Arsenal Thread

Good Blog post about what is going on with Supporters at the moment, supporters being labelled in one group or another and having words put into their mouths by the media and certain people of 'Stature' connected to the club.

http://www.arsenalvision.co.uk/articles/4220-youre-a-gooner-dont-get-misrepresented.html

He rambles on a bit, but I do agree there is a big grey area and I think most fans want Wenger to do really well, but are just frustrated that we aren't doing that well (On the pitch) and Wengers seemingly stubborn attitude to this. We always seem to be a few players away from a squad of players that can battle for honours.....This is the most frustrating thing, the fact it has been like this for at least the last 4-5 years.
 
bebo said:
The facts are we have players milking the cow and won`t leave. The grey area will expand with bad results that`s for sure ;)
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The grey area will shrink with bad results as more people will be in the Wenger out Brigade ;))

The thing is though I don't think we overpaid any of the players at the time they got their contracts. It's just they have got super shit over that time (Or not lived up to their potential) and know they won't get any better wages anywhere else. I can't blame Wenger 100% that we are in the situation with certain players and their contracts. The only way to avoid it is to have a time machine and see into the future.
 
BobbyBox said:
The grey area will shrink with bad results as more people will be in the Wenger out Brigade ;))

The thing is though I don't think we overpaid any of the players at the time they got their contracts. It's just they have got super shit over that time (Or not lived up to their potential) and know they won't get any better wages anywhere else. I can't blame Wenger 100% that we are in the situation with certain players and their contracts. The only way to avoid it is to have a time machine and see into the future.
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Salaries shouldn't be raised because of potential, but only when that potential is realised. That way we wouldn't have Denilson and Bendtner sticking out to their contracts for so long.

In some cases like Arshavin, Wenger wouldn't know beforehand. But with the overpaid youngsters, it's difficult because it prevents us from paying our superstars anywhere near what they would get elsewhere.
That socialist approach to wage structure has to stop. I hope the lesson has been learned.

The last season when we performed really well I think was 2007-2008, when it seemed we would run away with it, but then we had that horrific injury to Eduardo. Adebayor was the only centre forward for the rest of the season, because Van Persie was injured full time back then.
I still rue the day when things went pear shaped in Birmingham, with Eduardo's injury, the points dropped and Gallas' sulk. That was the last time we had it in ourselves I think.

Things need to change at Arsenal, but for now Wenger will have to prove that signing only Nacho Monreal is enough to retain CL status.
I personally think it's doable, because a 4 point gap to Tottenham is not too hard to overcome.

I think the team will recover and we will get the CL spot come the end of the season, that way Wenger will stay. In one hand is a good thing, but on the other hand it won't be a catalyst to the changes needed.
The problem is that I don't know how many more poor starts to a season we can afford before we miss out on CL football. It's very frustrating when we realise as early as December that we are too far behind to win the league.
 
If Wenger stays its a bad thing IMO. I love the guy but he cant keep making same errors year in year out its like Groundhog Day...
 
Rentboy said:
Salaries shouldn't be raised because of potential, but only when that potential is realised. That way we wouldn't have Denilson and Bendtner sticking out to their contracts for so long.

In some cases like Arshavin, Wenger wouldn't know beforehand. But with the overpaid youngsters, it's difficult because it prevents us from paying our superstars anywhere near what they would get elsewhere.
That socialist approach to wage structure has to stop. I hope the lesson has been learned.

The last season when we performed really well I think was 2007-2008, when it seemed we would run away with it, but then we had that horrific injury to Eduardo. Adebayor was the only centre forward for the rest of the season, because Van Persie was injured full time back then.
I still rue the day when things went pear shaped in Birmingham, with Eduardo's injury, the points dropped and Gallas' sulk. That was the last time we had it in ourselves I think.

Things need to change at Arsenal, but for now Wenger will have to prove that signing only Nacho Monreal is enough to retain CL status.
I personally think it's doable, because a 4 point gap to Tottenham is not too hard to overcome.

I think the team will recover and we will get the CL spot come the end of the season, that way Wenger will stay. In one hand is a good thing, but on the other hand it won't be a catalyst to the changes needed.
The problem is that I don't know how many more poor starts to a season we can afford before we miss out on CL football. It's very frustrating when we realise as early as December that we are too far behind to win the league.
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If you don't raise salaries due to potential then you risk losing those players if they fulfill their potential. I did a whole post a while ago on Bendtner, Denilson and Diaby and what they were actually doing when they were signed up on those contracts and given that money. All three were becoming integral parts of the team and playing a lot of games for us and playing well. If they turned out to be really good players and went off to better teams for Hardly any money, then Wenger would have also got slated completely. It is always a gamble and those players (Diaby more to do with Injury than anything) have not fulfilled their potential, but at the time I don't blame Wenger at all for trying to tie them down. So to beat him with that stick now is not good imo.

