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Which players do you think should be improved in WE9 ??

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Lol while reading this I realize many of you have come to your senses! :D

All these players are fixed in my data but I see people only mentioning likes of Kewell.. Vieri, these guys are world class do you know HOW MANY other players I saw who had nowhere near stats they should have in lower teams and lower leagues. 1000 but people don't notice them because they maximum only know their own league and in most cases only their own team which is why you'll come and see Juve fans say Zlatan now and Nurnberg fans say Mintal ;).

Truth is you can count me as fan of every club then :D cuz i notice it all and there's also quite a lot of over-rated players. If I do release it PLF data will have all this fixed.. plus 100 of players who I saw have WRONG weak foot accuracy and 100 who like C. Lucarelli have been given shit FK stats.

And EatonTJ, agree with that. Some players especially from African countries are strong fast as hell but should get 72 for technique or so but these are not there in the game, well you know what they are in data i'm playing.

Every team formation/line up tweaked to real life too :D

All players that needed to be created done so, many positions wrong :D I can't wait till i finish it 100% and play with that PLUS Reefur patch.. OMG I'm so exciteD! :D

Villareal data is quite perfect in my update right now. The appearances, the missing players the likes of Cazorla who had wrong name, under-rated speed and many more. Damn.. I created like 5-6 players for tha team too. Every team has got attention I've given to Villareal though so even if you Frenchies support Istres ;) don't worry about. you're sure to find they play their real tactic, have the players be good at whatever they are in real life ;) and bad at whatever they are in real life and act and LOOK like them with the RIGHT weak foot accuracy and position and everything you found about your team that was wrong in original Konami data will be changed :)

Now I just need to hexedit ML salary for 10 players or so, if anybody knows how to do this and can help me please msg me.

Take care and you all should be excited if you'd seen the amount of hours/realism and PLF knowledge that had gone to this ;) I know I am!! hahaha..

i'm out
 
GLAD to know you gave villarreal a good look PLF!!.
also you must realise this pacth for ps2 an pc..this is absolut GOLD m8..in my opinion , database is the most important thing.. i myself send hours and hours editing players too..
WE original database has a huge mistake, they rate the players ususally according to the team they play..i mean, its very strange, casue the small clubs do have good players too...only not as much as the big clubs..and ni the original database they think if a player plays for , supose cagliari, hes not as good as a player that plays for milan..thats not true..maybe the big clubs have the best players and a lot of great ones..but usually the best players for a small club is also the same level as a regular big player ..
what do you use to rate players??
i use verter! helps me alot..i think although the Football manager database is not perfect(wich is imipossible) its a great database, very realistc..specially casue they have one or more reserchers in every contry...
also you said about santi cazorla..have you seen him played live? hes not about speed.hes more a drible guy..just an observation here..
anyway..i cant wait to see your update..and maybe work with you in the future, as i see we are database freaks..:mrgreen:!
 
Hey yes Bruno everybody who knows me here or worked with me on database knows I'm a data freak.
When creating this update, my purpose was for a random guy who doesn't know anything about a random team to be able to pick them up and play with them in ML and have the players of that team have the same strenths/weaknesses/formation and squad like in real life without the guy knowing it ;)

But as you can see this isn't the case with original Konami data in anyway.

Give me any team you want and I'll tell you in an instant what's WRONG with their data in Konami.

So let me think.. you know what lets talk about a small club, lets say Albacete.

First thing you go there to realize is one of La Liga's FASTEST players and actually quite skilled too not just FAST, Mark Gonzalez (Half-Chillean, half South-african ;) ) has speed of 78!!!!!!!!

Then you go on and notice their main FK taker, PAcheco formerly of Inter has 55 or so for FK stats and Curling, should be more like 82. Also he plays OMF for Albacete but in game he's only CF.

Then you see at least 4 players missing.

Uruguayans Nicolas Olivera (Ex-Sevilla) and Horacio Peralta the 2 most notable ones. And finally you see players who are in squad who should be "FREE AGENTS". And few players with wrong positions. Like a DL who's playing in DMC in this game for some reaosn and doesn't even have DL as position.

Then apperances are all wrong too. Now I don't go to fix every player's apperance as I'm more concerned about actual data/stats and want to cut down on mistakes like C. Lucarelli's/Albert Riera/David Villa/Ugur Yildirim/ and these poeple's FK rather than looks. But since I did fix every player, I also changed their haircolour and style to RIGHT one if they were wrong. and you'd be surprised how many people were blondes for no reason or had no beard when they have facial hair in real life.

To cut a long story short, the data is horrible and I am in my own cocky opinion one of the ONLY people who can give you a REMARKABLE data and as perfect as it can get. Because while everyone notices their own team and league, I am an encyclopedia and know around 150 players right now off top of my head who are under-rated and should be improved..

Jesus Navas of Sevilla

just one example. Do you see anybody mention him here in this thread?? No because we don't have enough Spanish people or they don't post here.. often. Everybody's concerned with whether Raul's shot accuracy should be a bit lower or if C. Ronaldo is under-rated with Robben I mean fine those I'll fix for you in a sec as they're obvious but did you know there are NEDVEDs in other teams/leagues who are amazingly both-footed but have been given a 3 or 4 for weak foot accuracy in this game?? No.. but I've fixed these so once you play with my data.. you'll know you're getting the real deal. You don't have to NOT shoot with that player once it's on his left cuz you can see he has a 7! :D

This is just one example of course. I see wrong things all over.. I see target men being given "Side" special star by Konami and this is another issues. Many Special stars are wrongly assigned. Many past glory players like Marco Simone, Vieri, and basically anybody who was good ONCE but is not so class now has been rated like in their PRIME by Konami.

Finally every youngster in the game except the world reknowned ones like Rooney has 3 or 4 for consistency and conditioning. How is this fair?? This isn't even a stat that improves. All fixed.. now only youngsters who have 3 or 4 for consistency are actually the ones who proved to be inconsistent not someone who's just been promoted to first team and never even touched the ball at senior level yet Konami just handed a 3 or 4 too.

