'1v1': An exploration.......

[Anth James]

Hi all,

I wanted to create a thread that shows exactly what EA's dreaded '1v1' actually is. I feel that while a lot of people on here do understand what it is, there's also a lot who don't know much about it or realise just how big of an impact it has had on FIFA's gameplay since FIFA 20 onwards. I want to bring it to the attention of everyone. My small hope is that someone from EA may stumble across this and help us offline players out at some point.

To begin, EA introduced this in FIFA 20 when (from my understanding) a lot of FUT players were complaining about the fact there was 'too much AI defending' happening. Obviously this sounds bad - and it is! Football is a team game that requires constant positional movement/adjustments from the other 10 players on the pitch. This shouldn't be understated - it's HUGE. I understand online players maybe wanting this for the ‘skill gap’, but for us offline players who are wanting to have realistic midfield battles and patterns vs the cpu, we just can’t get beyond this feature.

So what is it?

'1v1' in FIFA means that there's only 1 ACTIVE CPU defender who is engaged in defensive duties. The rest of the team aren't engaged - they stand in their formation, unaware of what is happening around them. It's ALL because of '1v1'.

The implementation of this has slightly changed across the different titles from 20-23, but at it's core that's what it means. When people talk about CM's or DM's or CB's not tracking back enough etc it comes back to this - every time, no doubt at all.

There's a tracking system that once you see, you can't un-see. The best way to test this is to run with a single player as far as you can across the pitch. You can literally see the moment the tracking changes from one particular defender to the other. When the DM is the '1' tracking a run for example and the ball carrier gets to a certain point, the '1' will change to the CB - and the result is.....you guessed it - the DM will just stop dead in his tracks. THIS is 1v1.

Sliders and even gameplay files don’t fix this core fundamental. Believe me - I've tried. I've spent hundreds of hours in those gameplay files and playing with sliders - there is no magical fix in there. When modders say they have 'midfielders tracking back' for example, that doesn't mean they're anymore aware of the context of the game than before - they're simply just being told to sit deeper. It's also not a matter of low marking or anything like that. The core problem is that outside of the '1' - the rest of the team is essentially switched to 'off'. In my gameplay mod I've implemented a few strategies that help to offset the issue of 1v1 - but let me be clear - it doesn't solve it! It's a fundamental issues of the game that dramatically impacts our offline experience.

It goes much further than this too -it's the reason players stand rigidly in their formation, 'stepping up' when required, but not closing down passing lanes, not being active to condense space etc. The result of 1v1 means we have very similar and predictable patterns of play. It's why the wings can be easy to exploit, it's a big reason games are so end-to-end - it comes back to 1v1.

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Here is an example of FIFA 23 Switch version (which uses the Ignite engine and DOESN'T have 1v1).

Note how the off-ball team is closing off the space around the ball carrier and limiting their options. This is happening CONTEXTUALLY based on where the ball is.


Now compare this to 23 NG. Look at the difference. The Real Madrid midfielders are not engaged AT ALL regarding the position of the ball. They are simply rigidly staying in formation.


And again, here is another example of the Switch version when the ball is in a different area on the pitch.....

See how everything looks much more natural when we have contextual positioning.

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Whilst I do believe that Hypermotion 11v11 capture has helped in some small ways, as teams shuffle across a little more etc - it DOESN'T FIX THE PROBLEM at it's core. The same philosophy is still behind this.

To further explain 1v1, here are some old tweets of mine. Some show FIFA 23, others FIFA 21 (where the issue was at it's worst). I've compared with FIFA 23 Switch and FIFA 16.









As you can all see, it's majorly impacting our offline experience. This is not a post designed to just hate on EA and say FIFA is terrible. I think 23 actually has a lot of good in it - and the potential is even bigger. However, this one aspect has such a huge negative impact on gameplay for offline players. All we want is for EA to give us the option of toggling this off so we can have a much more enjoyable offline experience. Call it 'assisted defending' if you need to EA, but give us the option!

