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PES 2011 Discussion thread

fideco said:
Just raised aggression and defence values to 98 for sideback and fullback with editor and played a match.
It does nothing.:FAIL:
The "Green Zone Corner" Bug is hardcoded.
As i said in several post on several forum AI behavior is intentionally scripted by Konami to do "nothing" in that zone.
Therefore for Konami it's not a bug...
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That's not true at all. Not being affected by stats doesn't make something intentional, does it?

They just need to expand the AI's pitch coverage by a couple of metres each side of the pitch.
 
I tried it, yes it's there. But only if you're losing. Dunno if this was noticed already, but if the game is drawn or you're winning, although the defender covering you will stand still (he shouldn't), others will come to take the ball from you.
 
romagnoli said:
That's not true at all. Not being affected by stats doesn't make something intentional, does it?

They just need to expand the AI's pitch coverage by a couple of metres each side of the pitch.
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They're the wrong stats as well. I too believe it's a programming issue but defence influences positioning and aggression how aggressively and often a player will join the attack and make attacking runs. High aggression = more runs forward.

What he'd be looking for are work rate and mentality but I have no doubt it won't make a difference.
 
Nice Game...But Ps3 version Graphics is pixeled while PC version is far polished and detailed(I have both demos)...does Anyone konw if Xbox360 version is pixeled too?

Is there any chance to have final build for PS3 more detaliled and less pixeled?

please answer me
 
romagnoli said:
When I did it, the score was 0-0, Internacional vs Chivas. The only highlight of the half shown was the kick-off.
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Well, been trying different situations. Everytime you're losing, the A.I. will be much less aggressive, no matter where you are on the field, the man covering you will not make a move, and the game will actually "stop" if you wish. If you're winning, the other defenders reaction to you stopping is almost immediate (although the man covering you still doesn't make a move), 1 or more players will rush in to get the ball from you.

I'm still uncertain on drawn matches. My guess is that 0-0 is different from 1-1.

Also, if you're winning, getting past through the defense by simply "jogging", not happening (at least I can't do it.)
 
Rooney10 said:
i seriously suspect klash/jimmy being connected to Konami somehow. they're always coming out to defend the game, even to the point that it makes no sense. player runs were so normal in old-gen pes?!
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Excellent post. Wonder why jimmy and Thomasgoal ever left this site. (Sarcasm mode off)

Just because klash doesn't agree and posts a counter argument this shit gets thrown back at him.

Bye...
 
_anderson said:
Lol. If you were a purist you wouldn't be worried about this particular exploit.
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It probably wouldn't be that difficult to look beyond the sideline/corner exploit, but that second video, really? I mean, the guy is dribbling up the middle of the pitch for god's sake and the defense is totally complacent - how does something like that not have widespread ramifications?


Fitiello said:
Nice Game...But Ps3 version Graphics is pixeled while PC version is far polished and detailed(I have both demos)...does Anyone konw if Xbox360 version is pixeled too?

Is there any chance to have final build for PS3 more detaliled and less pixeled?

please answer me
Click to expand...

I believe someone said the difference is due to the console demo being a smaller size. Dunno if true or not.
 
I have been playing the WE demo and if the full version of PES is not the same I will cry. I do remember in the demo impression thread a guy that played the final game saying that it was different, what he described as the differences(slower & tighter) sound like WE to me, so fingers crossed.

I played about 5 matches with Japan earlier, did not touch the sprint button once and the game has just been taken to a new level. I liked it before but now I feel I am playing the best football simulation yet.

Expander is right, I thought he was full of sh*t at first but this game is hardcore, not the cpu difficulty but the depth of the game. Kind of reminds me of the old 2D fighting games, any idiot can pick up the pad hit the buttons and play, but there is a massive amount to learn and not everyone will see it.
Also like the fighting games timing appears to be a big factor. When I do now use the sprint button it has to be timed, press it too soon and you will have the ball caught up in your feet, too late and you will not get a good touch. This alone ramps up the difficulty considerably, the position of the ball when sprint is applied affects the quality of touch and acceleration speed. I do not think Konami have all the animations in needed to make this more apparent and this is where the game falls down for some as they can not understand why certain things that just seem wrong are happening.
Dribbling is hugely timing sensitive but it also has the added difficulty of having a feel for the players touching of the ball and the timing of applying sprint when necessary. Until this point I always found dribbling to be a bit frustrating and inconsistant, that was because I sucked at it and I still do, but now I have an understanding of the mechanic and it and it is very, very good. With the Japanese front man, I was able to turn my way out of a barricade of 3 Bayern players then past 1 more and if I hadnt used sprint would of had a clear shot of goal, I pushed the ball too far and it got taken. The replay looked like a Messi highlight, the close touches, body shimmying, feinting and tight turns, it was by far the most impressive thing I have done soo far in the game and I am just getting started.
Timing also applies to the controlling of the ball, your player taking the first touch is just the start. You have to time your touches after, the quality of your timing will effect the subsequent pass/movement/shot. Move the stick too soon after you have taken the ball down and you might catch it on the bounce, knocking it on in the air will mean you have much less control with your next action. Or maybe you have not knocked the ball far enough infront to hit the shoot and it balloons over, these are all things that need to be considered.

