eFootball PES 2021 Discussion Thread (CONSOLES)

[PRO_TOO]

Not good to hear. But I still look forward to starting a ML after the update.
I know it's not completely the same, but hope that FUMA changes a bit.

Wish I could tell otherwise.
It’s so sad that TS has such a negative impact on the game in ML. How I wish for an ML without that feature!
as much as my imagination allows it, I’m getting the most out of exhibition matches. But still I’m missing the thrill of being a manager and all that stuff that comes with it!! Man...

 

[ballsinwater]

maaan, this was so much fun

This was some beautiful stuff man, well played. That build up around the 5:00 mark (especially that backheel at 5:14) really deserved a goal.

 

[dinono10]

Stamina is still there mate.
20 minutes FUMA plays like heaven by the way, on Top Player at least .
What I like is that FUMA is playable even on TV cam as the control of directions is related to the Camera place, this is so sweet!

Your right mate. Stamina is still there. So not sure what conditioning can mean.

 

[Ameobinho]

Wow amazing game

0 fouls
All AI goals are identical turn and shoot crap
Players still stepping away from the ball for no reason
Non existent midfield
GKs stuck to their lines
Freekicks OP
Catch up bug
Hit the woodwork 3 times every game
ML same BS with regens and loan bugs not fixed


Not even another Konami Jesus resurrection can save this 💩

 

[Sovereign Hope]

Wow amazing game

0 fouls
All AI goals are identical turn and shoot crap
Players still stepping away from the ball for no reason
Non existent midfield
GKs stuck to their lines
Freekicks OP
Catch up bug
Hit the woodwork 3 times every game
ML same BS with regens and loan bugs not fixed


Not even another Konami Jesus resurrection can save this 💩

Have you tried removing deep defensive line and all out defense from both team's tactic? Also the winger has to track back-by setting wingback on in adv instruction or put them on LMF/RMF instead of LWF/RWF when out of possession. Those things will lead to non existent midfield

 

[orangebard]

Mate I only play fixed cursor lol

Haven't had time to play it yet because of work and life but I'll try get around to it soon

Be interested to hear your thoughts, you're the only person I know who plays exclusively the same way that I do. Have you had that moment (in 2020) and still in '21) where either you cross or your AI teammates, to the AI striker and they head it out/back rather than at goal? Drives me crazy. They seem to do it about 75% of the time. The attacking AI once you get to 95% team spirit can be amazing but this issue is really stupid. Obviously, your defenders still do absurd things, gives me a heart attack when they and the GK are dealing with a loose balls, it turns into a laurel and hardy movie!

 

[Ameobinho]

Have you tried removing deep defensive line and all out defense from both team's tactic? Also the winger has to track back-by setting wingback on in adv instruction or put them on LMF/RMF instead of LWF/RWF when out of possession. Those things will lead to non existent midfield

Thx for your reply, I'm a seasoned PES player and I'll tell you what I tried (On PS4 & pc as well) :

- Changing team formations as you mentioned and more, The AI still feeds the centre forward and refuses to play in any other way. No long range shooting or any type of creativity. Add to that the fact that they just try to get to the central edge of the area and shoot. Oh and dribbling doesn't exist by AI

Def/Atk levels are a joke, A team defending when they need a win and other crap situations.

- Tried prof/semi pro/superstar with FUMA (Which is not bad) and adv shooting other settings.

Holland's gameplay patch which makes every AI shot a goal and disables fouls.

Catch up bug, Fouls, Players stepping away form the ball and gks fumbling to AI are a disease in this game that cannot be fixed. Also the lack of team and player ID is just silly.

If only we had that facebook feedback page still available

 

[xicpanad]

Just for the record, catch up bug is not on this game.

