PES 2015 Tactics Thread

klashman69 said:
Schalke vs Real Madrid
YouTube - Schalke 04 vs Real Madrid | MOTW Champions League Last 16 | PES 2015

Home team on orange, away team on green arrows
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hey, I just watched about half of that video, nice flowing game, I appreciate the effort. I don't play the game but I'm happy tactics are part of the editing scene and that's kinda your doing.


I'll just give a bit of critical tactical feedback concerning Schalke's D.

Schalke's defense was very pourous (sp?), Real got into dangerous positions (centrally, close to box) way too easily. RDM's Schalke is much more vertically compact (distance from strikers to defenders) than yours.
I think the defenders drop too deep, they should maintain a higher line, I've seen situations where Real passed by Schalke's midfield three around the halfway line and they had like 20m of empty space between them and Schalke's defensive line, that's not good.

Also the strikers didn't seem to make much of a pressing effort, so they hardly protected the midfield which got bypassed very easily.

That ties in with low pressure in general, Real got too muh time on the ball before being pressured, especially in Schalke's half. Often it was only one guy pressuring which is not optimal if the rest of his team doesn't form a compact unit (they didn't). I think cohesive pressure and players ready to cover is the thing most lacking.

Dude, I'm not saying tactics are shit. I don't know the new PES at all and I didn't see real game this was based on. I just watched a video and thought I could point out a few very obvious (to me) flaws, this being a tctics thread and all. So make of it what you want, really. Cheers.
 
Chenghis.Khan said:
hey, I just watched about half of that video, nice flowing game, I appreciate the effort. I don't play the game but I'm happy tactics are part of the editing scene and that's kinda your doing.


I'll just give a bit of critical tactical feedback concerning Schalke's D.

Schalke's defense was very pourous (sp?), Real got into dangerous positions (centrally, close to box) way too easily. RDM's Schalke is much more vertically compact (distance from strikers to defenders) than yours.
I think the defenders drop too deep, they should maintain a higher line, I've seen situations where Real passed by Schalke's midfield three around the halfway line and they had like 20m of empty space between them and Schalke's defensive line, that's not good.
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I thanks for the response:

I'm sure what your referring to can be explained here:
http://forums.evo-web.co.uk/showpost.php?p=3006936&postcount=123

The game in general has players very spaced out, the vertical compactness just doesn't happen 'period' in this game regardless of tactics, teammates play quite far away from eachover.

The difficulty i faced playing as madrid was to find good shooting opportunities just outside the box and with 5 men at the back it was difficult to find good space to make assured shots at goal, most efforts where speculative.

Also I gave my played green arrows and schalke orange so that further influenced the general responsiveness and accuracy of my players actions, it's part of the challenge i put to myself.

I think it's best to give the game a go and get to know it more so i can better understand your views for future videos. What you saying here seems to tie into my general negative points of the game in which players are too flat footed, take too many touches and lack the agility to move around the pitch like in pes 2011-2013, in those games you could get players to play in a very compact way and get them to quickly form up defensively compared to 2015.

If anything before you do try and compare schalkes defence vs wolfsburg defence in the wolfsburg bayern game on my channel.
 
First of all thanks Klashman for all your work. I have given tactics for all EPL teams and the game is much better for it. Trying to play a league with man united and getting owned on professional. I don't know if I just suck badly at this game but getting killed with long balls all the time from teams like Hull. Any way to defend these? Also do you have any formation suggestion for playing both rvp and Falcao up front? Thanks again
 
its because they have a really high line, probably best to lower it to 6 or 7

I have new updated tactics for most premier league teams to come.
 
klashman69 said:
I thanks for the response:

I'm sure what your referring to can be explained here:
http://forums.evo-web.co.uk/showpost.php?p=3006936&postcount=123

The game in general has players very spaced out, the vertical compactness just doesn't happen 'period' in this game regardless of tactics, teammates play quite far away from eachover.
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Yeah that's what I mean, this kinda kills the game's appeal for me, without the option of compact pressing, virtual games won't feel like Bundesliga games. Maybe it's different for the EPL, though but I hardly watch that league.
(I realize the example for a compact team in your link is an EPL team but Spurs are kinda known for their pressing approach, in Bundesliga this is porably the norm not the exeption)

The difficulty i faced playing as madrid was to find good shooting opportunities just outside the box and with 5 men at the back it was difficult to find good space to make assured shots at goal, most efforts where speculative.
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Afaik, those are not the kind of opportunities Schalke regularily allow. Now Real's creative midfield should likely be able to create any chance they want but usually Schalke let's you play in front of their midfield not in front of their defense but they concede lots of space in behind to be able to keep your ball circulation in our own half.

