The referee thread: discuss referees and their decisions

I feel quite happy to say this after last night, as I've also said it in the past when decisions have gone for us, but I think generally some referees are far too quick to send players off. Regardless of whether you think it could have been a red card or not, I doubt there is many who will feel he had to go and ultimately the decision to send him off changed the match.

The game wasn't a particularly dirty game, there had been a couple yellow cards for bringing down attackers breaking free and that was about the height of it. This definitely added to my sense of disbelief at the red.

It's quite possible Real Madrid would have scored 2 goals and gone through anyway, but whenever we see a red card like this, I always feel robbed of the opportunity of finding out what could of been.

That's all I have to say on the matter, I can't be bothered to argue on the decision itself, I suspect anyone will see what they want to see anyway.
 
Pierluigi Collina says the sending off was fair enough, and that's all the confirmation I need. He was an official observer during the match, according to "El Mundo Deportivo" which is a Barcelona friendly newspaper.
 
Last edited:
Sabatasso said:
Pierluigi Collina says the sending off was fair enough, and that's all the confirmation I need. He was an official observer during the match, according to "El Mundo Deportivo" which is a Barcelona friendly newspaper.
Click to expand...
THE MASTER HAVE SPOKEN.
IT IS DONE.
 
Huh, I've not seen that picked up anywhere else. There are at least 2 fake 'interviews' with the Turkish ref circulating around the interwebz.

Seems kind of random that Collina would choose to go outside of UEFA channels given his official status, and speak to a single Spanish paper.

I love media in the internet age though, a quick search shows the Daily Mail, AS, Marca and numerous other papers carrying the quotes from Cakir - despite the interview being called out as fake. The Daily Mail even carries the quotes in a headline, and then at the very end of the article mentions that the Turkish FA deny the interview took place. That's magic.

Give the way Collina refereed his whole career, he would almost 100% not have sent Nani off, and would have instead brought the two players together, spoken to them at length, issued warnings and then got on with the match. He was famous for demonstrating a great understanding of what football is about - that's the reason he's viewed as the best ref in modern memory. He barely ever even had to issue yellows, because the players respected him so much.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the unnecessary Collina introduction. I am quite sure most people on the forum knows of him and what he's famous for...


Cakir's performance has also been criticised by pundits in Spain, but the AS story reported a claim from Turkish daily Milliyet that Cakir's performance at Old Trafford had been given a mark of 8.2 out of 10 by UEFA's official refereeing observer Pierluigi Collina.

Collina reportedly commended the decision to send off Nani, while saying Rio Ferdinand should also have been shown a red card for his vehement protests at the end.

http://espnfc.com/news/story?id=1366841&cc=5739


Seek, and you shall find.
 
Last edited:
Not sure what difference it even makes what Collina mightve said. If youve ever worked in a representative function like that you'd know that disagreeing with your employer in public tends to very bad for your career. In other words, its silly to think he would say anything else, regardless of his personal feelings.
 
Sabatasso said:
Cakir's performance has also been criticised by pundits in Spain, but the AS story reported a claim from Turkish daily Milliyet that Cakir's performance at Old Trafford had been given a mark of 8.2 out of 10 by UEFA's official refereeing observer Pierluigi Collina.

Collina reportedly commended the decision to send off Nani, while saying Rio Ferdinand should also have been shown a red card for his vehement protests at the end.

http://espnfc.com/news/story?id=1366841&cc=5739


Seek, and you shall find.
Click to expand...

Last night ESPNFC.com was carrying the 'interview' with Cakir on their website (today it's been taken down, replaced by the story from the Turkish FA saying it was fake. Don't believe everything you see on the interwebz.

I find the bit: "AS story reported a claim from Turkish daily Milliyet" to be a bit odd, it seems unlikely to me that UEFA would choose to only tell the official referee score to a single Turkish daily newspaper. But who knows, not I.

Listen you could be right. I don't know if Collina chose to speak to the press. He probably wouldn't break rank given he works for UEFA.

The very fact that the world has exploded about the decision should really tell you its hardly a clear red. I'm not saying it's a conspiracy, that he was bribed or that he's not a good referee. This is the thread to talk about referees and their decisions, and how refereeing works in the game today. That's all we're doing.
 
Last edited:
Sabatasso said:
Thanks for the unnecessary Collina introduction. I am quite sure most people on the forum knows of him and what he's famous for...


Cakir's performance has also been criticised by pundits in Spain, but the AS story reported a claim from Turkish daily Milliyet that Cakir's performance at Old Trafford had been given a mark of 8.2 out of 10 by UEFA's official refereeing observer Pierluigi Collina.

Collina reportedly commended the decision to send off Nani, while saying Rio Ferdinand should also have been shown a red card for his vehement protests at the end.

http://espnfc.com/news/story?id=1366841&cc=5739


Seek, and you shall find.
Click to expand...

What an arrogant post.
I think beach made a very good point by remembering where Collina has stood for as a referee. Collina the referee would never have given a red card to Nani. Never.

