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PES 2018 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread

talucchesi said:
Yea this is how I see it:

It's not about PES going the sim route that hurts their sales. It's that they don't do Sim WELL.

There isn't a more sim or in-depth game than 2k. Shoot, their offline modes are as indepth as their "ultimate team" and theyve also found a way to incooporate monetary profits for their offline modes through VC. The Show has to market freakin baseball and they still sell copies and have the most fanbase who thoroughly enjoy each game. Madden has been struggling to regain respect after their best and likely most in-depth game in 05. They're finally picking up that momentum. Why? Because Madden's becoming a good-ass, realistic game again. Penalties, inaccurate qb's, etc.

Pes' lack of licenses will always hurt sales, but a easy edit mode and miles better gameplay would attract many. Fifa's fanbase is always annoyed with perceived halfassed efforts in recent years. They're willing to try something new, Pes just has to shock them, like when 2k overtook NBA Live.
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well PES 2018 player models should impress them, they are miles better than FIFA now. Partnerships are coming yearly to also impress them. The roll PES is on i can't wait to see 2019.
 
In terms of competing with FIFA PES needs to be a lot better on the pitch than FIFA is ..even if it's equally as good or slightly better the majority will go for FIFA for the overall experience. I'm waiting this year for both to be released and then decide. If it's close I'm going with FIFA as PES always gets cheaper around XMAS new year where as FIFA holds value
 
Sorry, don't have the time listening to the podcast. But did u guys talk about passing PA 1 anything? Is a good balance between stats and user input? I can't bare another year with ping- ponging online. I play manual now but it takes away some of the individuality (it's now completely manual though...). I dream of the days when u FELT that u could do anything with Riquelme passing- wise, but when Cattermole had it u just wanted to play as safe as u could.
 
About PES2014.
That was a typical Konami product.
At it's core it was a very good game, but it was utterly broken because it was finished a couple of months too soon and one can doubt if it was tested (and if it was tested, what hallucinogens those tester had taken).
The game was crucified by the community and one can't really argue with that, but at the time people refused to see the very good core in it.
Unfortunately Konami took another turn (wich is understandable after the reactions) and the game became more arcadey... PES2015,16 and 17 were certainly better finshed products than 2014, but the franchise lost something with it.
 
so if they are using E3 code for the world tour, how are the chances we see that exact build for the online beta in july!?
would make no sense to have another build ready only 2-4 weeks after the world tour.

that would be so awesome... playing the same build as the guys at E3! i want to get to know that "E3 code was different to retail and demo" feeling! ;)
 
Do we know how to register for the Beta? As usual the site Konami have been horribly unclear.

I loved the PES 2014 Beta, even with its chronic input lag.

Can anyone who's listened to the podcast confirm if FKs were spoken about? Someone mentioned on here it's gone back to the old system but the tips in the corner on the game suggests they've just turned the guide off.

I would LOVE it if they returned to the old system. It was pretty much perfect.
 
gerd said:
About PES2014.
That was a typical Konami product.
At it's core it was a very good game, but it was utterly broken because it was finished a couple of months too soon and one can doubt if it was tested (and if it was tested, what hallucinogens those tester had taken).
The game was crucified by the community and one can't really argue with that, but at the time people refused to see the very good core in it.
Unfortunately Konami took another turn (wich is understandable after the reactions) and the game became more arcadey... PES2015,16 and 17 were certainly better finshed products than 2014, but the franchise lost something with it.
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I think pes2014, or the idea of it, was a bit ahead of its time - to the point ps3 just couldn't handle it.. or it really should have been released for the ps4. I remember early on with pes2014, with the poor response time, there was also the issue of slowdown in the final 3rd... then, later on, the final few patches fixed this, but also added some other problems like OP shooting... Still, if youre patient and give this game some time, its pretty damn good.
 
Bond!JamesBond! said:
My PES story:),
I never played PES until 2010 i thought it was ok but not great so i played 11,12. Then switched to FIFA 12,13,14. Then back to PES 15,16,17.

