Konami to end partnership with UEFA

*aLe said:
Screw that license if it's useless anyway. You'd better save that money for something else.
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I 100% agree. As I said before, Licensed Liverpool against T-Shirts United looks stupid, and as you say, half the CL/EL teams aren't there anyway.

My issue is - "better saving that money for something else" - the only place that money will go is the bank, and it won't come back out. Konami haven't invested in the development of PES for a while now, it's a tiny team in comparison to other games. Konami has been doubling-down on mobile and microtransactions for a while - they're not suddenly going to say "you know that money we're not paying to UEFA any more, here, see what you can do with it, we don't want it".

@Chuny said it best:

Chuny said:
If Konami use the money they used to destine for the UEFA licenses on improving motion capture, or full league licenses, better programmers, etc. Then this could be a huge hit for them. But if they don't...
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I agree with a few people who've said this seems to signal the beginning of a complete myClub / microtransactions focus. It's what they're doing across the company. Some YouTuber can make "ImDaBestBoiii FC" and no licenses are required.

Also...

manmachine said:
Adam: "Sometimes you have to pass backwards in football to move forward".

Oh man, if only PES & Fifa played like that!
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Post of the week for me. :D I'd love to reply to Adam and say "since when does anyone pass back in PES, there's no need to - the AI definitely don't" - but it wouldn't help the situation, so...
 
Chris Davies said:
I 100% agree. As I said before, Licensed Liverpool against T-Shirts United looks stupid, and as you say, half the CL/EL teams aren't there anyway.

My issue is - "better saving that money for something else" - the only place that money will go is the bank, and it won't come back out. Konami haven't invested in the development of PES for a while now, it's a tiny team in comparison to other games. Konami has been doubling-down on mobile and microtransactions for a while - they're not suddenly going to say "you know that money we're not paying to UEFA any more, here, see what you can do with it, we don't want it".
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There was a post on twitter from someone suggesting that Konami are already hiring devs for the gaming dept. I don't speak japanese so the link was useless to me and I don't that whether it's true or not, but i'm sure durandil is a legit community member and not likely to just make things up

https://twitter.com/Durandil67/status/986633766121738241

love that post about passing backwards in PES too :APPLAUD:
 
I didn`t bought pes 2018 becouse I didn`t really saw any real improvement over pes 2017 but loosing the license that keeps pes alive in terms of license (I mean kids) that will have big impact on the series. When Bhatti came in Konami we all have positive thoughts about the future of the game but all end in shambles. Biggest mistake was not build on Pes 2014, even though the game was unfinished and shouldn`t be released in public like full game, this game was the only football game that have physics right in all aspects. Don`t want to be pessimistic but I think the end for the pes is near, all of the hardcore fans, well most of them are married and have kids and new generations don`t want simulation anymore, all is about myclub and ultimate team stuff which isn`t point where realistic simulation game can exist...
 
I've been banging this drum for years now. There was never any point in Konami competing with EA on licences. As others have said, there's no point in having Liverpool licensed if the other 19 teams in the league are not.

They really need to take a look at what Big Ant Studios are doing with their tennis and cricket games. They include a stadium editor and a player editor, and let the community do the rest.

Focus on developing solid gameplay and then completely embrace the community for their editing skills. Make your product different, make it stand out, instead of trying to feed on whatever scraps EA leave behind.
 
shilts said:
Focus on gameplay and completely embrace the community for their editing skills. Make your product different, make it stand out, instead of trying to feed on whatever scraps EA leave behind.
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The problem is, we've been saying this for years, and years, and years. Make an edit system like the ones in other games, where you can create and share content within the game, not exclusively outside of it. Make it easy for people who buy the game to just go to a "downloads" section and update their game to be fuily-licensed in a few button-presses (after the community has put its best stuff together, anyway).

But they don't care about the guys who do that, because we're small-fry. Kids who buy points on myClub, though... That's a whole new revenue stream.
 
You're right @Chris Davies I'm probably living in the past. But if Konami's future strategy is to rely on revenue from online, they might be in for a shock. I think somebody mentioned that there was a survey that found many more people play career mode than Ultimate Team in Fifa, yet UT obviously makes EA a stack of money. So if PES's offline gameplay is neglected (and I'm assuming many more people play offline than online, just like Fifa) they'll lose their offline fanbase, and that will mean less people even trying their online version because they won't bother to buy the game in the first place.
 
How big could a database be that the consoles could cope with?
Couldn't Konami even get away with simple team names without using the full name? ie Manchester, Newcastle, West Bromwich.
 
