PES2016 - PC Version Discussion Thread

Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Did I notice in that video at team selection the players aren't animated any-more and back to fixed like 2014? Or is that only in kit selection ... hmmmm.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Since you signed up to this forum three weeks ago all you've done is complain about PES, and make claims about Konami not caring and intentionally deceiving gamers. Oh, and when someone was relating something positive about PES 2015, you replied that he was talking out his ass. So what was that about condescending? You post screens to complain about the game; I post screens helping to show people how to improve the game and to get the most out of it. pesmonkey posts mods, klash posts tactics improvements. What are you contributing around here? And why are you even here, you already stated this year will be the first year you won't be buying the game. You won't be buying it but still you'll stick around the PES forum and talk crap about it for months, that's called trolling.

You've jumped on every comment I've made, insinuating that i'm a "troll" and a "PES hater". I'm not, I own PES 2015 on PC,XB1 and PS4, in that order. The reason being is I was unhappy with it visually on PC, so turned to the console version.
I'm a PC gamer first and foremost and I don't believe it's asking too much to want Konami to make PES 2016 on the PC as high standard as the console version.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Pc games are not tested?
Ok...
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

You've jumped on every comment I've made, insinuating that i'm a "troll" and a "PES hater". I'm not, I own PES 2015 on PC,XB1 and PS4, in that order. The reason being is I was unhappy with it visually on PC, so turned to the console version.
I'm a PC gamer first and foremost and I don't believe it's asking too much to want Konami to make PES 2016 on the PC as high standard as the console version.

Ignore him and just move on. :)
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

The majority of them for sure are not tested as much as they should be. That's a fact.
PES obviously not.
Of course PES is tested. Think about it: Do you think the Konami devs could/would release PES year after year without, for example, not having tested the GK AI to see how HORRIBLE it is? Of course they test the GK AI every year, they just never bloody fix it.

I played a game last night in FIFA 15 where Joe Hart single-handedly kept my team in the game, making six world class stops in the first half alone. 0-0 at halftime. In PES 2015, the halftime score would have been 5-0 or 6-0, no question. (And with all goals dribbling in the lower far corner...)
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

The majority of them for sure are not tested as much as they should be. That's a fact.

Of course PES is tested. Think about it: Do you think the Konami devs could/would release PES year after year without, for example, not having tested the GK AI to see how HORRIBLE it is? Of course they test the GK AI every year, they just never bloody fix it.

Tested yes.

But not as much as they should be.

Please read properly :)
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Tested yes.

But not as much as they should be.

Please read properly :)
Language mixup bro, I was agreeing with you. Well, I suppose I was arguing that Konami does in fact test, yes, they just don't fix as much as they should. The GK AI has been broken for years, for example.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Console games ship with plenty of bugs. They are no better than PC games in this regard.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

I played a game last night in FIFA 15 where Joe Hart single-handedly kept my team in the game, making six world class stops in the first half alone. 0-0 at halftime. In PES 2015, the halftime score would have been 5-0 or 6-0, no question. (And with all goals dribbling in the lower far corner...)

Please balance that with what you have done with AI level and stats DB lowing and sliders in Fifa you mentioned in the Fifa thread, I say balance as in, not simply like for like vanilla comparison.

I don't think personally keepers are as bad as I have seen posted, but I can agree the curl shot is overpowered to get around most keepers, that needs to be tweaked.

I also feel in 2016 they really need to do something about the formation "down the middle" or "wing" play in terms of AI taking things literally and always dribbling only into the box and not crossing at all unless you set for wings & wide play.
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

I don't think personally keepers are as bad as I have seen posted, but I can agree the curl shot is overpowered to get around most keepers, that needs to be tweaked.
Overpowered is only half the issue. That shot is pretty much the only shot the CPU ever tries. The CPU never shoots high, never aims for the upper corners of the goal. CPU shots rarely travel more than a foot or two off the ground. It is not an exaggeration to say 90% of the goals the CPU has scored in all my games is from that curl shot along the ground into the far corner.

