YoungGun_UK
20 TIMES!
FFS great thread, Rooney out for 4 weeks 
this is what some of you wanted lol
this is what some of you wanted lolHow good do you think Wayne Rooney is at this present time?
- Thread starter Clockender
- Start date
Mixed emotions.....
Ret KiT
Premier League
- 25 March 2007
special players don't get breaks often 
i always thought something "special" were players like ronnie messi or kaka and i haven't seen rooney to anything special there are many strikers with his potential....
i always thought something "special" were players like ronnie messi or kaka and i haven't seen rooney to anything special there are many strikers with his potential....
No I saw that tournament, 2 goals against the Swiss (a very poor side) and 2 against Croatia (they were an average team in Euro 2004). His only goal for England against decent opposition in a competitive match was in Moscow last month.
2 Goals against Roma, same as Carrick (except he got his in one leg), is Carrick a special player ? Of course not!
Good because you know nothing about Argentine soccer.
vanzandt
The answer must be Jam
- 26 July 2007
- Everton
Ohh yea lets throw “THE ENGLISH ARE ALL THE SAME” “THEY ARE ALL ARROGANT and ALL OVERRATE THEIR PLAYERS” line in there just because on player in question happens to be English.
Well done, racist rubbish!!!!
Oddly enough I do not make such comments about people from other countries no matter what!!!
You see Gerd this is where you send me right off the fucking deep end just like the last guy I quoted.
What the fuck does my nationality have to do with this, why are you bringing this into it?
And what the fuck has the English league got to do with anything I have said or the debate in general?
And why the fuck are you using the term “YOU ENGLISH”, like we are all the same.
Mate this is fucking racist shite that is fit for nothing more than the bin.
Don’t ever refer to me as YOU ENGLISH or group me in with everyone like some homogenized soup for fuck sake!!!
I never call you “YOU BELGIANS”, I never act as though you ALL have the same opinion, same goes for the other guy- whatever his nationality maybe…..
I have watched episodes of Poirot and listened to Jacques Brel…maybe I should act like a racist pig and presume you are a mixture of the two?
If the other guy is Dutch, maybe I should presume that he lives in a windmill near a dyke and picks tulips and thinks like ALL DUTCHMEN?
No I wont do that, I’ll assume that you are both individuals and not part of some conglomerate Dutch/Belgian think tank with set views.
Open season on the English and all things English…..amazing the way racism is always acceptable if it is against the English, happens on here all the time.
If I see much more of this I wont be posting on here anymore.
Couldn’t give a toss about the debate any more…..
YoungGun_UK
20 TIMES!
:lmao::lmao::lmao: your right mate but some funny lines in thier, anyway Rooney was given Player of the month and probably in my opinion even with the injury he's got will win PFA player of the year
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bebo
Looking for a Manager
@ vanzandt ...I don`t think anyone is being racist . You need not to take things so personal . Calling someone racist is too easy and irresponsible, cleary your upset no worries...try prejudice imo I know the EPL is the most watched football in the World. The EPL has the greatest club Arsenal that`s being bias
vanzandt
The answer must be Jam
- 26 July 2007
- Everton
@ vanzandt ...I don`t think anyone is being racist . You need not to take things so personal . Calling someone racist is too easy and irresponsible, cleary your upset no worries...try prejudice imo I know the EPL is the most watched football in the World. The EPL has the greatest club Arsenal that`s being bias
I'll go with prejudice in the context here;
unreasonable feelings, opinions, or attitudes, esp. of a hostile nature, regarding a racial, religious, or national group.
Which is basically exactly the same as racism.
The above definition is exactly what it is; no race, religious or national group should be on the end of such statements.
Why some people want to try and fit in some critical comment of "the English" into a thread that has nothing to do with international football or the EPL I don't know. Well actually I do know because some people just love to Tee Off on a "they are all so arrogant, "they think they are the best", "THEY" you understand.... chip on shoulder lets piss on the English time.
Ohh we haven't done it in the last week, any way we can fit in a piss on the English into a thread about xyz? How about some veiled criticism or how about an open criticism if we can turn the thread in a direction that allows for it? Yes the thread is about Michel Platini’s arse or about Spaniels but I am certain we can blame it both on the English if we try hard enough.
There is fuck all difference from saying "the English" and saying "them bloody foreigners" like some Alf Garnet bigot.
Oh yea and the EPL should have been left out of this because you can’t use that to bash Rooney and at the same time trump Fabregas…cause guess what that doesn’t actually make any fucking sense whatsoever.
On the note of the EPL…not one person in this fucking thread said that the EPL was the best league not one, I repeat not one single fucking soul.
Mmm those pesky arrogant English.
P.S
I thought Rooney was brilliant not because he was English or because I am English, I feel the same way about Kaka, same about Messi, same about Fabregas….oh shit none of them are English, dam the whole idea that I feel the way I do is because he is English has just fell the fuck apart..
Nationality should have been left the fuck out of the thread- hopefully I have now booted it firmly the fuck out.
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gerd
Retired Footballer
@ vanzandt ...I don`t think anyone is being racist . You need not to take things so personal . Calling someone racist is too easy and irresponsible, cleary your upset no worries...try prejudice imo I know the EPL is the most watched football in the World. The EPL has the greatest club Arsenal that`s being bias
Vanzandt is right...i used the same kind of arguments as racists...i've sent him a PM to apologize and i will gladly apologize to other people who feel offended....I'm sorry...i was wrong.
On this English forum i should act like i guest in someone's house...
