Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread

UJSupanova said:
The Chelsea game was changed to the Sunday last week.



Oh, and Kuyt, Benayoun and Pacheco coming off the bench and not playing well is hardly Rafa's fault is it? They are players (well, Kuyt and Benayoun) who should be able to come off the bench and change a game, but they didn't.

I didn't see the problem with bringing Aquilani off tbh, the lad was clearly tiring, although i know that as far as Liverbird is concerned Aquilani should be playing 90 minutes every single game, but no, Gerrard didn't react in the slightest with the Aquilani substitution, why would he?
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If he is fit, why not ? I mean, I like players with quality to play for Liverpool. Not robots.
Did you see the pass he put to Maxi ? If Maxi hadnt missed that we would be all praising Aqua for the pass. How unfair is football sometimes ...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Liverbird said:
If he is fit, why not ? I mean, I like players with quality to play for Liverpool. Not robots.
Did you see the pass he put to Maxi ? If Maxi hadnt missed that we would be all praising Aqua for the pass. How unfair is football sometimes ...
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the most important part of your post was "if he is fit", because that's the main reason he's not playing.

And tbf mate one pass does not make a good player, i've seen Lucas play loads of quality passes yet he doesn't get the credit, especially from yourself. I'm not a huge fan of Lucas myself, but i see the quality he has when the team is playing well and we have that freedom to attack better, others only focus on the negatives all the time.

Football is unfair, but Maxi missing a shot is not unfair on just Aquilani, it would have meant more to Maxi because he hasn't scored yet, he would get all the credit. You're clearly a big fan of Aquilani, but you can't let that blind you from the truth, he's still not fit, he re-injured his ankle (or so he says) last month and even in February when everyone was saying "he's fit now, play him now!!!" he said himself in an interview that he was still playing with pain in his ankle every time he played.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

So with 4th likely out of reach (Slim chance anyway) do you lot think the Owners will look to offload as they can't afford it? Does winning the Europa league compensate with the money that could bring in?

I think Rafa's hinted at a big name being sold in the summer, I think Mascherano will probably be off to Real or Barca.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Torres to City?

Gerrard to anyone that will have him?

I thought the owners were selling up now?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I think more to like selling their shares instead of the players, if they even the slightest tries to offload Torres, Gerrard or Masch, they'll have the fans knocking on their doors.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Can't see any of the big named players being sold, the hysteria in the press about our debt is a bit ridiulous tbh i don't think we're in any kind of imminent danger, for instance Man Utd's debt is more than three times higher than Liverpool's yet they're still signing players and flying high.

The Americans are on their way out, it's been on the cards for a while but i think their time is definitely up now, it may take a few months but i reckon we'll have new owners before the start of next season.

If reports are to be believed, Barclay's Capital are willing to give £300m to pay off the £237m debt with the other £63m going into the transfer kitty, they would off us a better refinancing deal than the RBS one and would also actively look for a new buyer, but apparently Hicks and Gillett want to stay with RBS.


On another note, a mate of mine is currently shitting himself because when drunk and angry last week he emailed Tom Hicks , he started out quite politely with "Dear Mr. Hicks" and all that but got angrier as he was typing and ended the email with "the next time you're at the match we're gonna come up to the directors box and slit your throat"

:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

He panicked the next morning in case they inform the police, the funny thing is he has been to less matches than Tom Hicks this season anyway so there's very little chance of him actually carrying out the threat.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

"the next time you're at the match we're gonna come up to the directors box and slit your throat.....with a seasonticket, papercut/papercut/papercut"

Do they even have paper tickets anymore?

@ UJ, re my earlier comment;

It's not the players fault. But as I mentioned those subs changed the whole dynamic of the team and subsequently made the attack blunt. That's poor management, we all know Beni is going to cut inside and we know Kuyt and Pacheco won't be able to keep possesion on their own.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

UJSupanova said:
the most important part of your post was "if he is fit", because that's the main reason he's not playing.

And tbf mate one pass does not make a good player, i've seen Lucas play loads of quality passes yet he doesn't get the credit, especially from yourself. I'm not a huge fan of Lucas myself, but i see the quality he has when the team is playing well and we have that freedom to attack better, others only focus on the negatives all the time.