As for GK edits: I have not edited GKs in FIFA. I have though increased GK ratings in PES to 99 across the board. Overall and from my experience testing both games, I would say a GK in PES with all his ratings maxed out to 99, plays about as well as the worst-rated GKs in FIFA. And that's with the FIFA GK ability slider at default 50. I could if I wanted make FIFA GKs play much better by simply raising that slider, something that can't be done in PES obviously.

PES 2015 GK play isn't horrible relative to how bad PES GKs have been the past several years, that much I can agree with. PES is a better game than FIFA in some areas, but FIFA's GK coding is and always has been far, far superior. Compared to FIFA, PES GK coding is extremely poor and even borderline broken, that's how I would honestly describe it.

To hear one of those preview videos state that GK play in PES 2016 still isn't great, is disconcerting and maddening. If true, there is simply no excuse for that after all these years; fixing the GK AI should have been a top priority. With each year that goes by, it's looking more and more like the Konami devs simply don't know how to fix/integrate certain aspects of the old game coding PES still uses, this is the obvious conclusion.
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Overpowered is only half the issue. That shot is pretty much the only shot the CPU ever tries. The CPU never shoots high, never aims for the upper corners of the goal. CPU shots rarely travel more than a foot or two off the ground. It is not an exaggeration to say 90% of the goals the CPU has scored in all my games is from that curl shot along the ground into the far corner.

As for GK edits: I have not edited GKs in FIFA. I have though increased GK ratings in PES to 99 across the board. Overall and from my experience testing both games, I would say a GK in PES with all his ratings maxed out to 99, plays about as well as the worst-rated GKs in FIFA. And that's with the FIFA GK ability slider at default 50. I could if I wanted make FIFA GKs play much better by simply raising that slider, something that can't be done in PES obviously.

PES 2015 GK play isn't horrible relative to how bad PES GKs have been the past several years, that much I can agree with. PES is a better game than FIFA in some areas, but FIFA's GK coding is and always has been far, far superior. Compared to FIFA, PES GK coding is extremely poor and even borderline broken, that's how I would honestly describe it.

To hear one of those preview videos state that GK play in PES 2016 still isn't great, is disconcerting and maddening. If true, there is simply no excuse for that after all these years; fixing the GK AI should have been a top priority. With each year that goes by, it's looking more and more like the Konami devs simply don't know how to fix/integrate certain aspects of the old game coding PES still uses, this is the obvious conclusion.

I agree. The whole PES 2015 A.I is just plain simple and basic A.I. They need better A.I programmers to change it. Bring back the programmers from PES 5 and PES 6 days.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

I agree. The whole PES 2015 A.I is just plain simple and basic A.I. They need better A.I programmers to change it. Bring back the programmers from PES 5 and PES 6 days.
I would say there are two distinctly separate AI issues with PES 2015. The attacking/defending AI has been decent enough the past few years. But it seems the Konami devs broke it this year during the process of adding the new CPU simulation pass coding. There's no longer any variety to the attack AI or to goals; in-game defensive settings that worked well in other versions are now broken and don't work; etc. But those are brand new issues this year, so I have faith the devs can maybe fix and repair this for 2016. Whereas the GK AI has been an issue with PES since forever. That suggests the devs are simply unable to do any better.

EDIT: There's no longer any variety to the attack AI or to goals.
Decided to try an experiment and keep a running commentary listing CPU shots and goals, as I play a game:

1. shot on goal, near corner, shot height = 2 feet off the ground
2. shot wide, near corner, shot height = 1 foot off ground
3. shot hit post, far corner, 3 feet off ground
4. goal, far corner, ball kicked along ground
5. shot on goal, middle of net, 2 feet off ground
6. goal, far corner, 1 foot off ground
7. shot on goal, far corner, 3 feet off ground
8. shot on goal, right third of net, 2 feet off ground
9. goal, far corner, ball kicked along ground
10. shot on goal, far corner, 2 feet off ground
11. shot wide off header, far corner, 1 foot off ground
12. shot on goal, middle of net, 1 foot off ground

CPU totals after 12 shots:

9 shots to corners, 2 shots to middle of net, 1 shot to r/l third of net.
12 shots 3 feet high or less
0 shots higher than 3 feet
Average shot height = 1.5 feet off ground

3 CPU goals scored
All goals shot into far corner
All 3 shots 1 foot high or less
Average shot height of 3 goals = 0.33 feet off ground

This is broken game coding.
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Not broken angus, its basic. Its intentionally simplified football, and you know what i like it, i think for how basic the game is, thats why its been very good this year and many people have enjoyed the game.