I can't go on enough, this data neeed a lot of WORK!!!! I have spent 6 weeks now trying to perfect the data as I go through every player of every team and every league and now I'm at my last full league of Eredivisie.

I've created a long list of players whom I can publish the list of all over perfect replacements with right potential/salary.

Trust me when you play this, no matter what team you support what league you play in, you'll notice things and be like, "Now it's like real life" and even if you don't post on evo-web. This will make a Getafe fan and a Lens fan in France happy because as they play they see the players who are good at FK in their club are good here.. the ones who have good weak foot accuracy are there, their squads are 100% up to date and everything is like it should be :D

So no one person will be impressed because they won't notice much but everyone from whatever they know themselves will compare and be impressed and so i'll be happy even though I'm doing this for myself and myself ONLY!!!!!!!! lol.. but since many asked to release I just might. I only do this for myself though cuz I hated picking a ML team and finding out that RB who was pretty good with his left as well and can play there has a SHIT weak foot accuracy in game or get a ML with Livorno just to find out your star man, C. Lucarelli has 55 for FK accuracy.

So while data is subjectional in some parts for example whether Henry's shooting should be 90 or 92! Many of it is NOT!!!!! and we CAN make the perfect data by correcting all these mistakes but only someone with amazing knowledge of football and its database can do this WITHOUT the use of direct convertors or FM database tools as I find they over-rate or under-rate players.

And I know Cazorla trust me, you'll be particularly excited to play with Villareal just like every other fan of other clubs will notice their own changes ;) that's just how it works unless someone else has all-around good knowledge of all clubs whom will REALLY appreciate my work because he'll see it ALL! :D and there are a few of you ;)
 
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well thats great to hear m8.. and i am 100% with you..konami is shit when it comes to database..they only care about the big clubs..
guys like G.Rodrigues(villarreal) , D.Pizzarro(usdinese) and 10000 others, are so much wong...
i am also annyed when i go play, evan a friendly macth, than i see horrendius things, like that luccareli FK thing..its sad they dont really care about that part of the ga, wich is one of the most important, if not the second most important after gamplay..
but i dont agree with you about the convertor thing, i think FM has a great database, very fair, and complete, as theres a resercher in every contry frmo every league..and that what we need..no matter what you tell me, i wont trust your judgement about every player in every league, just for the simple fact that its impossible to wacth that many players play..so i think FM helps me alot.. i never use the numbers Verter gives me..but it helps me , to complete my knowlagble about that player.....
and i can trust fm database a lot..ok they have mistakes..but its impossible to have a perfect database..as every person has its onw judgment..and i am not talking about a team sporteer, that thinks hes player is better than the other frommthe other team..its not about that..but every person has its own way of seen the game..so maybe for you , suppose, adrianos shoot power is 94 but for me is 98..so it will never be unanimous..
and i cant belive you have seen every player of the game play a decent number of games to make their jugdment alone, without help..serious..i am not cashing you , not at all..far from it... i am just saying that its nice to have other people thought and than make as average..thats why i look up to FM..usually i edit players by appereance, i look pics in the internet...and stats, i get , at first my knowledge..wich is pretty good i presume, as i wacth all the major european championships(ITA,ESP,ING,HOL,GER) and ARG and BRA , the last one , i go to many games...than after this i look up in FM to see if that team or player were properly took care by the reserchers..cause sometimes, like BRA league data is all mess up..but i can secutre that for the european leagues , at least the first divisions, the data in fm is about 90% correct.. than i make the verter convertion, wich is a bit overrated, and i do my last adjustments..it takes me about 20mim for every player..i get pretty good result..

but it would be wonderfull to one day work with you on that..i see that you got exelent skils. and a huge knowlagble of our beloved game..

also, i was here making some adjustments in my game, what do you think about Cruzeiros FRED? please post your stats for him..i want to compare wiht mine and see a fair configuration for him..
 
this ain't a patch it will be an PARA file that you put in your ISO plus an xps to put on your memory card and for WE8LE for ps2 but I suppose it can be converted for PES4 as well.

Bruno, I'm a big FM fan myself and always have been (I used to live, breath CM ;) )and yes I agree that it has the BEST research in any football (Management or non-management) I've ever seen. And to have a top management game like that, honestly you have to have great data because in management stats are much more important than when you're actually using the players to shoot/move. But while it's the best it AINT perfect. Like you said some leagues especially have researches who seem not to know their stuff and hand out stats just randomly quite like Konami do.

I have a saying that goes like this: "The Less you know, the less you notice and the less it bothers you". This is a saying because I notice MANY wrong stats even in FM which can possibly ruin the league for me and which is why I play in leagues I have no knowledge in.

I'll give you a quick example, Benjamin Huggel big guy some of you might have seen in Euro 2004. He's built like a brick wall, very strong and plays for Basel and Swiss NT. In FM2005 the one data that I'd rather trust if I didn't have my own data, he has 7 for balance and 7 for strength!!

I'm just saying it HAS mistakes but you're right it's the best one by FAR and I do agree that perhaps even MORE than 90% of it is correct lets say 93% for sake of example and how do I know that because it has given similar stats to what I'd give :D for those 93%

Now let me also reiterate, perhaps I wasn't clear on this. I do NOT use any FM-convertors or Vartar or anything.. I change stats manually when necessary and some are actually quiet well done by Konami especially in bigger teams BUT I do have access to FM database in the editor to look at it in case I'm not familiar enough with a player to judge what stats he should get and so i'm not alone. ;) I also have a team of 9 other people working with me on this. I have my resources but use them wisely and not all the time ;), only when needed and when I have not watched that certain player enough times to give fair stats. For example when creating players there were many 18 year olds whom even I knew not much about or had watched, so What did I do? Opened their database in CM and gathered some info and gave them roughly correct stats.

Also like I said my aim was to make those data right that are NON-subjective. So yes we'll have different views on what Forlan's shooting accuracy/power should be but not by far if we know our football ;) and that is no problem to me, people will always have different opinions but that is not point of this data.

My problem is seeing Nigel Quashie who's brown as a BLACK person. Seeing Robert Earnshaw as a bald black person. Seeing a nice attacking dribbling MR as a CB in the database and all those players with wrong foot , wrong foot accuracy and FK stats and position.

