Guys, why do you think Konami screwed up big time with PES on NEXT-GEN ?

iluvnineties

iluvnineties

Banned
18 April 2008
Boston, Massachusetts, USA
FC Porto
I honestly can't put two and two together and figure out why would Konami make such a stupid move and just destroy a game that was once known as the best football simulation game ever to date ? :CONFUSE:

They made a huge success with PES/WE on PS2 even PS1 and such. People were going insane each year. I remember when we had countdowns for new releases. It was like a holiday or something. Why did they decide to screw this up ? Better question is: Why did EA all of a sudden come up with a better game ? CONSPIRACY ?? :SHOCK:

I just don't get this whole picture. Konami are surely losing a lot of money because of this. I bet half of what used to be PES/WE fanboys went with FIFA. 2 years in a row now.

Unless Winning Eleven shines I don't see how Konami can compete with EA&FIFA anymore.

Seabass should be fired. He along with his staff made promises that if I remember correctly he said: PES 2008 or 2009 will be the best football game ever remembered - this was the biggest lie in the gaming industry.

Feel free to elaborate and state your opinions.
 
They dont know what to do with all the CPU power, pretty simple, There not even making a new engine for 2010 so its pretty much FIFA for the simulation heads like myself.
 
If you ignore everything about the game except gameplay, PES5 is superior in every way (and even beats PES 09 in terms of sounds, animation and AI imo)
There's absolutely nothing in the gameplay that's an improvement over PES5, that's 3 years and all they have done is go backwards a LONG way.

PES used to be that magical game that would have a special flair to it that would keep you coming back, it's lost it over the last 2 or 3 versions (PES6 was a failure imo, not a huge one though) and the ones before that which had that appeal have not aged particularly well and are now just something you'd play occasionally for nostalgia purposes, not regularly.

I'll be very dissapointed with PES every year until they rework the fundamentals of the gameplay to give us a proper football simulation, unfortunately there are still enough fanboys who will bend over and take whatever shit Konami give them, meaning they have no real reason to work on the game...
 
Rob92 said:
If you ignore everything about the game except gameplay, PES5 is superior in every way (and even beats PES 09 in terms of sounds, animation and AI imo)
There's absolutely nothing in the gameplay that's an improvement over PES5, that's 3 years and all they have done is go backwards a LONG way.

PES used to be that magical game that would have a special flair to it that would keep you coming back, it's lost it over the last 2 or 3 versions (PES6 was a failure imo, not a huge one though) and the ones before that which had that appeal have not aged particularly well and are now just something you'd play occasionally for nostalgia purposes, not regularly.

I'll be very dissapointed with PES every year until they rework the fundamentals of the gameplay to give us a proper football simulation, unfortunately there are still enough fanboys who will bend over and take whatever shit Konami give them, meaning they have no real reason to work on the game...
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But there is also another fairy tale of how if none buys PES KONAMI will shut down the studio and PES will die as franchise...
 
This thread is the truth. PES6 is better then their next gen efforts actually to be honest all the PS2 versions are superior then Konami next gen efforts.
It's truly sad that when compared to the PS3 the PS2 is such an inferior machine yet the PS2 versions are so much better then what Konami offers on the next gen platforms.
 
It's a matter of vanity (Seabass), blindness and greedness (Konami) and not investing a s$%&$t! in this game for years. What did you expect? I almost threw the towel with pes 6 as the game was obviously already stalled by then.

Japanese lack the ambition and management talent to develop big games in next gen. They need to put 300 people working, not the current 45!
 
drekkard said:
It's a matter of vanity (Seabass), blindness and greedness (Konami) and not investing a s$%&$t! in this game for years. What did you expect? I almost threw the towel with pes 6 as the game was obviously already stalled by then.

Japanese lack the ambition and management talent to develop big games in next gen. They need to put 300 people working, not the current 45!
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So by your saying Kojima and his team are aliens...
 