I could go on about what I have recently discovered but I dont know if anyone has read this far or wants to read more so I will stop. But in closing, having the realisation of the depth the game has, has taken it to a whole new level for me, I think it is necessary to play with the lesser teams to appreciate it, it is very much a simulation and requires that it played as one to get the full enjoyment. I now understand why things felt forced and unnatural when adjusting to the game and I ask that people really persevere with it and dont jump back to FIFA after a few games, under a few layers is a great game and it takes time to understand.
I cant believe the satisfaction I get just playing the ball round defense, into midfield and back because of pressure but still keeping possession and playing 1 or 2 nice passes along the way. Or taking 20 - 30 passes to get the ball up field, spotting a run behind defense and then getting the final ball all wrong but not caring because the build up was just brilliant and utterly enjoyable. Or theres going into replay 20 times in a game to see how I evaded a tackle with close control, look at a aneat touch or a perfectly placed manual pass. I really think this is the best PES I have played and by a sizable distance.
 
Fitiello said:
Nice Game...But Ps3 version Graphics is pixeled while PC version is far polished and detailed(I have both demos)...does Anyone konw if Xbox360 version is pixeled too?

Is there any chance to have final build for PS3 more detaliled and less pixeled?

please answer me
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Is the Xbox360 demo now available for silver members?

If so I'll give it a try and compare the graphics to the PS3 version.

zeemeister said:
Excellent post. Wonder why jimmy and Thomasgoal ever left this site. (Sarcasm mode off)

Just because klash doesn't agree and posts a counter argument this shit gets thrown back at him.

Bye...
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Agreed. Two huge assets to Evo-Web lost because of the amount of fucking idiots on here.
 
I must say I'm very tempted to download the WE demo but I'm too afraid that it's going to be better than the retail version of PES...
 
Jamezinho said:
The Copa Lib mode will probably have an exhibition mode like the Champions League mode does.

That will be something at least, but I'm still not happy. My dreams of matches between the European and South American clubs are now shattered.
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I just hope it is true... Have Ronaldo and Roberto Carlos and not being able to take the world with them is so fustrating.
 
Kelf said:
I just hope it is true... Have Ronaldo and Roberto Carlos and not being able to take the world with them is so fustrating.
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we will be able to copy every copa lib player and ad to created team or free player slots for master league using base copy function in edit mode so its not as bad as 1st thought
 
Ern Dog said:
Expander is right, I thought he was full of sh*t at first but this game is hardcore, not the cpu difficulty but the depth of the game.
Click to expand...
Absolutely. It's why it's frustrating and cringe inducing when he mixes the two so often because it dilutes those parts of his posts which are true. It is fantastically deep - a lot of people complain about juddery/clunky animations, but in many cases it's because they're "doing it wrong". You can't just hold sprint and press a direction to knock the ball past a challenger - you've got to time it right to get the desired effect. You can't just hold R2 and move in any direction the split second you move the stick - you have to manipulate your momentum as well as your opponents. You can't just hold forwards and pressure, otherwise you get the dozens of fouls people complain about. You've got to time your challenges, holding the opponent up and not committing.

The game is way short of perfect still, but 2012 and 2013 will see Konami listen to what we think needs improving from here and build further. For a lot of us who have 'come back', perfection wasn't a requirement.
What we wanted was a PES that was playable, enjoyable and deep. You can tell at this early stage that those three have been ticked for a lot more of us than recent in years.
 
But will the Copa Libertadores players be usable in MLO? That's my biggest issue. I think the MLO will be a great success and the more players are available the more diversified (and therefore fun) the game will be. I just hope for the better...

Right now I am feeling some of the old PES 6 magic environment! Feels good to have the real deal back.
 
Ern Dog said:
I have been playing the WE demo and if the full version of PES is not the same I will cry. I do remember in the demo impression thread a guy that played the final game saying that it was different, what he described as the differences(slower & tighter) sound like WE to me, so fingers crossed.
.
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I'm sorry but did you say you've also played the pes demo and the WE demo seems better to you? Or have you only played the WE demo?
 
romagnoli said:
Absolutely. It's why it's frustrating and cringe inducing when he mixes the two so often because it dilutes those parts of his posts which are true. It is fantastically deep - a lot of people complain about juddery/clunky animations, but in many cases it's because they're "doing it wrong". You can't just hold sprint and press a direction to knock the ball past a challenger - you've got to time it right to get the desired effect. You can't just hold R2 and move in any direction the split second you move the stick - you have to manipulate your momentum as well as your opponents. You can't just hold forwards and pressure, otherwise you get the dozens of fouls people complain about. You've got to time your challenges, holding the opponent up and not committing.

The game is way short of perfect still, but 2012 and 2013 will see Konami listen to what we think needs improving from here and build further. For a lot of us who have 'come back', perfection wasn't a requirement.
What we wanted was a PES that was playable, enjoyable and deep. You can tell at this early stage that those three have been ticked for a lot more of us than recent in years.
Click to expand...

Very good post. Agree with everything you said.

