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PES 2020 Rumours Discussion Thread

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On the other hand EA look like they've been exposed for scripting and looks to be actual proof as well.



Looks to be a document of a patent for 'Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment'. A lot is rather complicated, but this makes EA seem even worse than ever.
 
Pwalie86 said:
The legislation they're trying to bring in will most likely be too late to affect the Fifa and PES games this year, unless they can stop microtransactions at any time if it has been approved. If not, then maybe next year and if they're banned for next-gen games then it could be an exciting fresh start. If Konami decide to call it a day then I'm sure another company would love to jump at the chance to try and topple the might of EA.

It will only be the USA afterall, but it's an absolute market and it could cause many other nations to think twice.

Google Play Store are somewhat aware of this and have told its game developers that they need to disclose the 'odds' of what gamers are going to receive in lootboxes....so, surely anything involving odds is gambling? Very strange.
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If approved, the legislation will kick in from whatever date is agreed. If that's half way through a game's life cycle then it would still have to be implemented immediately. They wouldn't wait until a new game as that would mean that they could essentially keep the current game alive to allow microtransactions to continue.
 
Pwalie86 said:
On the other hand EA look like they've been exposed for scripting and looks to be actual proof as well.



Looks to be a document of a patent for 'Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment'. A lot is rather complicated, but this makes EA seem even worse than ever.
Click to expand...


Oh yes, we were talking about that before. Konami has it too. Everything is well-calculated manipulation. Especially in my club mode, (offline too in some parts). The gameplay is manipulated depending on whether you are buying coins or not, how often do you do it, when to get you and how to get you to do it. How often do you win or lose, how to keep your interest, and so on. This has been in PES for at least 2-3 years, but this year is just scandalous and is noticed by Mars.
 
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Pwalie86 said:
On the other hand EA look like they've been exposed for scripting and looks to be actual proof as well.

Looks to be a document of a patent for 'Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment'. A lot is rather complicated, but this makes EA seem even worse than ever.
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Of course both games feature scripting mechanics, but this is not a proof. Just because a patent exists, that doesn't mean that its content is actually being used.
 
majuh said:
Of course both games feature scripting mechanics, but this is not a proof. Just because a patent exists, that doesn't mean that its content is actually being used.
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if you're even considering such methods vs the "script" that ought to take place when a defender with x stats interacts with attacker of y stats you've already made a big mistake as a game dev - especially with pes if they're going to advertise the game as "realistic".

because what should be :
"we want to achieve the most realistic on-pitch footy game ever"
becomes
"we want to achieve the most realistic looking on-pitch footy game ever with the best ever scripting mechanics that remain oblivious to the gamer"

the latter is probably palatable as a game if the script becomes so oblivious.

pes introduced team spirit/player levels in 2016. i could see the scripting in 2015 so in my view the introduction of player levels was an attempt to mask the script behind more seemingly complex mechanics.

(IMO you had to play 2015 - the birth of myclub - to understand where i'm coming from and why i detest the direction pes has taken and why this year i did not play even one competitive online match)
 
So, no news, no teasers, rumors or annoucements? This is very strange. Perhaps they dont have nothing new to show this year.
 
No news on 2020 probably waiting on the governments to make a decision, These companies have a lot to hide and so many lies in store for us poor souls!

tbh I don't need to see a patent to prove that these online modes have a rigged scripting element to it. Anyone with a little experience with football games, And an objective, Non biased mindset can easily notice the rubber banding.

As a mainly offline player, I can notice how Konami and EA approach the AI, And it's obvious with every patch/data pack they release that they try to make the script more effective for online purposes (Removing fouls/Handballs ,less ball freedom, GK behavior,45-90 minute goals...etc)

I hope the governments will make a move to protect the industry and the gamers from such cheating and also FALSE ADVERTISING, As well as establish a quality control scheme where these lies and deceptions are investigated and punished. After all, These products are licensed by FIFA,and have partnerships with football clubs and professional associations.

And as someone who is part of a community forum that has been ridiculed for years by shills, Konami PR puppets and a number of untrustworthy inidividuals, I can't wait to see the day that these people are put into their places as well. NO MORE LIES!
 
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Well, if all you are saying is true, this is bad news because it seems that all their presentation is based on lies and deceive.

Its sad to see how a japanese company sell their souls like that. They have the reputation of taking the honor very seriously.
 
