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Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread

only time will tell, you just know there`s something up. Like when wenger didn`t really want asrhavin and Ivan Gazidis got him anyways, and then he didn`t pick him vs chelsea(final) to prove a point (Im Le Boss).

I think it`s backroom stuff that`s overflowing ,but rafa should have the support from the fans until the truth comes out that he`s the real problem it`s just 1 season and most likely to win a trophy this season too

Liverbird said:
Couldnt understand a word of what you said
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sorry wasn`t trying to be too specific didn`t want to draw blood so made it very vague :LOL:
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

But Rafa did want Aquilani and I think he wanted him so much that he even bought him injured. So, now after paying 17 M for him, he doesnt want him ?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

@ Gerd,

Before Houllier Liverpool were one of the most attacking teams in the league. That was the problem, they could score loads but couldn't defend to save their lives. And they weren't consistent either, a bit like Newcastle really, before they went downhill.

So Houllier came in, signed two unknown defenders (among others) and made one of the best defensive teams around, with the attack coming from counters with Owen and Heskey. Great in cups, not enough for the league. That went stale and he left.

Benitez pretty much restarted the same development from scratch but with the focus on midfield control (Hamann, Alonso, Gerrard).
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Roy Evans :ROLL:

Before that, Graeme Souness :ROLL: :ROLL:

To be fair, I didn't mind the Evans days too much.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Something to be admired during the Evans days, the fact that you were a proper scouse club.

Scouse manager, team full of scousers, owned by scousers.

Shows how much football has changed really.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Yes but the Sky era also meant that English clubs earned big bucks compared to the clubs of the litle leagues (and even compared to French, German and Italian clubs). A team like Man utd flourished because of the TV money (and also because they had a brilliant manager of course) whereas before that era they relatively were unsuccessfull in Europe, same goes for Arsenal and Chelsea and to a much lesser degree Liverpool.
Even within English football times have changed. Can you imagine clubs like Nottingham and Villa winning the CL ?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

gerd said:
But Liverpool have a (litle) tradition in signing defensive coaches: Houllier and now Benitez (can't even remember who managed them before Houllier).
I hope for the sake of the club that they don't replace Benitez with Keagan, that would be the worst case scenario...

Oh and i really don't understand why Benitez wanted Aquilani if he hardly ever plays him.
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well, Liverpool have been around since long before 1998 so with all respect that's bollocks.

As for Aquilani, he said himself two weeks ago that everytime he plays he feels pain in his ankle, he's still not 100% and Benitez has signed him to a 5 year contract, not a 5 month one.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

UJSupanova said:
well, Liverpool have been around since long before 1998 so with all respect that's bollocks.

As for Aquilani, he said himself two weeks ago that everytime he plays he feels pain in his ankle, he's still not 100% and Benitez has signed him to a 5 year contract, not a 5 month one.
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So, if that´s the case, how can he be able to play against teams like Unirea and not be able to play against teams like Arsenal or Manchester City ? What´s the difference ?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Pressure, time on the ball etc.

I forgot about the pain in his ankle, that does explain the lack of matches. However putting him on for 3min. seems pointless to me.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Liverbird said:
So, if that´s the case, how can he be able to play against teams like Unirea and not be able to play against teams like Arsenal or Manchester City ? What´s the difference ?
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If i remember rightly, he had an illness for the Arsenal game and was vomiting (Skrtel had been ill the previous week), as for the City game Rafa knew it would be a hard fought game and not a good idea to risk him with his ankle.

So, that is in fact the case.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

UJSupanova said:
If i remember rightly, he had an illness for the Arsenal game and was vomiting (Skrtel had been ill the previous week), as for the City game Rafa knew it would be a hard fought game and not a good idea to risk him with his ankle.

So, that is in fact the case.
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You re right about Arsenal game, I forgot that he didnt travel because he was ill. Anyway, I think that his injury is over, he recently said that he has to cope with pain, but that is normal. We are talking about an injury that last for 1 year. What I dont understand is how he can be able to play against lower phisical teams and not be able to play in bigger matches that arent suppose to be that phisical (Arsenal at home, Manchester City at home and away, for example). And also, dont you think that the fact that when he got a run of a few consecutives matches (werent that much, though), was when Mascherano was injured and suspended ? I think that that says a lot about Rafa´s first choices.
He is ready to play, it is a question if Rafa wants to play his 18 M bought or leave him in the bench. Im convinced that the only big team of the Premier League in which Lucas would be a first choice is Liverpool and that the only big team in which Alberto wouldnt is also Liverpool.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

if you're convinced of that then you don't watch enough football mate, sorry but Lucas has been our most consistent midfielder this season and is better than a lot of midfielders out there but he's the scapegoat for the dickheads that believe everything they read.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

That's right. Reminds me of how Fletcher was scapegoated by our fans in the past.