On the core, on what matters, PES is "PES" again. Every PES fan should be happy with what PES 2011 is because of that.
 
romagnoli said:
It is fantastically deep - a lot of people complain about juddery/clunky animations, but in many cases it's because they're "doing it wrong". You can't just hold sprint and press a direction to knock the ball past a challenger - you've got to time it right to get the desired effect. You can't just hold R2 and move in any direction the split second you move the stick - you have to manipulate your momentum as well as your opponents. You can't just hold forwards and pressure, otherwise you get the dozens of fouls people complain about. You've got to time your challenges, holding the opponent up and not committing.
Click to expand...

Ironic isn't it that it's FIFA with all the tutorials when it's PES that needs it most, especially for those who've been chilling on the Dark Side these last few years.

Defending isn't so much a problem as offense. The game's been getting better and more enjoyable for me but if the clunky feeling is all down to me playing the game wrong, hell if I know what it is I'm doing wrong. Some of it is just not knowing how to do something, and there's much to learn, but it sucks not knowing how to do simple things like a knock-on much alone how to manipulate momentum as suggested.
 
My two cents on the off-the-ball movement:

Steekbal said:
I believe the lack of off the ball movement in PES is due to poor player stats. There are a few stats which decide off the ball movement, including attack, aggression and mentality. Player cards can have influence as well.

Attack stat determines how well a player can position himself in an attacking position. Aggression determines how often and aggressively a player will make a run forward, and finally mentality is required for those long and frequent runs. Having played a bit of PES 10 I also felt off the ball movement was terrible, but after playing at a friend who used modified stats from pesstatsdatabase I thought it was much better and playable. Will be interesting to fiddle around with player stats once I get my hands on the full game.
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Might not be all of it but I'm convinced editing player stats can go some way in fixing the problems some people've been having.
 
_anderson said:
Well, been trying different situations. Everytime you're losing, the A.I. will be much less aggressive, no matter where you are on the field, the man covering you will not make a move, and the game will actually "stop" if you wish. If you're winning, the other defenders reaction to you stopping is almost immediate (although the man covering you still doesn't make a move), 1 or more players will rush in to get the ball from you.
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It makes sense that the AI is less aggressive when winning, but it still shouldn't be letting you run up for an easy cross. I was down 2-0 against Barca in the 81st minute, changed my tactic to "Green zone exploiting" and whammo, 2-2 was the result.
 
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romagnoli said:
Absolutely. It's why it's frustrating and cringe inducing when he mixes the two so often because it dilutes those parts of his posts which are true. It is fantastically deep - a lot of people complain about juddery/clunky animations, but in many cases it's because they're "doing it wrong". You can't just hold sprint and press a direction to knock the ball past a challenger - you've got to time it right to get the desired effect. You can't just hold R2 and move in any direction the split second you move the stick - you have to manipulate your momentum as well as your opponents. You can't just hold forwards and pressure, otherwise you get the dozens of fouls people complain about. You've got to time your challenges, holding the opponent up and not committing.

The game is way short of perfect still, but 2012 and 2013 will see Konami listen to what we think needs improving from here and build further. For a lot of us who have 'come back', perfection wasn't a requirement.
What we wanted was a PES that was playable, enjoyable and deep. You can tell at this early stage that those three have been ticked for a lot more of us than recent in years.
Click to expand...

Good post. It's nice to see such positivity from you towards this years PES. Coming from someone who's been so heavily involved with EA, I think your opinions speak volumes for how good the game is this year.

I don't think PES2011 is juddery/clunky at all. The level of close control is quite immense, perhaps, conversely, due to the lack of complex animation routines that I feels weighs down Fifa. I'm finding that the dribbling in this game is a joy to behold and it's great fun twisting and turning defenders and trying to wrong foot and throw them off balance. Dribbling in PES2011 is sharp, natural and rewarding. Defending against it requires good timing and patience. There's a great balance there.

This year we have a new game that PES diehards need to relearn as well as those coming across from Fifa. The 'clunkiness' is just an excuse from those that don't want to invest the time in the demo and scratch beneath the surface.
 
mfmaxpower said:
Ironic isn't it that it's FIFA with all the tutorials when it's PES that needs it most, especially for those who've been chilling on the Dark Side these last few years.

Defending isn't so much a problem as offense. The game's been getting better and more enjoyable for me but if the clunky feeling is all down to me playing the game wrong, hell if I know what it is I'm doing wrong. Some of it is just not knowing how to do something, and there's much to learn, but it sucks not knowing how to do simple things like a knock-on much alone how to manipulate momentum as suggested.
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I would suggest doing what I did and play several games without using the sprint button. You will get a better feel for the slow pace of the game, the weight and momentum of both players and ball and figure out the timing.
 
Isslander said:
It makes sense that the AI is less aggressive when winning, but it still shouldn't be letting you run up for an easy cross. I was down 2-0 against Barca in the 81st minute, changed my tactic to "Green zone exploiting" and whammo, 2-2 was the result.
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Yep, I wasn't saying it was right, I was just stating what happens. I'm not sure now how easy a fix to this could be.
 
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