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One thing is certain until now: Pes 2020 will be playable at E3. So, at worst we will have to wait until then for some news about it.

I honestly don't care if we still haven't a single info about it, that's not what it counts in the end. There is always time for Konami to start marketing with the usual promises.

This year beta, demo, closed beta, impressions, are all useless. The final game always changes, the final code is always worse, i'm waiting for news coming from you guys playing the game the first few weeks.
 
your spot on ameppe, what we gonna see at E3 not all will be in the final game, even if they show new master league features still wont believe them till final release, konami are the kings now of false advertising, they do it so they can make sales from digital pre orders, very dishonest company, last year they kept quiet about removing d2 leagues till someone found out and there was an uproar then they explained themselves
 
I don't know how this thing works in legal terms exactly,but isn't it supposed to be gambling only if it gives chances to obtain a player?Like a 10% chance to obtain a player you want from 10 different choices for example.
If there is not any chances and you can obtain a certain player you want for some amount of coins or gp,then i guess this isn't considered gambling,cause you don't gamble for something,you just gain something specific for an exchange.
I think both companies may find some legal windows opportunities and continue this method with coins.
They'll just have to find other ways to present it and get rid of chances so it won't be considered as gambling.
 
Ameobinho said:
No news on 2020 probably waiting on the governments to make a decision, These companies have a lot to hide and so many lies in store for us poor souls!

tbh I don't need to see a patent to prove that these online modes have a rigged scripting element to it. Anyone with a little experience with football games, And an objective, Non biased mindset can easily notice the rubber banding.

As a mainly offline player, I can notice how Konami and EA approach the AI, And it's obvious with every patch/data pack they release that they try to make the script more effective for online purposes (Removing fouls/Handballs ,less ball freedom, GK behavior,45-90 minute goals...etc)

I hope the governments will make a move to protect the industry and the gamers from such cheating and also FALSE ADVERTISING, As well as establish a quality control scheme where these lies and deceptions are investigated and punished. After all, These products are licensed by FIFA,and have partnerships with football clubs and professional associations.

And as someone who is part of a community forum that has been ridiculed for years by shills, Konami PR puppets and a number of untrustworthy inidividuals, I can't wait to see the day that these people are put into their places as well. NO MORE LIES!
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I agree.

At the same time, your post made me think of one word; Exposed, which then made me think of this song.



And now it's stuck in my head.
 
the following is slighty connected to the topic, so...:

Anti-loot box bill poses a real threat to sports video games
How else are those billion-dollar licenses paid?
If passed in anything close to its proposed form, Sen. Josh Hawley’s anti-microtransaction legislation will punish, if not obliterate, a staple genre of video gaming for offenses it never really committed.

That may be fine with you. You may not like sports or their games, you may hate Electronic Arts because everyone else does. But this is the feeling I get when I read the text of the proposed “Protecting Children from Abusive Games Act,” because it goes well beyond what actually got everyone angry — Star Wars Battlefront 2’s original loot boxes. The list of no-nos the bill proscribes cover all the ways in which licensed team sports video games now make a lot, if not most of their money.
...
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https://www.polygon.com/2019/6/1/18...-josh-hawley-senate-nba-2k-fifa-ultimate-team
 
PRO_TOO said:
https://www.polygon.com/2019/6/1/18...-josh-hawley-senate-nba-2k-fifa-ultimate-team
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What a load of hot garbage that article is. In a nutshell, "how do you expect companies like EA/Konami to survive and develop the incredible products we 'take for granted' without, specifically, Ultimate Team/myClub?"

A) We take friends and family for granted - to say we take the quality of a game "for granted" is pretty pathetic, and B) it's dirty money as far as I'm concerned, literal money-for-nothing.

I don't understand how anyone can defend this practice, putting you into a system where you're at a disadvantage if you spend less on microtransactions than the other guy. It's like saying to you at the checkout, "how much do you want to pay us for this game - $80 to lose, or $180 to win for a while". It's a scandal and deserves to be treated as such.

I'll never forget the moment this whole thing really hit home for me - when the Tiger Woods games introduced a microtransaction that gave your golfer the absolute maximum possible attributes on day one. So you'd be playing online, hitting the ball 250yds off the tee, while your opponent was hitting it 350yds-400yds. They completely ruined the game, unless you were willing to fork over an extra $20 or however much it was.

It turns out that a lot of people were willing to pay that, for a game to massage their ego and assure them that they're a golfing legend... and nothing's really changed.
 