You see some things are subjective but most are not. There are 100 of wrong height/weight/skin colour and just to give you an idea, have a look here, this is about 20% of what I've fixed regarding to height mistakes in data. Because at one point I figured there is too many to write down and then post in that thread so I just posted one or two of what I remembered but fixed all in the file :D

http://www.pesfan.com/bulletin/showthread.php?t=50315&page=5&pp=15

Hell the new Makelele, Rio Mavuba is 170 in real life but 10cm TALLER!!!!!! in game which can make real difference. Even some players at top clubs like Louis Saha have wrong height. He's 10 cm short in game! Now you see the opposite lol ;)

Point is things like this CAN'T be subjectional and we're fixing it.

I'd say 5 years ago I knew about 1/4th of what I know now, Bruno and so I'd regard FM database back then CM of course very highly and still do but now i'm in a spot where FM DAta which is 100 times better than any other game I've seen is NOT good enough for me and sometimes I WISH i was a data researcher. I simply see too many non-subjectional wrong stats/position in there and on the 93% that I say they're good at we almost always AGREE with each other ;) and that's how I know I'm in tip top shape :lmao: and so is FM. But i'm saying this data will even be more accurate than FM's because in this one, Huggel will have more correct stats than he will in FM!! Of course our job is a lot easier as this game has 120 clubs or so while FM has 12000000 but at least in the clubs we have, my knowledge and data will even exceed FM's and for whatever I'm not sure, I will use that so no worries.

Finally, I have much more to say especially about the most important thing that motivated me about doing this data and it was what you mentioned earlier, people have NOT being rated INIDIVIDUALLY. I'll talk about this one in next post as this is getting quite long but this is main problem. THey've been rated not by own performance but by which team they're in which is ridiculous!
 
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thats my point m8..they have been rated by the team..not individually..HUGE MISTAKE !

also this: "The Less you know, the less you notice and the less it bothers you"
this is the best sentence ive heard to describle my feeling regarding WE database..
its almost impossible for me to play a full macth when i go to try two new teams..i aways, see something wrong, the the anchor player of that team, i mean anchor, for the player that made me pick that team in the first place..than i aways have to go back to the editor. :D..
just one liitle exemple of the high thing, Forlan is a 172cm in the game, and this one is tricky, unlees youve seen him personaly, you will think hes 172...mainly becasue 90% of the web site list him as 172, evan Man UTD oficial site, but actually hes 180cm, i know this for 2 reasons..first i saw him very closely one time, and second casue in villarreal oficical site, they corrected and put 180cm..this is just on little of the 1000000000000000000000 mistakes of the origianl database..
man i wish i could help you..are you assinging boots for players?? maybe i could do that for you?
i have a great bootpack, wich has more boots than anyother bootpack(i can make nike vapor, umbro(terry, deco), lotto (cafu) in one editable boot, than i have nike 90editable for the second , and than 3 predators(blue, gray and black) , 2 F50+(black/blue and white,gold) and diadora(totti) and mizuno black) with this i have covered 75% of the boots , the only i miss is pumas...but its looking very good...
so maybe if you want i could do the assingment in your data..be sure i would do as perfect as it can be , for ALL the players..i would serach , search and search again...

this database of your will definatly rock..just by talking to you, i notice youre have a lot o knowlagble!..

about mark gonzales, funny, this is one of the guys i awayas modify, every single WE new version i get!:mrgreen:! hes quick as hell, and that 78 is just and onfece to him!
my good, i cant wait to play your database..it will be nice to go and pick whatever team,and know it will be all correct!!:D!!

also please give your stats for FRED(cruzeiro)
 
Hey Bruno, looks like we've got more in common with each other than I originally thought ;)

Basically I'm a data freak and that sentence truly tells my feelings about every soccer game I feel and nowadays even FM in some cases :( because I simply know TOO MUCH for my own good lol.

I have only watched Fred of Cruzeiro twice Bruno and don't feel I'm in a position to give accurate stats as I can with other players. But man.. what a talent :D if you've watched him you know what I mean. He seems to be very well rounded too, he has speed, good at heading/jumping, great finisher but not only just a finisher but also a good player and by that I mean some forward are better PLAYERS than they are FINISHERs.

Jon Dahl Tomassson, Del Piero, Zlatan are just 3 examples there's thousands more while Inzaghi, Gilardino, Forlan are better finishers than players.

Fred seems to be both ;) hahhaa..

As for joining the team, I'm rather cautious with hiring people for PLF Data project just because I want things to be perfect and not because I might release but because if it's not it won't satisfy PLF himself ;) lol. This is the whole reason I'm doing this, I want perfect stats every team and player I look for and can buy in ML rather than wrong ones all over.

By the way Forlan is 180cm in MY Option file.. if you want to check, i'll send you. The thing you said about height is true, sometimes, but rather rarely, many sites have DIFFEERNT height in those cases I go with official ones. Another example is Martins, some say he's 170cm while some say 177cm. How do I spot these, well I even have a good sense of how tall they are and when I saw Forlan is 172! I thought hey this is another one of those fishy ones.. he looks a bit taller than that to me. So I dig up the info and also saw 180 in few places so stuck with that since it made sense more. ;)

Now back to the bootpack stuff, oh yea as I was saying I'm rather cautious with having people just join the team cuz I need perfection and even the ones on the team don't directly edit STATS for me no... rather they give me reports AFTER having reviewed me file for their league and usually come with 1 or 2 things they don't agree with lol and these are very knowledgeable people so again the fact that I know them and FM agree with me I know i'm in top-shape. Another thing they helped me with a bit was formation and lineups. I get to watch Bundesliga/Eredivisie a little less than the other 4 top leagues but still I'd say I know more than 10 times average fan but it probably won't be as perfect as my EPL/French league data is.