Two years ago i tried PES 5,6. I understand why now PES is popular. They nailed the perfect recipe back then. Game developers were genius. But today Konami doesn't have genius developers. That intelligent level isn't there, hopefully it comes back.:PRAY:

So for somebody who's new to old PES, take my story as you wish.
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Amen!
you experienced it backwards and still felt the magic, that says a lot.
 
scholes1 said:
If it was released as a full game at full retail and sold to people without prior knowledge of the original games it would get PANNED. Released as a £25 PSN game marketed as a fun arcade title it'd do very well.

Remember just launching crosses to vieri who was never beaten in the air and scored headers for fun?

The way certain traits and stats were exaggerated made these things stand out and it WAS great until things moved forward.

I've tried playing the games since (I know lots of you do still) but the whole thing felt dated and restricted. Too many things from newer games I miss. The problem is nobody gets the feeling they did from PES 6, from next gen PES or FIFA. Whilst I'd argue they're better games, they're not pushing boundaries like PS2 PES did so the feeling is far less.
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you didn't really get me i think.
An updated 4K HDR version of PES5 or PES6 with the latest teams and squads. smoother animations if possible. More stadiums
There wouldn't be any Vieri or Adriano. We know a few players and teams would have exaggerated stats but the fact still remains that because of the ballance these games had, there was always a way to counter that.
If you knew how much guys sell updated ps2 and pc patches and option files especially in South America you really wouldn't think it be a failure, especially cause it wouldn't cost as much to produce this game.
 
aussiepesfan said:
I think pes2014, or the idea of it, was a bit ahead of its time - to the point ps3 just couldn't handle it.. or it really should have been released for the ps4. I remember early on with pes2014, with the poor response time, there was also the issue of slowdown in the final 3rd... then, later on, the final few patches fixed this, but also added some other problems like OP shooting... Still, if youre patient and give this game some time, its pretty damn good.
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Second last patch was brilliant. . . the game played great but for some reason they changed it within a couple of weeks with a shite patch which ruined it.
 
Let me post my thoughts about those who asking for a PES 5 with new graphics.
Pes 5 and 6 was an ANCIENT game which aged very well.
The mechanics was so simple, so the development team had too little to consider.
1.More simplistic physics
2.Ball very linear and simple, not indepentent
3.Collisions was scripted, no plysics engine was applied there
4. ONLY 8 directions of movement
5. Assisted passes only (manual wasn't working well)

Therefore it was so simple to organise the AI, to predict the potential outcomes at each single situation.

Now, With manual 360 movement, manual passing, ball physics, indepentent ball, there are so many parameters and factors to be considered, and so hard to be organised into a perfect working game.

PES 2014 was phenomenal, regarding, physics, animations, photorealism, ball physics, but KONAMI threw away all this technology to give a more simple, technologically inferior pes 2015.
 
I've just caught up with the latest posts. Lots of very good points made across the board, concerning both the game itself as well as its organisational/business context. I especially liked Gerd's post about the concept of customisation, which I not only support 100%, but also consider one of the “keys” to solve many problems in the game. This needs to be emphasised and advocated consistently going forward.

Really looking forward to catching more glimpses of gameplay in the coming week. For the last few days I've rewatched the IGN 4K gameplay video over and over on a 50inch plasma TV and it never fails to impress me. I keep rewinding the footage every 5 seconds to watch a particular movement or ball bounce in slow motion, and most of the time it looks so good I almost have to pinch myself to make sure I'm not dreaming. Never in the last years decade have I been more excited than I am now. I can't wait for the demo!
 
GiogiPogi said:
For the last few days I've rewatched the IGN 4K gameplay video over and over on a 50inch plasma TV and it never fails to impress me.
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I watched it @ 1080p on my PC (hooked up to a 4K TV) and it already looked pretty good... It looks like I'll be finally using the YouTube app on the TV itself. Native 4K, here I come!
 