Don't you miss those days when you have to skip school or work or whatever so you can be in your house, wait for the mail man to deliver the game :P I sure do. But those days are over I'm afraid. I had countless hours of fun ordering Winning Eleven from Play-Asia and then firing them up on my DMS3 modded PS2. ;)

As much as FIFA has improved over the last 2 years I still get bored of playing it ??

I remember staying up until 4am playing PES3, 4 and Winning Eleven 7:International - WHY ?? Because these games had the depth, incredible gameplay, and the true simulation flavor.

Guys, serious question now: Do you think if all of us, big time PES/WE fans get all together from various message boards and just write something to Konami and direct the letter straight to Seabass would get us anywhere. Or simply boycott the game ?? Would this get us anywhere so Konami and the rest of their lazy staff can pull their heads out of their ass and release a proper football game ?
 
iluvnineties said:
Don't you miss those days when you have to skip school or work or whatever so you can be in your house, wait for the mail man to deliver the game :P I sure do. But those days are over I'm afraid. I had countless hours of fun ordering Winning Eleven from Play-Asia and then firing them up on my DMS3 modded PS2. ;)

As much as FIFA has improved over the last 2 years I still get bored of playing it ??

I remember staying up until 4am playing PES3, 4 and Winning Eleven 7:International - WHY ?? Because these games had the depth, incredible gameplay, and the true simulation flavor.

Guys, serious question now: Do you think if all of us, big time PES/WE fans get all together from various message boards and just write something to Konami and direct the letter straight to Seabass would get us anywhere. Or simply boycott the game ?? Would this get us anywhere so Konami and the rest of their lazy staff can pull their heads out of their ass and release a proper football game ?
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Trust me I completely understand where you are coming from I feel same way but Konami just don't seem to care and the blind fanbase looks like will accept any trash Konami throws at them and will even go as far to make excuses for them.

If they don't introduce a new engine I am not buying it, my brother made the mistake buying this years next gen version on the PS3 then later found out once we played the skill system has been removed.
Next year I am not buying it's as simple as that unless they can make it as good as the PS2 versions of past.
 
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ryu1999 said:
Trust me I completely understand where you are coming from I feel same way but Konami just don't seem to care and the blind fanbase looks like will accept any trash Konami throws at them and will even go as far to make excuses for them.

If they don't introduce a new engine I am not buying it, my brother made the mistake buying this years next gen version on the PS3 then later found out once we played the skill system has been removed.
Next year I am not buying it's as simple as that unless they can make it as good as the PS2 versions of past.
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If everyone was like you and I we would have a much better PES game today. Kudos
 
iluvnineties said:
If everyone was like you and I we would have a much better PES game today. Kudos
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We cannot...as long as KONAMI has Japan the 2nd gaming market in the world and the first it terms of footy (USA has nothing to do with football) they wont care....its when Japan starts buying FIFA (aka never) they will pull their heads out of their rears...
 
I think konami is using its trademark called "PES" to make some money. Since PES 5 (not included) the game is getting worse and I just don´t understand why they don´t do something different. They need a completly new game engine. Unless they buy one againa (as they did in old gen) they will loose much money.

Sometimes I think if Seabass just doesn´t care anymore about the game as he´s a rich guy.

Also, if any games company decides to make a football game I´m sure PES will "die", because every game company would make a football game with a real next gen engine.

If only 2kSports make a football game... :BOP:
 
I don't see problems to the current generation PES. 4 me its still the best soccer sim on the market :)
 
I don't know why people still want to talk about PES/WE as a football sim. Seabass has clearly stated it's not a sim, and they are not developing or evolving the game in that direction. Clinging onto that sim belief is likely to end in disappointment.

If Seabass and Konami want to serve a segment of the market other than sim, that's just fine. What they really need to improve is the technical side of things which I guess will happen gradually as their staff get used to the hardware.

