PES 2018 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread

slamsoze said:
Also something crucial i forgot to mention. @vxcmplx told us before about the advantages of using super cancel and how it breaks the rails. I confirm now that running with R2+R1 (supercancel) can often by-pass the catch up bug. Even if you are with your speedy striker and you are running only with R1 ,shoulder to shoulder with the opponent defender after a through ball or a chipped through ball, 9/10 times you are caught by catch-up. Ok i know it seems pointless to use super cancel to just sprint some meters ahead. But if you try to run with super-cancel you will see a clipped animation where you player will starting moving a little bit faster and you will outrun the defender like he was slowed down by invisible chains and shutters them after. This at least off-the ball. On the ball you are being caught up even if you run a 99 speed player vs a 40 speed player.
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Using super cancel to adapt your run and help outrun or catch players is PES 101 lol. Got nothing to do with cancelling the effect of some bug.

It's just an assistance system -- without the ball, PES works by orienting players near to the ball to its direction. It's like a kind of magnetism, and it's on par with the assistance given to shooting and passing. Like those two elements, you can make running "full manual", by using super cancel.

The game isn't randomly restricting your movement with this assistance; it's doing it to keep you locked onto the path of the ball. For any serious player, you have to be overriding it a lot of the time, because you're thinking ahead of the ball. Off the ball I'm holding super cancel for large periods of the game, except when I'm jockeying.
 
janguv said:
..Using super cancel to adapt your run and help outrun or catch players is PES 101 lol. Got nothing to do with cancelling the effect of some bug.

....
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I use super cancel since it was introduced.Thank you for the repeat of the explanation after all.
You clearly did not understand what i said. When the ball is to a point B ahead of you and you are in a point A with an opponent, if you go from A to B with opponent following,simply pressing R1 your player usually gets caught up.THIS is not a bug. I did not say anything about bug. It is game mechanic to create scripts or momentum.
If you run with R1+R2 you run technically "free". You don't need to change direction just get "de-magnetized" from the rail-path. Just run straight with R1+R2, it seems pointless phenomenically since the only thing you do is running straight ahead. BUT your player runs closer to his original speed statistic.
AFter all i tried it, i have implemented it in my playstyle and it works. I started doing it to take shortcuts of the ball to win some balls, but in the course i saw that it works even for a simple straight 20 meters sprint and i posted it.I am winning challenges and do some counter attacks that could not do before.

P.S.: What is PES101lol? A personal offense against me?
 
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slamsoze said:
What is PES101lol? A personal offense against me?
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Not meant to be a dig at you, no. But not everyone knows about this feature, and the way you spoke about it in your first post (and this new one too) makes me think this way of using super cancel is new to you, whereas it's actually a long-established usage.

slamsoze said:
THIS is not a bug. I did not say anything about bug. It is game mechanic to create scripts or momentum.
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slamsoze said:
I confirm now that running with R2+R1 (supercancel) can often by-pass the catch up bug.
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I only mentioned 'bug' because you did so in your post. I too don't think it is actually a bug; I think it's a game mechanic. I disagree that it is used to create/affect momentum. I think it is just part of the (dodgy, often unhelpful) assistance system which doesn't trust players to have free control. (Incidentally, in real life football, the "catch up" phenomenon does happen, even between mismatched defenders and attackers—another reason I don't think of the in-game representation as a bug.)

slamsoze said:
AFter all i tried it, i have implemented it in my playstyle and it works. I started doing it to take shortcuts of the ball to win some balls, but in the course i saw that it works even for a simple straight 20 meters sprint and i posted it.I am winning challenges and do some counter attacks that could not do before.
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It's this kind of thing that made me refer to super cancel usage as PES 101, because this is an old and faithful way of using it—as old as the introduction of super cancel itself.

slamsoze said:
Just run straight with R1+R2, it seems pointless phenomenically since the only thing you do is running straight ahead. BUT your player runs closer to his original speed statistic.
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I think this description isn't quite right. Super cancel allows you to run a path which—as you say—is not stuck to a rail. What the game mechanic wants is for your player to curve towards the ball in its present position and so always slow down the run to increase the accuracy of that run-path. It's like a homing function.

With that function off, you can chase other things, such as the future position of the ball, which is great for interceptions, or the future path of the player (great for obstruction). If you're running ahead of the ball, you'll run at full pace, except if you're turning as you do it. Running in that situation without super cancel, you're constantly curving towards the ball (imperceptibly), in order to stay locked onto it, which is why the pace is reduced.
 
janguv said:
Not meant to be a dig at you, no. But not everyone knows about this feature, and the way you spoke about it in your first post (and this new one too) makes me think this way of using super cancel is new to you, whereas it's actually a long-established usage.