RAMAXWY said:
you didn't really get me i think.
An updated 4K HDR version of PES5 or PES6 with the latest teams and squads. smoother animations if possible. More stadiums
There wouldn't be any Vieri or Adriano. We know a few players and teams would have exaggerated stats but the fact still remains that because of the ballance these games had, there was always a way to counter that.
If you knew how much guys sell updated ps2 and pc patches and option files especially in South America you really wouldn't think it be a failure, especially cause it wouldn't cost as much to produce this game.
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The thing is, the balance was struck by having lots of exagerrated stats along with a finite number of outcomes which were always known. That was fine at the time, because there was nothing other than that and what konami did amazingly well was recreate the emotion etc using that balance and having the engine omptimised.

The issue now is there are no longer limited outcomes from a pass or shot or dribble etc They are finite still but the number is far higher. To then cater for all of these outcomes becomes an absolute minfield and so difficult to handle.

The reason they could be countered is because A could be countered by B and B by C and C by A if that makes sense? That means there wasn't a vast pool of outcomes to be balanced and tweaked.

Look, i still think those games were incredible at the time and there's a lot that can, and i expect will, be taken from them once Konami nail the basics. It looks as though they have finally found a base with which to work and from what i can see, they've made huge steps this year. I'm making a conscious decision to get excited about the improvements they have made than the things they missed. I used to hate a lot of things in the PS2 games but they were outweighed by the good stuff. I'm hoping we get to that point this year and I can overlook some issues. We had a really balanced game before but at the expense of freedom amongst plenty of other stuff.

I really hope next year Konami can put work into stats, even if it means they need to exaggerate some liek old days to make it really stand out, certainly for the top 50 players at least. That way you really get that wow when picking the ball up with Neymar for example. To do that though, everything else has to be nailed and working well.
 
DC1sfvUXkAEoe83.jpg:large
 
i also hope they put more time in making the stats matter much more. but since they want to attract FIFA players it makes me wonder how high that is on their priority list, since they are used to it to not really matter much.
Stoke can play like Barca in FIFA.
Still looks like it will be a good game but somehow i expected so much more.
so yes Gerd's costomization proposal seems to be where the future lies. cause going totally manual never really had my support.
 
scholes1 said:
Look, i still think those games were incredible at the time and there's a lot that can, and i expect will, be taken from them once Konami nail the basics.
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Don't get me started on the things that were there and that got removed (or that I don't notice anymore, at least)... There's just too much I'd love to see taken from those old games and implemented in PES from now on:
  • Evening matches, with a warmer light and longer shadows (they used to be there in PES 2010 if I recall correctly).
  • Snow (PES 5 and PES 6, it got removed at the beginning of the PS3 era and never came back).
  • The chance to mix and match shorts/socks, so for example Milan home kit would feature white or black shorts depending on the need (PES 5).
  • The biased commentator: you could choose to have him support the home team, the away team or to be neutral (PES 3 I believe).
  • Crowd stance and support, where you could decide how much full the stadium would be and whether the crowd would support more the home team or would be more neutral (PES 4 if I don't remember wrong).
  • Different kinds of crowd noise depending on the nation, some would chant while some would use percussions (PES 6).
  • Stadium creator, although it was pretty limited (PES 2011).
  • Stadiums! I take that the Spanish teams, at least the ones of them which are unlicensed, can't have a licensed stadium anymore but hey, teams like Ajax are licensed (and Amsterdam ArenA used to be in back in the day). Benfica and AS Monaco are licensed, so are Sporting CP, Lazio and Roma. Bring on their stadiums again!
Just imagine how better would PES 2018 be if they only brought back these things...
 