 

[Anth James]

Thx for your reply, I'm a seasoned PES player and I'll tell you what I tried (On PS4 & pc as well) :

- Changing team formations as you mentioned and more, The AI still feeds the centre forward and refuses to play in any other way. No long range shooting or any type of creativity. Add to that the fact that they just try to get to the central edge of the area and shoot. Oh and dribbling doesn't exist by AI

Def/Atk levels are a joke, A team defending when they need a win and other crap situations.

- Tried prof/semi pro/superstar with FUMA (Which is not bad) and adv shooting other settings.

Holland's gameplay patch which makes every AI shot a goal and disables fouls.

Catch up bug, Fouls, Players stepping away form the ball and gks fumbling to AI are a disease in this game that cannot be fixed. Also the lack of team and player ID is just silly.

If only we had that facebook feedback page still available

From what I see, the problem is so deep that nothing will really fix it. Changing various things can help make the game play slightly better, but ultimately what modern PES titles lack is any kind of natural behaviour. It's weird to even say this considering what the series is known for, but it's just a million miles away from that right now.

The core of the gameplay is just following a whole bunch of different tactical commands - almost none of which have to do with where the actual ball is. Changing various settings seems to just divert the AI command to focus on something else, and then something else again etc and it's just a continuous cycle and there's still no organic play. A team without the ball cannot 'settle' until it is on the edge of it's box. That's where 95% of modern PES matches are played. Irrespective of deep defensive line, high line, offside, etc, etc - nothing changes it for long enough to make a difference. There's a huge problem with how teams mark - they react to virtually all runs even if it's illogical to do so.

The best way to see for yourself is to play an older PES title. PES 2013, PES 2014 (which is on the Fox engine as well), even go back as far as PES 5 and you just don't see teams running around reaching specific invisible markers on the pitch all game long. The focus is on the ball - cutting passing lanes and making it difficult for you to play through. I'm not saying those games are perfect - but the overriding philosophy of the game is not to just tick off tactical commands.

Really hoping they scrap this approach completely for 2022..

 

[Ameobinho]

@Anth James Absolutely agree

Also it is amazingly sad how all these attributes and traits and special player abilities are muffled by the poor implementation on the pitch.

Speed and physicality is nullified by the scripting and the poor collision system so small players will push big players and so on. Nobody fouls or even pushes the opponent.

Dribbling and skills is nullified by the removel of any dribbling move and the game turning into a basketball-like one touch passing fest. (Messi plays the same as Gary medel!)

Vision and passing is nullified by the on the rails ball movement, playing FUMA makes all players equal so Iniesta and a donkey like Fellaini can play the same through pass.

Shooting is a complete disaster, All AI players finishing with a laser guided missile into the top corner. The same goal over and over again. They didn't shoot wide or above the crossbar until PES 2020! Also now it seems that hitting the woodwork 3 or 4 times a game is the norm.

I will stop the negativity I'm sure a lot are enjoying it and I am trying to as well, But we all know how close this is to an excellent product.

 

[Anth James]

@Anth James Absolutely agree

Also it is amazingly sad how all these attributes and traits and special player abilities are muffled by the poor implementation on the pitch.

Speed and physicality is nullified by the scripting and the poor collision system so small players will push big players and so on. Nobody fouls or even pushes the opponent.

Dribbling and skills is nullified by the removel of any dribbling move and the game turning into a basketball-like one touch passing fest. (Messi plays the same as Gary medel!)

Vision and passing is nullified by the on the rails ball movement, playing FUMA makes all players equal so Iniesta and a donkey like Fellaini can play the same through pass.

Shooting is a complete disaster, All AI players finishing with a laser guided missile into the top corner. The same goal over and over again. They didn't shoot wide or above the crossbar until PES 2020! Also now it seems that hitting the woodwork 3 or 4 times a game is the norm.

I will stop the negativity I'm sure a lot are enjoying it and I am trying to as well, But we all know how close this is to an excellent product.