Maybe if you feel confident in your knowledge as well which I seem to think you are ;) we can talk on MSN or via email : "sinashgh@yahoo.com" and then I can have you helping me with a few things about La Liga or to get a second opinion rather as I'm done with it, perhaps there is something about formation of one team like an arrow that you don't think is like that since I think you've watched more La Liga than me :). So yes after we talk and I see your knowledge which I'm already hoping you're good, you can be a part of the team and we'll talk about bootpacks later. There is somebody who already contacted me, pk9 and asked to let him do the bootpack stuff for this patch if you wanna call it and how he wants to give players varied boots. Since I know NOTHING about boots and who wears what or how they should be in game I said yes to him but if you want we can work something out so you can apply your boot knowledge too :)

To me data is most important thing and after having licensed kits, it's the most important one. To put it in other words I'd rather play reefur 0.9 + PLF data than

Reefur 1.0 + EVEN NEW commentary! Lol..

so can you imagine how excited I am to be nearly finished work and gettin ready for almost 2 months of magic with WE8LE for the first time with PERFECT Patch of REefur 1.0 and Perfect Data of myself :D lol.. I'm droolin oh yea and thanks to BeardyMagic, plus NEW COMMENTARY.

In next post I'll talk about what I wanted to say about players being rated by team/league rather than individually as that's a long article on its own.

Take care and anybody who reads this and thinks they can help me with HEXEDITING a few player's ML salary, I'd appreciate it. Reefur is supposed to teach me how to do it but he's quite busy with patch and other things in life right now and it's hard for me to get hold of him, so if anybody else thinks they can help with this or anything else talk to me.

Also I've had few more people yesterday before I even post these msgs in this topic, pm me and tell me they want a COPY of data ;) (you know who you are ;) ) if I don't release and so yes you guys will get it even if I dont release.

Looks like after all we have more people who care about data than I originally thought and this makes me feel more at home :)

Take care guys
 
ok m8..i got your msn..we talk there than..
also pk9 is definatly the right man to do the boot assigment..i was just think about a more consistent boot pack, you know, that we could have more than 2 editables and 7 non editable boots..
thats why i made this 3 in 1 boot..its far from perfect..the only boot that has all detail is nike vapor, but the otehr ones look goo ingame too..the look like the real ones from any playing camera..thats whats matter too me..too see the player looking and acting like the real life counterpart..!
please send me a copy of you data..i would be more than happy to test it..and i am sure i would enjoy!
 
oh about fred , i think you got the eye man...you descrebed him, almost as i would..and ive seen him play since he and i was 16 years old..i played with him at America, sadly i couldnt turn into a pro ..:(..its ok..i am over it now....anyway, i was a golie(iam 173cm, i guess thats why things didnt work out for me) ..and you should see how hard was to keep that guy out of the net! FUCK!
at 16 his Shoot was already, as powerfull as any pro palyer...you can bet this guy will become a Adriano stile of player..he just loves to shoot...and i bet that after he tranfer to europe(in a few months i guess) he will build up his body, just like every brazilian player..and than youll see..i am betting big time in him..hes such a great player and great person to..unlike most of nowdays DIVAS..

GO FRED!
 
stats for FRED:
if you think its high , casue you ve seen him playing and you thing its wrong its OK!!!!much OK!but if you think is too high, just cause he plays for cruzeiro(if you think that, you think just like konami..a pleyer rated by the team..WRONG!)
Offence: 89
Defence: 41
Balance: 85
Acceler: 86
Pace: 82
Response: 83
Dribble A: 83
Dribble S: 78
Pass A: 71
Pass S: 77
Long P A: 68
Long P S: 74
Shoot A: 89
Shoot P: 90
Shoot T: 87(i guess thi is the ability to shoot from dificult positions rihgt?)
FK: 79
Curve: 66
Heading: 83
Jumping: 80
Techinic: 82
Off Agree: 88
Consistence: 7
GK: 50
Team work: 71
Weak foot A: 7
Weak foot F: 6
 
I don't know if the last sentence was targeted towards me? The one where if you think it's too high cuz he plays for Cruzeiro but if it was I totally agree and you know me ;) It doesn't matter what team you play for. Players should be rated individually like I've done with them not by what team they play for. I'll tell you why.

Tell me this honestly, how many times have you guys been surfing around in PES/WE sites and see threads like, "Anybody got UPDATED stats for X"?? (X being the new signing of a big club like Barcelona or Man Utd). Well this just shows STUPIDITY of people. I saw it with Maxi Lopez, saw it with Djemba Djemba when they got him, saw it with Drogba and lots of other places and deep down I :lmao: because these people are as dumb as Konami when it comes down to data.

Don't you get it? A player's stats do NOT improve within a week when he's a RIVER Plate player and then suddenly becomes a Barcelona player. He's the SAME player he was and had Konami spent enough time rating them individidually rather than where they play for, they would've got FAIR stats that wouldn't need changing. But sadly we all know this isn't true.

Remember that Mark Gonzalez example??? Well had he been a Real Madrid or AC Milan player, he would have got 95 for speed and everything else at least in 80's. As it turns out he doesn't have anything over 80 and he can't be FAST either because he plays at a weaker club :lmao:

This is where Konami's stupidity gets me. What they could have at least done was to make players at weaker clubs TECHNICALLY less superior but at least give them their right PHYSICAL stats like Stamina and Speed but they didn't. Many Martins type fast players (Mostly AFricans in Dutch league, French league) are only given 82 or 83 for TOP Speed and acceleration in the game. Yet when they move to a bigger club Eto'o did suddenly their speed goes +10 in less than a month/week or whatever.

This is Konami's BIGGEST Flaw and one that Bruno pointed out in his first post here which made me have a good impression of his knowledge/smartness in this matter. I repeat playes should be rated only by their OWN level of performance/ability and not by club/league they're in.

And this is EXACTLY what I've done with my data. Every player is changed (if not good already) in stats that NEEDED to be changed.

I've changed over:

- 100 players who are LEFT-footed in real life but have been ignored and given the standard RIGHT-foot. Many were also right-footed wrongly of course but not as many.

