SPAIN thread

ALBICELESTE2010 said:
Sabatasso Ramos himself prefers to play at centreback. I'd rather see Javi Martinez in the role but that's the way it is going to stay.
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Doesn't matter if he prefers striker, he's best at the right back. His lack of height and brute force is a liability in defence. He's prone to losing an important air battle against an average air-striker, and that is not good. He's got a good jump, but any striker with similar height and more beef will beat him thoroughly in the air.
 
You're kidding right?

Ramos lacks height and brute force?

One of the most athletic players in the world! The guy is a BEAST in the air and not many will beat him with crosses. In fact, despite being shorter than Pique, he's definitely a bigger aerial threat and a better header.

And it's not like he's short. The guy is like 184cm and jumps as high as it gets and heads pretty well too.

In any case, he would've played right back if Puyol hadn't been injured but he's definitely better in CB than someone like Raul Albiol or playing Javi Martinez out of position. And given the fact that Arbeloa is doing a good job as RB (Was Man of the Match yesterday), then this is the best combination for now.

What's a lot more puzzling is the stuff happening up front. With Del Bosque taking out Torres to bring on Navas. I'm completely with Albiceleste on this. With Llorente and Navas in the team, you finally have a real striker and a real WIDE man who has something to aim at. I'd love to see those two play at the same time. So far it hasn't happened.

I don't know why you need all these CENTRAL playmakers who all want to 'pass' instead of 'move' and run into space. A bit inbalanced. Xavi, Busquets, Alonso, that's 1 too many. One of them needs to be sacrificed for Navas with Iniesta/Silva playing in middle.
 
It's not just me that finds watching this Spanish team a chore is it? Football is supposed to be about skill and technique, yes, but also about risk and reward, creating and taking chances.

This Spain team play like an 11 year old who is 1-0 up on FIFA/ PES and just pass it around the back and midfield to waste the last 60 minutes of online matches.

I dig it's effective, great, but to utter them in the same breath as Brazil from the 70's, the golden Dutch side or even the French 'double' winning team of the late 90's is blasephemy imo. They're as entertaining a trophy winning team as Inter winning the CL 2 seasons ago.

And I don't get why pundits are so into it. They won the last World Cup having scored the fewest goals ever by not only a winning team, but any team that has gotten to the final.

They're the best 'piggy in the middle' team known to man. But Christ it bores me to death.
 
They were boring yesterday.

What's worse is for long portions it seemed they were happy to get a draw and didn't actually want to win which is a VERY dangerous proposition given the fact that if Rakitic had taken that great chance better, Croatia and Italy would be through.

Comparing a team that passes like this and has some of the most skilful individuals around like Iniesta, Silva, etc. to a team like Mourinho's Inter is widely off the mark however as they are entirely different.

I don't like Spain's style for a couple reasons.

1. Usually not enough long-shots. Just like Barca. Luckily yesterday, at least Ramos and Pique (Their Center-backs!) tried their luck from distance and did well.

2. Too much passing, not enough off the ball movement. Too many play makers, not enough width. They HEAVILY rely on their two full-backs to provide width but as good as Arbeloa is doing, he's no Dani Alves. Alba is getting better and better and will be able to play that role for them for years but you need some real 'width' in your midfield too rather than putting 5 players in there who are more or less all central players and all more of a 'passer' than a receiver.

I thought Del Bosque's tactics were too negative and taking out Torres for Navas was strange as well. But whatever, this team is for the most part, still a joy to watch just like Barca is.

They definitely have days like yesterday though where they frustrate you and you almost wish Croatia had punished them for playing like that and they almost did!
 
effectiveness is key though Ryan ! English sits back the whole match almost like covering the gol mouth ,but yet they get the business done. Everyone will praise England`s efforts.

I admit Spain`s ability to try and walk the ball in does my head in 4 REAL! I said before Spain chews very slowly before swallowing as annoying it is to wait for a gol to be tapped in. Its effective I seen about half of the Croatians team with their hands on their hip exhausted.

Blanc said England parks the bus the whole match calling them anti- football. I wud be interesting to see what Blanc Le Bleu will do facing Spain.
 