Yeah spot on, stats really don't seem to make much of a difference anymore. I find it really odd how much football games in general have gone backwards instead of forwards. Even visually, there are some obvious visual improvements, but there's also some areas where the visuals have gone backwards in my opinion. I hate bashing the game, I just can't get behind the current implementations and I find it incredibly frustrating!

The developers seem so obsessed with creating highlight reel moments that they don't understand that making these the norm rather than the exception destroys any emotion you might attach to them.

 

[abbes]

Your right mate. Stamina is still there. So not sure what conditioning can mean.

That should answer your questions. Basically conditioning affects arrow form indicator. The bigger number in conditioning the bigger are chances for good form and less chances for being a retard on the pitch.

 

[hitmanuk]

Wow amazing game

0 fouls
All AI goals are identical turn and shoot crap
Players still stepping away from the ball for no reason
Non existent midfield
GKs stuck to their lines
Freekicks OP
Catch up bug
Hit the woodwork 3 times every game
ML same BS with regens and loan bugs not fixed


Not even another Konami Jesus resurrection can save this 💩

Are you playing 21?

AI scores quite a variety
Not seen any of my players step away from the ball
Midfield could be better but to tactics improve it
Freekicks have been toned down but managaing the GK also helps alot to save
Not seen any catch up bug of if i get free with salah hes not being caught
Hitting woodwork 3 time in Every game? not seen that once
Not tried ML so maybe its just that mode but it certainly isnt league and cup

 

[SJ321]

Wow amazing game

0 fouls
All AI goals are identical turn and shoot crap
Players still stepping away from the ball for no reason
Non existent midfield
GKs stuck to their lines
Freekicks OP
Catch up bug
Hit the woodwork 3 times every game
ML same BS with regens and loan bugs not fixed


Not even another Konami Jesus resurrection can save this 💩

There's definitely fouls, does it give all the fouls it should? Absolutely not as the game is fundamentally broken in this respect. The AI relies far too often in running into you, making you stumble and then taking the ball. This can't be fixed by a patch as it needs a complete rework so hopefully it's something they've remedied for the next gen as it really annoys me too.

AI goals I'm seeing variation with the build up but far too often the final finish is an absolute rocket that doesn't miss. Doesn't matter if it's Gibraltar or Barcelona, they're way too clinical with the finishes.

Players stepping away from the ball or the player select choosing the wrong player is a nightmare on manual I agree. There's zero intelligence. On assisted passing if I power up a powerful pass then the closest player will move out of the way and let it go through to the intended target, on manual this player will instead try and control the 100mph pass rather than having the sense to let it pass. They also make runs where they stop after a few paces so you end up passing to nobody as they've stopped the run. This lack of intelligence is also why the midfield can be skipped at times, far too often the AI can take out my entire midfield and a lot of my defence with a single pass due to the awful positioning of the defenders and midfield, I do what I can but can obviously only control one player at a time.

Goalkeepers are absolutely fine for me with 1 on 1's, If I get 1 on 1 they'll come out, this was a huge problem on the 2020 demo but I've not seen it since. Catch up bug is definitely not a thing, knock the ball on and run with a fast player and you're not getting caught, the only way they catch you is if they do that BS thing where they're right behind you at the start of the run and make the player stumble. I also don't get the woodwork issue but play manual shooting so that might be why.

I am incredibly frustrated with the game if I'm honest, if they could solve these issues then it would be a strong 9/10 for me but I have zero faith in Konami to sort them and I'm not even sure they can sort some of them before next gen as it needs a complete overhaul.

 

[elfie]

Good on you. I've got to apologise too.

I've spoken to Barry before and he's a really nice guy - something that is seemingly going out of style in the world right now. Whether you agree or disagree with paying for option files.

(And something I didn't realise was that all the PES Universe content is available for free via their forums, so I didn't have my facts straight there. The paid options are just to support the site - something I know we've considered in the past, because web hosting isn't free and the costs are only getting higher.)