Football is unfair, but Maxi missing a shot is not unfair on just Aquilani, it would have meant more to Maxi because he hasn't scored yet, he would get all the credit. You're clearly a big fan of Aquilani, but you can't let that blind you from the truth, he's still not fit, he re-injured his ankle (or so he says) last month and even in February when everyone was saying "he's fit now, play him now!!!" he said himself in an interview that he was still playing with pain in his ankle every time he played.
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Yes, you are right about that. Anyway, in yesterday match Aquilani made a lot of shots with his right foot. In previous matches he used to shoot more with his left foot. I guess it was because of his pains, and maybe now he is better. He even tried a rabbona.
About Lucas. Sorry but I ve never seen he made a pass like that one. It is a typical pass of players like Xabi, Xavi or Scholes.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

Liverbird said:
Yes, you are right about that. Anyway, in yesterday match Aquilani made a lot of shots with his right foot. In previous matches he used to shoot more with his left foot. I guess it was because of his pains, and maybe now he is better. He even tried a rabbona.
About Lucas. Sorry but I ve never seen he made a pass like that one. It is a typical pass of players like Xabi, Xavi or Scholes.
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Lucas has made plenty of great passes but they get overlooked almost instantly. He played a great ball through to Torres against Blackburn but Torres wasn't fully sharp enough to get onto it, it then fell to Maxi who put a good ball in and Torres scored. There was one against Newcastle that always sticks in my mind when he played an amazing through ball to Gerrard who scored from it.

I suppose his run and goal against Benfica wasn't good enough, and his constant pressing and running against Lille as well.

The fact is, Lucas never gets the credit he deserves because he's the easy scapegoat.

Scapegoats change regularly.

2009-10 Insua and Lucas
2008-09 Lucas and Dossena
2007-08 Voronin and Pennant
2006-07 Pennant and Gonzalez (and Zenden)
2005-06 Josemi and Zenden
2004-05 Kewell and Smicer (and Biscan, Traore and Dudek)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Is today's news the best us Reds have had all season?

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/lfc-announces-new-chairman

To actually have the two tw*ts perfecting their goodbyes, things can only get better can't they?! :RSCARF:

Thomas Hicks and George Gillett said: "Owning Liverpool Football Club over these past three years has been a rewarding and exciting experience for us and our families. Having grown the Club this far we have now decided together to look to sell the Club to owners committed to take the Club through its next level of growth and development.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

It's one of those where it appears to be fantastic news, but until the leeches have actually left the club, I'm not getting overly excited.

We saw what happened with Mike Ashley and Newcastle, and he's still there. And we have to assume the leeches don't still value the club at £500m and are putting potential buyers off. And Barclays Capital are the same group that Ashley hired to find a buyer.

It's promising but I'm still dubious about it all.

And then we start all over again wondering what the new owner is like :(
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

Since the owners been on what have Pool won? an FA Cup... ?
IMO the owner always gave to Rafa what Rafa wanted. If anything I think Rafa has the Club by the balls .He sign a new contract last season and the owner would have to pay up and that would take away from debt and transfer kitty. Now, Rafa`s agent admitted to talk w/ Juve. Rafa just want the owner to know I got big balls son ...sack me then pay me and I have a job lined up.

If anything the owners been too naive.... Rafa never trusted them since, they went behind his back to find another gaffer. Never point a gun unless you have the bullocks to pull the trigger my ni....!!! (just rhymes couldn`t resist)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I understand your scepticism but to be honest, I'm ready for any silver linings to this miserable season (including the Mickey Mouse UEFA cup thingy).

Seriously, whoever it is, could it be much worse than H&G?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

beboq said:
Since the owners been on what have Pool won? an FA Cup... ?
IMO the owner always gave to Rafa what Rafa wanted. If anything I think Rafa has the Club by the balls .He sign a new contract last season and the owner would have to pay up and that would take away from debt and transfer kitty. Now, Rafa`s agent admitted to talk w/ Juve. Rafa just want the owner to know I got big balls son ...sack me then pay me and I have a job lined up.

If anything the owners been too naive.... Rafa never trusted them since, they went behind his back to find another gaffer. Never point a gun unless you have the bullocks to pull the trigger my ni....!!! (just rhymes couldn`t resist)
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It's been documented enough times how Rafa has had to buy his second or third choice players because they wouldn't give him the funds to buy his first choice. Rafa has had money to spend, and has spent quite a lot, but his net spend is still tiny, he's had to bring in most of the money through player sales and the yanks still have hardly put a penny into the club, it's all the bank's money.