I think it's best to give the game a go and get to know it more so i can better understand your views for future videos. What you saying here seems to tie into my general negative points of the game in which players are too flat footed, take too many touches and lack the agility to move around the pitch like in pes 2011-2013, in those games you could get players to play in a very compact way and get them to quickly form up defensively compared to 2015.
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thanks but I'm not really interested in the game. I am decently happy playing WE9LE, as I like that game's attack/defense balance, especially the defense part. I am envious of 2015's attacking AI, though. But I didn't come here to endorse one game over another, I just happened to watch a video and felt like commenting as you seemed like you'd appreciated feedback (I wasn't wrong). Maybe I'll watch and comment on other videos some if I'm bored but I wouldn't bank on it.

If anything before you do try and compare schalkes defence vs wolfsburg defence in the wolfsburg bayern game on my channel.
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Only have a faint memory of your Schalke (was sooooo long ago :PP) but I'm not sure it's a good idea to compare because you played Wolfsburg and you do things a lot differently than the AI will.

I can still provide a bit of feedback on Wolfsburg, though. I'm pretty sure they usually play a 4-4-1-1 and press in a 4-4-2/4-2-4, those numbers don't always mean much but there is a noticably difference to the 4-1-4-1 you gave them for both attack and defense (I like that feature, allowing different formations for different phases, they should add a transition phase, btw. does the AI make good use of those? Didn't look out for that).
Your De Bruyne is too deep to influence attacking play like he does IRL and when defending he is just not where RL De Bruyne is, in your 4-1-4-1 he's a midfielder while he usually presses next to Dost (Olic in your Bayern game).
Defensively Wolfsburg's backline is too deep thus allowing Bayern space in midfield. I'm sure you watched the real game, Wolfsburg were extremely compact, Bayern found NO SPACE in midfield, they couldn't consistently play past the halfway line and resorted to long balls (Guardiola...long balls...what the hell!:SHOCK:..:R1). I'm not saying you should be able to create that within the game (no idea if possible). Just reporting what I see and comparing it to reality (or rather how I see reality). Hope it helps.
 
Chenghis.Khan said:
Yeah that's what I mean, this kinda kills the game's appeal for me, without the option of compact pressing, virtual games won't feel like Bundesliga games. Maybe it's different for the EPL, though but I hardly watch that league.
(I realize the example for a compact team in your link is an EPL team but Spurs are kinda known for their pressing approach, in Bundesliga this is porably the norm not the exeption)
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Tottenhams pressing only happened recently, it's Pochetiino's philosophy but he's only recent got the team pressing high using players like Kane, Mason etc.. who live and die for the shirt, he was having issues getting bastards like Adebayor and Capoue for example to press and work hard. I'll make that change in a comping update because before tottenham where very easy to play against and didn't press properly at all.


Afaik, those are not the kind of opportunities Schalke regularily allow. Now Real's creative midfield should likely be able to create any chance they want but usually Schalke let's you play in front of their midfield not in front of their defense but they concede lots of space in behind to be able to keep your ball circulation in our own half.

thanks but I'm not really interested in the game. I am decently happy playing WE9LE, as I like that game's attack/defense balance, especially the defense part. I am envious of 2015's attacking AI, though. But I didn't come here to endorse one game over another, I just happened to watch a video and felt like commenting as you seemed like you'd appreciated feedback (I wasn't wrong). Maybe I'll watch and comment on other videos some if I'm bored but I wouldn't bank on it.
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Thanks, i tried WE9LE 4 years ago in regards to implementing tactics but had very, limited and very disappointing effect. That game is still quality though and unlike 2015 it's a complete game where everything works perfectly toghether. I remember playing as Leverkusen i think, you could play 25-30 minute matches and everything was tight, took a lot creativity to work spaces and a lot of patience.