PES 2014 for example failed because konami tried to do too much and didn't finish it properly and didn't even know how long all the elements would take to fix.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Not broken angus, its basic. Its intentionally simplified football
I didn't post that to argue good or bad, just to prove what I was saying earlier. But yes actually, elements are entirely broken. The tactics sliders work perfectly last year, this year the compactness slider doesn't work at all. And I just posted an hour long test that I ran showing how the CPU shot coding is broken this year, it worked fine as well in 2014. I like PES 2015 too, but elements are definitely broken no question. Big difference between a fun simple back-to-basics game, versus gameplay elements that used to work but are now broken and need to be patched for 2016.
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

I would say there are two distinctly separate AI issues with PES 2015. The attacking/defending AI has been decent enough the past few years. But it seems the Konami devs broke it this year during the process of adding the new CPU simulation pass coding. There's no longer any variety to the attack AI or to goals; in-game defensive settings that worked well in other versions are now broken and don't work; etc. But those are brand new issues this year, so I have faith the devs can maybe fix and repair this for 2016. Whereas the GK AI has been an issue with PES since forever. That suggests the devs are simply unable to do any better.

EDIT: There's no longer any variety to the attack AI or to goals.
Decided to try an experiment and keep a running commentary listing CPU shots and goals, as I play a game:

1. shot on goal, near corner, shot height = 2 feet off the ground
2. shot wide, near corner, shot height = 1 foot off ground
3. shot hit post, far corner, 3 feet off ground
4. goal, far corner, ball kicked along ground
5. shot on goal, middle of net, 2 feet off ground
6. goal, far corner, 1 foot off ground
7. shot on goal, far corner, 3 feet off ground
8. shot on goal, right third of net, 2 feet off ground
9. goal, far corner, ball kicked along ground
10. shot on goal, far corner, 2 feet off ground
11. shot wide off header, far corner, 1 foot off ground
12. shot on goal, middle of net, 1 foot off ground

CPU totals after 12 shots:

9 shots to corners, 2 shots to middle of net, 1 shot to r/l third of net.
12 shots 3 feet high or less
0 shots higher than 3 feet
Average shot height = 1.5 feet off ground

3 CPU goals scored
All goals shot into far corner
All 3 shots 1 foot high or less
Average shot height of 3 goals = 0.33 feet off ground

This is broken game coding.

This along with scripted passing and cutback goals. Playing with A.I get's really repetitive really quickly. I think they might as well revamp the whole A.I and make sure the CPU players follow their abilities/stats and the team tactics rather than a scripted behavior. When PES 2016 comes out, we will test to see if they changed the A.I at all this year.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

This along with scripted passing... they might as well revamp the whole A.I and make sure the CPU players follow their abilities/stats and the team tactics rather than a scripted behavior.
I (mostly) have faith the devs will improve this aspect for 2016. I was really excited when I first played 2015; the new CPU simulation pass coding was a revelation, first time ever in a football game the CPU would build up play in a slow methodical realistic manner. But you're right, after a number of games it becomes clear it's all meaningless, the scripted passing that goes on bears no relationship to team tactics or player skills. I will give the devs the benefit of the doubt here and believe this is a new gameplay feature that will only get better as they work on it.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

I didn't post that to argue good or bad, just to prove what I was saying earlier. But yes actually, elements are entirely broken. The tactics sliders work perfectly last year, this year the compactness slider doesn't work at all. And I just posted an hour long test that I ran showing how the CPU shot coding is broken this year, it worked fine as well in 2014. I like PES 2015 too, but elements are definitely broken no question. Big difference between a fun simple back-to-basics game, versus gameplay elements that used to work but are now broken and need to be patched for 2016.