I only mentioned 'bug' because you did so in your post. I too don't think it is actually a bug; I think it's a game mechanic. I disagree that it is used to create/affect momentum. I think it is just part of the (dodgy, often unhelpful) assistance system which doesn't trust players to have free control. (Incidentally, in real life football, the "catch up" phenomenon does happen, even between mismatched defenders and attackers—another reason I don't think of the in-game representation as a bug.)



It's this kind of thing that made me refer to super cancel usage as PES 101, because this is an old and faithful way of using it—as old as the introduction of super cancel itself.



I think this description isn't quite right. Super cancel allows you to run a path which—as you say—is not stuck to a rail. What the game mechanic wants is for your player to curve towards the ball in its present position and so always slow down the run to increase the accuracy of that run-path. It's like a homing function.

With that function off, you can chase other things, such as the future position of the ball, which is great for interceptions, or the future path of the player (great for obstruction). If you're running ahead of the ball, you'll run at full pace, except if you're turning as you do it. Running in that situation without super cancel, you're constantly curving towards the ball (imperceptibly), in order to stay locked onto it, which is why the pace is reduced.
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Basically it seems to me that we talking about the same thing.Our posts have the same meaning. Or i get lost in translation.
My point is like your. Moving only with L stick+R1 or not R1, is moving guided by the game engine assistance. The same applies for defending especially this year that engine is bad at positioning players. If you defend trying to intercept with R2+R1 and press X in good timing you have better defending results than by just pressing the X even in the right timing,the AI will possibly disposition you. That's why also square defending is nerfed this year. It is the function you describe ,the engine assisting you according to ball current position. I hope we say the same thing this time, or i must go and do courses to refresh my English speaking.
I made the first post cause, despite i use the super cancel since PES 3 i never imagined that you could run more free in a single straight line.Ok i used it to intercept passssing lanes ,or to challenge bad-accuracy passes.

As for the catch-up bug, ok you are right the "bug" term is technically false ,it is an permanent AI mechanic not something temporary i know, i used it as it is missused all these years in the pes discussions. I think i have seen many people calling it the catch up bug. But we know that it is not a bug with the meaning of a software bug.

I didn't feel totally offended from your previous message. Just wondered if it is hirony or salty against me, as if i lied or i had said that i made a "Fatality combo" in PES.
 
Ahhh so a patch came out the other day. I only noticed it because I turned on the Xbox and it was part way through installing it. Didn't know what it was for but got to play a game last night - the third group stage game of my world cup campaign. Australia vs Peru.

Gameplay seemed different so the fine print about minor gameplay tweaks seems to be accurate lol. Saw a few different animations and the ball seemed a bit more free. I wonder when they get to this stage of development for the new game if they try incorporating some of it into the existing game to see how it works.

There was an attemped overhead kick where the player struck it straight into the ground and it bounced up and over the bar harmlessly - normally they go straight over the bar (maybe this animation was already happening before for other people). Saw a great 50-50 challenge where the keeper got to the ball at the same time the striker did (inside the box)and instead of magically grabbing the ball, the striker got a foot in first.
 
This might have been answered before but is there any reason why Konami don't update the National teams? You know, since there is a little thing called the World Cup going on and all...
 
Someone clear this up to me please.

Regarding dribbling mechanics... Just tapping r1 randomly on the ball can make players take different touchs ?

I think I am slowly rediscovering drubbling on this game

I am also loving the new dribbling animations of well timed click r1 button.

Im trying to combine the two, tapping r1 quickly and ramdonly with the proximity of defender and making a timed r1 click in the exact moment the defender try to tackle and steal.the ball.
 
Yes reduction in fouls if that was even possible ..now seeing maximum of two per game ..patch before i was winning penalties by diving at the right time ..doesnt seem to work now at all
 
hitmanuk said:
Yes reduction in fouls if that was even possible ..now seeing maximum of two per game ..patch before i was winning penalties by diving at the right time ..doesnt seem to work now at all
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Crap!
I was warming tw this game (minus scripting)
I've tried to dive a few times,got booked:)
 
if ever there was proof they do actually make adjustments to gameplay its the fact they have nerfed closing down an AI defender when the Gk plays a short goal kick

before you could run straight at them to steal it and have a clear chance now your player will automatically stop as he gets too close giving the AI more time to clear

just a small thing i noticed
 
Aha,that's something I use to do when playing on professional difficulty,did it work on higher difficulty as well?