Like you said, the newer games are doing things with strategies which the older games just aren't capable of.

Only have a faint memory of your Schalke (was sooooo long ago :PP) but I'm not sure it's a good idea to compare because you played Wolfsburg and you do things a lot differently than the AI will.

I can still provide a bit of feedback on Wolfsburg, though. I'm pretty sure they usually play a 4-4-1-1 and press in a 4-4-2/4-2-4, those numbers don't always mean much but there is a noticably difference to the 4-1-4-1 you gave them for both attack and defense (I like that feature, allowing different formations for different phases, they should add a transition phase, btw. does the AI make good use of those? Didn't look out for that).
Your De Bruyne is too deep to influence attacking play like he does IRL and when defending he is just not where RL De Bruyne is, in your 4-1-4-1 he's a midfielder while he usually presses next to Dost (Olic in your Bayern game).
Defensively Wolfsburg's backline is too deep thus allowing Bayern space in midfield. I'm sure you watched the real game, Wolfsburg were extremely compact, Bayern found NO SPACE in midfield, they couldn't consistently play past the halfway line and resorted to long balls (Guardiola...long balls...what the hell!:SHOCK:..:R1). I'm not saying you should be able to create that within the game (no idea if possible). Just reporting what I see and comparing it to reality (or rather how I see reality). Hope it helps.
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Thanks,

Again it's just not possible to get that tight compact like defence like in real life, it's not a Konami flaw, it's the way the game has been made, its there to give balance, PES 2014 allowed this type of defending but has officially imbalanced! Instead you have too look at PES 2013 for this which was done fantastically,i'll try and find some screenshots of this type of compact defensive an attacking play.

To get this you need the game to have a lot of dynamic movement off the ball and on the ball, players are too flat footed and the dribbling/movement mechanic isn't good enough to allow this hence why players are so spaced out, unlike in 2013.

on Wolfsburg wasn't sure and i sometimes get a little confused with the difference between giving a

4-2-3-1, 4-4-1-1 or 4-1-4-1

They are similar formations with the difference being more personnel if anything and thats why i decided on the 4-1-4-1 because on Who scored which is ok, but very rigid and at times inaccurate it gave 4-2-3-1 so i worked from there.

It makes sense though to see De Brunye as a second striker instead of attacking midfielder. Second striker these days is really for me and ingame 'free attacking role'.

My mentality was thinking more about Veirahina, a player I've watched for a long time, a very aggressive winger and i thought surely they would attack aggressive down the wings with him, with 4 attackers it usually leaves the defence a bit open.

I setup Wolfsburg in that game to defend wide, since bayern attack on the wings.

The best example of compact defending on PES 2015 is here with Atletico:

YouTube - Midweek Matches! | Liverpool v Chelsea | Barcelona v Atletico | PES 2015
 
James Beaver said:
Thanks again. Loved that Monaco equaliser.

Would it be possible for you to remove that relatively annoying "click to SUBSCRIBE" text? Or at least display it only at the very beginning?
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Yep, well i'm trying to get more subscribers, starting from 0 a few months ago in a time when its hard to generate views like it was 6-7 where t was piss easy

i tried to make it small so its out of the way but there
 
I hadn't even realized there was a "click to suscribe" text... But removing it is as easy as turning off notifications when you're watching the video, man...
 
Vobo said:
I'm a bit dissapointed with this year's tactical options. There were much more options in 2014.
The biggest issue is short/long pass option, cause most of the teams are playing something in between
The other issue is unability to set the team width - from my testing team compactness isn't affecting it at all. Teams are too wide while defending.

Here is an example from United - Tottenham match last week.
358x4hu.jpg

24qpimr.jpg


The team compactness is set nearly to the most compact one but as you can see, Tottenham is just super wide while defending compared to real life.
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THANK YOU FOR THIS!!! I created a profile just so I could comment on this. I've been absolutely shocked that nobody seems to notice this/I haven't been able to find a solution to this. But I'll continue reading this thread to see if there's a answer to this.


If anybody has a solution to this please let me know!! This problem makes playing with Barca very difficult and unrealistic.
 