Rafa has only bought two players for £20m+ (Torres and Keane) and three others at £15m+ (Mascherano, Johnson and Aquilani) and even then the Johnson deal was covered by £10m that Portsmouth owed us for Crouch. Most of his buys have been less than £10m because he didn't have the backing to buy the bigger players when he wanted them.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Their asking price will have to plummet though without any Champions League money.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Liverbird said:
Hahahaha, you sound just like Rafa.
I guess Benitez has made the wrong change in two games in a row now.
Did Gerrard react like this when Aqua went off ?

ne.gif
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what matters, we are in deep shit and you talk about how he manages the club? Imagine Benitez in Real madrid, or Man city...if he would have the backing of owners and money to buy, he would..

Aqua is good player but shurely not better for LFC team as Xabi alonso was..yet

Rafa had to move Torres down becouse he rested him for Benfica...

what gerrard thinks is not important, important is to win sth this season and the only we can is europe league, and without torres it is impossible..

i also wish this season just would end but i wish we start next with Rafa and new owners
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

UJSupanova said:
It's been documented enough times how Rafa has had to buy his second or third choice players because they wouldn't give him the funds to buy his first choice. Rafa has had money to spend, and has spent quite a lot, but his net spend is still tiny, he's had to bring in most of the money through player sales and the yanks still have hardly put a penny into the club, it's all the bank's money.

Rafa has only bought two players for £20m+ (Torres and Keane) and three others at £15m+ (Mascherano, Johnson and Aquilani) and even then the Johnson deal was covered by £10m that Portsmouth owed us for Crouch. Most of his buys have been less than £10m because he didn't have the backing to buy the bigger players when he wanted them.
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That's going off the assumption that the more money spent on players, the more successful you'll be and that the more expensive the player, the better he is. In theory this is true whereas in practice it doesn't always work like that.

SAF has only bought 4 players over £20m, Rooney, Berbatov, Veron and Ferdinand and he's also funded a lot of his purchases with sales (Beckham, Veron, Heinze, Smith, Richardson, Rossi etc etc). It's not about how many expensive players you have, it's about assembling a good squad and buying the right players. You could argue that both manager's most expensive signings have been hit and miss (Veron and Berba for Fergie, Keane and to some extent Johnson and Aquilani for Rafa). The difference between a £3m player and a £15m player isn't much, most of the cost comes from a media hyped reputation and the standard of club the player is currently at, the difference in actual skill is not that great and the mentality and psychology of the player is more important.

Everyone says Berbatov is a £30m striker so he should score more goals. This is flawed, he was only £30m because SAF was desperate for him and Spurs did us by stringing us along all summer until deadline day then getting us in a bidding war with City. This puts increased pressure on him as realistically he's a £15-20m player, and while his contribution is good (better than most 2nd choice strikers and almost identical to Tevez's record this season), he now feels he has to do more. Wenger has shown that you don't need to spend a lot of money on players for them to be good and to build a decent side and the fact they've had a considerably better season than you is testament to that.

Like Beboq said, Rafa has got the club by the balls, he negotiated that contract (the longest in the league) knowing he had the backing of the fans and the security to do what he wanted due to the financial implications if he was sacked.

Truth is he's performed poorly at times in the transfer market and his dealing with players already at the club and this has hindered any progression. It's too easy blaming the owners for all the problems, they've sorted an £80m shirt sponsorship deal with Standard Chartered, a £150m deal with adidas is close to completed I think, they paid a shit load in unnecessarily high signing on fees to the likes of Torres etc when renewing their contracts (which came out of the transfer budget and Rafa was aware of this) so they've really not been that bad. Yeah they bought the club with loans but they've had little bearing on the on-field performance, this comes down to the manager and the players and I believe it's the attitude and psychology that's the problem.

Anyway, they're off now so you all got what you wanted, now it's time for Rafa to prove me wrong and prove you lot right with no pesky Yank leeches to hold him back.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Jumbo_ said:
That's going off the assumption that the more money spent on players, the more successful you'll be and that the more expensive the player, the better he is. In theory this is true whereas in practice it doesn't always work like that.

SAF has only bought 4 players over £20m, Rooney, Berbatov, Veron and Ferdinand and he's also funded a lot of his purchases with sales (Beckham, Veron, Heinze, Smith, Richardson, Rossi etc etc). It's not about how many expensive players you have, it's about assembling a good squad and buying the right players. You could argue that both manager's most expensive signings have been hit and miss (Veron and Berba for Fergie, Keane and to some extent Johnson and Aquilani for Rafa). The difference between a £3m player and a £15m player isn't much, most of the cost comes from a media hyped reputation and the standard of club the player is currently at, the difference in actual skill is not that great and the mentality and psychology of the player is more important.