I have no problems to believe in that step backwards that Adam mentioned, but that step forward... :THINK:
In fact, I find it a silly statement from Adam. He just says the next PES is a step backward.
With that kind of statements you can expect a heavy fall of sales.
 
majuh said:
I guess they are throwing out all Single Player modes and make a subscription based game centered around myClub instead.
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You know, I'm afraid that it's the most likely scenario to happen. Maybe not in a year, but surely before a couple.

Just to simplifiy, CL used to make them money; they lost CL.. so now what? Let's push it all on the My Club mode, the thing that actually give them more money than the others.. after all, not only watching at the strong online friendly turn the game took this year, but also reading old posts of Adam and the others with hindsight makes a lot of sense in this direction.. they were probably well ready in advance for this to happen. So i'm afraid the "part of the plan" bit could be less bragging than it sounds.

That's why for how nice it sounds, I can't fantasize about mega editing tools, good simulative offline gameplay, realistic alive careers (God knows how much I wanted one too!) and the such.. because by action and words, it just isn't the direction they are going. At this point, if anything I think I'll daydream about some third soccer game, seems to me more likely than them not becoming Pro Evolution My Club.
 
saintric said:
Adam has tweeted "the future is incredibly exciting"

who knows maybe the money spent on the UEFA stuff will now be reinvested in to hiring more staff and more manpower to flesh out the different modes and things like testing the game for bugs for the first time in 10 years? personally I think its a bit of a disaster losing the UEFA license but interested to see what they come up with after so many years of being a let down surely they can strike gold at least once?
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I wish people wouldn't believe him anymore. We have heard those "future is bright", "future is exciting" so many times they lost all meaning, he doesn't hype me anymore, he makes me angry. Just remember he said the same thing when announcing Pes 2018, look at the results.
 
Madmac79 said:
I can't fantasize about mega editing tools, good simulative offline gameplay, realistic alive careers (God knows how much I wanted one too!) and the such..
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No, I'm repeating myself now but - for literal years we've asked for that. Begged for that. Stadium creators and the like ... and there's been no movement. They're not going to suddenly care about those things. They didn't even care about including all the teams in the one major competition license they had, for God's sake.

There's zero interest in implementing the stuff you mention. Losing a license won't cure their self-inflicted blindness to us.

But all of us, to this day, buy PES for the gameplay and nothing else. We are all still foolish enough to say "you know what, even if there was just an exhibition mode and nothing else, if the gameplay was amazing we'd buy it".

That we've still got this attitude given the evolution of gaming in general, and what other games are doing in terms of adding depth... It's astonishing, really. We inflict blindness on ourselves, too, and Konami make fools of us for it.

But a fool I am, and I still hold out the slightest hope that this year, they invest in the game.
 
Chris Davies said:
No, I'm repeating myself now but - for literal years we've asked for that. Begged for that. Stadium creators and the like ... and there's been no movement. They're not going to suddenly care about those things. They didn't even care about the missing teams from the biggest competition license they had...

There's no interest in implementing any of those things. Losing a license doesn't remove their self-inflicted deafness.

But all of us, still, buy PES for the gameplay and nothing else. We are all still foolish enough to say "you know what, even if there was just an exhibition mode and nothing else, if the gameplay was amazing we'd buy it".

That we've still got this attitude given the evolution of gaming in general... Man, Konami make fools of us.

But a fool I am.
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And this is one of their biggest problems. They cant compete financially with EA with regards to licenses and marketing and so on.

Make a game that has simple and huge modding possibilities and that game will sell as long as the gameplay is good.

Look at the amount of us still playing/modding pes5/6, 10+ years later. If that isn't a huge clue to them then I don't know what is.

I picked up 2017 on a steam sale and I do play it and its not that bad but the editing just seems so unnecessarily restrictive and hard work compared to the earlier pes's. Even things like setting up a cup with teams from different leagues is an arduous task of backwards and forwards through screens.

Surely, having very few licenses you would think they would see the need to make a key part of the game to allow everything to be easily edited.
 
Look at PES3 and Fifa 2004. Fifa had over 20 leagues. PES had 64 teams. Yet PES was a much, much better game. Only a handful of licenses too. It didn't bother me then and it doesn't bother me now. Just sort the gameplay!
 
Yeah, the number of licensed teams doesn't mean anything to me.
I've been saying for years (and you know it better than me) that even 16 unlicensed teams with proper gameplay and proper match atmosphere (but of course with the chance to modify/add teams and leagues like it happens in rFactor) would be more than enough for me.
 
A game with just 16 teams would be very bold from Konami. But with the opportunity to add as many teams as you wanted and having it completely customizable would be a dream. I know there are people that don't want to do that so imagine being able to download player created teams and leagues would also be massive. However, if Konami make the perfect game, why would they need to release another one? No money to be made again.
 
majuh said:
I guess they are throwing out all Single Player modes and make a subscription based game centered around myClub instead.
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Titch said:
However, if Konami make the perfect game, why would they need to release another one? No money to be made again.
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Well, you have a point.