We spoke on the phone after some comments I made on here, and I came to realise that it must have felt pretty shit to achieve something that means a lot to you, having your first professional review published by a big name site, and then have another guy who's been in the PES community for as long as you have (15-17 years) calling foul play.

I have apologised to Barry - and to Asim, who I mentioned in the same comment, and who took the time to speak to me earlier this week. Sometimes it's too easy to be cynical. For me, anyway.

A bit of a late reaction, but how is the pesuniverse content available for free? I registered to the forums, but no option files available. Did i misread your comment or am i doing something wrong?

 

[Antoine]

If anyone wants the option file let me know..

 

[Antoine]

Are you playing 21?

AI scores quite a variety
Not seen any of my players step away from the ball
Midfield could be better but to tactics improve it
Freekicks have been toned down but managaing the GK also helps alot to save
Not seen any catch up bug of if i get free with salah hes not being caught
Hitting woodwork 3 time in Every game? not seen that once
Not tried ML so maybe its just that mode but it certainly isnt league and cup

Agree. Not seeing this either. One thing you should adjust is goalkeeper clearance in abilities. For instance Alisson has it in the 90s, so when a shot is hit at him and you see that ridiculous over powered parry that goes for a throw or near the corner flag, thats the attribute.

Lower it and he parries it much more naturally. Whilst it shouldn't just drop closely its very rare you see a keeper parry for a throw in!

 

[Antoine]

Incidentally i posted this earlier in Klashmanns thread...anyone provide any insight @hitmanuk ?

Im not on PC folks but any tips to get the Ai playing a bit more creatively? I only play exhibition matches and it plays for the most part well. Theres certain teams though that continually pump long balls to a lone striker.

I get the odd team as well that gets on the flank, dribbles to the edge of the area and will look to dribble across goal to the centre for a shot, rather than try a shot on the angle or a cross.

Is this a problem with player skills/com skills on the player, or a team one?

 

[normazimuth]

@Anth James Absolutely agree

Also it is amazingly sad how all these attributes and traits and special player abilities are muffled by the poor implementation on the pitch.

Speed and physicality is nullified by the scripting and the poor collision system so small players will push big players and so on. Nobody fouls or even pushes the opponent.

Dribbling and skills is nullified by the removel of any dribbling move and the game turning into a basketball-like one touch passing fest. (Messi plays the same as Gary medel!)

Vision and passing is nullified by the on the rails ball movement, playing FUMA makes all players equal so Iniesta and a donkey like Fellaini can play the same through pass.

Shooting is a complete disaster, All AI players finishing with a laser guided missile into the top corner. The same goal over and over again. They didn't shoot wide or above the crossbar until PES 2020! Also now it seems that hitting the woodwork 3 or 4 times a game is the norm.

I will stop the negativity I'm sure a lot are enjoying it and I am trying to as well, But we all know how close this is to an excellent product.

Agree to some extent, certainly agree that it is a very frustrating game when scripting kicks in and, at times, nearly nullifies everything else.

For dribbling, there is some. I quite often find holding down R1 (I think that means R2 in you use the default control setup) means you can hold onto the ball far better and sometimes dribble around players. The R3 stick dribbling I still find pretty unreliable, so have pretty much given up on it.

The cpu does dribble, particularly if you assign the players the various COM playing styles. It's not very convincing and often involves them going on unrealistic dribbles down the wing and then fannying around at the edge of your 18 yard box - and when the cpu team has a scripted boost, they can be impossible to get the ball off - but they do at least dribble sometimes, rather than only doing laser guided passing.

