PRO_TOO
Team Heffernan
so glad to finally see someone here knowing "the truth"! ^^
i feel sorry for you!
bye bye...
...or are you just thinking about beeing done?!
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PES 2018 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread
- Thread starter ThomasGOAL
- Start date
i feel sorry for you!
bye bye...
...or are you just thinking about beeing done?!
Ameppe
International
- 23 December 2007
- Team
- SSC Napoli
Blame the DFL that continues to give exclusive match simulation rights. If they opened the package to be non exclusive Konami would have made an offer like they did for the manager package rights.
- Staff
- #2,823
So... Konami have a Bundesliga license... But... It's bad news?
What is going on? I don't understand!
EDIT: See responses below, doesn't affect PES - just their mobile manager games. I was worried it would affect option files etc...
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To make it simple: KONAMI has the right to use the Bundesliga in ONE manager simulation like the Sega Football Manager. Only EA can use the Bundesliga in a football game. So it's the same like the years before.
Ameppe
International
- 23 December 2007
- Team
- SSC Napoli
Pes Club Manager (mobile game) and Football Manager will have Bundesliga license starting from 2018-19. Fifa will have exclusive match simulation rights until 2021-22 season.
- Staff
- #2,826
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.
Makes sense now, thank you. So in other words, PES Manager on iPhone/Android will have a licensed Bundesliga. PES (the game) will not.
Thank you!
Panthera1
Championship
- 4 February 2004
Not really the fault of Konami that the bundesliga or other leagues sells it rights like that. Its up to the FAs. Exclusive rights like that must be against some euro fair trade law. Think how different the football (all Sports) computer game industry would be if there were no exclusive rights
- Staff
- #2,828
Yeah, not much point getting angry at Konami about it - they don't have the capital that EA has, and the FAs that offer "exclusive licenses" are scummy, as far as I'm concerned.
Even indie football games that wouldn't generate enough sales to buy a second-hand car can't call Arsenal "Arsenal", and I find that utterly pathetic. But that's business, I guess.
For as long as we can create and share option files, we have a way around it (although I wish it was easier and that there was more we could edit - e.g. stadia - so that more non-PES guys might be tempted to buy the game).
zeemeister
foxy engine
Hahaha one of my first mentions about 20 years ago was on pes fan about using the vibration function on the game. It only took them 18 years to I finally get it right
Not sure if this has been posted before but this is a less than stellar preview after a guy played the E3 build. Interesting point of view.
http://www.criticalhit.net/gaming/p...gle-making-annualised-games-feel-interesting/
RAMAXWY
Premier League
- 16 October 2006
- Team
- Barcelona
so glad to finally see someone here knowing "the truth"! ^^
i feel sorry for you!
bye bye...
Ryuga-san
League 1
- 14 January 2009
- Team
- AS Monaco
Sorry PRO_TOO I meant "in my opinion", instead of "the truth". I fixed itso glad to finally see someone here knowing "the truth"! ^^
i feel sorry for you!
bye bye...
.I don't know who to blame any more. I used to blame both the DFL and EA, and thought Konami were the good guys of the story. Maybe they are, I don't know. But what I don't want to do this time is to blame everybody except Konami.
What I think (I didn't say "the truth"
), is that Konami are not offensive enough towards EA license-wise. For example, why don't Konami make an exclusive partnership with an italian team like AC Milan, just the way EA did with Juventus? If Konami did that, EA couldn't have AC Milan as a licensed team in their game and everybody would moan about that. But fortunately for EA, Konami hasn't done that (for the moment?). There are some weird coincidences in this licensing thing. For years people wanted Dortmund in the game, and the year they finally come in PES, there's no Bayern. Some fans wanted the J-League in PES (while it was available in WE), and ultimately they come in FIFA.
IMO Konami are too soft in terms of licensing towards EA, they seem to hold themselves back while on the other side EA doesn't hesitate to hit Konami. Remember last year? EA exclusively licensed ManU, LaLiga and Juventus. What did most of the reviews mention when they talked about licenses in PES ? "No Man United. No Juventus. No real Liga.". That's really sad for Konami.
