal kick, or vice versa?
 
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Isslander said:
Why can't a video ref tell a ref to reverse an obviously wrong call, like the ball going off the wrong player, say for a corner instead of a goal kick, or vice versa?
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Exactly, how many times have we watched football and seen a replay before a corner or goal kick has been taken and seen it was the wrong decision.

Isslander said:
So a fundamental part of the game (celebrations) can be thrown out the window for a laugh. Also, refereeing should be robotic and artificial. Not really selling me on this, sorry.
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Totally agree with this one. It is a big part of going to football, celebrating the goal, that spontaneous moment of elation, what do you now, wait?
 
Isslander said:
Why can't a video ref tell a ref to reverse an obviously wrong call, like the ball going off the wrong player, say for a corner instead of a goal kick, or vice versa?
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That's what VAR should be, in my opinion.

But I think it's getting overcomplicated because FIFA are trying to protect referees (and themselves), and instead of being able to overrule basic decisions, VAR is only currently allowed to overrule the big ones - but it still has to be the referee's decision.

Which puts him or her under a lot of pressure - if the game is stopped by VAR to show you something, the pressure is 100% on you to "agree" with the VAR stoppage, otherwise as a referee you're saying "VAR might as well not be there".
 
Isslander said:
I don't remember asking for that.


So a fundamental part of the game (celebrations) can be thrown out the window for a laugh. Also, refereeing should be robotic and artificial. Not really selling me on this, sorry.


In life, not everything is fair and not everything is 100% accurate. People still have to deal with it.
Refs get things wrong, they still get them wrong after watching a screen for 2-3 minutes, I'm pretty sure this VAR thing is stressing them out more than it helps them. Hard enough to make a mistake in a match, but making a mistake after watching it for minutes, that's rough. Going back to my first point, I have not asked for every call in every game to be perfect, as long as the ref is unbiased, I could live with stuff going wrong, it was (and amazingly, still is) a part of the game. Just with added layers of technology.

NBA and NFL have constant stops in play anyway, so video assistance makes a bit of sense there, dumb AF as it can still be (see the Saints exit in the last NFL semi finals) but football is a free flowing sport that only gets slowed down with added technology (nothing against goal line tech, btw, as it seems to be infallible)

Before continuing, I would like someone to answer me this:

Why can't a video ref tell a ref to reverse an obviously wrong call, like the ball going off the wrong player, say for a corner instead of a goal kick, or vice versa?
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When i'm saying ''you simply can't expect...'' i don't mean you personally.I mean ''you'' in general like ''us''.
So your answer seems a bit off.


So you're telling me we should be worry not to break some celebrations more than allowing a wrong decision which can totally and unfairly change a match result?Seriously?
Nobody is forbiding anyone to cheer and dance and sing and celebrate through the whole match if they want.
But we must have justice in a match.Otherwise what's the point?
It's not being used just to fuck with some people's feelings,but to bring justice and fair play.
If people can understand this simple thing,then they'll just accept it because it's the right thing to do.
If they undestand it but they still being butthurt just because it broke their precious little celebrations,then yeah i'm just gonna laugh to it because it's ridiculous.That's my view to it.
And it's not that it will happen every other Sunday..It may happen once in 10 or 20 matches or even more..So i don't see where's the big deal with it..
Also when i'm saying that it should be almost robotic,i don't mean that we should literally throw a damn robot in there.
But to take advantage of every weapon that technology gives us to make sure that we'll have as much justice as possible.
I don't see why would anyone disagree with having as much correct decisions as possible in a match so the result can be decided only by skills and luck as it should,and not by some wrong referee decision which is totally unfair.


''In life not everything is fair''...so what?We should just accept this and not try and take advantage of what technology offers us to correct wrong decisions and bring justice to a football match?Why?It's not important enough?
Then why bothering with trying to fight poverty and world hunger and scientists discovering new drugs for cancer etc..
We could just say ''oh well...shit happens...life's unfair...what's you gonna do...''
We should always try and improve in everything that can be done and in this case with VAR it can be done.
''They get things wrong even after watching the screen for 2 minutes'' I don't know if this has happened but from the matches i have seen until now and VAR was used,i haven't seen a wrong decision.
And i think that these 2-3 even 5 extra minutes is a very small price to pay in order to have correct decisions in a match.Like..are these 5 extra minutes really so important for someone?Why?