If they still had some licensed leagues, I would answer "season packs".
Though, I agree that with 16 unlicensed teams it would become difficult to justify a "new season DLC".
 
Han said:
I cannot imagine what can be soo important that it compensates licenses.
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Every single other league in the world? Or at least half of it? 1/3rd of them? Hell, 1/5th which equals to about 25 playable leagues would be good, we had barely 7 or 8 the past few PES games.
And suuure, if that's in, making a few edits in Bundesliga, EPL and CL/EL for the logo anthem and stadiums won't be annoying at all.

But of course...in the end, we get nothing new license-wise and keep on losing, and have to do it all remaining by ourselves, plus transfers, etc, then yeah...cba...

Lost licence for new licences times 3
Lost game mode for new game mode times 3
etc
Cmon Konami...do something. It's 2018...
 
Ameppe said:
I wish people wouldn't believe him anymore. We have heard those "future is bright", "future is exciting" so many times they lost all meaning, he doesn't hype me anymore, he makes me angry. Just remember he said the same thing when announcing Pes 2018, look at the results.
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haha I know trust me been around long enough to have heard every marketing line and false promise from konami possible in regard to PES which is why I added surely they can strike gold at least once I mean if you throw enough mud at the wall surely some will stick

thats the best hope right now they somehow accidentally stumble on a winning formula
 
To me its not the loss of the individual mode, its the loss of it in Master League... its one of the highlights, having the music play as the teams come out :( Gets you up for it.

They need to pull something out of the hat now though, as much as gameplay can be improved... if FIFA pick this up and market it as only EA can do, it will take sales away from PES.

Id be surprised, very surprised if PES can survive much past 2020 at this rate. It will take an absolute stormer of a game and FIFA to continue to stagnate, but I just cant see it. I think we are going to be left under EAs monopoly soon and have the odd indie game come along now and then.
 
Veteran PES players like myself are unaffected by this.

I like PES for what it is on the pitch, not for licenses or cosmetic features.

I remeber playing ISS Pro Evo 2 in 2002 and those magic moments... nostalgia.

Sadly ppl like me are very rare these days when everything is about licenses & stuff.
 
johnnyusa2k3 said:
Veteran PES players like myself are unaffected by this.

I like PES for what it is on the pitch, not for licenses or cosmetic features.

I remeber playing ISS Pro Evo 2 in 2002 and those magic moments... nostalgia.

Sadly ppl like me are very rare these days when everything is about licenses & stuff.
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THe problem is, we dont even have that on the pitch feeling really anymore... not like the old days.

So what we have, is a game shedding one of its major licenses, adding silly little individual licences and everyone relying on a major overhaul in the game.

I remember when we had La Liga and all the stadiums one year, the Copa Libertadores... its like they strip things, people believe the 'money' saved will go into fixing the game... it dosent and we look ahead 12 months to the next game.

However this time I think Konami are on a short lifespan, 2019 has to come up with something special on the pitch to peak peoples interest. Right now, im not getting it as every year I buy in, get my hopes up, try to defend it and in the end sit there realising what im dealing with.

Im gutted tbh, maybe im too old for it all.. part of me wishes there was no or limited internet and I just found PES2018 and enjoyed it for what it is sometimes.
 
We usually start to think about "what they're going to do now, where are they going to go from here" once we get the news. Which is way after everything's been decided. So we kind of have a limited vision about the story.

Usually these decisions take months. Konami probably knows the deal with UEFA was going to end before PES 2019 came out. Which means they probably already had a plan. Like: OK, so PES 2018 will be the last game with UEFA licenses. So let's do something special: Let's make the Ultimate Stage Stadium. And for PES 2019 we'll do this and that.

It's like, when we start getting the first information batch, screenshots and videos with the new features. We tend to 'like' or 'dislike' it but there's nothing we can do about it, because it's done and that's the path Konami chose to go that particular year. So no matter how much we complain or throw ideas at them, the future is sealed and they can only take our opinions into account for next year.

The problem is that we have no idea what they came up in order to make the UEFA Licenses absence less noticeable.

But whatever that is, it's been decided a lot of time ago even though we've received the news just now because we are a month away from the Champions League finals in Kiev.

We receive the decisions when they're final and there's nothing we can do about it anymore.
 
PES has been dying for a years now in quality, sales, and support. This is just another step further along that path. I feel like PES2014 is when this series really got put on ice, as there hasn't been any substantial investment or improvements since then. I'm not even that sad anymore - it's been over a decade PES5/6, the hope of a comeback is well and truly expired by this point. My opinion.
 
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