I don't believe in the interview. If Collina has given an interview to AS about his report, he has made a very serious mistake. If UEFA would want to use Collina's report as an argument about the ref's match, they would never do it this way: one interview with one newspaper. No then they would use Collina's report to make an official statement issued to all press agencies and not a single paper.

And besides all that: never ever believe an article in Marca or As.
 
beachryan said:
The very fact that the world has exploded about the decision should really tell you its hardly a clear red. I'm not saying it's a conspiracy, that he was bribed or that he's not a good referee. This is the thread to talk about referees and their decisions, and how refereeing works in the game today. That's all we're doing.
Click to expand...

I never claimed it was a "clear red". I just claimed the the red card isn't as unjust as most United fans claim it to be. It is in a border zone where SOME referees would give red and some not. United was unlucky, Nani was stupid and the referee strict and the card "fair enough", end of story.

There are much worse or more unjust situations to discuss than an "orange card awarded red" to be honest. Wrongly disallowed goals or goals that never should have been allowed for example. Wrongly disallowed goals cost Spurs 7 points last season, which would have put us above Arsenal with a clear margin, for example. I have not researched if it was evened out in any way, by having goals against wrongly disallowed or similar.

This should never happen, for example.
YouTube - Roy Carroll drops Mendes' shot over the line.


gerd said:
What an arrogant post.
I think beach made a very good point by remembering where Collina has stood for as a referee. Collina the referee would never have given a red card to Nani. Never.
Click to expand...

Collina doesn't strike me as a person that would say something he doesn't mean either.
 
Last edited:
Sabatasso said:
Collina doesn't strike me as a person that would say something he doesn't mean either.
Click to expand...

Exactly, that's why i'm pretty certain he never said that.

And i'm also a Sputs fan, but was it really necessary to come up with Mendes and his goal that was never given...
I also don't believe that Spurs would have ended up before Arsenal if referees would never make mistakes. You mention the 7 wrongly disallowed goals but maybe Arsenal fans can come up with 9 wrongly disallowed goals and can say that they would have ended second otherwise...i know it isn't true that all these mistakes even themselves out after 38 matches, but i do believe that after 38 matches teams end up where they belong...Spurs were not good enough to end 3th...discussion over.
 
Sabatasso said:
This should never happen, for example.
YouTube - Roy Carroll drops Mendes' shot over the line.
Click to expand...

Wow, it's like Godwin's law. Any conversation involving a Spurs fan and refereeing eventually goes back to what, 10 years ago now, when the linesman screwed up against United. Don't forget the Carrick non-penalty a few years later, that's normally the clear evidence of the bias towards United.

If only the authourities were....oh....wait what? Oh the FA and FIFA both have roadmaps in place to start goal-line technology next season?

Well alright then. Good discussion.
 
Ferguson bitched about three times where United had been kicked out of the CL because of bad refereeing. (According to gerd, it evens out in the end so he got nothing to bitch about...). If Ferguson can bring up incidents from the past and bitch about them, so can I, but to be honest it wasn't the actual incident that was the point of my post, it was ANY incident like that. For or against Man United, Once Caldas or Arsenal de Sarandí.

I knew some of you would fail to see that and focus on the wrong point though, you're so predictable.
 
Last edited:
Sabatasso said:
Ferguson bitched about three times where United had been kicked out of the CL because of bad refereeing. (According to gerd, it evens out in the end so he got nothing to bitch about...). If Ferguson can bring up incidents from the past and bitch about them, so can I, but to be honest it wasn't the actual incident that was the point of my post, it was ANY incident like that. For or against Man United, Once Caldas or Arsenal de Sarandí.

I knew some of you would fail to see that and focus on the wrong point though, you're so predictable.
Click to expand...

How about you make your points clearer and say what you actually mean. I've seen you in a couple of threads mention things, they can be quite ambiguous and then people try to converse with you on what you said and you get defensive and smart arsey, which doesn't help.

Maybe it isn't other people but you that is the problem?....just saying :DD
 
Well, excuse me for not being a native English speaker. Conversing in a foreign language is quite complicated unless you discuss the weather or something really simple.

I only become "smart arsey" when people intentionally pick the least sensible interpretations to be honest.
 
Sabatasso said:
Well, excuse me for not being a native English speaker. Conversing in a foreign language is quite complicated unless you discuss the weather or something really simple.

I only become "smart arsey" when people intentionally pick the least sensible interpretations to be honest.
Click to expand...

It's not about being a native English speaker, you need to keep in mind that people may not read your posts as you intended them.

Your English is very good, so I guess most people see what you write and take it at face value. They are probably unaware that what you are trying to say is another point you are trying to make.

It's a reciprocal thing, people need to look at what you are saying more openly and you need to not be so attacking if people are not understanding your posts the way you intended.
 
Well, I assume it is intentional when I say "Norway reinvented the Zonal defense in the 90's" and someone interprets it into "Norway played yoga bonito in the 90's".
 
Sabatasso said:
Well, excuse me for not being a native English speaker. Conversing in a foreign language is quite complicated unless you discuss the weather or something really simple.

I only become "smart arsey" when people intentionally pick the least sensible interpretations to be honest.
Click to expand...

You're not the only one who's not a native English speaker, yet you don't find the others as "rude" or "condescending" as your posts may imply at times.