About your last question,i think that video ref should be able to correct a wrong corner call because it could lead to a goal.I think they're not using this still for time convenience and because the pitch ref is still considered the ''boss''.
I think it should be a 51%-49% authority relationship with the pitch ref having the 51% but the video ref also having enough authority to inform him for the wrong corner or goal kick.He wouldn't even have to go and check the screen but just take the word of the video ref as he can see it more clearly.There wouldn't been any time wasting except for a couple of seconds which is nothing.I think they'll consider this in the near future.Now it's all still in an early experimental phase and some small loop holes are natural and expected.
 
Isslander said:
Here is a an idea, take the money that is being wasted on VAR and funnel it towards these issues.
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The money is not being wasted on VAR,because it actually brings the results that it's supposed to bring.The money is being spended for a reason.It would have been wasted if it didn't have any results.
Also you could say that for literally everything.Take a team's half budget and donate it to science,stop eating junk food 5 times a week and donate it to a children's hospital,stop using your car everyday to help the enviroment etc etc..
This is a totally different subject and has nothing to do exclusively with VAR.
 
One problem with VAR is that assistant referees are going to become almost pointless in regards to offsides, because anything close they will HAVE to let go in case they get it wrong and stop a potential scoring chance.

Also if you bring in VAR to make matches have near perfect decisions is this only of importance in the top leagues then because it's not going to happen in the Division's below (2nd Division it may at a push perhaps in some countries).

Offsides and the goal line technology are fine, they are black and white decisions.

The bottom line is if players were not cheats then you wouldn't even need VAR for anything else. So maybe that's what they ought to be sorting out. Use video retrospectively and give bans... Dive - 3 game ban, that'll soon stop it. Put your leg into the opponent to 'get brought down' 3 game ban and so on. And do away with the absolutely nonsensical rule that you can't retrospectively punish a player if the ref saw the incident and acted on it, such as giving a yellow when in replay it was clearly a red and a dangerous tackle for example. (don't know if that's elsewhere but it's in England)


A perfect example at the weekend was Mane. He knocked the ball past the keeper and Heaton brushed his legs, but as the ball was reachable and the goal empty, Mane stayed on his feet and scored. Had he over hit the ball or there were covering defenders he'd have gone down.

Cut the cheating out and penalties become an easier decision.
 
VAR doesn't make a decision, the referee does. Although doesn't seem that anyone can agree what handball is, have to say I've given up trying to guess!

The pretty abysmal level of refereeing in England anyway is more of an issue.
 
I think technology is not only downgrading (ironic, isn't it?) football but it's specifically making Refs look worse and worse.
I don't think I can remember a worse time for referees in the history of this sports for as long as I lived. This is their worst time. Globally.

All this super-mega-slow cameras, 360° cameras, drones, VAR, etc... all they do is second-guess ANY decision made by the Ref.

I actually was OK with VAR being implemented. But not like this. I don't think this is the way to do it.
 
Feel like both Tottenham and Man City were robbed of penalties today. While the Women's WC deffo took VAR too far, with the slightest touch in the box often becoming a penalty, the Prem takes an entirely different approach, where the calls actually have to be blatantly wrong to be overturned.
VAR has changed the game, but it sure as shit hasn't fixed it.
 
If you are complaining about VAR in europe, imagine here in Brasil where a decision from the VAR takes like 3-6 minutes everytime its used. Then in the end of the match the referee gives at most 4 or 5 minutes of extra time haha

But aside of that i also think it's essential. The problem keeps beeing the "humans" not the thecnology.
 
Isslander said:
Feel like both Tottenham and Man City were robbed of penalties today. While the Women's WC deffo took VAR too far, with the slightest touch in the box often becoming a penalty, the Prem takes an entirely different approach, where the calls actually have to be blatantly wrong to be overturned.
VAR has changed the game, but it sure as shit hasn't fixed it.
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Man City yes, Chelsea too actually. But Spurs one not a penalty for me, and opinion seems pretty divided on it.