To be clear as well - we want the game to be MORE DIFFICULT because of this, not easier. It's not about a lack of challenge, or 'learning how to defend', we want a proper challenge of breaking down defences and playing through difficult midfields.

 

[Paul-v]

Whilst I appreciate the passion. But sorry to burst your bubble. You are not going to win.

They did as a "skill gap" for FUT. So players do not get a helping hand from AI when defending. The skill freaks want this because otherwise they'd do the skill step 1,2,3 but get tackled by AI on step 2.

The ONLY way this will be fixed is if they split online and offline (career only likely) coding. This is very unlikely to happen. Reason being is that technically FUT does run "offline" on occasion too. AND offline is seen as "practice" for online.

Also the amount of times I got told by people who are involved in the game that they "have no time or staff to do" XYZ is astronomical.

By the way. In my latest mod, I would say the 1v1 problem isnt that bad apart from defending the wings. But I'd raise many other things wrong in vanilla offline over that, namely tactics, AI decision making, the laser passing!!, game pace, the through ball over the top exploit and many more.

All I can hope that we can mod FC24, otherwise I wont bother after 23 anyway. No way i could play unmodded unless there is a significant improvement in sliders.

(typed on my phone, apologies if i wrote something slightly wrong and couldn't watch all your videos)

 

[Anth James]

Whilst I appreciate the passion. But sorry to burst your bubble. You are not going to win.

They did as a "skill gap" for FUT. So players do not get a helping hand from AI when defending. The skill freaks want this because otherwise they'd do the skill step 1,2,3 but get tackled by AI on step 2.

The ONLY way this will be fixed is if they split online and offline (career only likely) coding. This is very unlikely to happen. Reason being is that technically FUT does run "offline" on occasion too. AND offline is seen as "practice" for online.

Also the amount of times I got told by people who are involved in the game that they "have no time or staff to do" XYZ is astronomical.

By the way. In my latest mod, I would say the 1v1 problem isnt that bad apart from defending the wings. But I'd raise many other things wrong in offline over that, namely tactics, AI decision making, the laser passing!!, game pace, the through ball over the top exploit and many more.

All I can hope that we can mod FC24, otherwise I wont bother after 23 anyway. No way i could play unmodded unless there is a significant improvement in sliders.

(typed on my phone, apologies if i wrote something slightly wrong and couldn't watch all your videos)

Thanks Paul. Definitely not expecting to win as such. I'm not expecting it be removed from the game completely as I know the skill gap etc means it won't happen. I feel like expecting an 'assisted defending' toggle for offline really isn't too much to ask when we look at the vast amount of toggles we have in the game right now.

I agree regarding a need to mod the game - 100% right there with you.

In terms of 1v1 not being that bad....I'm not sure I agree. I just feel like it impacts the gameplay in so many subtle, and not so subtle ways. I can still enjoy 23 with my gameplay mod also, so to a point I understand, but I've worked extensively on fixes for this alone - some of which have helped - but none of which are a proper solution though that would compare to being able to toggle it off.

If it could be turned off then our mods would be able to go to a place that they otherwise just can't get to. In so many ways I wish we had access to gameplay file editing just one year earlier for FIFA 19, as there was no 1v1 then..

 

[Paul-v]

The problem is we are not neccessarily working on fixing anything. We are only editing configuration files, not changing the underlying code. The leaked source highlighted so many problems in the gameplay code, I do not know where to start. The ultimate gameplay fixes would be to compile that code and run our very own FIFA 21.

My group finally to decided to have a game of FIFA with me last night. All locked to 1 character. One of my group was shocked to see a midfielder track back and tackle him from behind whilst using my mod BUT down the wings is a different story. Its VERY 1v1, so I agree with you. I wouldnt mind it so much if the AI knew how to use it to their benefit too, so its a fair fight.