*aLe said:
Don't get me started on the things that were there and that got removed (or that I don't notice anymore, at least)... There's just too much I'd love to see taken from those old games and implemented in PES from now on:
  • Evening matches, with a warmer light and longer shadows (they used to be there in PES 2010 if I recall correctly).
  • Snow (PES 5 and PES 6, it got removed at the beginning of the PS3 era and never came back).
  • The chance to mix and match shorts/socks, so for example Milan home kit would feature white or black shorts depending on the need (PES 5).
  • The biased commentator: you could choose to have him support the home team, the away team or to be neutral (PES 3 I believe).
  • Crowd stance and support, where you could decide how much full the stadium would be and whether the crowd would support more the home team or would be more neutral (PES 4 if I don't remember wrong).
  • Different kinds of crowd noise depending on the nation, some would chant while some would use percussions (PES 6).
  • Stadium creator, although it was pretty limited (PES 2011).
  • Stadiums! I take that the Spanish teams, at least the ones of them which are unlicensed, can't have a licensed stadium anymore but hey, teams like Ajax are licensed (and Amsterdam ArenA used to be in back in the day). Benfica and AS Monaco are licensed, so are Sporting CP, Lazio and Roma. Bring on their stadiums again!
Just imagine how better would PES 2018 be if they only brought back these things...
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Bookmarking your post for future ref.

Also, outstanding work on the new faces!
 
*aLe said:
Don't get me started on the things that were there and that got removed (or that I don't notice anymore, at least)... There's just too much I'd love to see taken from those old games and implemented in PES from now on:
  • Evening matches, with a warmer light and longer shadows (they used to be there in PES 2010 if I recall correctly).
  • Snow (PES 5 and PES 6, it got removed at the beginning of the PS3 era and never came back).
  • The chance to mix and match shorts/socks, so for example Milan home kit would feature white or black shorts depending on the need (PES 5).
  • The biased commentator: you could choose to have him support the home team, the away team or to be neutral (PES 3 I believe).
  • Crowd stance and support, where you could decide how much full the stadium would be and whether the crowd would support more the home team or would be more neutral (PES 4 if I don't remember wrong).
  • Different kinds of crowd noise depending on the nation, some would chant while some would use percussions (PES 6).
  • Stadium creator, although it was pretty limited (PES 2011).
  • Stadiums! I take that the Spanish teams, at least the ones of them which are unlicensed, can't have a licensed stadium anymore but hey, teams like Ajax are licensed (and Amsterdam ArenA used to be in back in the day). Benfica and AS Monaco are licensed, so are Sporting CP, Lazio and Roma. Bring on their stadiums again!
Just imagine how better would PES 2018 be if they only brought back these things...
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I miss dusk weather too. The orange tone looked so beautiful. But they removed it because they think its not important as gameplay.

But I think weather matters. Durin rainy matches, players should slide more, lots of improvement can be done for rain weather.

Snow affects the gameplay too. Nevertheless, having them back will be great.
 
Couple of nice goals on Twitter from PES world tour..the Liverpool one with the dink over the keeper is nice ..search #pes2018WT
 
Had a lengthy chat with Adam on twitter yesterday. Some of you may have seen it. I will post it fully here so nothing's taken out of context.

@Lami_Z
This and my tweet and my evoweb poll should be proof enough many agree and not just one man's opinion @officialpes more options the better

@Adam_Bhatti
We acknowledge it mate, I certainly do. But in a world where we get 1000s of requests a day, we simply need to prioritise based on data

@Adam_Bhatti
So it's not a case of ignoring, but making sure we hear everyone, and use resource to implement the things most fans want. We'll get there :thumbsup:

@Lami_Z
Thanks for acknowledging Adam. We're a good diehard portion of the pes community wanting the best football represented in-game for #pes2018

@Lami_Z
We appreciate your hard work sifting through tons of requests. Just little tweaks and we have nothing short of a masterpiece #pes2018

@Lami_Z
Hope you've seen enough passion from us & shot up the priority list ;)

@Lami_Z
Not asking much tho; Tactic option to return, defence lines fixed & more stat driven first touches if possible. Can sliders ala FIFA help?

@Adam_Bhatti
Doesn't work like that. I came in 4 years ago wanting many things, believing what I thought was right. Quickly learnt to make right choices.