He'll develop into a good player.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I have a question for you guys, how can Liverpool win the League 18 times and when the premiership got introduced they never won any? Is it the premiership format? What is it exactly?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

There wasn't a change of format, it was exactly the same. Just more money / tv rights.

However at that precise point in time Manu had a great team (signing Cantona from Leeds (who had won the league the previous year)) whilst Liverpool lost Dalglish as manager and replaced him with Souness, someone who has failed everywhere, even Scotland! He pretty much ripped apart the winning team and since then Liverpool have played catch-up whilst manu, with a good team and succes ran away with the extra money they earned. Liverpool were crap for most of the 90-ties with poor managers (Evans wasn't good enough) and Manu developed two great teams in that period and consolidated their position for the noughties. With only a really good Arsenal team (98/03-04?) getting between them and the title and for two seasons a heavily funded Blackburn (95-96?) with Dalglish. And then Chelsea (03) came along and spent 250mil in two summers and have pretty much used that money/team the last 5 years with a couple of 20mil players added every season. Arsenal have been developing strong young teams since then when it became obvious that without that amount of money you can't compete.

So with that in mind it's not strange that Liverpool have mostly been fighting with Arsenal for 3rd/4th when they finally got their act together.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

So, in conclusion, all you need is a new "Dalglish" accompanied with heavy funding.

Who do you think can replicate him?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

TikTikTikTikTik said:
@ Gerd,

Before Houllier Liverpool were one of the most attacking teams in the league. That was the problem, they could score loads but couldn't defend to save their lives. And they weren't consistent either, a bit like Newcastle really, before they went downhill.

So Houllier came in, signed two unknown defenders (among others) and made one of the best defensive teams around, with the attack coming from counters with Owen and Heskey. Great in cups, not enough for the league. That went stale and he left.

Benitez pretty much restarted the same development from scratch but with the focus on midfield control (Hamann, Alonso, Gerrard).
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Good point, fellow Liver-m8... but Houllier DIDN'T sell-off these players he got; instead, Rafa DID THAT! Also, just to refresh your memory... Rafa was "fooling-around" with Stevie, by using him as Winger many years, before he FINALLY put him in the center as CM-AM player (thxs God!).
And finally... what's wrong playing THE MOST ATTACKING footie?!
How old are ya? I'm 39 and I'm watching/supporting LFC since Rome's CL trophy, in the middle of 80s. Have you seen LIVE "King-Kenny" and Ian Rush, attacking like... "Tsounamis" in the opponents' defences??? Marvelous spectacle! Then, we probably got a couple of goals and... we scored 4 or 5!!!
What's wrong with that? You like now... with GOALESS draws or pathetic 1-0 scores???
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

matherto said:
Something to be admired during the Evans days, the fact that you were a proper scouse club.

Scouse manager, team full of scousers, owned by scousers.

Shows how much football has changed really.
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THANK GOD!!!!!! FINALLY... someone ELSE has the same bl*ody thoughts like me!
Indeed, m8s! I don't bl*ody care if we'll face a "dark-decade" without titles! What I DO care... is NOT watching this "hybrid" Liverpool, with tones of latin/spanians and foreigners, instead of BL*ODY BRITISH lads!
It's so damn, so bl*ody SIMPLE to understand it:
Especially in teams like us, a passionate, "family-community" & "hot-spirit" football club (I think, WE ARE THE "MARK" TEAM of this category)... that kind of team needs LOCAL lads, "SCOUSERS" (managers, coaches, players... OWNERS!!!), because only local fellows can UNDERSTAND what means to BE (not just play!) a "KOPite"!!! In the older days, everybody, from the chairman to the... gardener was shearing the grass (lol!), from the most unknown supporter to the best "star" player... EVERYBODY was "FEELING"... BLEEDING... FIGHTING like a "KOPite"!!!
Look now... WHO except Stevie, Jemmie and Kuyt is playing with such passion? LOOK BACK ONLY FEW YEARS..., when Rafa just came in. We have plenty players with such "spirit" & passion...
Now... we ONLY HAVE "MERCENARIES", only care to make money & reputation, by playing in one of the best clubs in the world.
And WHAT they did to that club...? They "managed" to make it MODERATE english club, instead of the BEST BRITISH football club.
That's... not success, from my part.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

TikTikTikTikTik said:
There wasn't a change of format, it was exactly the same. Just more money / tv rights.