 

[El Ogro De La Norde]

Now compare this to 23 NG. Look at the difference. The Real Madrid midfielders are not engaged AT ALL regarding the position of the ball. They are simply rigidly staying in formation.
View attachment 223808

I don't get this. What else are they supposed to do in that situation? Here's a random screenshot from the semifinal earlier this year where they're doing exactly the same thing. In general, midfield positioning is pretty good in FIFA 23.

 

[Anth James]

I don't get this. What else are they supposed to do in that situation? Here's a random screenshot from the semifinal earlier this year where they're doing exactly the same thing. In general, midfield positioning is pretty good in FIFA 23.

View attachment 224338

The difference in the pic above is that the ball is in the middle of the field. I don't have an issue with teams being in their formation if that's what the context of the situation asks for, but when the ball is on the wing you don't see all of the midfielders standing in the middle of the field rigid and disengaged.

 

[dontellmama]

I don't get this. What else are they supposed to do in that situation? Here's a random screenshot from the semifinal earlier this year where they're doing exactly the same thing. In general, midfield positioning is pretty good in FIFA 23.

1v1's problem is the "sensitivity" of all defenders to the ball.

 

[Matt10]

It's a hard one here because while yes the 1v1 is not good, I still remember so many hours dedicated to ignite engine defending. Where 1v1 may be too "stock" with the positioning, meaning the base defensive formation doesn't adjust to the dynamic attacking positioning, ignite engine defending had a high tendency to have attention deficit defending. There was such an issue in 15 and 16 where the defending players are not even looking at the ball carrier, and instead looking at the player behind him or to the opposite side. I remember we had to combat this so often because it meant the defensive line would never meet the attacker fully, and there was such an issue with low physicality as a result. The defending angles were impacted which affected the closedown rate, something that 1v1 does much better (especially with adjustments) which mimics retro PES difficulty of pressure to perform on the ball.

The good thing is that when the focus + tenacity was there in the ignite engine, it was the best because it was supported with multiple defending players, and not in a switch-on/off fashion the way 1v1 frostbite is. With that said, the 1v1 does keep the player who is "next up" zoned in and focused on defending. Yes on World Class there are issues at times, but with the right settings, it makes for some incredible 1v1 action. From there it's about adjusting the spacing so there is a flow to bring whoever is "next up" to be activated sooner and within the sequence of the play.

All that said, it's such a topic that doesn't have much ground to stand on unless EA make separate game modes like Paul said. AI Defending is the meta term the FUT players hated, so we had to accept the 1v1 into the recent iterations. I don't think it's going away anytime soon.

 

[Anth James]

It's a hard one here because while yes the 1v1 is not good, I still remember so many hours dedicated to ignite engine defending. Where 1v1 may be too "stock" with the positioning, meaning the base defensive formation doesn't adjust to the dynamic attacking positioning, ignite engine defending had a high tendency to have attention deficit defending. There was such an issue in 15 and 16 where the defending players are not even looking at the ball carrier, and instead looking at the player behind him or to the opposite side. I remember we had to combat this so often because it meant the defensive line would never meet the attacker fully, and there was such an issue with low physicality as a result. The defending angles were impacted which affected the closedown rate, something that 1v1 does much better (especially with adjustments) which mimics retro PES difficulty of pressure to perform on the ball.

The good thing is that when the focus + tenacity was there in the ignite engine, it was the best because it was supported with multiple defending players, and not in a switch-on/off fashion the way 1v1 frostbite is. With that said, the 1v1 does keep the player who is "next up" zoned in and focused on defending. Yes on World Class there are issues at times, but with the right settings, it makes for some incredible 1v1 action. From there it's about adjusting the spacing so there is a flow to bring whoever is "next up" to be activated sooner and within the sequence of the play.

All that said, it's such a topic that doesn't have much ground to stand on unless EA make separate game modes like Paul said. AI Defending is the meta term the FUT players hated, so we had to accept the 1v1 into the recent iterations. I don't think it's going away anytime soon.