One of the things I liked on 18 Vs 17 is the fact that goalies are a bit more human,I've never seen a goaile in 17 missing a clearance with his feet,but I've seen weird human stuff in 18.
I hope they have the GK for 19 at least at a Pes 18 level
 
yea used to work on superstar especially against weaker teams if you timed it right (i didnt try to abuse it though as was a bit too cheap of a way to score)

and agree about the goalkeepers i think the defenders need a bit more human type mistakes added in too they very rarely mistime things or passes in open play sometimes when they get possession in a crowded box when you have a corner they just pass it out with 100% accuracy rather see them make hacked clearances now and then
 
saintric said:
yea used to work on superstar especially against weaker teams if you timed it right (i didnt try to abuse it though as was a bit too cheap of a way to score)

and agree about the goalkeepers i think the defenders need a bit more human type mistakes added in too they very rarely mistime things or passes in open play sometimes when they get possession in a crowded box when you have a corner they just pass it out with 100% accuracy rather see them make hacked clearances now and then
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Yes,they need a bit more of a human touch to them.
It usually work if you have gegenpress, I’ve forced them to making bad clearances,and even stealing it,even seen them scoring own goals because of pressure.
If I’m not playing gegenpress full on,I always have it turned on when I’m getting corners
 
Fires it up the last two days again (ML).
I don´t know what they have done, but it feels okay for me. Somehow the ball is more loose.
Also the goals I concede from the CPU look fine.
At least I haven´t seen them before like that. Volleys, low shots....etc...really nice.

After watching the world cup, playing that game, feels very well at the moment.
I can´t complain that much, to be honest.

About fouls...
I still have some...more or less.....two in one game yesterday.
That´s less, yeah, but it´s not that the latest patch removed them.

EDIT:
One of the little things I´d wish for, was a more realistic team handling by the CPU. Played CL quarterfinals against Real Madrid and Ronaldo got subbed in the 60th minute (no injury).
In real life this wouldn´t happen....but well.....now that I think of it....I´m playing my 3rd or 4th season, so he must be like in his end thirties...?
 
i was seeing as low as four and as many as 6 fouls in a game - i was getting at least two shooting chances from free kicks regularly and was able to win penalties - thing i had 3 in four games (by diving at the right time). This has definitely decreased, luck to get one free kick in shooting range every two games - the AI just doensnt close down enough and penalties forget it. This doesnt reflect the world cup at all to me as there are loads of fouls, freekicks in shooting range and a fair few pens - i honestly think its by design now - they dont want collisions that will slow down online play and that is being transferred to single player.
 
Yeah, the problem with KONAMI is, finding the balance.

I remember PES 2014 coming with a patch, where every little push got called.
This really destroyed the flow of the game as you barely had 5 game-minutes without interruption.

Now it´s too extreme in the other direction.
I only get fouls when AI slides from behind, which doesn´t happen too often.
It doesn´t bug me that much, even quite often the AI gets away quite much with very questionable tackles and slides.

I just wish this could be more dynamic, where the agression level and ref strictness and everything depends on which game it is (derby, finals etc), which teams play against each other, which players are on the field (for example Ramos who´s known to be quite heedless) and so on.
 
chiefrocka4real said:
Yeah, the problem with KONAMI is, finding the balance.

I remember PES 2014 coming with a patch, where every little push got called.
This really destroyed the flow of the game as you barely had 5 game-minutes without interruption.

Now it´s too extreme in the other direction.
I only get fouls when AI slides from behind, which doesn´t happen too often.
It doesn´t bug me that much, even quite often the AI gets away quite much with very questionable tackles and slides.

I just wish this could be more dynamic, where the agression level and ref strictness and everything depends on which game it is (derby, finals etc), which teams play against each other, which players are on the field (for example Ramos who´s known to be quite heedless) and so on.
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It’s way to unbalanced like you say,I can live with few fouls,guess having 5-10 free kicks in a 20 min game would be perfect,that’s about what I get in 17.
But it should be a bit more aggressive and more sloppy and reckless at time (derby,fighting for trophies etc)
Biggest killer for me is no penalties,which has been an issue on 16-17-18,few on 16-17,none on 18.
I really miss that,especially when I’m playing 11-12-14 right now and see it regularly
 
rockstrongo said:
It’s way to unbalanced like you say,I can live with few fouls,guess having 5-10 free kicks in a 20 min game would be perfect,that’s about what I get in 17.
But it should be a bit more aggressive and more sloppy and reckless at time (derby,fighting for trophies etc)
Biggest killer for me is no penalties,which has been an issue on 16-17-18,few on 16-17,none on 18.
I really miss that,especially when I’m playing 11-12-14 right now and see it regularly
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You are absolutely right.

I totally forgot that I never had any penalty, even I got fouled in the box, just like @hitmanuk said.
 
In my ML I play 5 or 6 games in a row without suffering any fouls, this is ridiculous! And I never had a penalty in ML, why Konami does things like that? Why?
 
Just finish playing an WC with Brazil and manual shooting. Man! Its fun playing on manual! When you miss, YOU miss and dont have that feeling of the game is cheating you. Shooting became way more variated as well! Its so cool man!

Here two goals I score on manual. Please dont mind Firmino skating on the first one:LOL:

 
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