However at that precise point in time Manu had a great team (signing Cantona from Leeds (who had won the league the previous year)) whilst Liverpool lost Dalglish as manager and replaced him with Souness, someone who has failed everywhere, even Scotland! He pretty much ripped apart the winning team and since then Liverpool have played catch-up whilst manu, with a good team and succes ran away with the extra money they earned. Liverpool were crap for most of the 90-ties with poor managers (Evans wasn't good enough) and Manu developed two great teams in that period and consolidated their position for the noughties. With only a really good Arsenal team (98/03-04?) getting between them and the title and for two seasons a heavily funded Blackburn (95-96?) with Dalglish. And then Chelsea (03) came along and spent 250mil in two summers and have pretty much used that money/team the last 5 years with a couple of 20mil players added every season. Arsenal have been developing strong young teams since then when it became obvious that without that amount of money you can't compete.

So with that in mind it's not strange that Liverpool have mostly been fighting with Arsenal for 3rd/4th when they finally got their act together.
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I don't say, I'm not agree with ya, m8. Obiously, your summary is right.
But... for the love of God! Stop, everybody, blaming lack of MONEY & TV rights!!!!!! Jesus!... Take example of A.Villa, with Martin O'Neil... Villa having plenty money?! No... They have Martin O'Neil, a BRITISH good coach, who took them from moderate team (as they became - a legendary english club from the old days) and he made them good team and... Villa now is THREATING US to take from us the 4th CL place from EPL' table!!!
(And what SERIOUS/EXPENSIVE transfers, O'Neil & Villa made these last years???)
It's all about "policy" and "spirit", m8s!
We DON'T "have it", anymore... Rafa never had it. Rafa is a good manager, a GOOD PROFESSIONAL... and that's about it. He has no "feeling" for LFC, he doesn't "feeling/bleeding" as Liver-m8.
Rafa always wants to have a good PROFESSIONAL "look". He likes to have newspapers' reports to say "he's a good manager"... Rather if he's manager in LFC or OTHER team, he doesn't care except doing his job well.

Well... that's NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR US, FOR LIBERPOOL!

My da told me (he saw many times Liverpool in SHANKLY's TIMES!), Liverpool during Bill Shankly's time was a SUPERB, a MYTHICAL team... not because old-Bill was the "greatest manager in the world" (in fact, he was just a good manager), but because Shankly was EXACTLY WHAT Liverpool needed:
A "father"... a "general"... a "footsoldier"... a "slave"... a manager who liked to BLEED, to DIE for our club!!!
And THAT "spirit" he had, he was able to "transmited" it to the players and the lads were BLEEDING in the pitch - and the crowd, the LFC supporters were "inebriated" by that and they were in ecstasy!!!

Have you felt LIKE THAT... except (probably; I was!) in Istanbul's final, the FINAL GAME that I saw Liverpool playing so passionate like in "good-old-days"?
I don't think so...
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

Aren't you a foreigner yourself?

I don't see the problem in teams playing players from any background as long as they're in the team to do what they should be doing.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

andrew.mazlim said:
Good point, fellow Liver-m8... but Houllier DIDN'T sell-off these players he got; instead, Rafa DID THAT! Also, just to refresh your memory... Rafa was "fooling-around" with Stevie, by using him as Winger many years, before he FINALLY put him in the center as CM-AM player (thxs God!).
And finally... what's wrong playing THE MOST ATTACKING footie?!
How old are ya? I'm 39 and I'm watching/supporting LFC since Rome's CL trophy, in the middle of 80s. Have you seen LIVE "King-Kenny" and Ian Rush, attacking like... "Tsounamis" in the opponents' defences??? Marvelous spectacle! Then, we probably got a couple of goals and... we scored 4 or 5!!!
What's wrong with that? You like now... with GOALESS draws or pathetic 1-0 scores???
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WTF are you on about?!
- I didn't say Houllier sold players, I said he added defensive stability
- Rafa fooled around with Gerrard?! You mean he developed him from a tactically naive CM to one of the most feared AM in the world?
- There is no problem with attacking football, unless offcourse, you like, can't defend!
- Yes, I obviously love those sleep inducing 0-0 draws. Surely it's obvious from my positive posts regarding the team, it's style and the matches in recent months.
- And I'm not blaming TV Money for Liverpool's problem. If your reading is as good as your writing, which is to say barely legible you would have understood that I didn't blame money.
- And Martin O'Neill is a good manager, but don't get carried away. They are organised and have good attackers, but the past couple of seasons has seen them spend a similar amount to Liverpool. And yet even in Liverpool's worst season this decade they are just about keeping up! If you want a good manager with little money Moyes is a better example.