We’re definitely in agreement that having 10 players essentially ‘switched off’ in a 11v11 team sport is not good. There’s so many ways that this results in issues throughout a match that really impacts us offline players.

A lot of players these days really aren’t aware of some of the ways it impacts the gameplay, so I just wanted to highlight those to help build some understanding of the issue. The more people who know about it, the more chance (although I understand it’s still very small) we have of having some kind of change/option to toggle off.

I think FIFA has had an issue with defensive angles for many years and I don’t think Frostbite fixed those either. I find the ease of bursting beyond a defender far too easy on Frostbite, even though it also exists in Ignite. I’m not sure I agree regarding your feelings on the Ignite engine, but it’s not really relevant for the sake of this discussion anyway. The examples provided show what a working team engagement off the ball should look like, and if EA were to give us that option, then we don’t have to assume that it would revert to legacy issues. Having more than 1 player ‘on’ is not the reason for some of the apparent issues with Ignite mentioned.

For the sake of unity and keeping things streamlined, I’m just trying to highlight some of what is wrong with 1v1 and why it leads to logistical problems within a match for us all. I’m not really expecting it to go away anytime soon either, I know what we’re up against.

I do think it’s important though that some of us at least can come together to create a little bit of resistance. I think our best chance for change is to keep the core issues we’re fighting for simplified. I worry that if we present an overly complex case of something which essentially has a pretty simple solution, then the 1% chance we have of getting anywhere is going to be 0% because it’ll just be looked at as personal opinion etc.

We know lots can be fixed/adjusted with sliders and I know lots can be with gameplay files also…..but we both know in this case that both of those are not enough to fix 1v1. I'm also not bashing the game, I think 23 does a lot of things very well, but this is the single biggest area where change would really, really help us offline gamers. We need EA to help us out though and at a minimum, one more toggle is really all I’m fighting for. I think asking for this and highlighting it is completely fair enough.

 

[dontellmama]

https://www.vgr.com/fifa-20-gameplay-changes-off-the-ball-features-1v1-play-bring-new-commands/

With FIFA 20, EA says gamers are going to see a lot more 1v1 situations all over the pitch. They also mention that the dribbler and defender are going to have “more time and space” in which to react to the situations. That should make for some interesting strategies as gamers adjust to this update.

Another one of the big changes EA made was to overhaul how AI defenders will act in FIFA 20. According to their notes, gamers will find “better defensive support” from their AI-controlled teammates. This will come due to how they updated both the positioning and tackling systems.

FIFA rolled out a short video clip which was part of the larger gameplay trailer they released. It showcases the updated “Dynamic 1v1” situations for attack and defense.

Change the game in defence and attack with more 1-on-1 situations #FIFA20

— EA SPORTS FIFA (@EASPORTSFIFA) July 22, 2019
Due to the changes, EA notes that the off-the-ball gameplay will be “slower and more composed.” However, on-the-ball will be “very responsive and agile.” That remains to be seen, but most gamers are hoping that’s better than FIFA 19.

Gamers should basically see more natural and realistic motion from players during their games. This will give gameplay that feel of being a real-life game even though it’s a video game simulation.

 

[Anth James]

Here's a clip from FIFA 11 that shows just how much better (and more logical) defending was before 1v1.

We have 3 defensive players involved in this one sequence. If this was post 1v1 we would have....you guessed it - 1! It would be the same player just chasing back as the dribbler ran into the box with the defensive line dropping off.

Here we have the second midfielder realising that he needs to come in and cut the angle off as the initial runner is simply chasing. After this, we have the RB who notices the immediate danger and STEPS UP to make the tackle. This is what we need again.

 

[Byronic]

Here's a clip from FIFA 11 that shows just how much better (and more logical) defending was before 1v1.

We have 3 defensive players involved in this one sequence. If this was post 1v1 we would have....you guessed it - 1! It would be the same player just chasing back as the dribbler ran into the box with the defensive line dropping off.