Anyway, this is just my opinion and it won't change the fact that we'll not have an authentic Bundesliga in PES before 2022. I was optimistic back in 2014, but now I'm sure PES will never have the Bundesliga as long as there's EA.
Hahaha one of my first mentions about 20 years ago was on pes fan about using the vibration function on the game. It only took them 18 years to I finally get it right
Not sure if this has been posted before but this is a less than stellar preview after a guy played the E3 build. Interesting point of view.
http://www.criticalhit.net/gaming/p...gle-making-annualised-games-feel-interesting/
Interesting that he said, pace of the game is still fast, could be cos he was playing against humans and space was so open it was quick end to end, that's what I'm assuming.
Hahaha one of my first mentions about 20 years ago was on pes fan about using the vibration function on the game. It only took them 18 years to I finally get it right
Not sure if this has been posted before but this is a less than stellar preview after a guy played the E3 build. Interesting point of view.
http://www.criticalhit.net/gaming/p...gle-making-annualised-games-feel-interesting/
Ther's only so much you can do with a football game. . .it will still be 11 players each team and get the ball into the net so there ain't much else they can do to improve it . ..except try and pick up on features that weren't in it the year before or improve existing features . ..to say it's a bit like last years will always be true.
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Chelsea4ever
League 1
- 12 March 2003
Is this for every online mode or just ranked matches? Can you invite friends from outside your region for friendlies etc?
The difference in budget between EA and Konami for FIFA & PES respectively is astronomical. Ignoring the fact that FIFA sells 40-1 copies vs. PES, the operating budgets of both games are stupidly different. EA can afford to spend millions on licenses and agreements with leagues - The Premier League license is worth something like 28 million a year (http://www.sportspromedia.com/news/ea_sports_renews_with_the_premier_league).
It's also coming from the clubs side as well - if you know that a game sells 40 times better to a particular audience then you're going to be more receptive to your club being represented in that game in order to get larger visibility. It's a no brainer from a club side which is why it's really great to see PES move into club licenses with Liverpool, Barcelona, Dortmund etc.
I honestly don't think we'll ever see this change, EA will always have the licenses for the key leagues and teams. It's a shame but we're not necessarily in this for the licenses, of course it matters to some degree but having the better playing football game is more important IMO.
PRO_TOO
Team Heffernan
yeah, IMO! thats much better!Sorry PRO_TOO I meant "in my opinion", instead of "the truth". I fixed it
I don't know who to blame any more. I used to blame both the DFL and EA, and thought Konami were the good guys of the story. Maybe they are, I don't know. But what I don't want to do this time is to blame everybody except Konami.
What I think (I didn't say "the truth"
There are some weird coincidences in this licensing thing. For years people wanted Dortmund in the game, and the year they finally come in PES, there's no Bayern. Some fans wanted the J-League in PES (while it was available in WE), and ultimately they come in FIFA.
IMO Konami are too soft in terms of licensing towards EA, they seem to hold themselves back while on the other side EA doesn't hesitate to hit Konami. Remember last year? EA exclusively licensed ManU, LaLiga and Juventus. What did most of the reviews mention when they talked about licenses in PES ? "No Man United. No Juventus. No real Liga.". That's really sad for Konami.
Anyway, this is just my opinion and it won't change the fact that we'll not have an authentic Bundesliga in PES before 2022. I was optimistic back in 2014, but now I'm sure PES will never have the Bundesliga as long as there's EA.
we dont know whats going on behind the scenes of license negotiations. we dont know what the licenses cost. we dont know anything. at least i have no clou. maybe some users that are working in that area could clarify...
a lot of questions asked by the users, right so. i'm interesseted myself in that regard. but it seems there are things we will never understand. as long as the OF's are working i dont care to much. thats just my point of view!
edit: and yeah, sure, one major point is the money EA can efford to invest in licenses. ^^
keep up the good conversation!
vialli82
International
- 4 September 2005
- Team
- Juventus
We can at least takes stats from PES club manager for bundesliga...