Everyone says Berbatov is a £30m striker so he should score more goals. This is flawed, he was only £30m because SAF was desperate for him and Spurs did us by stringing us along all summer until deadline day then getting us in a bidding war with City. This puts increased pressure on him as realistically he's a £15-20m player, and while his contribution is good (better than most 2nd choice strikers and almost identical to Tevez's record this season), he now feels he has to do more. Wenger has shown that you don't need to spend a lot of money on players for them to be good and to build a decent side and the fact they've had a considerably better season than you is testament to that.

Like Beboq said, Rafa has got the club by the balls, he negotiated that contract (the longest in the league) knowing he had the backing of the fans and the security to do what he wanted due to the financial implications if he was sacked.

Truth is he's performed poorly at times in the transfer market and his dealing with players already at the club and this has hindered any progression. It's too easy blaming the owners for all the problems, they've sorted an £80m shirt sponsorship deal with Standard Chartered, a £150m deal with adidas is close to completed I think, they paid a shit load in unnecessarily high signing on fees to the likes of Torres etc when renewing their contracts (which came out of the transfer budget and Rafa was aware of this) so they've really not been that bad. Yeah they bought the club with loans but they've had little bearing on the on-field performance, this comes down to the manager and the players and I believe it's the attitude and psychology that's the problem.

Anyway, they're off now so you all got what you wanted, now it's time for Rafa to prove me wrong and prove you lot right with no pesky Yank leeches to hold him back.
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Berbatov's contribution is almost identical to Tevez's this season?

Berbatov - 39 games 12 goals
Tevez - 30 games 28 goals

Sorry but they're not even remotely close.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Carlos Tevez
Appearances
30
Minutes on the pitch
2,493
Goals
22
Minutes per goal
113
Goal assists
7
Chances created
48

Dimitar Berbatov
Appearances
29
Minutes on the pitch
1,857
Goals
12
Minutes per goal
155
Goal assists
4
Chances created
47

Pretty similar, and remember Tevez has scored quite a few penalties too and is first choice with the formation tailored to suit him.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Before this all gets out of hand, there is a scientific study about what actually makes (sports)teams succesfull when it comes to transfers.

It's not the transfer fee, as Jumbo has already said it can be very hit and miss. It's wages!

This allows a club to have a better squad by keeping good players happy whilst not playing enabling them to use them when dealing with injuries and fatigue.

I think Chelsea are top, then manu, then arse and then Liverpool.

Rafa has spent a lot, but then he has also sold a lot. Not being able to keep good players has shown especially this season.

You could argue that the first team is pretty close to the other 4, it's the squad that is utter crap.

In the same way you can say; but you could have signed krankjar (or whatever his name is) for 2,5mil. That is the case, but if you have spend 4mil a season to keep him on the bench it's not possible. I have no idea what his wages are, but the point being you end up spending 10 to 20mil on a player that won't play often so the transfer fee is pretty irrelevant.

Liverpool just don't have the finance to keep good players happy with high wages.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Jumbo_ said:
Carlos Tevez
Appearances
30
Minutes on the pitch
2,493
Goals
22
Minutes per goal
113
Goal assists
7
Chances created
48

Dimitar Berbatov
Appearances
29
Minutes on the pitch
1,857
Goals
12
Minutes per goal
155
Goal assists
4
Chances created
47

Pretty similar, and remember Tevez has scored quite a few penalties too and is first choice with the formation tailored to suit him.
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Again, not close to being similar.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Well they are, but Berbatov was a total side point to what I was saying as you know but it's easier to dig at that than just acknowledging what I said like Tik has.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Jumbo_ said:
Carlos Tevez
Appearances
30
Minutes on the pitch
2,493
Goals
22
Minutes per goal
113
Goal assists
7
Chances created
48

Dimitar Berbatov
Appearances
29
Minutes on the pitch
1,857
Goals
12
Minutes per goal
155
Goal assists
4
Chances created
47

Pretty similar, and remember Tevez has scored quite a few penalties too and is first choice with the formation tailored to suit him.
Click to expand...

Well no they're not because Tevez's are better all over, and you only counted league games.

plus i only picked on that bit because it was funnier to do so than to read your entire article.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Interesting results yesterday.

So who do you hope finishes 4th? I think it might be for the best if Spurs manage it. You know ManCity will be spending in the summer and not being able to offer CL football may be enough to keep them from getting too far ahead. Spurs on the otherhand, with Harry, won't be the same draw for players and tbh I can't see them doing well in Europe either. He doesn't have the tactical skills for it, and disregarding the EL won't do them any favours either imo as they will have no experience in europe as a managementteam.

Guess we will have to cheer on Spurs next week then.....
 
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