I think France could definitely beat Spain. Won't happen though, because France will beat Sweden to top the group.

I'm not saying Spain are easy to beat, or not the favorites to win this tournament, but their 'style' is so much more negative and dull then the press they get would lead you to believe.
 
beachryan said:
It's not just me that finds watching this Spanish team a chore is it? Football is supposed to be about skill and technique, yes, but also about risk and reward, creating and taking chances.

This Spain team play like an 11 year old who is 1-0 up on FIFA/ PES and just pass it around the back and midfield to waste the last 60 minutes of online matches.

I dig it's effective, great, but to utter them in the same breath as Brazil from the 70's, the golden Dutch side or even the French 'double' winning team of the late 90's is blasephemy imo. They're as entertaining a trophy winning team as Inter winning the CL 2 seasons ago.

And I don't get why pundits are so into it. They won the last World Cup having scored the fewest goals ever by not only a winning team, but any team that has gotten to the final.

They're the best 'piggy in the middle' team known to man. But Christ it bores me to death.
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Nothing to add here, this style was once breathtaking and new, but seeing more and more teams adapting it, while seemingly forgetting how to shoot on a goal isn't nice.
 
Am I the only one who thinks Spains football is incredibly boring?
 
PLF said:
You're kidding right?
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No, he's 183cm and while he jumps like a cheetah which I already pointed out, he's not a heavy weight. So in reality it does not matter how high he jumps, a smart striker seeks body contact with him and he will never leave the ground. And he is not strong enough to withstand brute force.
 
beachryan said:
I think France could definitely beat Spain. Won't happen though, because France will beat Sweden to top the group.

I'm not saying Spain are easy to beat, or not the favorites to win this tournament, but their 'style' is so much more negative and dull then the press they get would lead you to believe.
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Really, yep Nostradamus you ain't.

Now I've listened to some shite in my day, but listening to the English on TalkSport talking about how Spain are poor and that supposedly this French team don't fear them, I must be on a different planet from most including yourself.

Not sure if your English as well right enough, so maybe it's an English thing (and possibly a French thing if that is indeed true).

How can the most negative team have more possession than anyone in the tournament, have more shots on target than anyone in the tournament and have scored more goals than anyone in the tournament.

LOL, absolute shite that people come out with.


FD
 
See, the point is the following: Their play isn't towards scoring goals, but winning games with one more goal than their opponent. Yes, it is effective and yes, ball possession of over 70% is nice for the team, but yes, it is boring to watch them play, as they never even try to shoot on goal until they in a distance of three meter to the line. And football lives through goals, not through ball possession.
 
You can't deny the fact that Spain is the best team out there. Both individually and as a coherent unit. But I completely agree with S-NipE, their style is just boring to watch. And not just boring, it also creates some kind of propaganda that this kind of football is the best one out there, which is complete and utter crap. As long as it's not played by many teams (at the moment that's only Barcelona/Spain), I'm okay with it, because there's certainly a way to stop it, although when that happens, these guys instantly begin to whine about how the pitch wasn't good enough, how the ref gave the other team an advantage, how their opponent is ruining football. Well, give me a break, I can say that this all-possession shite they're doing is ruining football in my perspective... There's not a right or a wrong way to play football (as long as you're not breaking legs out there). Yeah, but what do we know. :)
 
S-NipE said:
See, the point is the following: Their play isn't towards scoring goals, but winning games with one more goal than their opponent.
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Are you Del Bosque? How do you know that. Did the match against Ireland ended 1-0? What went wrong there?

Seriously: i can't believe that any coach wants to gamble on a 1-0 result. That is a very big gamble. In football a goal can come easy even if one team is much better than the other...

People forget that Spain have nothing to win in this tournament, they have everything to loose. Winning the tournament is considered a normal thing. In those circumstances, when one has to play a very good Croatia teamn it's normal that teams become nervous. Besides that, the build-up to Nava's goal was fantastic.

While i agree with you that a long shot now and then would not be a bad thing, i can say that i enjoy watching Spain. I can't understand the pundits on Belgian television who claimed Spain-Croatia was a dull match. It was after Spain-Italy the best match i've seen in this tournament.
 