Likewise for shooting - yes, most cpu goals tend to be laser guided rockets into the top corner but giving lots of players in a team the COM playing style of Long Ranger and giving them player skills of long range shots, etc definitely makes them shoot more from distance and they tend to miss most of these shots. I think the Finishing attribute then does play a part on whether these long shots are on target. Of course, when the incredibly annoying scripting kicks in and gives the cpu a boost, the player stats get overridden. I wish they would bring back the Shot Technique attributes (and make it apply to the cpu too)

All in all, it's a mixed bag of a game. Elements of it are as good as it's ever been (ie. the pace, the feel on the ball, ball physics) and when I play back-to-back the previous versions of the game from recent years, I can see the progress through each edition. But other areas are not improving or getting worse (AI, tactics, refereeing, scripting) and it's a worrying trend. I do wonder if they're taking the game in the same direction as FIFA in making it an esports end-to-end pile of crap with 99% of development focused on how it plays online in 1v1.

 

[SKYHIGHTREES]

There's definitely fouls, does it give all the fouls it should? Absolutely not as the game is fundamentally broken in this respect. The AI relies far too often in running into you, making you stumble and then taking the ball. This can't be fixed by a patch as it needs a complete rework so hopefully it's something they've remedied for the next gen as it really annoys me too.

AI goals I'm seeing variation with the build up but far too often the final finish is an absolute rocket that doesn't miss. Doesn't matter if it's Gibraltar or Barcelona, they're way too clinical with the finishes.

Players stepping away from the ball or the player select choosing the wrong player is a nightmare on manual I agree. There's zero intelligence. On assisted passing if I power up a powerful pass then the closest player will move out of the way and let it go through to the intended target, on manual this player will instead try and control the 100mph pass rather than having the sense to let it pass. They also make runs where they stop after a few paces so you end up passing to nobody as they've stopped the run. This lack of intelligence is also why the midfield can be skipped at times, far too often the AI can take out my entire midfield and a lot of my defence with a single pass due to the awful positioning of the defenders and midfield, I do what I can but can obviously only control one player at a time.

Goalkeepers are absolutely fine for me with 1 on 1's, If I get 1 on 1 they'll come out, this was a huge problem on the 2020 demo but I've not seen it since. Catch up bug is definitely not a thing, knock the ball on and run with a fast player and you're not getting caught, the only way they catch you is if they do that BS thing where they're right behind you at the start of the run and make the player stumble. I also don't get the woodwork issue but play manual shooting so that might be why.

I am incredibly frustrated with the game if I'm honest, if they could solve these issues then it would be a strong 9/10 for me but I have zero faith in Konami to sort them and I'm not even sure they can sort some of them before next gen as it needs a complete overhaul.

great post. sums up my feelings. The same exact problems on full manual. It's like really small stuff right? PES could be an absolutely fantastic football game if they fixed these bullshit things

 

[gabe.paul.logan]

Any article why we dont have fake bundesliga players and teams by the way? Never understood that part. Did FIFA bought player attributes like height, weight for the players? Team formations? Town names? Everything related to Germany? Cant we have teams with fake names, fake named players, proper height, proper weight, proper nationality? Or thats just not a thing anymore for Konami, to have something without FIFPRO?

 

[hitmanuk]

I might be in the minority here, but I was happy enough with PES2020, got the season update and im really enjoying it, feels totally different, more responsive with a wide variety of goals, im also just getting into manual which is making it even more interesting.I bought FIFA20 recently on the store for around 6 quid, everything about it was good until I played the actual game, its just not close to resembling football.Ive been reading and watching reviews for FIFA21 and it seems like theyve made it even worse.

Incidentally i posted this earlier in Klashmanns thread...anyone provide any insight @hitmanuk ?

Im not on PC folks but any tips to get the Ai playing a bit more creatively? I only play exhibition matches and it plays for the most part well. Theres certain teams though that continually pump long balls to a lone striker.

I get the odd team as well that gets on the flank, dribbles to the edge of the area and will look to dribble across goal to the centre for a shot, rather than try a shot on the angle or a cross.

Is this a problem with player skills/com skills on the player, or a team one?