@Lami_Z
Poll I've done on evoweb. Wanted to wait for it to reach a higher number before showing it to you. Looks good ;). #PES2018 (Showed him an image of the poll here)

@Adam_Bhatti
There's things that get asked by 5,000 people that don't even make the top 10 of overall requests, it's not an easy task pleasing everyone.

@Lami_Z
Of course. What we hope be in are football fundamentals that should've been there all along though. They're what makes football, football.

@Adam_Bhatti
In your opinion. I don't expect you to accept or even understand why things are a certain way,I was very different before I joined Konami

@Lami_Z
But we've got videos that clearly show these issues & many people agree. We do this every year & always asked to wait til demo. By which time it's too late and people discuss their same frustrations by winter then waiting and hoping the next game is better

@Adam_Bhatti
I see it all the time. But when I sit down and see what the serious issues actually are, these things don't even register.

@Adam_Bhatti
Man, I came in asking for stadium editor, boot editor and team kit edit like PES 5 where you could change shirt and socks. Got a big shock!

@Lami_Z
What happened?

@Adam_Bhatti
So low on the request scale, but more importantly extremely low on the in-game usage reports. Point is, we hear you all, tough to please all

@Lami_Z
Ok. Good to know where I stand. Won't bother any more.

@Adam_Bhatti
No please do. The point I'm making is not to presume what you think is always a simple choice to make. Push for what you believe in, always :thumbsup:

@Lami_Z
I fully know where you're coming from. But it looks like the sim pes diehards want will always be low on the list. Pursuing seems futile.

@Lami_Z
But I'll keep trying. Can't stop trying. It's a 2 decade love story.

@Adam_Bhatti
Great, I hope comms helps you understand a little more, even if u don't agree. But I feel when you play the game, you'll see we are aligned in vision, in desire to create a realistic experience. What you see in videos, is something you cannot feel. Like the old days :thumbsup:

@Lami_Z
I hope so. Nothing feels better than playing pes like I would football irl; tactics, dribbling, passing, to scoring feeling fully immersed

@Adam_Bhatti
I strongly believe you will get it in PES 2018. When you finally play the game, you'll feel the weight, the realism in movement etc.

@Lami_Z
August feels too far off. Any chance I get in the online beta?

@Adam_Bhatti
Of course, it's open :thumbsup:

@Lami_Z
Fabulous. Is it happening soon?

@Adam_Bhatti
July 20th-31st

@Lami_Z
:thumbsup:
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giphy.gif
 
*aLe said:
Don't get me started on the things that were there and that got removed (or that I don't notice anymore, at least)... There's just too much I'd love to see taken from those old games and implemented in PES from now on:
  • Evening matches, with a warmer light and longer shadows (they used to be there in PES 2010 if I recall correctly).
  • Snow (PES 5 and PES 6, it got removed at the beginning of the PS3 era and never came back).
  • The chance to mix and match shorts/socks, so for example Milan home kit would feature white or black shorts depending on the need (PES 5).
  • The biased commentator: you could choose to have him support the home team, the away team or to be neutral (PES 3 I believe).
  • Crowd stance and support, where you could decide how much full the stadium would be and whether the crowd would support more the home team or would be more neutral (PES 4 if I don't remember wrong).
  • Different kinds of crowd noise depending on the nation, some would chant while some would use percussions (PES 6).
  • Stadium creator, although it was pretty limited (PES 2011).
  • Stadiums! I take that the Spanish teams, at least the ones of them which are unlicensed, can't have a licensed stadium anymore but hey, teams like Ajax are licensed (and Amsterdam ArenA used to be in back in the day). Benfica and AS Monaco are licensed, so are Sporting CP, Lazio and Roma. Bring on their stadiums again!
Just imagine how better would PES 2018 be if they only brought back these things...
Click to expand...

I agree with most of what you've mentioned there. ... I loved those evening matches and the different atmosphere and noises when playing in Africa or against the Netherlands for instance. . ..made it all more realistic.
 
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