DamjanStefanov said:
Am I the only one who thinks Spains football is incredibly boring?
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No, I agree with you to some degree. I don't think it's funny to watch Spain pass the ball back and forth without gaining territory. It's frustrating to be honest, especially when they consistently refuse to cross the ball or even pass to an unmarked wing/back. When they "force" it through the middle, I think they're limiting themselves and it does not make great entertainment value for neutral watchers.

Spain with Navas and Torres on the other hand, is not so bad to watch. I wonder why the hell he took off Torres and put on Navas in the last match, though. Torres needs Navas to work properly in this team, and Navas needs Torres as they're the only two players in the squad who prefers to take advantage of the space behind the defense.
 
That's because Italy coped really well with Spain's midfield I though, Pirlo and Marchisio were fantastic. I think Germany also have the capabilities in midfield to do something similar which would be a great game but most sides will struggle to touch the ball.
 
I like seeing excitement in football, and Spains football is all about passing, and I just don't enjoy watching it. I much more prefer watching real football with crosses, scrimages in the box and shots from distance. The endless passing is just boring to me.
 
DamjanStefanov said:
I like seeing excitement in football, and Spains football is all about passing, and I just don't enjoy watching it. I much more prefer watching real football with crosses, scrimages in the box and shots from distance. The endless passing is just boring to me.
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Agreed. What they do they do with great skill and it's absolutely okay they play that way - but I just can't make it through 90 minutes of tiki-taka anymore without falling asleep or just switching the channel most of the time. The match against Italy was great, though.
 
Personally I prefer watching Germany to watching Spain, and that has been true for me in this tournament and in the WC in 2010. The Germans have a plethora of skillfull, in form, players in every department, not just midfielders or midfielders masquerading as "false" strikers or wide men. Upfront Gomez, while he stuttered at times against Portgual, has shown real skill at times too (against Holland for example his goal was the touch of the tournament), Ozil has been very good in games - his distribution of the ball is excellent. Müller has been a fantastic engine in this German team when he's played, really driving them on. Lahm has always been a classy defender, but also now especially Hummels and perhaps even Badstuber have really developed in central defence, and Neuer is a top class goalkeeper. Germany have a 100% record in a slightly tougher group than Spain, and most of their games they have won by playing varing styles of football - they can go direct with balls into Gomez, they can use wing play, or their midfielders can probe and shoot. Spain are very good at this 1-2 touch short passing game, but they can be one dimensional, teams like Italy and Croatia have limited them to single goals, I think a fairly good organised team could beat Spain by packing the midfield and defence and shutting off the short passing. I think Germany would be much harder to defeat as if a team adopted that approach then the Germans could take the ball away from the congested central area and get crosses into Gomez or even bring Klose on to try and feed on the end of crosses.
 
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Aboutreika18 said:
I don't see the need for both Busquets and Alonso. Why not move Iniesta into the middle and have the Barca trio dictating things?

Iniesta's a victim of his own versatility at times.
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+1

xavi--busquets--iniesta
silva--torres--pedro/navas

alonso out!
 
i know there a lot of people here familiar with the game of basketball. has anyone ever thought of the idea to add a shot clock rule to football?
 
I love both Germany and Spain. They are both very attractive but in a different way.
If i had to choose which is the most attractive, without a doubt Spain.

A team i also liked to watch (in the first and the third match, haven't seen their second one) is Ukraine. They were toothless upfront against England, but i enjoyed them immensely.
 
gerd said:
Are you Del Bosque? How do you know that. Did the match against Ireland ended 1-0? What went wrong there?
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Well, 100% of the goals Ireland received in that tournament were a more or less direct consequence of an individual mistake and their defence wasn't existing against Ireland. If Spain would have used their chances better they had easily win this match with six or seven goals. So you cannot really count this game when comparing their style to the ones of other nations.

How many shots did you see from Spain being shot from outside the box? And how often did they try to carry the ball into the net? I don't think I need to be Del Bosque to see their task not to shoot from the distance.
 
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