- 70 players with Good - Excellent FK stats that had been ignored by Konami. This is another part that gets me. As we all know every team in the top European leagues no matter how weak and in fact in even second divisions of Spain, France, Italy, England, Germany have at least one player who can take a FK. He doesn't have to be a FK master but he's good enough to score or at least get close from them every once in a while. In most cases however there's at least 2 of them and Top European clubs have 4-5 in their FIRST team sometimes lol. Now the top clubs are good again once again regarding this FK matter.. but is Konami stupid enough to BLINDLY I repeat this is a crime.. to BLINDLY give EVERY player at a club like Ajaccio 50-60 for FK Accuracy leaving you with ZERO real takers if you start a ML with them!!!

Answer is YES They are.. or they simply don't CARE enough. Well turns out they were wrong, Abdesalam Ouaddah the Algerian ponytailed CM of Ajaccio not only is a good technical player (should have descent technique passing which he doesn't :roll: ) but can also take a very good FK. A 84 would be fair. And it doesn't end there.. as expected they have 3 other players who can take descent FK and Corner kicks and will do from time to time when Abdeslam is not present on pitch and they've been given a realistic FK value by me too, a 75 for one particular player.

Now you see Ajaccio is just one example. There are many other clubs who have the same condition and NOT just with FK stat by with EVERY stat.

AFter all this time working on data, I now sincerely believe that Konami spent 10 mins on lower teams researching and basically just decided EVERY player should get between 60-70 without any specialization. But you seee I love specialization and I want it the same way it is in REAL LIFE.

Every team has players who are BAD with weak foot like a tall striker who's shit with left-foot and has been given a 3 by me but unnoticed by Konami's overpaid useless researchers while also having good two-footed players which again Konami have missed out on unless your name is Nedved, Zidane or something high calibre like that.

I can go on and on about this for every stat of course but it's more tiring typing all this than working on actual data which I know will be a good investment because it can finally provide me with the ML I've DREAMED of with no wrong stats and as correct as ONE can get!

IT doesn't end there.. as it turns out players at crap clubs also ALLLLL have LOW TEAMWORK and WEAK mentality. COmpletely stupid yet again. IF anything those weaker teams are less superior technically but through team-work and belief we've seen teams like Greece or AZ do very well yet in the game, that's the way they DIFERENTIATE between good and bad clubs. Because they don't want to put the time to get every player right which will ultimately result in AC Milan still being stronger than Ajaccio but for the RIGHT reasons and in the RIGHT stats rather than by Ajaccio's ROY Keane being given 65 for MENTALITY and TEAMWORK just because he plays for a crap club ](*,)

Anyways I can prove that my data is best and talk about whatever aspects anybody wants to but I think it's best if people who really care about data and don't want all those 100000 mistakes in there to just TRUST ME. and TRUST MY knowledge and ability and it won't let you down. I promise you it will be the BEST DATA you've EVER played with in your PES/WE game history.

I know this because every patch that's been out so far for any of those games that HAS touched data has in fact made it WORSE. And this is why I'd rather play with Konami Data rather than any patches/anyone else's IF I didnt have PLF Data.

Reason for this is those patchmakers who have altered stats in previous times have had something in common with Konami. I'll tell you what that is.. their main job is not doing DATA. THey were PATCH makers.. who had a million things to do to get perfect patch and data was just one of the 1/100 things they had to do or at max they had a person assigned to data but he was not a very knowledgable person and gave better stats to his OWN team or touched stats that shouldn't have been at big clubs making them worse than Konami's while not noticing all their mistakes at lower clubs. Do you honestly think they had the time to spend 6 weeks JUST on data going through EVERY player making sure he has right stuff/apperance/position.

Answer is NO and even if they had the time.

They did NOT have PLF knowledge, there is very few people that do and I don't think many 18-19 year olds do anyways. If some people can compete with me it's either they're real life job ;) and they're in their 50's and call themselves SOCCER ANALYSTSTS or they're in their 20's but haven't made patches like our boy DeniroBob from PES4 ML thread ;) Great chap and he knows his $hit, and it will be people like him whom I think will open up my file and say "THANK YOU PLF, Thank you soooo much" because they'll notice everything while everyone else will notice improvements in realism of their own team or league max.

This is why I KNOW we have not had Data this good because nobody has the KNOWLEDGE OR the time and a combination of those which I've had thank to summer time and being PLF ;) has given me the opportunity to create this data which I'll hate to say good bye to if I have to when WE9 comes out :(

More of my thoughts on Fred and your evaluation of him in next post... for now post replies to what I've said here.
 
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man youre really getting me fired up!!
i think after your pacth this will be a hole new game for me..a game with 120 teams..not a 25 teams game like it is now..i woundt dare to play with Nantes or evan Palermo(wich is pretty good) in konamis default roster...thats becasue i would be so dissapointed to get in the formation menu and find out that my fastest player isnt fast, my best FKer isnt any good..
i will just enjoy WE after your database like it should..or maybe like a person who doesnt know anything about real football would..i NEED it to be perfect!! its a feeling of being covered..you know what i am saying? i need to know that if sunddly i wanna play with damn Hannover, i will have ecxacly the same roster and payers stats and apperances, that i would see in a real game..its like, one thing that really get on me, is when i am wachtin a real game, afeter its over i aways throw a WE game with the same teams...and than i really get dissapointed , to see that the data is tottaly CRAP!!
perhaps konami should hire people like you or me or evan others(i bet there are people out in this world who would love to do that for free! I WOULD! ...anyway my friend..i that thing i said wasnt towards you..and that thing you said about maxi and ohters is just the way i aways felt about any football game..its just stupid how a player grows his abilities when tehy transfer from clubs..evan in FM that occour a bit..not much..but also happens..

when r you gonna be online in MSN? please get in touch, brunnoce@hotmail.com
i really wanna try your data, evan though that is gonna cost all boots assigments and apperances changes i made..do ytou know any way i could mix it? i dontthink its possible..but no problem..i BET your data will be well worth to start all over again!
 