However I do agree with Rafa lacking spirit, or atleast being able to instill it in the team.

THANK GOD!!!!!! FINALLY... someone ELSE has the same bl*ody thoughts like me!
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You should watch out Matherto, surely that in itself is enough to turn you to drink. ;)
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

Lami said:
Aren't you a foreigner yourself?

I don't see the problem in teams playing players from any background as long as they're in the team to do what they should be doing.
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My good lad... First, I'm HALF English, as well as Hellen ("Greek" it's not the word).
Also, I "feel" more English than my... teacher I had in school.
I'm proud for my both "bloods" in my veins - I'm proud been a "Son of Pericles", as much as "Son of Elizabeth Tudor"!. And I never "felt"... "mercenary"! I'm GIVING & I'm taking from England, instead of these present foreigner players.
But... You completely LOST my point!
It's not a "racist" comment, my point. It's a bl*ody COMMON SENCE, friend!!!
WHO IS LOVING MORE YOUR HOME-TOWN... than YOU, your parents, your neigboors DO???
That's my point!!! If a manager's start using MORE local lads, these lads first will feel EXTREEM PROUD for playing in their LOCAL team and second, they're feeling much more than... professional player's responsibility - as a job!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

name me some other Scouse players who are out there who are better than the foreign players in our team, because i watch the reserves regularly and i keep up to date with the local lads we've sold on and there isn't any. The best Scouse players right now are Gerrard, Rooney and Carragher. Youth wise there's Spearing who'll never make it, and Kelly who is the only decent local lad who is close to the first team.

It doesn't make sense to prefer nationality over ability, not at all. Would you rather have had David Thompson over Dietmar Hamann? Neil Mellor over Fernando Torres? Do you see what i'm saying? It doesn't matter where you're from, if you're good enough then you're good enough.


It's great to have passionate fans like you lad, but you've spoken a lot of bollocks on this page, i love how you say you've been supporting/watching Liverpool since 1984 yet you bang on about Shankly who had left 7 years earlier.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

TikTikTikTikTik said:
WTF are you on about?!
- I didn't say Houllier sold players, I said he added defensive stability
- Rafa fooled around with Gerrard?! You mean he developed him from a tactically naive CM to one of the most feared AM in the world?
- There is no problem with attacking football, unless offcourse, you like, can't defend!
- Yes, I obviously love those sleep inducing 0-0 draws. Surely it's obvious from my positive posts regarding the team, it's style and the matches in recent months.
- And I'm not blaming TV Money for Liverpool's problem. If your reading is as good as your writing, which is to say barely legible you would have understood that I didn't blame money.
- And Martin O'Neill is a good manager, but don't get carried away. They are organised and have good attackers, but the past couple of seasons has seen them spend a similar amount to Liverpool. And yet even in Liverpool's worst season this decade they are just about keeping up! If you want a good manager with little money Moyes is a better example.

However I do agree with Rafa lacking spirit, or atleast being able to instill it in the team.


You should watch out Matherto, surely that in itself is enough to turn you to drink. ;)
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My friend...
- I DIDN'T say (that you said) Houllier sold players.
On the contrary, I said RAFA DID THAT (and I ment Houllier didn't that!)
- You're joking, right? Stevie was a "naive" CM?????????? And Rafa WAS THE MAN who "made" him the best AM in the world???... "RAFA" was??? Thank God I'm NOT a FANATIC person in general and I can "see" clearly. I don't mind to supporting Rafa, my friend. I mind to be SOOOOOOO damn inordinate and fanatic supporter of a single man, who was nobody before 2004-2005 he joined us... instead Stevie, who was ALREADY A BL*ODY LEGEND not only in our club's history, but in global football history!!! You offending Stevie G., by saying "Rafa made him"...
- And now, my dear m8, AFTER these GLORIOUS/MYTHICAL old days, when we're playing FULL-ATTACK... NOW... now we're playing "SOOOOOOOO DAMN GOOD DEFENCE", right? THAT DEFENCE we're playing now, you calling it... "good"? Good God!... When I was playing footie (as goalie), "THAT KIND OF DEFENCE" (we're playing now - LFC) we used to calling it... "pathetic"!
- I've read what you wrote and I said I agree, didn't I?
- Very, very, very good example!!! Sorry I didn't mention Moyes. I like a "solution" like that.