Ret KiT
Premier League
- 25 March 2007
right i feel the same way, we can't really discuss anything negative about england or players in an english forum. I don't blame vanzan for defending his fellow countrymen
marukomu
Ecchi otoko
Yeah, leave the negativity to us English. We're really good at it.
vanzandt
The answer must be Jam
- 26 July 2007
- Everton
There is zero/no problem with being critical of any/all English players, the English national team or any/all English clubs.
The issue is about not having prejudicial/racist language or opinions of English people.
E.g
If you say Everton which are my club are crap, no problem- though I strongly disagree.
If you say Rooney is crap, no problem though I may strongly disagree.
I might not even continue talking to you for a while Hehe and I might argue with you….but it is nothing more than a disagreement all the same.
But if you say things like “the English”, as though we are all of one mindset then that is what is problematic.
If you take that further and say “the English are arrogant”, or “the English over-rate all their players or national team” etc..
Then I have a massive problem with that because that becomes categorizing millions of people with negative, unsubstantiated and derogatory language.
To widen the point;
If I say Bayern Munich are crap then there is no problem (I think they are very good actually). If I say the German or Belgian or Dutch national team or players are crap, again that is an opinion on the players (I do not think this either) and acceptable even if wrong.
But if I say “ALL Germans are arrogant”, or “the Belgians over-rate all their players” or “Italians are hooligans”, “all Brazilians are lazy” etc
All the above statements would be unacceptable in the same manner stated, they would all be an utterly wrong categorization of millions of people, as though they think and act as one person and such language would be racist/prejudicial and in this context also derogatory.
The difference between the two issues is vast/blatantly different.
I have spoken to Gerd and I know he made an error of language and nothing more and am convinced he is a good guy so that is over with, no idea about the other guy who said much worse things….
I want to comment on something on this issue that is related and perhaps the big problem that is going on here at the site.
I believe there is a widely held misconception by some that English people are arrogant in the following of the national team and/or clubs.
I personally do not know of a single English football fan who thinks that the England national team are even good, never mind over-rates them and in my lifetime I have never personally known any English football fan that felt that the England national team were going to win a world cup or Euro. The overwhelming opinion I have experienced in those I have come into contact with has been a mixture of hope and pessimism. My experience of English fans following their clubs is no different from that of football fans from the continent, in that typically fans think they have a great chance of winning things if their team is big and they have lots of money and have had success and if they are a smaller club with less money and success they are worried about their team in Europe. I as an Evertonian for instance have expected little and feared the worst for my team in Europe, the fact we have had moderate success so far is very welcome- not expected.
Of course there will be English football fans that over-rate the England national team, and the same goes for the clubs, but the same can be said of every countries football fans in Europe and I see no evidence whatsoever for this widely held misconception of English fans.
There is little to no evidence of this on the forum, of people over-rating the England national team or clubs.
I just do not see this at all, where are all these English football fans boasting about the England national team or clubs?
I don’t see any evidence for this and I don’t believe it exists.
If the English media is guilty of this behavior then criticize them by all means. In fact this is where I think this feeling stems from in many cases, but it is not something that any English fan is at fault for and it is not something that any English fan can influence. So if the English media or certain sections of it are many of the things that seem to be attributed to English fans, please leave the blame at their door as opposed to falling into a trap of prejudicial thinking and derogatory language.
Given this is an English forum I am certain that of course via sheer numbers a number of prat arrogant statements/posters can be found, but I do not believe this is any more representative in relative terms, any more representative of English people than of any other nation.
Yeah, leave the negativity to us English. We're really good at it.
The irony of the situation is that some English fans really are incredibly pessimistic to the point of doing far more damage to their own teams interests, so much so that outside critisism is often not even required in order to bring the team in question to its knees.
P.S
What I am saying is not something that is just for English people but for all people. I would never want to categorize any group of people, we should be equally fair to all people by judging them as individuals not as some group, if I fail to do this myself I will be the first to apologize.
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Ret KiT
Premier League
- 25 March 2007
yes vanzan i agree with everything you've stated and im sure many won't make the effort to explain things to an extent like you do in your longs posts without going overboard or make racist arrogant comments, nicely put. :applause:
Himawari
Far from home
As a Utd fan, I've watched Wayne for quite some time. Sometimes he wows me, sometimes he utterly bores me, I've seen the kid play some classy football, and other times just plain suck.
Waza IS a good player, just inconsistently, though I think that in the past he really hasn't had someone that he's linked with quite as well as this Teves-Rooney pairing seems to be working so far, but only time will tell on that matter.
Waza IS a good player, just inconsistently, though I think that in the past he really hasn't had someone that he's linked with quite as well as this Teves-Rooney pairing seems to be working so far, but only time will tell on that matter.
gerd
Retired Footballer
Good post Vanzandt...i will try to remember that in the future...
And about Everton: they are doing very well this season...IMHO they have one of the best coaches in the premiership.
And about Everton: they are doing very well this season...IMHO they have one of the best coaches in the premiership.
Re-arranged
Hashish?
- 3 August 2004
- Newcastle United FC
For me Rooney is an excellent player on his day, but a good player for most of the time.
tobi
"Clear Eyes Full Hearts Can't Lose."
- 5 August 2005
- Spurs, Suns and Cowboys
I would describe Wayne Rooney as an excellent player.
Plan M
Banned
- 27 September 2007
- Manchester United
Rooney is world class, simple as that. He has vision, is quick, can finish from anywhere, is strong and isn't even at his best yet. He is like all the great forwards though: he is crap with his head.