brunnoce said:
man youre really getting me fired up!!
i think after your pacth this will be a hole new game for me..a game with 120 teams..not a 25 teams game like it is now..i woundt dare to play with Nantes or evan Palermo(wich is pretty good) in konamis default roster...thats becasue i would be so dissapointed to get in the formation menu and find out that my fastest player isnt fast, my best FKer isnt any good..
i will just enjoy WE after your database like it should..or maybe like a person who doesnt know anything about real football would..i NEED it to be perfect!! its a feeling of being covered..you know what i am saying? i need to know that if sunddly i wanna play with damn Hannover, i will have ecxacly the same roster and payers stats and apperances, that i would see in a real game..its like, one thing that really get on me, is when i am wachtin a real game, afeter its over i aways throw a WE game with the same teams...and than i really get dissapointed , to see that the data is tottaly CRAP!!
perhaps konami should hire people like you or me or evan others(i bet there are people out in this world who would love to do that for free! I WOULD! ...anyway my friend..i that thing i said wasnt towards you..and that thing you said about maxi and ohters is just the way i aways felt about any football game..its just stupid how a player grows his abilities when tehy transfer from clubs..evan in FM that occour a bit..not much..but also happens..

when r you gonna be online in MSN? please get in touch, brunnoce@hotmail.com
i really wanna try your data, evan though that is gonna cost all boots assigments and apperances changes i made..do ytou know any way i could mix it? i dontthink its possible..but no problem..i BET your data will be well worth to start all over again!
Click to expand...

Lol man you sound just like me. Hahah we were a set of regulars on PES4 ML thread and then one day I just couldn't take this data anymore so I told them all that I'm taking a break from having ML till I fix up this data once and for all and it's been 7 weeks now.

But after this I know I can pick ANY team and face real teams and formations with their real FK taker/CK taker which makes great effect as well. Because CPU makes whoever has that option in formation do it so if the option file is wrong and has it on some player with 56 accuracy the CPU will take it with those.

After this I know I can pick ANY Squad and have all real stats :D

You should be excited man lol.. me and 2 dozen other people have been excited about this ever since they asked me and I said FINE! Lets do it so we can finally enjoy ML because WE8LE is a great game and with right data and great patch like we have coming up from Reefur this will be amazing. I can't wait till I'm done and I hope I don't run into any problems because I AM a Computer Newb so I could always run into a problem but I just know my data.

I see you haven't added me on MSN cuz I went on and didn't get that"has added you " but i'll add you its okay.

it's "sinashgh" that's it to add me.

I'll get on sometime but in general I ain't on much. so email or pm more.

Also if you feel confident about your La Liga knowledge, perhaps you can look over afew things for me like a couple formations and etc. we'll talk later.

I'm out
 
PLF i think am going to fall in love with you :P hahahah !: P

I dont post in this forum so often because i never saw a topic realted to stats and other stuff related to it so i thought of posting a topic related to this subject.

I agree with you and Bruno 100000000000000000000000000 %, it all makes sense.
Why dont you both apply for jobs at Konami !

and about rating individaully i realized somthing else also, they have not researched all leagues prorperly, you can see players in the english premier league rated indivudally regardelss of their club, like fulham for example, they have good players and reflect their abilities as a person. Whereas if you look at the Serie A, teams like Palermo have really great players in real life (like Toni, Corini, Santana, Zauli and Grosso). They all are rated like crap.

There is also something when rating young players. They dont rate them properly, for example Bojinov is really underrated, but sometimes when i thinok of it i say maybe they have done this for the sake of the master league so that you can get those players and get them to develop. (what do you guys think about this ?? )

In the previous winning elevens(mostly Winning elven 2000 U-23) on the PS1, i would have to say that the players were rated individaully ( not all but almost all ) . PLayers like Aghahowa and Campos( who as a keeper had good stats for a winger:P ) Even players from Saudia Arabia had fairly rated stats which reflet their abilities as i have seen them play irl. Teams like Ukraine, Morroco, NIgeria, Chile etc. had players who play for lower leagues but had individaully rated stats.
But this might also bring up a point, that at the old wining eleven's they didnt much care about the clubs so they had time to rate the national teams in more detail, so they were able to rate them individually ??

So what you guys say is correct, that they dont rate yje teams proeperly and look at the lower clubs for 10 mins and shrug them off and go to the next. So, in the next winning eleven they should have sent team researchers to every lague and rate them sensibly and hope they have done so and not make WE9 a dissapointment regarding the stats issue.

anyone who disagree's is free to say.
 
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PLF, when you release your option file, I'll be happy to give you an opinion in my "special field" (river, boca, and south american national teams). Of course I can give you a hand with any information you want about them, or any other argentinian team (I've created the arg league).
 
Hi people.

Yes Zygalski I mentioned that if I do release it'll be a option file and a PARA you put in your ISO to keep the stats in ML and everything :)

@Inter, you're the only Bahraini guy I like lol ;)
Yes dude I KNOW I'm 100% right. What I've done makes SENSE. The fact that crappier teams have even less TEAMWORK and MENTALITY just tells you how dumb Konami are.

Their captains in real life have also been given a standard 67 for lets say mentality and teamwork in many cases where if you know the guy he's the carbon copy of Roy Keane but in lets say FC Utrecht.

The thing is though like I said, the less you KNOW , the less you NOTICE and the less it BOTHERS you. You'll see people here who won't KNOW all these mistakes by Konami and are fine iwth original data cuz they don't know much but if you want a real ML Expeience where you want to pick an unknown team to YOU for fun which is a great thing to do and I urge everyone to try it. Try a league you haven't with a team you don't know much about. Then you have to LEARN your players strenths and weaknesses and design a tactic based on that and buy cover where you're short ;). This was my dream to get it sorted for myself and everyone else because no matter what team you picked before, their data did NOT reflect real life. EVerything from speed to FOOT to height to body type, weak foot accuracy, consistency and conditioning and special stars and POSITION were wrong.

I mean data is so bad at TIMES that I see a Right winger in real life who's quite good goin forward and descent dribbling and etc. I go to PES and try to edit him and find out he's a CB in the game and a CB only. And guess what he has 59 for dribbling and 70 top speed and ATTACK 52 DEFENCE 76.

Basically he's a TOTALLY different player lol.. but with that guy's name. Now this is an obscure player in Bastia and if you don't know this.. you won't notice it! I hope I'm making sense here. :D

Let me put it this way i HATE wrong data and wish to eliminate it.