Just saying.
 
Your problem has nothing to do with not being a native English speaker.
You are manipulative. Look at my last post. What did i wrote:
"i know it isn't true all these mistakes even themselves out after 38 matches..."

What do you make of that:
"according to gerd it evens out in the end"

First of all, and maybe you didn't to that on purpose: you make it look as if i've said exactly the opposite. Now i've delibaretely reasoned like you in what i quote about you. I know that if you read your post and my post two or three times it becomes clear that you don't cite me on referee mistakes but on the final ranking after 38 matches.
But most certainly you did not do that on purpose (well i might hope so).

But where i talk about leagues and the fact that after 38 matches teams end up where they belong, you use that argument for a cup competition like the CL. I never wrote that. If you had the will or the ability to read between the lines, then you would know that when i'm talking about leagues, that is "as opposed to club competitions" where the random factor (an injury, a referee mistake,...) can have big consequences. IMO a referee mistake can never influence a league...
And then there is the argument of being a non native English speaker. One could reply to that that if your English is not good enough, the maybe you should refrain from discussing. And this is written by a native Dutch speaker...

Spurs generally end up loosing to Man Utd (but not this season !!!!), they loose 9 times out of 10 because they are inferior to Man Utd, not because of the referee.

I love Spurs, but IMO they are a couple of steps away from clubs like Arsenal, Chelsea and Manchester United because they still don't have the winners mentality, that was very clear in the match against Arsenal...Spurs' first team is better than Arsenal's but in the end the difference was minimal... Clubs like Manchester City (who are better than Spurs) and Spurs still need to acquire a winners mentality. This is the one aspect where United stands out, they have a winners mentality in their DNA. All the other clubs are behind them in that aspect. Chelsea is second and Arsenal third, then come clubs like Spurs and City. Clubs like Everton and Newcastle, in the end kind of choke because they are not used to winning. This aspect in the end is much more important than referees (and yes where i agree with you is that ref are influenced by it, but you got to deserven this as a club...wheather we like it or not, Man Utd has earned that advantage...). This happens in every league and also in cups, you can see it as injustice, but it's the essence of sports...
 
Sabatasso said:
Well, I assume it is intentional when I say "Norway reinvented the Zonal defense in the 90's" and someone interprets it into "Norway played yoga bonito in the 90's".
Click to expand...

You rambled on about Norway and edmundo (Was it him? sorry if it wasn't) was trying to understand what you were trying to say (Because it was going off topic) then you got defensive and then he was trying to understand by asking you to explain by showing you facts and figures, then you got all arsey :DD

You also present things and don't research them properly as edmundo pointed out and also get defensive. Your whole thoughts on George Graham showed that.

So my point is, not everybody is perfect including yourself, if you make a point and people don't understand, then explain it better. If you can't then try and refrain from being smart arsey and trying to make the other person look stupid...because from what I have seen it only makes you look a bit stupid and makes you look argumentative and a bit of a WUM as you seem to keep doing it.

You seem like a smart and intelligent guy, but the way you are coming across at the moment means that nobody is going to want to talk with you and that would be a shame.
 
Sabatasso said:
Everybody can't be friends, just saying.
Click to expand...

This is what is irritating about you.
That is the way 14 year olds discuss. I might suppose you are older than that.

You might not like my posts about you, but i do this to help you, not to destroy. If you do feel offended, i apologize (something you might try once in a while too).
 
I rarely get offended, I just don't feel the need to sugar coat everything. I appreciate honesty, and if you don't like me that's perfectly fine. I am not trying to get friends here, if I was it would be a fairly stupid way to go about it. I am belittling, arrogant and rash on purpose because we're always discussing menial stuff on forums and it is nothing more than entertainment. A forum without occasional drama isn't worth reading in my opinion.

@BobbyBox; My assessment of Georg Graham is spot on in my opinion. He can't do anything without a superior squad, Spurs anno 1999 was a good squad and strengthens my initial statement. This is opposed to managers that have proven to make inferior squads become "Giant Killers." He botched the league though, so the League Cup was his only accomplishment, and it is in all fairness the least interesting trophy available for English clubs, and with a squad that should be pushing more desirable silverwares like The FA Cup and European qualification (which is just an "imagined" silverware but still very (most) important financially).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999–2000_Tottenham_Hotspur_F.C._season
 
Last edited:
Being belitling, arrogant and rush on purpose is not my idea of entertainment.
It helps to have a few "friends" on internet.

Are they true friends ? No they aren't.
But it can be good to have some sort of bond with people you have never seen in person. It is good to know that you are appreciated by some people, if you don't see them.
Everybody has need to some sort of affection even if it is only virtual affection.

Life is sad without affection and appreciation. You don't have to come here to be universially liked, but some sort of bond is nice.
 
I have a bachelors degree in pedagogics, you don't need to teach me how to make online friends. As I said, this is all an act for my own personal amusement. I am not lonely, and I don't seek a "meaningful online relationship". I do appreciate each and every one of you, though, regardless of what you think of me.

If you look at my posts, you can clearly see where I am being serious and when I am bickering for the sake of bickering.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom