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eFootball PES 2020 Demo Discussion Thread (PS4/Xbox)

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OBH said:
Following on from that, why does PES still not have a button to make a player come towards you? FIFA's had it for a few years now
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This is driving me insane, the number of times a player up front waiting for the ball to roll to them rather than moving their ass towards the ball mostly to the effect that the AI will steal it away. You can alleviate this a bit by turning the support range down but it's outright stupid to begin with.

The other day I've realized again how incredibly undynamic, stupid and uninspired your attackers are. To start with, I am always outnumbered. I can play 4-2-4, crank the level up to red, have three players support attack but my ball carrier will still be surrounded by AI. Even with top teams it's so difficult to find someone to pass the ball to in the last third of the pitch. Midfield to their box it's fine, if a bit too deserted, but as soon as you reach their box, you are greeted by two back lines, and there is no one to play to, because everyone seems to hide on the outside of the pass behind a defender, making totally stupid runs at illogical moments and nobody ever seems to cut in or make space for themselves.

loco said:
“The bastard form of mass culture is humiliated repetition. Always new books, new programs, new films, news items, but always the same meaning” – Roland Barthes
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Plus one for the Barthes quote. This forum never ceases to amaze me.
 
Rodchenko said:
This is driving me insane, the number of times a player up front waiting for the ball to roll to them rather than moving their ass towards the ball mostly to the effect that the AI will steal it away. You can alleviate this a bit by turning the support range down but it's outright stupid to begin with.

The other day I've realized again how incredibly undynamic, stupid and uninspired your attackers are. To start with, I am always outnumbered. I can play 4-2-4, crank the level up to red, have three players support attack but my ball carrier will still be surrounded by AI. Even with top teams it's so difficult to find someone to pass the ball to in the last third of the pitch. Midfield to their box it's fine, if a bit too deserted, but as soon as you reach their box, you are greeted by two back lines, and there is no one to play to, because everyone seems to hide on the outside of the pass behind a defender, making totally stupid runs at illogical moments and nobody ever seems to cut in or make space for themselves.
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Couldn't agree more.
You can try to mitigate the problem by using either False-9 or Wing Rotation, but False-9 is PATHETIC. The striker flat out refuses to run forwards even during a counter attack. Wing Rotation works better, but only if you intend to score goals with your midfielders. I can't stand the support range slider either because it applies to the entire team. To be honest, I think attacking instructions applying to the entire team is stupid. That isn't how football works. Yes, as a team you play 'counter-attacking football' for example, but it's still a collection of individual instructions that make it counter-attacking football.

Defending isn't any better either. The only way to stop players bombing forwards is to waste your two tactics on Defensive? And even then you can only apply it to two players? Who thought that was a good idea?

Even things like picking a defensive line makes no sense because you can’t see the line on the pitch. So if I move my defenders as high as they possibly can, then set the defensive line to 1, I have absolutely no idea how my players will act in game.

I know some people have said they don't understand why we harp on about the UI, but UI isn't just it's appearance, 99% of it is how they display the information to the player, and PES have been atrocious at this for ages now. How the formation screen is laid out is just as much a UI complaint as the disgusting giant grey boxes used everywhere is.
 
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Also, I can't believe someone has actually been paid to do PES's UI (first image). I've taken 10mins out of my life and rushed a better job than they've done.

It really isn't that difficult to do something that doesn't look like it's from the 80's.

UI1.jpg UI2.jpg
 
OBH said:
Also, I can't believe someone has actually been paid to do PES's UI (first image). I've taken 10mins out of my life and rushed a better job than they've done.

It really isn't that difficult to do something that doesn't look like it's from the 80's.

View attachment 16893 View attachment 16892
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Looking at the second pic I suspect that Pes2020 will have new skill move - Kame Hame...
Culture_DragonBallBroly.jpg
Apologies... that was dads joke...
 
OBH said:
Also, I can't believe someone has actually been paid to do PES's UI (first image). I've taken 10mins out of my life and rushed a better job than they've done.