Also Inter_211 , I posted quite a lot of info last night as Bruno kept me on fire as it'd been quite a while I hadn't discussed PLF Data publicly because I didn't want to get people's hopes up and then not release or so but please go back and read EVERY post of mine in this thread. I talk about how every under 19 is UNFAIRLY given consistency/conditioning of 3 or 4. This means basically for most of them before they even START their career, they're decided as INCONSISTENT or have bad NATURAL FITNESS (conditioning). How is this fair??? Especially since these 2 stats and agility don't improve and RESPONSE barely does???

So In this file.. you'll see most under 19's whom haven't realy played much pro football yet get the standard 5 and 5 for consistency and conditioning they deserve. And then I specialize yet again ;) if they have proven consistent they get more and if not.. there are some youngsters with 4 cuz they've PROVEN inconsitent not just given stereotypically lol.

So I urge ANYBODY Who's interested in PLF Data to please read ALL my posts FULLY in this thread. I know it's a big task as it's quite a lot and I had hard time writing it but there is a lot of info in there and I've almost discussed ALL The wrong things with the game including youngsters, Inter211.

I even talked about how badly designed formations/too much arrows and bad starting line up that we're given with Original Konami data and many other option files/patches we get affect the game and make it too easy and LESS realistic. All that fixed too.

@Gergerger, get in contact with me and If I'm on MSN we'll talk.

I have a long word document of list of players to create and usually there's 6 players per club max with some like Villareal only needing 2 new ones and some none like REal Madrid but with Boca and River my list is close to 12-13 people! And I don't think I'm gonna put the effort in like I have with EVERY other player and LEAGUE to get them perfect too :(

REeason is gergerger, I wanna go play the game too and I KNOW I won't use Boca/River/Cruzeiro in my ML so spending almost 30 mins on each team.. will cost me a lot of time that WILL NOT be a goood investment.

But yeah get in touch with me.. and I'll fix some major stuff if I haven't already ;) trust me I even know Argentina and have Rodrigo Palacios ready for you to go in Boca ;) and we'll talk about it or maybe you can help with it.

I'd also like South American national teams lineup/formation so maybe i'll talk to you about that though I quite know and have fixed that too but I realize there's a few playes I have to CREATE for Colombia. Sutto, and 2 strikers and maybe more.

Take care guys!
 
PLF, I am looking so forward to your data release. It sounds like top stuff.

I'm just gonna list players I can think of at the moment, though I'm sure I'm gonna forget loads.

Underrated:
Alexander Frei.
Forlan
Lucarelli
Robinho
Essien
M. Diarra
Mazure
Chamakh
Rothen has a great cross on him.
Andy Johnson
Gary Neville (steady right back for years, good crosser of the ball for us)
Darren Fletcher
Yakubu
Pirlo
Xavi
Sergio Ramos
Park Ji-Sung
Super Luca Toni
Regueiro
Fred of Corinthians
F. Inzaghi's response should be quite high.
Giuseppe Rossi (this guy is awesome, but I'm biased, but seriously, I've watched him a lot this season, he's a very good finisher)
Kromkamp
J. Mathijsen
Landzaat
Romeo Castelen
The Kalou brothers
Miguel of Benfica
D. Carvalho
Ricardo Oliveira
Kuyt

Overrated:
Alan Smith (shooting wise)
Kewell (his stats are unrealistic for even Kewell at Leeds)
Cisse's heading stats are quite high, imo.

That's only some, I'll edit my post if I can think of more.

Good stuff here, I'm out.
 
What you said are pretty correct. All are done already though as quite obvious.

Giuseppe Rossi had to be created for Man Utd too because he wasn't in WE8LE for some reason but was in PES4.

He's quality trust me and has great potential in my update too ;)

Anyways these are all obvoius you don't have to worry about him. Plus Inzaghi and Vieri and most of these players need to have stats lowered but I don't know why you didn't mention him but mentioned his response should be higher.

Anyways it doesn't matter, I don't need any guides on these things. Now I just need time to finish this thing so we can have at least one heavenly month of WE8LE before WE9 comes out! :D
 
That's cool man. Rossi looks amazing. I really hope he gets a chance next season, but with Saha, Smith, Van the Man, Rooney and maybe a returning Solskjaer, he may not get a chance.

I think of Inzaghi as a proper goal poacher. That's why his response should be higher imo, but it's not a major thing. He'll still score goals, lol. On second thoughts, I do agree that Inzaghi does deserve to have lower stats.

It's gonna be good though. I've been playing the fantastic French Evo patch v2, but that was in anticipation of Reefur 1.0 and your data. This is gonna kick arse.
 
I imported the data to my PARA but something went wrong in the process. I lost my tactical work. I also lost the team names, player numbers...

Anyone knows if this happens everytime you update the para file? I'm sorry I posted this here, in fact I was going to post a message with info about s.american national teams when I realized I lost that work :lmao:
 
Yeah don't worry about that gergerger lol.. what a name! ;)

The PARA does NOT carry formation stuff and a few other things perhaps number is one of them.

But if you put the PARA in ISO and same XPS in your memory card all will be fine! :)
 
PLF, if you can read spanish, this is what I am modifying in my game. I wrote it in an argentinian forum, it's too long to traslate it now, maybe I will do it tomorrow. Although long, this is a brief explanation of what I am doing with the game:

bla bla bla
(Text traslated in my next post)
 
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I don't understand Spanish at all but what are you saying? are you making an update too or do you want to help me with my file?
 
Just wanted to share some ideas i have had, I won't release any of this.
Alright, I will traslate it:

By default, players in the attacking side have a tendency to supperpose each others positions once you pass the midfield line. Offensive midfielders (OMF) supperpose in the same line as forwards (CF), defensive midfielders (DMF) reach permanent OMF positions, side midfielders (SMF) usually run all the way to the end line without anyone defending there, and to make things worst, they will stay there, so you don't count on them to elaborate more elaborated maneuvers other than giving them the ball while they run so they can make a cross.

When the attacking side loses the ball, the other team does the same thing their opponent did in the first time (they go forwards), and we get this feeling of a constant counter attack. This is just not the way teams move. Did I say constant counter attack? here's what happens: the spaces left by the attacking team leaves you almost no other better choice than to play the ball vertically, since your own field is crowded, and the other team has their players in ridiculous positions.