People should not think Seabass must make a football sim.
 
oFifa09o said:
So by your saying Kojima and his team are aliens...
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You should probably know that Konami had to ask for help to external developers and most of the code of the engine of MGS4 is done by an american team of programmers hired by Konami when they saw the problem they were putting themselves in. That happened some time ago and was the reason why the game was released later than expected at the beggining. Simply put they couldn't succeed because they didn't had a clue about how to develop for multiprocessors properly.

The few good japanese programmers in terms of ball physics signed for EA almost 3 years ago. EA had in mind a new engine for the next-generation football title and invested. Next-gen investments are HUGE and only show at LONG TERM.

That's why there's no hope for PES in next.gen, they need at least 2 years to have a solid new game engine and we all know seabass doesn't like to work very much.
 
Someone should create a thread titled, "Guys, why do you think EA screwed up big time with FIFA on the PC"?
hehe
 
as I said in another thread a portion of this for me is trying to show the indivuality of players, adrianno started it with his super shot and inability to be tackled now Barca, Manu etc have so many special players that its not about skill in reality its about the team you pick.

You will have the odd player who can pick a 2nd tier vs 1st tier and win but put two great players against each other one with Barca another with Hull and there will be one winner...mostly because you can press X to tackle but the machine decides that Messi is the best and just ignores you..
 
I have another question!
Why all believe that PES 2010 will be a unique new engine and is superior to FIFA?
It is spoken everywhere, PES 2010 will be great, but why believe that konami would make such a big step?
What makes you think so? Had anything officially out on this occasion?
 
antraxa said:
I have another question!
Why all believe that PES 2010 will be a unique new engine and is superior to FIFA?
It is spoken everywhere, PES 2010 will be great, but why believe that konami would make such a big step?
What makes you think so? Had anything officially out on this occasion?
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I thought that was rubbished by Seasbass himself according to the WENB boys and 2010 will be the same engine..
 
Well then you do not wonder why most switching to FIFA ... 6 years can not offer the same engine and expect people to like it ... As it is well fed. But definitely I can not say that the new engine is good.
 
drekkard said:
... most of the code of the engine of MGS4 is done by an american team of programmers hired by Konami ...

The few good japanese programmers in terms of ball physics signed for EA almost 3 years ago. ...
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Can you share your source for these? I've frankly not read about these before. Thanks.
 
Hi everyone.
Nice topic.

I actually started my "romance" with Konami in 1998 at the very first game they made with real players. When you could still play only with national teams.

You are all right, since PES5 there's nothing new in the games that come out, and I played every version available over the years, including every Winning Eleven.

The ps3 version is horrible (didn't get a chance to play 09 on it yet..)
Don't understand how it came down to this.
 
I think Konami should channel their resources to PS3 + PC, instead of this XBOX, Wii, PSP gibberish. Its taking time and resources off the MAIN game.

It has sadly become a money grabbing game rather than gameplay first (just like FIFA of the years gone by)
 
Fear
Simple and true reason.
Fifa did not have much fans or was that popular since 2000 to 2006,when PES was progressing,and everytime coming with a improved great game.
PES 5 was closest to simulation,and then came PES 6 which was failure,but not big one.
But that year Fifa anounces that next version of fifa is coming as a next gen,with brand new graphics,AI,gameplay,everything.
KONAMI in fear makes fatal mistake,and takes what Fifa was since 2000 to 2006.
Seriously I compared graphics from wide camera on both games,they look 95% same.
They need some inovation,they need to stop making crap games and saying that it will be best simulation.
PES 2009 has more arcade features then simulation features
Every game volley,overheads,ping pong results...
Is that real in real life?
I don't think so,they even screwed up shooting,which was always good at PES.
I dunno how they manage to do it,but yet in past 3 years they dissapointed thousands of fans all over world,and lost many of players...
Sad isn't it?
EA who was in shadow for almost 10 years,in 2 years made a game that is now closest to simulation-Fifa 09 on xbox and ps3
Don't get me wrong,I love PES,playing since ISS,but I tried Fifa 09 on ps3 and I was thrilled...
Ironic...
 
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