It really isn't that difficult to do something that doesn't look like it's from the 80's.

View attachment 16893 View attachment 16892
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Nice (I'm assuming your effort is the second pic?) - but PES has got carried away with aesthetics (player faces) and sacrificing intelligent gameplay.

I'd take a PES 2020:Black edition (with no menu logos/art, just a black screen and white text, a couple of game modes, and a full-on on-the-pitch football play and tactics experience with already-implemented PES 19 graphics/animations) any day.
 
In-depth tactical instructions don't sell, if not detrimental to sales since the normies will say they are too complicated, this isn't FM. All that sell nowadays are nice graphics and boosted stats in myClub. We can moan all we want but game producers only care about what sells nowadays, not what is correct.
 
du0 said:
In-depth tactical instructions don't sell, if not detrimental to sales since the normies will say they are too complicated, this isn't FM. All that sell nowadays are nice graphics and boosted stats in myClub. We can moan all we want but game producers only care about what sells nowadays, not what is correct.
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The irony of that is it's the level of tactical depth that KONAMI have placed on the last few iterations that is actually killing the gameplay.
 
Anyone else curious why they are announcing the demo release date so soon? Last year they waited until late July to announce the 2019 demo.
 
Those arrows in the tactic settings...
I miss them!

I don't understand why they had to change that.
PES 2010 had pretty good tactic options as well.
You could set every player individually from defensive, over balanced to offensive.
Much better than having fixed offensive wing defenders etc.
 
chiefrocka4real said:
Those arrows in the tactic settings...
I miss them!

I don't understand why they had to change that.
PES 2010 had pretty good tactic options as well.
You could set every player individually from defensive, over balanced to offensive.
Much better than having fixed offensive wing defenders etc.
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Because they moved the game away from being sim to an arcade mess. Same on the pitch with this contextual stuff i.e very little skill input required. Fifa clone game play, with baffling tactical settings. Pes 2020 looks like some movement back to the past, but is it going to be enough to give the game more longevity?
 
Dribbling is hardly something where little skill is required.

It's not even a Fifa clone for that matter. Bar having to put a leather ball between two posts there's very little the two have in common.

What was it about previous PES games that made them so much more difficult in your eyes? If anything I'd say they were easier. Less controls = less to learn. Less to take into account when making decisions.
 
OBH said:
Dribbling is hardly something where little skill is required.

It's not even a Fifa clone for that matter. Bar having to put a leather ball between two posts there's very little the two have in common.

What was it about previous PES games that made them so much more difficult in your eyes? If anything I'd say they were easier. Less controls = less to learn. Less to take into account when making decisions.
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Shooting and passing depended so much on your body position, the skill of your player, the timing, the power bar. They were directly linked. Nowadays.... not so much. At all.

Everything else, besides shooting and passing, depended on all those factors I mentioned before. Player speed (much more noticeable before than now), dribbling skills and success at it, etc.

And don't even get me started on the AI. The AI was very good back in the day while still behaving somewhat humanly, making mistakes, failing passes, shots, ball control, even though they created many many more chances chances than they do now, they didn't always score. Nowadays, they're lucy if they get 2 shots on target by the end of the match, and half of the times, they score at least one of them.
 
Chuny said:
Shooting and passing depended so much on your body position, the skill of your player, the timing, the power bar. They were directly linked. Nowadays.... not so much. At all.

Everything else, besides shooting and passing, depended on all those factors I mentioned before. Player speed (much more noticeable before than now), dribbling skills and success at it, etc.

And don't even get me started on the AI. The AI was very good back in the day while still behaving somewhat humanly, making mistakes, failing passes, shots, ball control, even though they created many many more chances chances than they do now, they didn't always score. Nowadays, they're lucy if they get 2 shots on target by the end of the match, and half of the times, they score at least one of them.
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Agree. Every game vs the ai used to feel unique. Playing the modern pes games vs the ai and I feel like I have seen everything that the ai team has to offer very quickly.
 