We notice it, but Im affraid there is no solution, mate. The best thing you can do is to set compactness to 10, containment area to Center and position players close to each other in the defensive formation.
 
talucchesi said:
THANK YOU FOR THIS!!! I created a profile just so I could comment on this. I've been absolutely shocked that nobody seems to notice this/I haven't been able to find a solution to this. But I'll continue reading this thread to see if there's a answer to this.
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I pointed this out this morning in the PES 2015 general discussion tread. I stated the height/compact tactic options don't work and the game in that regard is borderline broken. One semi-fix I have found: create a 5-4-1 defensive formation with 5 backs and 4 DMF. Switch to it whenever the CPU gains possession. This is pretty much the only way to create a somewhat effective defensive formation that gets your players in position to help defend, given the compactness option doesn't work at all.
Tinker said:
We notice it, but Im affraid there is no solution, mate. The best thing you can do is to set compactness to 10, containment area to Center and position players close to each other in the defensive formation.
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That doesn't work either and has no effect on compactness.
 
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angus said:
I pointed this out this morning in the PES 2015 general discussion tread. I stated the height/compact tactic options don't work and the game in that regard is borderline broken. One semi-fix I have found: create a 5-4-1 defensive formation with 5 backs and 4 DMF. Switch to it whenever the CPU gains possession. This is pretty much the only way to create a somewhat effective defensive formation that gets your players in position to help defend, given the compactness option doesn't work at all.
That doesn't work either and has no affect on compactness.
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Yea I'm reading all of your comments and I've noticed. Sorry, I'm brand new to this board, I thought I'd do some research as Operations Sports is basically dead in terms of PES. I should've read everything first before I commented but I was surprised and somewhat frustrated that nobody was really picking up on this.

In fifa if you change the wings to RCM's and LCM's they defend almost PERFECTLY. Unfortunately, this might be a deal breaker for me as I was just about to but PES. I looove almost everything else, especially how well the CPU plays but this is just a fundamental aspect of Football that I feel should be pretty obvious. :cry:

Wish I had a PC to play on also :(
 
talucchesi said:
I looove almost everything else, especially how well the CPU plays but this is just a fundamental aspect of Football that I feel should be pretty obvious.
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Using the marking feature helps a lot: assign your RB to mark the CPU's CF, your LB to mark the CPU's SS, etc. This pulls your outside players back into the middle of the pitch, when defending anyway.
 
angus said:
Using the marking feature helps a lot: assign your RB to mark the CPU's CF, your LB to mark the CPU's SS, etc. This pulls your outside players back into the middle of the pitch, when defending anyway.
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Interesting! I might try it out on the demo, if this works, I'll go through with buying the game.

This will work in terms of assigning the CPU the same man marking assignments also??
 
mydumpstinks said:
Dont do it, you`ll be bored of it in a fortnight, you will regret it.
I hoped it would get better but the more i play the more im turning away from it.
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Really? I need an alternative to Fifa though and I love the pace of the game...

The marking thing helped much more, the problem is what you would expect though, defenders being pulled wayy out of position. But in all honesty, I preferred this to the default marking. I suggest others try this as well as it at least gives the possibility of the 'switch' being on.
 
talucchesi said:
This will work in terms of assigning the CPU the same man marking assignments also??
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I have not attempted to set CPU marking tactics because I don't have the sider mod installed. I found other fixes for the slow-to-react CPU defense that work for me.
talucchesi said:
Really? I need an alternative to Fifa though and I love the pace of the game...
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The pacing of PES is brilliant, without question the most realistic football game ever in that regard, and by miles. Makes it very tough to go back and play frenzied FIFA, even with the several issues PES has. I uninstalled all my FIFA games months ago, don't even have Origin installed on my PC for the first time in 4 years.

Example of what happens when the RB and LB are assigned to mark the CPU's two FWs: they pinch in and help defend. By default they stand around near the sidelines, even with defensive compactness set to max...

mc1_zpsmrfiqdre.png
 
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angus said:
Example of what happens when the RB and LB are assigned to mark the CPU's two FWs: they pinch in and help defend. By default they stand around near the sidelines, even with defensive compactness set to max...

mc1_zpsmrfiqdre.png
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Which fw's do you man mark? Just the front striker? What about the SS's outside or Wingers?
 
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