But i hope they will up-to-date the game from 2018-19 season, because it's still the same panel of attributes as PES 2015 (no new gk stats, not physical contact/balance)
That's the only thing which really interest me, don't care about having real faces
But i hope they will up-to-date the game from 2018-19 season, because it's still the same panel of attributes as PES 2015 (no new gk stats, not physical contact/balance)
That's the only thing which really interest me, don't care about having real faces
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- 7 August 2004
First touch error doesn't guarantee a major miscontrol. It includes any touches which are looser, where the direction varies from the direction the user has pressed.
With that in mind, thought I'd actually look at how true your statement is. There's nothing less helpful than going to Konami and saying there's no touch error when they know there is. You have to look at how it's actually being applied - just the same as your comment about every pass being flat as if on glass when that's not the case.
2:12 - you can see the touch is awry but conveniently goes with the BVB player. It looks Bergkampy but is lucky. IRL he would have had to take a second to work out where the ball has gone.
2:51 - a ball into the box flies up into the air after a failed take by the striker - I think it deflects off the defender to do so.
3:23 - a drilled ball out wide isn't taken cleanly, pushing Passlack out to the touchline.
3:32 - Passlack tries to control the punch out from Karius but doesn't keep it close enough to him and the onrushing defender dispossesses him.
3:49 - Schmelzer tries to run onto the loose ball but takes a heavy touch and loses out.
4:26 - Castro properly miscontrols the ball, it pops up a few yards behind him and he scrambles to pick it back up.
From this point on, there aren't really any difficult balls that would be a struggle to control as far as I saw. The video's poorly cut so there's a lot of stuff that gets missed out.
The vast majority of passes in the match shown are pretty straightforward, easy to control or play first time. It'd be good if somebody could put together a list of times where they thought there should have been error but there was none whatsoever, or not enough at all. The main one that sticks out to me is 4:04, when a Lallana cross field pass is taken down a bit too neatly (though it is also something you'd see fairly routinely if a player is under no pressure at all). It'd be interesting as well to see this pass played 10 times, with the intention to take the touch that same way, and see where the ball actually goes.
IMO, it looks like the first touch error is mostly pretty decent. If you want to increase the number of loose touches, you need to increase the number of passes that are difficult to control - most of these passes are slowing to a comfortable speed by the time they get to the recipient. You need to make other changes to get to that point - faster ball speed, less accurate passing (particularly first time passes), players finding themselves in less space. To make the game a bit more hectic.
But I want to play the game first before I get more specific.
Bravez
Championship
- 26 June 2005
Glad someone took the time to do this, I was too lazy.
I don't disagree the error could be more prevalent but it is definitely there, it's just subtle. It's stops players from making quick bursts or making a pass quickly when their touch is heavy or slow.
All. You have to have the same version of the game to play with friends.
Chuny
-
- 11 December 2007
Hahaha one of my first mentions about 20 years ago was on pes fan about using the vibration function on the game. It only took them 18 years to I finally get it right
Not sure if this has been posted before but this is a less than stellar preview after a guy played the E3 build. Interesting point of view.
http://www.criticalhit.net/gaming/p...gle-making-annualised-games-feel-interesting/
It's not that I always want to look at the glass half-full, but I can't take seriously a guy who refers to the amazing FOX ENGINE as "dusty". If anything, EA's Ignite and FrostBite look more dated making graphics almost cartoon-like than FOX ENGINE which just keeps improving every year and seems they can still take some juice out of it for another year or two.
I mean, just look at the massive changes between PES 2017 for PS4 and then for PS4 PRO. And it's the same game!
Now compare that to FIFA 17 on PS4 and then PS4 PRO, you can barely appreciate any changes aside from a smoother anti-alising filter.
I was actually looking forward to reading the one and only guy who actually played PES 2018, criticising PES 2018.