Try setting a team to possession tactics and turning off all adv tactics . Imo though honestly think the AI adapts somewhat to your play style ..leave the cf unmarked and space and they will exploit it .. look at the videos I posted , I send the AI shoot from 20-25 yards, I got 8 fouls in one game ex
Advantages , I have never hit the most three times in one game , not as the AI ..nevermind every game as some see.

 

[Flipper the Priest]

Any article why we dont have fake bundesliga players and teams by the way? Never understood that part. Did FIFA bought player attributes like height, weight for the players? Team formations? Town names? Everything related to Germany? Cant we have teams with fake names, fake named players, proper height, proper weight, proper nationality? Or thats just not a thing anymore for Konami, to have something without FIFPRO?

Totally understand that bemusement. I have many questions like this throughout the age of PES. Just how cease and desist-y can FIFPro get over likenesses.

The example I always use is the Joneses. Why did Jones go from [Cobi] Johns in PES to [Kenwyne] Jibohou in PES6? It's safe to say fake player names have gotten even more obscure since. When and why are the cards held by FIFPro, FIFA, a national association, a league body, a club or a player?

Oranges in PES2 (even Huygens FFS), Cagliari the only unlicensed Italian side in PES5. In FIFA and Football Manager, again, the Dutch national team has been fake when all the players exist elsewhere in the game. In FIFA, Ronaldo (Brazilian) and Djorkaeff two examples of individuals being absent over the years. It all seems so... inconsistent.

 

[Antoine]

Try setting a team to possession tactics and turning off all adv tactics . Imo though honestly think the AI adapts somewhat to your play style ..leave the cf unmarked and space and they will exploit it .. look at the videos I posted , I send the AI shoot from 20-25 yards, I got 8 fouls in one game ex
Advantages , I have never hit the most three times in one game , not as the AI ..nevermind every game as some see.

Where is your vid pal?

 

[hitmanuk]

Here's an highlight vid

 

[Antoine]

Here's an highlight vid

Thanks man!

 

[saintric]

I was bored today checking out old games on ps2 emulator and tried madden 05 franchise mode man I wish I understood American football fully you could get lost in it for hours literally has everything you can think of pre season camp, players battling over starting spots build your stadium jerseys relocate your team to another city etc etc right down to the cost of parking outside the stadium for fans

These companies really used to care about single player modes that you could get lost in for hours of enjoyment such a shame how things panned out in sports games with online

 

[hitmanuk]

I was bored today checking out old games on ps2 emulator and tried madden 05 franchise mode man I wish I understood American football fully you could get lost in it for hours literally has everything you can think of pre season camp, players battling over starting spots build your stadium jerseys relocate your team to another city etc etc right down to the cost of parking outside the stadium for fans

These companies really used to care about single player modes that you could get lost in for hours of enjoyment such a shame how things panned out in sports games with online

Two key factors are no online play and no chance to patch it . They couldn't afford to be lazy . I remember back in the day if buy a magazine and read reviews of games and you could actually count on them . If they said a game was good it normally was . Now there's way too many and most have hidden agendas

 

[majuh]

Any article why we dont have fake bundesliga players and teams by the way? Never understood that part. Did FIFA bought player attributes like height, weight for the players? Team formations? Town names? Everything related to Germany? Cant we have teams with fake names, fake named players, proper height, proper weight, proper nationality? Or thats just not a thing anymore for Konami, to have something without FIFPRO?

PES 5 had a fake German league, and then the DFL successfully sued KONAMI.

There's an article discussing the judgment, but I don't think you will be able to read it: http://sportrecht.org/cms/upload/06medienrecht/01/CaS_2009_S166ff.pdf

 

[gabe.paul.logan]

PES 5 had a fake German league, and then the DFL successfully sued KONAMI.

There's an article discussing the judgment, but I don't think you will be able to read it: http://sportrecht.org/cms/upload/06medienrecht/01/CaS_2009_S166ff.pdf

How can be fake names and weight, height stats, national flags be monetized? Its a joke however it happened.