Fair one.
Not saying you guys are wrong or anything. I don’t disagree PES was better in the past. I’m just not sure it was necessarily more difficult.
 
chiefrocka4real said:
You could set every player individually from defensive, over balanced to offensive.
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They kept this part, but removed the off. arrows from 2009 and earlier, you see they do this on purpose, there is no other explanation.

The player card system was nice though, but this they dumbed down in 2011 already, could not change the cards on/off or something, cant remember, Nokami are clowns, nothing more to expect.
 
OBH said:
Fair one.
Not saying you guys are wrong or anything. I don’t disagree PES was better in the past. I’m just not sure it was necessarily more difficult.
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I think, if I remember correctly, they used to say "easy to play, hard to master" or something? Don't think that would "sell" a game these days to the average person, unfortunately. You cannot compare the graphics etc, but the game play/ ai/ tactics etc just felt satisfying to play. Hope that they find that old magic again, at some point soon, before I am deceased/senile/incapacitated. The old ps2 master leagues were great fun.
 
Tbh, I chose PES dribbling system over Fifa.
Except for the right analog stick though.

But left stick dribbling together with R1 tapping or double tapping works nice when the timing is right.
Means, it doesn't work always, so it's not too easy.
Also... If you double tap R1 at the right moment, your player performs stuff like nutmegging etc.
It's not perfect, but I like it the way it is, even if could use improvement.
It helps me often to gain room for my wing attackers.
For example, walking slowly with the ball on the wing towards the defender, then quickly change direction along the sideline together with double tapping R1.
Works nice.
 
chiefrocka4real said:
Tbh, I chose PES dribbling system over Fifa.
Except for the right analog stick though.

But left stick dribbling together with R1 tapping or double tapping works nice when the timing is right.
Means, it doesn't work always, so it's not too easy.
Also... If you double tap R1 at the right moment, your player performs stuff like nutmegging etc.
It's not perfect, but I like it the way it is, even if could use improvement.
It helps me often to gain room for my wing attackers.
For example, walking slowly with the ball on the wing towards the defender, then quickly change direction along the sideline together with double tapping R1.
Works nice.
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That's what I use my wingers for when dribbling,create space!
Pretty much the same with my fw,even though I try to beat my man and go for goal quite often,because it's fun,and also just playing the ball around like a game of Handball is so boring.
I like Pes way of dribbling,shouldn't be easy.
But,one thing needed,that's dribbling (on higher difficulties) that really takes away the defender,and not having him recover and catch up in 0.1 second
 
I want to to be able to really get *around* someone. I don't mean slowing down, then double-tapping R1 and outsprint them parallely like you describe, but facing them, then moving diagonally sideways and getting around them when your player should have the speed and acceleration stats to do this and the defender should have the momentum against him to be able to catch up. It seems impossible.
 
I don't know about going around someone.
But what I pulled off was :

I was facing the defender, double tapped R1 and he pushed the ball by him before running around him.
Looked pretty cool but I can't say if you need specific stats for this.
It also doesn't work always, it depends on the position of the defender, your player and the ball.
But I think, it is explained in the training tutorial of the game.
 
Rodchenko said:
I want to to be able to really get *around* someone. I don't mean slowing down, then double-tapping R1 and outsprint them parallely like you describe, but facing them, then moving diagonally sideways and getting around them when your player should have the speed and acceleration stats to do this and the defender should have the momentum against him to be able to catch up. It seems impossible.
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These things can be done, but you need to use more than just sprint.

Double tapping sprint is an essential way of getting by people in a lot of situations, not just the ones described earlier (my video earlier showed he different animations you can do, all by double tapping it). A quick movement in the other direction helps as well, be it by tapping R2 or just flick the right analogue stick in the opposite direction to make your player drop a should, then move off in the other direction.

Trying to get by players using nothing except normal sprinting is really, really hard in any situation besides when you have a back to a a defender and turn them.

@chiefrocka4real
Exactly. I have a video earlier in this thread using Messi illustrating this exact point. Double tapping has a lot of animations attacked to it, you don’t have to aim away from the defender at all.
 
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