Matt10
International
- 5 February 2004
Hahaha one of my first mentions about 20 years ago was on pes fan about using the vibration function on the game. It only took them 18 years to I finally get it right
Not sure if this has been posted before but this is a less than stellar preview after a guy played the E3 build. Interesting point of view.
http://www.criticalhit.net/gaming/p...gle-making-annualised-games-feel-interesting/
I'm not sure he had a defined POV. This felt like an unfinished article, is there a page 2 I'm missing? It's like the article was more of a caption underneath the pictures.
When using the broadcast camera, FIFA 17 certainly looks better than PES 2017.
Apart from the resolution, there is literally no difference between the PS4 and the PS4 Pro version of PES 2017:
Matt10
International
- 5 February 2004
Yeah, I had to stop watching these videos. The problem with PES, from an analytical view, is that there are so many variables involved. These variables are used For or Against the discussion. They can be used as a crutch, or they can be used as a legitimate reason.
At the end of the day, it's all out of context. Was the advanced instructions on? Was the player role set to DMF or SS or CF? Is the attack/defense level rigidness lessened? Are the preset tactics rigidness lessened? Increased?
The last part, and the part that has me waiting until game is in hand, is that Adam already said he doesn't take those who analyze the game - without playing - seriously. While I 1000% disagree with that concept, there's no point in arguing if I know it's not going to make a lick of difference.
People harp on about how I focus too much on realism, to the point that it has a negative connotation..sadly. Let me tell you, it's not about for the sake of realism. It's about FUNCTION. The realism part occurs when the form of the function is introduced in the proper context.
I could talk about the space, but another, unmentioned, reason there's space is because players are backing off like PES 2010.
Bartra just decides to run away from Mane'...
The reason it seems so easy to dribble past is because the players off the ball are too agile - to a fault. Look closely at the defending players, see how quickly they essentially break from side to side, in multiple movements. They are caught in two minds. Last year it was about being caught in two minds attack/defense, now it seems to be left or right, forward/backwards.
Look at Lovren #6 here :
Again though, I haven't played the game. However, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that part of the success/failure in football is determined by the actions of players off the ball. Which is what a good majority any coach will focus on.
Chuny
-
- 11 December 2007
PES 2018 (and I think FIFA 18 too from what I've read) focuses a lot more on attacking. And will favour those who like attacking and dribbling, I know that already. That's not SIM. But it doesn't make it a bad game either. It still can (and I think it WILL) be the best football game ever.
Chuny
-
- 11 December 2007
Pyro
Championship
- 3 November 2011
Can we at least have a fake bundesliga in PES from now on? Or did they totally lose this?
At least it's good news for FM fans. FM 2018(or 2019) will have all leagues now.
At least it's good news for FM fans. FM 2018(or 2019) will have all leagues now.
PESBUL
Championship
- 11 June 2016
Well ... the bet will come for all at the same time or .. depends on the region where you live and where you made your PSS account? Does anyone remember how was for PES 2011 MLO beta?
I could talk about the space, but another, unmentioned, reason there's space is because players are backing off like PES 2010.
Bartra just decides to run away from Mane'...
The reason it seems so easy to dribble past is because the players off the ball are too agile - to a fault. Look closely at the defending players, see how quickly they essentially break from side to side, in multiple movements. They are caught in two minds. Last year it was about being caught in two minds attack/defense, now it seems to be left or right, forward/backwards.
Look at Lovren #6 here :
Again though, I haven't played the game. However, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that part of the success/failure in football is determined by the actions of players off the ball. Which is what a good majority any coach will focus on.
I understand your point but i don't fully agree with that, if a defender is too tight to an attacker most of the game and gets turned, he will eventually give space and the first image example isn't the best example, its very close to when he passes the ball and defender moves (Mane one i think).
2nd image with Lovren is a bit more odd though as when the ball is crossed in, he comes to a full stop immediately and then continues to move and looks unnatural. I just need to try this out for myself and see how responsive the defending is and animations and how fluid or non-fluid they are. time will tell really.
- Thread starter
- #2,850
ThomasGOAL
Retired Footballer
- 15 March 2003
Germany are not FIFPro members, so I don't think so...