If you carefully "read" my thoughts... we're saying the same, only with different and more "aggressive" spirit.

Bottom of line:

- Do you lads like present Liverpool?... I DON'T!
- Have you (ever) looking back the old glorious past?... Me, ALWAYS!
- Don't you like to... "ej*culating" by watching our team, like WE DID (I DID!) in Istanbul 2005 and... from the second level of the stadium I... "found" myself 2 yeards from the pitch?!... AYE, I want that!
- Are we "ej*culating" now from our play?... Me, by all means, NO!
- Are we STILL SUPPORTING our club, people, managers, etc., everyone?... There's no comment from me, about that! I'm calling myself "LOYAL LFC's SUBJECT"!!! So...?
- But, should be "blind" and not making critics?... By all means, yes! To everyone, chairmen, coaches, managers, scouters, players...
- Do we need a... Shankly's "resurraction"?... I believe yes, we need it badly!
- Do we need more "local lads" around, like "King-Kenny" who bled and gave his life to our club?... BY ALL MEANS, yes!

Anyway... Don't blaming any "different" voice, thought, m8s.
That's the point of the bl*ody dimocracy! And it's borring everybody agree with everybody.

YNWA... and, GOD BLESS STEVIE, MY INTERNAL "SKIPPER"!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

UJSupanova said:
name me some other Scouse players who are out there who are better than the foreign players in our team, because i watch the reserves regularly and i keep up to date with the local lads we've sold on and there isn't any. The best Scouse players right now are Gerrard, Rooney and Carragher. Youth wise there's Spearing who'll never make it, and Kelly who is the only decent local lad who is close to the first team.

It doesn't make sense to prefer nationality over ability, not at all. Would you rather have had David Thompson over Dietmar Hamann? Neil Mellor over Fernando Torres? Do you see what i'm saying? It doesn't matter where you're from, if you're good enough then you're good enough.


It's great to have passionate fans like you lad, but you've spoken a lot of bollocks on this page, i love how you say you've been supporting/watching Liverpool since 1984 yet you bang on about Shankly who had left 7 years earlier.
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Of course you're right... "SCOUSERS" are few good enough.
But when I'm saying "LOCALS"... I mean "ISLAND-ERS", from "BRITANIA", from England, from Wales, from Eire, from Scotland!!!... As a matter of fact, our BEST EVER player was... Scotchman - "King-Kenny"!
Also... YOU DON'T KNOW if there are PLENTY players, GOOD players, ENGLISH or even 'POOL-eans!!! How you know that? We don't using NOT EVEN OUR YOUTH ACADEMY's PLAYERS anymore!!!
Not mention how many lads MAYBE are around and NOBODY is looking for them, because EVERYONE is looking "outside"!
And finaly... You saying foreigners are better from Englishmen (I'm totally dissagree!!!)?... Fine! Let's choosing with MORE clever mind!
LATIN FOOTBALL & SPANISH FOOTBALL are not "suitable" for ENGLISH FOOTBALL, how difficult is for someone to understand that?! Let's have a couple of latins to give you some "magic", but MOST of your roster must be "similar" to English way of football!
Whom?
Skandinavians (SO MANY GOOD EXAMPLES we had, in LFC!), Duchmen, Germans, Frenchies, etc.
MEDITERRANEANS & LATIN AMERICANS... are by far totaly different from the British! Not only in football tactics, but in their way of thinking! They thinks/believes different that the British and that's obvious in the pitch!
For example: Leto was a moderated player for LFC. He went to PAO Athens and he "digested" into the greek team! Because HE "FITS" BETTER in a Mediterranean team!
Another example? WHY ALMOST ALL LATINOS are going to Spain or Italia to play? Is it because these leagues are the best? NO! EPL is the best, everybody's saying that!
So, why? BECAUSE THEY'RE "FITTING" BETTER there, they have similar habits, for pity sakes!

About the last comment of your...
"but you've spoken a lot of bollocks on this page, i love how you say you've been supporting/watching Liverpool since 1984 yet you bang on about Shankly who had left 7 years earlier"
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...

First I didn't offend you. Second, YOU'RE NOT THAT SMART LAD, isn't it??? I said/wrote HOW MY FATHER SPOKE TO ME ABOUT THESE OLD SHANKLY'S DAYS!!!... Which part you DIDN'T understand? Are you familiar with the English language?
Anyways...!
 
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