Here we have the second midfielder realising that he needs to come in and cut the angle off as the initial runner is simply chasing. After this, we have the RB who notices the immediate danger and STEPS UP to make the tackle. This is what we need again.

And on Top of that great situation just look at the Body Physics and the realistic collision of the 3 participants. No ghostly go through.

 

[Byronic]

If it could be turned off then our mods would be able to go to a place that they otherwise just can't get to. In so many ways I wish we had access to gameplay file editing just one year earlier for FIFA 19, as there was no 1v1 then..

I am about to launch FIFA 19 again just for the test of the last FIFA where 1v1 not popped in like you mentioned.

 

[Hels The Ronin]

This is because of online skiller whinnies, as Paul said. Fucking kids that think that playing football is playing tricks all the time and running very fast and playing very flashy. FIFA has gone hell simply because people don't actually like or understand football, specially, new generations, which are the people that put money in cards.

Fuck this life.

 

[Hels The Ronin]

Also, if this can be changed somewhere, it is more probably in combination with InitFS, hoping that there's a line that disables this shitty behaviour. But there's a lot of InitFS files and I doubt that they've actually set a lane to disable this. Would be cool if they did, but I trully doubt they've done so.

 

[*aLe]

FIFA has gone hell simply because people don't actually like or understand football, specially, new generations, which are the people that put money in cards.

On a different note, I must say that it also happens with real football.
New generations hardly have the will/patience/attention span to follow a 90 minute match entirely.

This is also one of the things, if I recall correctly, that Piqué mentioned while talking about the reasons why he decided to start the Kings League (which is, pretty much, a combination of Volta and "house rules", but in real life).

No surprise it also applies to gaming now. If you add the "I think football is boring" brigade to the "I want the skill gaaaaaaapppppp" brigade, here's your recipe for disaster.

 

[Hels The Ronin]

On a different note, I must say that it also happens with real football.
New generations hardly have the will/patience/attention span to follow a 90 minute match entirely.

This is also one of the things, if I recall correctly, that Piqué mentioned while talking about the reasons why he decided to start the Kings League (which is, pretty much, a combination of Volta and "house rules", but in real life).

No surprise it also applies to gaming now. If you add the "I think football is boring" brigade to the "I want the skill gaaaaaaapppppp" brigade, here's your recipe for disaster.

Yup, completely true, what you said. It is sad all this, the whole sport might change itself. I am 34 myself and I have the feeling that newer generations don't even like football or have the will to follow it. And must I say, it might have a positive effect on the long term for the sport, because with time, all this might be useful to destroy the economy inflation on the sport and market, the market prices might stabilize or even go down and the sport will go back to be something about your base players and not only about who has more money.

Also, the number of matches in the calendar might reduce if less people look football, so all in all, it might have a positive impact. But yeah, in general terms, it will be a very bad thing for the income of teams, specially small ones.

 

[simogto90]

On a different note, I must say that it also happens with real football.
New generations hardly have the will/patience/attention span to follow a 90 minute match entirely.

This is also one of the things, if I recall correctly, that Piqué mentioned while talking about the reasons why he decided to start the Kings League (which is, pretty much, a combination of Volta and "house rules", but in real life).

No surprise it also applies to gaming now. If you add the "I think football is boring" brigade to the "I want the skill gaaaaaaapppppp" brigade, here's your recipe for disaster.

The problem Is that "1vs1" in the way Is designed and implemented,makes the game boring, monodimensional and predictable. It doesn't bring skill gap neither.
I am playing fc24 online seasons and i can say that fifa16 (or your favorite one before the 1vs1 introduction) needs way more skill to be played at high level.
On fifa 16 passing and build up require skill vision, timing. Dribbling require real skill on the fingers. Shooting require way more skill than new ones.
Yes defending Is easier, but tactical defending was enough to create a Fair skill gap. There were a lot of variables that we had to consider on the pitch, we need both brain and hands.
Now the game is so much streamlined,we just need hands.

 

[dontellmama]

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