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I think forbidding this microtransactions it's the only way we can get a good football videogame. Before this, these companies made some efforts to do good games, invested in different game modes.

Nowadays, with this modes, I think they neglect master league / caree mode and pro clubs in fifa (and Konami doesn't create a similar mode) to force us play this modes and burn all our money in it.

It can only be good for consumers, we'll get a better product. I don't understand how Konami have the license to European nations and not integrating it in ML or fifa world cup not existing in 2018 to sell more cards in these modes shitty modes. They destroyed football videogames for those who want a realistic approach.
 
I can see E3 being the place where we’ll get any news on PES2020.

It seems that they have changed tactics a bit with the way that they are promoting the game. Rather than anything pre-E3, I think they must be saving it for then.

As for expectations, I’m saving myself to feel the game in its finished state before going goo goo over it.
 
I imagine they'll survive in a similar manner prior to video games being riddled with micro-transactions; by not price gouging their customers and creating a compelling product. Does that author honestly believe that the likes of FIFA will be unwilling to do business with publishers if they clamp down on such practices? Like they always say, some money is better than no money. More to the point, I'm sure they'll still make a handsome profit.

Who knows, perhaps FIFA, NFL, NHL, and the MLB will be less inclined to have their licenses tied-down to one series if all of the Ultimate Team-esque money dries up. It would be nice to return to those halcyon days where there weren't just 1-2 games for each respective sport. I'd love it if this were to inject some competition into a stagnant, dilapidated scene. Unlikely, but a man can dream.

Just to beat the proverbial dead horse, it goes without saying that the offline experience in both PES and FIFA (as well as other sports games) have regressed massively over the past decade. The aforementioned titles have been falling, with no end in sight, down a pit of stagnation at the detriment and expense of the consumer. Rather, these soul-sucking suits are standing on the backs of once great titans in order to peddle their exploitative, unimaginative micro-transactions so they can line their already bulging pockets.

It honestly reminds me of this, albeit with different context:

Needless to say, I have zero sympathy for billion dollar corporations who are hell bent on sucking the joy and money out of everyone under the sun.
 
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HAHAHA :D spot on.

So now.. sports game developer must... be not lazy again.. and to bring quality content into their games ?? NOOOO ... oh, it's too cruel! So sad, now all these multi-billion-dollar companies MUST WORK, FOR REAL:( ... How they will survive ?? HOW ?

sarcasm-mode-on-womens-premium-longsleeve-shirt.jpg
 
They're scared sh*tless, it's a joy to watch! :LOL: I honestly had expected to read many more of these types of articles, given the way the mainstream media has protected the major sports gaming franchises for far too long with outrageously positive reviews on iterations that barely improved upon the previous one.

I get that the article is trying to make everyone care about the poor poor billion-dollar franchises who need their microtransaction money or else!; but the thing is, I don't give a flying sh*t. For all I care, all of them could go bankrupt tomorrow. As long as there's talented people out there with a vision of what a sports game should be (I don't doubt for a second that they exist), and know how to captivate an audience without being accused of being shameless, greedy bastards, new sports games franchises would inevitably appear and all of our hearts would go on, playing the best of those. Ain't free market grand?

It's the same free market that up until the 00s allowed for countless football games to enter the scene and compete for people's attention. If PES and FIFA ceased to exist, such a scene would be seen again. And yes, inevitably, as it has happened before when people naturally gravitated towards the best football games which were PES and FIFA, once again the best games would overcome and defeat the others.

And if you know me, you know I had to say this as well: even in some absurd scenario in which no more football games would ever be produced again, there's a huge catalog of great, entertaining games released over the last decades. It's not as if there's a shortage of quality entertainment out there...

So I really don't see how the author of that article could make any reasonable gamer care about this issue. He did try with his fear-mongering. If this bill passes, then the ball is on the devs' court and either they'll adapt to the new scene and abide by the law; or if they don't want to, then they shall take their ball and go home and cancel their franchise. And I'll sit back and enjoy the show.
 
My hype this year is all about the banning of lootboxes and microtransactions. I feel like something game-changing is going to happen and like you said this would directly affect football games that would be forced to innovate to keep their games interesting and appealing.

Can't wait for that. In the meanwhile Konami will desperately try to earn (steal) as much as possible with Myclub, like thieves do the very moment they hear police coming to arrest them.