Tactics are the best part of PES 2015!

You get team individuality done and consistently shown in a really enjoyable way. Its new and fresh and it works.

I wrote a guide on the sliders on my site. They wont provide the same freedom as seen in other games, again because its basic.

The whole premise of PES 2015 is for it to be holistically basic and free as if all elements of the gameplay tie together. You don't these exploits u can easily use like on the PS2 game, or broken aspects like you see in 2014 which limit the games competitiveness.

I think the next test you should look at is get rid of all the tweaks you make, a give the game a go on manual or any low pass assistance setting and just literally master it, start winning every game convincingly so you know all its shortcomings and strong points.

You will see what you cant change such as defensive compactivness which is rigid because players aren't dynamic in their movement and there is just aren't enough animations to allow it.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

You will see what you cant change such as defensive compactivness which is rigid because players aren't dynamic in their movement and there is just aren't enough animations to allow it.
Defensive compactness works perfectly in PES 2014 and works even better in FIFA. How is it that suddenly in "next-gen" PES 2015, there "aren't enough animations to allow it"? You're going to have to explain that one a bit more.

Below are 3 screens showing the 3 games' defensive compactness settings set to MAX. In only one of these 3 games, the defensive compactness settings don't work and are broken, see if you can tell which game. ;))

compactness%203%20games_zpsxeeaivok.jpg
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

In one italian preview, a guy said that while defence ws improved in the Pes 2016 build he tested (May build,before E3 build) there were too much empty spaces on the flank because LB and RB players weren't fast enough to come back to defend.

There is something wrong which we hope will be fixed at release.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

In one italian preview, a guy said that while defence ws improved in the Pes 2016 build he tested (May build,before E3 build) there were too much empty spaces on the flank because LB and RB players weren't fast enough to come back to defend.

There is something wrong which we hope will be fixed at release.
This is very bad news if true. This sounds like the same defensive positioning issue 2015 has: the RB and LB stay too far out on the flanks, a battalion of tanks could drive through the holes it creates in the backline. I fixed this issue somewhat (band-aid solution) by assigning the RB and LB to man mark the CPU FWs, this generally draws them back into the middle when the CPU is attacking.
 
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Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

In one italian preview, a guy said that while defence ws improved in the Pes 2016 build he tested (May build,before E3 build) there were too much empty spaces on the flank because LB and RB players weren't fast enough to come back to defend.

There is something wrong which we hope will be fixed at release.

Konami don´t read this fórum, we need to send this from the real devs in japan. Or will be too late to get the message. They still think we are fans of Playstation 4, and we are not.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

Konami don´t read this fórum, we need to send this from the real devs in japan. Or will be too late to get the message.
It is entirely possible this issue with the defense is not an glitch at all, but is intentionally programmed into the game in order to create a more wide open football experience. Wide open football = more goals = more excitement = more young people who will give the game a try.

Konami started down this arcade path a few years back when they began simplifying the game, the ratings system and the tactics: removing key player ratings like shot technique, along with tactic options such as the ability to assign attack/defend directional movement to players.

Bottomline, Konami is a business. They no doubt consider whatever the game requires in order to make it more appealing to a larger consumer base, i.e. young gamers who don't want complicated.
 
Re: PES2016 - Discussion Thread [ASIM/BHATTI TALK = NOT PC RELATED]

It is entirely possible this issue with the defense is not an glitch at all, but is intentionally programmed into the game in order to create a more wide open football experience. Wide open football = more goals = more excitement = more young people who will give the game a try.

Konami started down this arcade path a few years back when they began simplifying the game, the ratings system and the tactics: removing key player ratings like shot technique, along with tactic options such as the ability to assign attack/defend directional movement to players.

Bottomline, Konami is a business. They no doubt consider whatever the game requires in order to make it more appealing to a larger consumer base, i.e. young gamers who don't want complicated.

They just simply don't understand that FIFA is doing the same thing and now they are just following FIFA's path instead a path of it's own like they use to it. That's a shame.
 
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