But the other stuff I agree with although we haven't won anything for 8 years, it really has been 4-5 years where we have been properly behind the pace, every season I feel we are about 3 players away from having a solid squad of players ready to mount a charge on the title (amongst other trophies) but every season, we stay in the same position and it is beyond frustrating.

I really hope we get 4th but I am not as certain as you that we will, Spurs look very good at the moment, Everton are going to be consistent I feel and Chelsea will regain their composure I think.

So it will be touch and go and If we don't Wenger is the one that needs to answer to why. It has been one of our least injury prone seasons and we are still struggling to get to 4th let alone challenge for the title.

I hope he stays, because as I said I feel we will do worse without him, but I am starting to get a bit weary from it all and he needs to start making some statements and moving forward, it is the right time to start doing it now.
 
Benni said:
its been the right time for years now Bobby
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Not really, It's the right time now, because the stadium is nearly paid up (Apparently) we are renewing financial deals/promotions/sponsors that will bring in much more money every year and we have more money to spend as a result. We have a core of players (except maybe Sagna) that want to be at Arsenal. We have also a great mix of experienced and young players that compliment each other now, which we haven't had for a long time and with our British Contingent all signing up to longer term contracts I think we are in a position where we haven't been for many many years.

What we have to do with this is to get rid of all of the dead wood players (Easier said than done) and find quality replacements, I would say 3 definitely, but see how we are in the Summer. The need for another top striker and a real defensive, strong midfielder is key though and if we get these then I really see us pushing forward. I was hoping we would get them in January, so that was disappointing.

But as I said before.....I have been saying we need a 2-3 players now for so long and now Wenger has no excuses in my mind not to get them. If he doesn't and we are doing worse, then something needs to change.
 
I'm convinced that Arsenal will pass Spurs.
Spur's first team is (perhaps) better than Arsenal's, but Arsenal have a better squad.
IMO Everton pose a bigger problem, but they still are vulnerable on certain positions (Heitinga should never ever play again, he was once again shocking saturday against Benteke, the first goal was maybe the worst defending i ever witnessed, that was not Benteke being good but Heitinga being spectacularly bad): CB, FW and what would happen if Fellaini would get injured (and he is injury prone) ?

I have an off-topic question. I remember that match against Birmingham and the horror tackle on Eduardo. I was also aware that 'something' was wrong with Gallas, but i never quite understood what exactly. Could anybody enlighten me about that...
 
gerd said:
I'm convinced that Arsenal will pass Spurs.
Spur's first team is (perhaps) better than Arsenal's, but Arsenal have a better squad.
IMO Everton pose a bigger problem, but they still are vulnerable on certain positions (Heitinga should never ever play again, he was once again shocking saturday against Benteke, the first goal was maybe the worst defending i ever witnessed, that was not Benteke being good but Heitinga being spectacularly bad): CB, FW and what would happen if Fellaini would get injured (and he is injury prone) ?

I have an off-topic question. I remember that match against Birmingham and the horror tackle on Eduardo. I was also aware that 'something' was wrong with Gallas, but i never quite understood what exactly. Could anybody enlighten me about that...
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I don't think anybody knows really, he was the captain and he seemed like a good one when everything was going well and we were winning and looking good, then that game happened and he broke down etc and turned into one of the worst Captains, he couldn't do his job when things were not going well. He was the Captain at the expense of Gilberto which shocked everybody at the time and it proved to be a bad move by Wenger in hindsight.
 
Gallas went into shock at that game. He was supposedly to get the team in order instead he sat down on the pitch in protest . He wanted the team to push through for his personal glory I felt at the time. Now, I just think the leg break and seeing everyone in disarray he couldn't cope and never recover. He needs a debriefing in epic portion .

How does Spur have a better 1st team? And not a squad . You mean they play longer together and have better chemistry ?
 
I like Arsenal, I like their supporters and I love their manager. I hope you guys come good again because you do everything correctly and are a classy club unlike the Chelsea's of this world.

But I fear for Wenger unless the board give him so money so spend. You are one world class striker and two world class centre backs from being a very, very good team.
 
The problem is: centre-backs are incredibly hard to find at the moment. The only two possible centre-backs I can think of are Hummels and Subotic and they'll not be easy to pick up.
 
True. everyone and their mother wants to sign Hummels, he'll have the choice and freedom to go where he wants (probably Real Madrid or Barcelona then ZZZzzzz)
 
BobbyBox said:
If you don't raise salaries due to potential then you risk losing those players if they fulfill their potential. I did a whole post a while ago on Bendtner, Denilson and Diaby and what they were actually doing when they were signed up on those contracts and given that money. All three were becoming integral parts of the team and playing a lot of games for us and playing well. If they turned out to be really good players and went off to better teams for Hardly any money, then Wenger would have also got slated completely. It is always a gamble and those players (Diaby more to do with Injury than anything) have not fulfilled their potential, but at the time I don't blame Wenger at all for trying to tie them down. So to beat him with that stick now is not good imo.

