The Motorsport Thread

If anyone is interested in motorsport now that WC is here, tomorrow is start for Le Mans 24h race. Here are all cars and drivers:

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I'll be cheering for #8 and #12 in LMP1, #35 in LMP2 and all Ferraris in GT class :D

You'll notice on 1st picture #0 Nissan car...it is not competing in a race (for points in championship etc.) but have entered in "experimental" category...their goal in this race is to to one full lap at Le Mans only using electric engine and it will take 2-3 laps driving on standard internal combustion engine to charge batteries enough for one lap.


Also, Loic Duval has crashed his #1 Audi in practice 2 days ago:
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He's not in any life danger, but doctors asked for him not to compete in a race, so Marc Gene will drive instead.
 
Always rooting for the Deltawing (even if it won't get any points, but the concept is so fascinating) and, of course, Audi (highest hope for no. 2). Seems like this'll be the closest 24hours in the last years with Toyota, Rebellion and, finally back at Le Mans, Porsche competing with Audi in the LMP1. In the end though I think the e-tron quattro will make it, when no car is wrecked by them (is McNish somewhere near the course) or an other car, the should be winning this. LMP2 never interested me as much as the rest, so I can't give any clear predictions due to not knowing most of them. Same goes for the GTE Am, only interested in the GTE Pro, this seems to be a pretty hard grid, think it will be decided between the no. 74 and the no. 91, from a German POV I'll cheer for Porsche.

Hopefully not as many crashes as in the last years, but more intense racing until the last hour.
Sadly can't watch the race completely, but will watch as much as possible via Eurosport or live stream (think Audi had live streams from inside the car last year).
 
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I wouldn't be that optimistic about Audi as Toyota has won both rounds in this years championship so far (Silverstone and Spa) with Audi nowhere near them. They also have pole position for this weekend.
I am also not interested in LMP2 that much, but I am cheering for #35 because it is the first racing car by Ligier in about 2 decades + Brundle's son is driving that car and I really want to see him perform good.
 
Short addition to the pictures of Duval's crash: It's simply amazing, how safe professional race cars are nowadays. Such a crash would've killed a driver for sure twenty or thirty years ago.
 
S-NipE said:
Short addition to the pictures of Duval's crash: It's simply amazing, how safe professional race cars are nowadays. Such a crash would've killed a driver for sure twenty or thirty years ago.
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Then I remember back to Allan Simonsen's seemingly innocuous yet fatal crash last year as a reminder of how dangerous this sport is.

You're right though, car safety is amazing these days.
 
Yes, you can't take away the always present danger of death in a sport revolving around high velocities completely. Always sad to hear pro drivers dying these days (another example is Sean Edwards), but as hard and harsh as it sounds, I think it helps to make the sports (and at the end of the development every production car for the public) much safer.
 
well, most of the deaths in modern racing are on bikes (which is obvious as drivers are protected by lightweight racing suit and helmet) and GT/Nascar/Touring cars where cars are still done quite similar to the everyday road cars. In most hi-tech open wheel series and in prototypes cars are done in a way that insures almost no chance for death with strong carbon fiber monocoque which is there to protect driver(s) and than everything attached to it.
 
Very true, but in Simonsen's case the car was only moderately damaged. A very unfortunate incident really.

Edit - both Edwards and Simonsen's deaths were a result of unsafe trackside barriers rather than the cars involved.
 
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Car might be only moderately damaged, but carbon-fiber cars (F1 or LMP1 for example) are designed to disintegrate up to a certain point and in that way to dissipate energy that would otherwise be felt by a driver. In most crashes it is not damage that kills you but rather the force that you are suspected to. EDIT: Woops haven't included your edit in my post....Barriers are supposed to help in energy dissipation and that is why they are coated by tires, or in recent years by some foam-like material (can't remember the name) which they first started to use in Monaco just few years ago and practically saved the life of Perez


And here are full qualifying results for Le Mans. Toyota has 1-3, Porsche 2-4 while Audis are 5-6-7.
http://www.24h-lemans.com/wpphpFich...du-mans-2014-qualifying-practice_combined.pdf
 
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I was reading an article that discussed how the Simonsen and Edwards deaths were avoidable. In Simonsen's case the armco barrier was installed up against at tree at the exact point of impact, therefore there was no flex in the barrier which would have absorbed much of the energy from the collision as it is designed to do. Real negligence there if you ask me.

Similarly, Edwards' Porsche hit a tyre wall only one deep which was placed up against a concrete wall. This offered very little absorption of impact.

In both cases it was rapid deceleration which killed them. The cars were very safe, the tracks were not.
 
ZEOD/Deltawing obviously already out of the race. :(

Porsche looks a bit slower, while Audi improved obviously quite a lot since the qualifying. Right now it looks like it'll be decided between Toyota and Audi.
 
Oh my...again a F430 involved in one of the crashes. Just as in Rocky's case two years ago. And last year I think Magnussen collided with one as well.

The Audi is out, I guess, what about the Toyota? Eurosport 1 (the only I get here) decided to show Tennis until late this evening and so I'm watching the WC for some hours now. Too much sport at the same time, can't watch it all! :LOL:
 
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Toyota had quite some damage to it's nose but he crawled back to the pits and he was sent back on track if I am not mistaken.
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Just came back from my match and saw the first images since 2 am this morning, what happened to the Toyota that both remaining Audis are in front now (and will probably drive it home in the last hour)?