It's amusing but also depressing seeing Konami making Myclub totally free to attract as many potential whales (lootboxes addicted gamers) as possible, you don't even have to pay for PS+ to play multiplayer online since the latest patch. They are also disrepecting people that bought the full game by doing so considering that now someone that bought Pes 2019 still has to pay for online multiplayer in Myclub.

Such a shitty move from Konami. When you think they reached the bottom and they can't go lower than that they manage to surpass even your most pessimistic expectactions.
 
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at this time last years the forum already drives crazy, this year absolutly nothing... the first good sign for me, dont know what but something is different this year.
 


Now EA selling dirt facepaint on Battlefield V for $5. :LMAO:

Cosmetic only, but this is the gaming world we're all living in these days. If this legislation does pass, then it may take a while, but if this what these companies are doing to bleed every last penny before it's done then good riddance to them.

No doubt we'd have way better offline and other online modes without lootboxes. I actually wouldn't be surprised if this year's games had better ML and career modes just in case they have to cease with lootboxing and doesn't make them look as bad when a lot will go back to them and say they've been planning improvements all this time.

They probably got wind of this bill sometime beforehand and had to start working hard in all areas as a back-up plan in case the lootboxing got banned. Very suspicious if all of a sudden after they're not earning extra revenue we're getting Football Manager-esque ML and career modes.

It's just a hunch of mine..and I somewhat feel because CoD pretty much has a new engine this year just before next-gen comes next year that either PES and/or Fifa could have new/updated engines.
 
Pwalie86 said:
On the other hand EA look like they've been exposed for scripting and looks to be actual proof as well.



Looks to be a document of a patent for 'Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment'. A lot is rather complicated, but this makes EA seem even worse than ever.
Click to expand...

hopefully the cataylst to get it removed. if fifa ever removed scripting i would buy it immediately over a scripted pes.
 
Regarding the gaming business and such, my stance is pretty clear, atleast as harsh as guys like Jim Sterling, which should tell you enough.

I have no issue paying even 120 bucks on a good game, ffs I remember SNES games being that pricey back then but it was worth it, but I demand a finished and complete product for this money, which todays industry mostly cant deliver.

And @above, agree on the scripting part.
 
As an offline pes player, I have been paying more for less for years now! I must be stoopid or something? Or have I not been playing the game correctly like the "insufferable w*nkstain" that I am? Can't wait for Pes 2020 news to drop....Not.
 
Pwalie86 said:
On the other hand EA look like they've been exposed for scripting and looks to be actual proof as well.



Looks to be a document of a patent for 'Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment'. A lot is rather complicated, but this makes EA seem even worse than ever.
Click to expand...

Surely EA can’t get that patent accepted if I understand it right. It impacts all games not just football games. Racing games that want to have an option of rubber banding must either take it out or pay EA. Nearly all games have some kind of dynamic difficulty going on. Even Lego games have dynamic difficulty to accommodate small kids and big kids.

Also through the years people are saying that scripting needs sorting out. By the very nature of playing the CPU rather than a real person, the CPU has to run scripts to be able to play against a human. What particular scripts are we not wanting in Pes2020? Is the useless referees classing perfect tackles as fouls a script? That’s the most annoying for me.

I find the most enjoyment playing rival matches because the CPU is so determined with variable play and more surprising efforts. It’s a shame regular matches can’t be forced into rival matches.
 
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predator002 said:
Surely EA can’t get that patent accepted if I understand it right. It impacts all games not just football games. Racing games that want to have an option of rubber banding must either take it out or pay EA. Nearly all games have some kind of dynamic difficulty going on. Even Lego games have dynamic difficulty to accommodate small kids and big kids.

Also through the years people are saying that scripting needs sorting out. By the very nature of playing the CPU rather than a real person, the CPU has to run scripts to be able to play against a human. What particular scripts are we not wanting in Pes2020? Is the useless referees classing perfect tackles as fouls a script? That’s the most annoying for me.

I find the most enjoyment playing rival matches because the CPU is so determined with variable play and more surprising efforts. It’s a shame regular matches can’t be forced into rival matches.
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What about focusing efforts to make AI smart instead of using script and dynamic difficulty? I think with next generation we will have such powerful machines and CPUs that AI can be really improved on, making huge leaps forward. We can't just accept that AI will forever be stupid and cheap, it's time that developers start improving it. Obviously i'm not just talking about Pes, but games in general.
 
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