I like the way the Premier League is using VAR so far to be honest. Obviously checks goals and penalties but doesn't interfere too much after that. One thing I hate about VAR is the ref going over to the screen to see a replay a million times that the VAR guys have already seen. Improvement needed for sure but if this format of VAR is used going forward it is not going to get in the way too much.

Does seem like the offside rule should be changed slightly, considering we now have absolute precision. But someone smarter than me will need to come up with a solution to that. :D
 
What I didn't get was the penalty given to Napoli against Fiorentina, a clear dive by Mertens with no contact by the defenders, yet, VAR confirmed it.
 
Biggest problem with anything introduced in football in England, is that half the officials aren't bright enough to run a bath. As ever it's not being applied consistently. United had two penalties denied (although to be fair the Martial one was more of a free-kick as the contact began outside the area) There are handballs by defenders that aren't punished in the same way as attackers, offside seems to dance from "you're off, you're off" to "there has to be daylight" from one game to the next, it's a total screw up.

Plus with some of the walking egos that referee our games, I can't see them often reconsidering if VAR advises them.
 
Spurs was a penalty for me, non intentional, but it hampered Kane.
That said Spurs didn't deserve a point from this game (i'm a Spurs fan and very worried, something is rotten in the state of Spursmark, don't like the Vertonghen situation at all).

Don't understand why lots of English pundits are anti VAR. It will make football more fair. And on top of that, it should benefit the litle teams (without VAR no Spurs or Ajax in semi's CL last year, for example).

And yes there will still be mistakes (the Mertens dive for instance), but if yo uare playing as bad as Spurs did aganisnt Newcastle, you shouldn't complain about the ref or VAR.
 
I don't mind City or Spurs spilling points, all for it actually, but I know this VAR stuff will have its day with Liverpool as well, eventually. If the video rules are going to be fuzzy like that, only turning blatantly wrong calls, you have managed to change out a flawed system, for a differently flawed system with extra steps. And what exactly is the point of that?
 
Isslander said:
I don't mind City or Spurs spilling points, all for it actually, but I know this VAR stuff will have its day with Liverpool as well, eventually. If the video rules are going to be fuzzy like that, only turning blatantly wrong calls, you have managed to change out a flawed system, for a differently flawed system with extra steps. And what exactly is the point of that?
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Completely disagree.

A game before...

A) No blatantly wrong decisions = normal game, potentially contentious calls but down to the referee's discretion considering he has no help.

B) Blatantly wrong decisions = game ruined/decided by wrong call(s).

A game now...

A) No blatantly wrong decisions = normal game with a few pauses, and a few potentially contentious calls that would have been made anyway.

B) Blatantly wrong decisions = normal game, prevented from being decided by wrong call(s).

It's better. What's happening is that people are moaning about "why wasn't that overturned" instead of "why wasn't that a foul". The same fucking argument, but blaming someone else. Which is completely hypocritical, because these people go from "there shouldn't be technology" to "why didn't technology change that decision".

You can say this or that should have been a penalty under VAR, but for as long as anybody can make a point and say "well actually", then the referee is king and yet clear and obvious errors are pointed out.

It's like the Kane non-penalty where the defender falls across him, for as long as you can even make a case for the defender not committing a foul then it is not a clear and obvious penalty, that is the point. Therefore your problem is with the ref, not VAR. The good old fashioned way (which seems to be people's biggest issue).

The reality is (and I'm not accusing you of this, more the fans who chant "fuck VAR")... People don't like change, people are scared of technology, people are losing excuses (where, without VAR, it would be the other set of fans needing them) and in time, everybody will be fine with it, I'm sure. Also, British football fans love an excuse to say "fuck you".

Do you think Man City fans would be chanting "fuck VAR" if the handball rule had cost Tottenham a goal? They'd be chanting "love VAR". Football fans are fickle fuckers.
 
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VAR is an absolute farce. Hope us jocks see the mess you guys in England are having to deal with and stay well clear.

https://streamja.com/6pQA

What a shambles! Yet another farce for var. No wonder fans want rid of it and are chanting against it. Ruining the sport.
 
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