But the other stuff I agree with although we haven't won anything for 8 years, it really has been 4-5 years where we have been properly behind the pace, every season I feel we are about 3 players away from having a solid squad of players ready to mount a charge on the title (amongst other trophies) but every season, we stay in the same position and it is beyond frustrating.

I really hope we get 4th but I am not as certain as you that we will, Spurs look very good at the moment, Everton are going to be consistent I feel and Chelsea will regain their composure I think.

So it will be touch and go and If we don't Wenger is the one that needs to answer to why. It has been one of our least injury prone seasons and we are still struggling to get to 4th let alone challenge for the title.

I hope he stays, because as I said I feel we will do worse without him, but I am starting to get a bit weary from it all and he needs to start making some statements and moving forward, it is the right time to start doing it now.
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Wenger made some gambles before, most of them worked out fine, a few didn't. But with this last batch of players too much went wrong. If they went on to move to other clubs and turn into world beaters then Wenger would get a lot of stick anyway. But to be very honest I never had much faith in those guys becoming really good.
Maybe it's more down to the players and their professionalism in the end. I never thought Song would have turned into a half decent footballer but he did thanks to Wenger. Now he can enjoy being benched at Barcelona and it looks like he is in the process of Hlebying his career. Or Flaminised? I can't decide which is the best term.

I think this year Arsenal will probably finish ahead of Spurs, if we consider that last year's task was much more challenging. That 12 point gap evaporated.
Now at this point we are only 4 points behind them, and 5 behind Chelsea. We still have a game to play at Spurs though. But overall Arsenal is more used to being up there in the table, whereas Tottenham get nervous or something when push comes to shove. It's just a feeling I have. I hope I'm right!

gerd said:
I'm convinced that Arsenal will pass Spurs.
Spur's first team is (perhaps) better than Arsenal's, but Arsenal have a better squad.
IMO Everton pose a bigger problem, but they still are vulnerable on certain positions (Heitinga should never ever play again, he was once again shocking saturday against Benteke, the first goal was maybe the worst defending i ever witnessed, that was not Benteke being good but Heitinga being spectacularly bad): CB, FW and what would happen if Fellaini would get injured (and he is injury prone) ?

I have an off-topic question. I remember that match against Birmingham and the horror tackle on Eduardo. I was also aware that 'something' was wrong with Gallas, but i never quite understood what exactly. Could anybody enlighten me about that...
Click to expand...

Gallas not only could control the nerves of his teammates after that horrific challenge to a colleague (I'll admit that it was not an easy task), but he became the opposite of a leader after the final whistle. From what I can remember Clichy conceded the most stupid penalty kick ever in injury time. Gallas went storming in the opposite direction of our penalty box instead of hoping for a penalty save. Birmingham equalised 2-2 and then the game ended. Then William Gallas proceeded to sit on the pitch like a spoilt little kid and didn't talk to anybody. The team went to the dressing room and he remained there - instead of trying to lift their spirits, which other captains might have done.

This is only the tip of the iceberg, probably. What happened in the dressing room can only be guessed, but I think there was a lot of finger pointing there. After that the team was clearly shaky for the rest of the season. And then Wenger stripped Gallas of the captaincy and gave it to Fabregas (it was during that same season, if I'm not mistaken).

PS: that Benteke goal was actually funny how he could overtake Heitinga so easily. It reminded me when I was 10 years old and I played against a 8 year old :LOL:
Everton does have a very good team, but I'm hoping they will feel the pressure of competing for those spots and Arsenal hopefuly will have an edge.
 
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As strange as it may sound, Bergkamp didn't make me a Gooner. Henry did. And I'm from the Netherlands.
 
Freddie Ljungberg for me...but afterwards it was Cesc most of all...and Song.
Those two were my favourites.

But it all started with Ljungberg.
 
PLF said:
I think Arsenal owes half its fanbase to Dennis Bergkamp. :P
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I became a Gunner because of Dennis Bergkamp! :D
My favourite ever for his sheer class and grace. And that's saying a lot, cause I watched a great deal of Romario and Ronaldo in my day.

I hope Jack Wilshere will become a reason for future gunners. He is getting better and better. Tonight I was at Wembley and he was immense against Brazil. His passing was amazing, and he did a great deal of carrying the ball forward himself and pressing up the pitch. He won the MOTM award.

Theo was another one who played really well. He created all sorts of problems for the substandard Brazilian fullback (I think it was Adriano).
 
I got hooked on Arsenal because of the Panini sticker album 83. Pictures of the sticker packs still gives a good feeling and makes me remember how happy that little kid was when he got his hand on one. I have always thought Arsenal stood out because of training ground pictures, but I later found out that is not the case, so I really dont know why I ended up with Arsenal...
 
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