Edit: Just read a live ticker from 5am this morning until now...maaaan, what a race did I miss here! :(
 
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me too, I had some things to take care of...but we might be lucky...there is guy on youtube who had posted both full races they run this season...I really hope he will upload Le Mans too.
 
S-NipE said:
In the end though I think the e-tron quattro will make it, when no car is wrecked by them (is McNish somewhere near the course) or an other car, the should be winning this.
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Pretty decent guess I think, although I've to admit, that Toyota would've won this, if they hadn't been captured by problems.
 
what problems exactly Toyota had? Was there another crash involving them or technical problems?

But problems are part of racing, and Audi did best to stay out of them, so they deserved to win.
 
One Toyota ended up third, the second one was obviously leading the race for many many hours, before suffering a small fire in one of the many cables in the cars (sorry, for not knowing the exact English term) at around 5:00 am with Nakajima driving and -I think- two laps in front of the next opponent, which was the winning Audi #2. And this fire was reported to be not very big or damaging, but destroyed the most important part of the electronics, so the car couldn't come back into the pits. Following the #2 at that time was the Webber Porsche, before both Audi had problems with the turbo charger and the drama continued.
 
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DTM:

Not sure what to think about this...

http://www.touringcartimes.com/2014/06/05/dtm-changes-regulations-for-mercedes-to-catch-up/

I'm in two minds. As a Mercedes fan it's disappointing to see them struggle. They have a decent driver line-up: the experience of Paffet and di Resta with younger talent like Vietoris, Wickens and Wehrlein who could be champions one day. Clearly something is badly wrong with the car as Mercedes are making up the last five or six cars on the grid every qually and trailing badly in races. Apparently it lacks balance and downforce and is difficult to drive. Vietoris is putting in admirable performances and driving the nuts off the car, which shows how good he really is. His win at Oschersleben was completely against the odds.

However, if Mercedes has developed a poor car then perhaps they should live or die by that and wait until 2015 to field an improved design. Permitting mid-season development time to one manufacturer is perhaps a dangerous precedent and I'm not sure I'm comfortable with it. Audi and BMW were at the meeting and were presumably ok with this which seems strange.

When Mercedes dropped to six cars last year I did wonder if they were looking to scale back their involvement in DTM and possibly withdraw in the near future. This year they increased to seven cars so perhaps that speculation was incorrect, but I still have doubts about how seriously they are taking the DTM now that they so heavily involved at the sharp-end of Formula 1.

I hope Audi, BMW and Mercedes are all in the DTM for the long term as the series is much stronger for having these three famous German brands. Maybe this is the driving force behind the decision to allow Mercedes to play catch-up? The DTM must promote healthy, even competition between the three brands for commercial reasons.
 
My first reaction was: Completely idiotic to change rules and allow them testing. On the other hand: If BMW and Audi agreed to that there is hardly an argument to start a debate with. If I would be in the position of one of the deciders, I would vote against such a decision, because I support, what you wrote: Live with what you developed over the last winter or die with it.

And I don't think, they'll leave the DTM in near future, the series is too big for them to leave them, mainly because of PR reasons: Due to the lack of further prominent series (as we talked about) they would have nothing to promote their production cars in motorsport on a broad base to many viewers and possible buyers.
 
S-NipE said:
My first reaction was: Completely idiotic to change rules and allow them testing. On the other hand: If BMW and Audi agreed to that there is hardly an argument to start a debate with. If I would be in the position of one of the deciders, I would vote against such a decision, because I support, what you wrote: Live with what you developed over the last winter or die with it.
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Yes, that would be my reaction, more so if I was Audi or BMW. I suspect the DTM organisation sold it as being in the interest of the DTM brand and mid-season development and testing could be offered to all teams in future.

I'm not keen on it at all. I don't want the DTM becoming like F1.
 
Wouldn't make a lot of sense to me for a small grid like the WTCC. Spectators would have to wait for more than 7 or even 8 minutes until they see the cars again. If it can be placed inside the 24h-race it might make sense though, as many spectators could use the time otherwise.
 
My thoughts exactly. I don't rate the Nordschleife as a race circuit, not for spectators anyway. I'd love to see the WTCC take to the GP strecke though.
 
Nordschleife was an iconic track because it tested drivers ability to control the car and drive fast on the track where it is almost impossible to remember all corners and where you know that if you make a mistake you are not so sure that you will be walking home.

But that track is now outdated, it's time has passed. I am not at all saying that we need to forget what was in the past and where drivers of their generation earned their names. But we are constantly progressing, and I see no point in slowing that progress just because it is hard to move on.
 
Whaaaaat? I nearly feel personally attacked. :D

The Ring is one of, if not the most prestigious track in the world and still is a challenge for every driver. Its uniqueness is not only the product of its length, but also because of the turns, the elevations, the overtaking places and many, many risky passages. The main problem is that it's not really usable for small grids, they better should stay on the GP course.

Read today that the WTCC return is secured. The WTCC will run one race of 120 km (=5 rounds of the full layout) with one pit stop instead of the normal pair of two 60 km races.
 
I'm not a fan of long race tracks in general. The Nordschleife is a piece of history, and a beautiful one at that, but I agree with Cuky - its time has passed.

I think the place still exists for the experience and challenge it offers (track days) or for putting cars to the test, but it's just not ideally suited to modern motorsport.
 
Just out of curiosity: How do you define "long race tracks"? Would you call tracks like Le Mans (Circuit de la Sarthe, not the Bugatti course) or Bathurst long race tracks?
 
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