Now, for another problem. Different scenario: you have a goal kick/you have the ball in your own side/you pass it backwards/etc. Your central back. Opponent's team (forwards AND midfielders) will go after you in your own field, that's unreal as well. This is where I started my work.

First thing to chang is: team pressure (instance where the whole team participates in defending) begins in their own field (after the midfield line). Here I realized that, no matter how I tried to modify that with the defensive arrows and stuff, that wasn't the problem. The problem was the players positions.

What I do, basically, is to place the lines as backwards as I can (the forwards in the edge where they become midfielders, midfielders where they become defenders, and defenders in the very edge), occupying the whole pitch horizontally. For example, midfield with 2 SMF(S), 1 DMF(D), 1 CMF(C), and 1 OMF(O), where the OMF's back relies on the DMF:

S---D-O--C---S

...now, the reason for not doing this...

-----O--------
S---D---C----S

... is because I don't need to. First of all, if I place the OMF further in the pitch, he will bring me the same problems I had with the old formations. The problem with pes is that if you place a player ahead of the other:

---O---
-S-D-S-

when O goes forwards, D will vertically occupy O's place, causing this "domino effect" I'm talking about. In the line system, O can go forwards and D will still be a D (DMF).

With these positions (backwards in the field) the team applies an intelligent pressure (as a compact group). The problem now is how come a flat and defensively posicionated formation be dynamic and aggresive at the same time.

Firstly, the main advantage of my modification is that the formation constantly breaks within the match but the order remains. It breakes thanks to this:

* Player stats for occupying defensive or offensive position (I really don't trust this).
* His role (whether he's a DMF, CMF, etc)
* His attacking arrows
* His defensive arrows

A little word about defensive arrows: it has no effect when the player is situated before the line of the ball. If the ball is played beyond his position, that's when the defensive arrows has effect. So using a short arrow for forwards won't stop them from chasing your CBT's, only positioning will do it the way you want it.

For the sidebacks to effectively defend their sector, appart from joining attack, you must consider something first: if the playing standing there is really a sideback (it includes proyection) or actually more of a back defender defending the side. How many sidebacks really go to attack? But the real problem is that sidebacks have a strange tendency to forget defending, leaving the famouse great gap in the flanks. So first, identify your player (just watch his offensive and defensive stats), then decide where to leave him as a sideback (example: Roberto Carlos) or make him a CBT and put him wide open in his position (examples: Heinze or Coloccini, they play by the sides in 4 men defense and their main mission is to defend). If you want your side CBT to go up, assign him an attackig arrow. He will go up, but not to far. And he will defend his sector much better. There is also another advantage for this but I just can't find the words in english. :P

Attacking arrows: you gotta be carefull here with the arrow that points totally forwards. This provoques your player to make a run, and make an unwanted tactical superposition. Think that, generally, teams only have 1 or 2 players with the mission of dashing forwards by surprise without ball posession.

So, your team is defending and your CBT recovers the ball. You will find that most of your teammates are in your own field, so you will have to think it twice before passing the ball forwards in the old fashion "constante counter attack way", just do it and you will find that the last man you passed the ball to is all alone, like it happens in reality. To make things worst, the other team doesn't have supperpoused offensive players anymore and it is easier for them to assume defensive positions. Sure, you can still make an effective counterattack, but you will think it twice. You will surely prefer to start passing the ball while your teams makes the transition from defense to attack. This whole bunch of things give the game an entirely different flow, it gets a lot more tactical, teams defend better, as they are more compact, make real transition from attack to defend, from defense to attack, your defenders will have more space to move without being chased (they do get chased, but not like before), a lot of things.

One last comment: If WE pitched seemed too small for you, with this modifications you will realize that the problem wasn't the pitch size, but the distribution of the players in it.

I'm still experimenting and trying things, mostly regarding attacking arrow keys. I think I have it 98% the way I wanted it to be, there is always room for more variations.

Well, I finished. I wouldn't be surprised if almost no one readed this far. :P

I also have ideas about stats macroedition. For example, what could be called "progressive stamina": decrease stamina progressively according to positions. For example, -3 to all defender's stamina, -8 to all midfielders stamina and -7 to all attackers stamina. You know, stuff like that.
 
gergerger, I see where your concern is and it's nothing new. I've noticed it, you've noticed it and so has the next guy. The CPU unfortuantely is an IDIOT and PRESSURES you 100% of the time often with 3-4 players leaving many of you other players with empty space.

Yes I know you have the ball lets say on your CB and if you hold it enough with him you'll notice not 1 but BOTH opposition's forwards PLUS an attacking or closest midfielder are PRESSING you which is quite horible and not how it works in real life. If teams pressed like that for 90 minutes in every match not only would it be impossible because they'd run out of gas after 50 minutes but it's also not a SAFE thing to do defensively as it leaves other players empty if you have more than one player pressing the opposition player with ball.

BUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

Having said that, this is a FLAW with game and until Konami fix it, I don't believe it's worth our effort to change player positions drastically and player stats and 100 other things especially for this DATA. Because it'll confuse the hell out of average person who downloads this to find the forward is positioned as far back as possibly and the defender as far back as possible and all those other alterations you were talking about.

I'm not dismissing your idea, I like it but I think it's good for a private thing not if you want for something huge like PLF data if it was to be released.

Also it seems to me like you've got a good sense about tactics ;) like I do and I tried to encourage a nice "Tactical Thread Discussion" where we would talk about effects of putting backward arrows of all kinds and adjusting Role select and Defense and much more but people here aren't really into those things here, so I tried it at PESFan Forums with great success.

Here's the link to the topic I started that went on for 22 pages with many great tactical analysis and thought in there by many great contributors and tactical minds there such as Blazing_Saddler.

http://www.pesfan.com/bulletin/showthread.php?t=57274&page=18&pp=15&highlight=tactical

Take care for now and lets keep further TACTICAL discussion in pm or there. I'd like to keep this thread more about what it's about which is wrong stats which we can further improve on with updates like PLF Data.

Latez
 
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