FIFA 21 Discussion Thread

manmachine

Championship
22 June 2008
Well, it's not the right game for the instant gratification crowd, that's true.

Please, it's a game for 10 year old boys with access to their parents CC card. I've also spent almost 100 hours trying to mod that other pile of poo, fifa 20. Is that enough time for you to accept other people's opinion? But you're obviously trolling so please do not quote me again.

To any mod/admin: Is there a block function so that you don't see public posts from certain people? (edit: Well, I tried the 'ignore' link that pops up, let's see).
 
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rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
Please, it's a game for 10 year old boys with access to their parents CC card. I've also spent almost 100 hours trying to mod that other pile of poo, fifa 20. Is that enough time for you to accept other people's opinion? But you're obviously trolling so please do not quote me again.

To any mod/admin: Is there a block function so that you don't see public posts from certain people? (edit: Well, I tried the 'ignore' link that pops up, let's see).
Ignore button works.
 

rojofa

Premiership
15 September 2017
The sale of FUT packs is about the most obvious appeal to those who want instant gratification and it's where they make the vast majority of their profit. To say FIFA 21 isn't for those seeking instant gratification is hilariously wrong. They directly target those people as it's so lucrative.


If this isn't "instant gratification" then what is? He's not even playing the game (the football part) and gets this worked up about it. This video has almost 3M views and there's countless popular videos like this from the last decade. I've known people who use the mobile app to open packs on their lunch break and reacting similarly to this because they bought a lucky pack.

That's the main part of the game, the instant gratification casino. The football part is a dull as dishwater generic online action game. The lack of resemblance to football or relevance of realistic tactics/strategy if anything broadens the appeal beyond football.

You can watch/play no real life football but be great at FIFA just because you have good gamepad skills and reaction time/timing.

Having no concept of how football is actually played probably helps your level in FIFA as you wouldn't be trying to do the stuff that you would on a real football pitch, or instinctively not trying stuff you wouldn't. You would only do what the "meta" dictates is the most effective way to win at FIFA.

Ironically it seems like the only way to enjoy FIFA offline is to be terrible enough at it that the dogshit AI offers any kind of resistance whatsoever. So learning to play the game better would only make the single player content worse. The opposite of delayed gratification.
 
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manmachine

Championship
22 June 2008
Ironically it seems like the only way to enjoy FIFA offline is to be terrible enough at it that the dogshit AI offers any kind of resistance whatsoever. So learning to play the game better would only make the single player content worse. The opposite of delayed gratification.


Well, I scored and uploaded this, in my very first session with the trial version against the world class AI. Nobody can tell me that I didn't give the game enough time, or that it's deeper than that and the AI will get magically better if I buy it. (And please no "try ultimate/sliders/manual/playing with one eye closed", the game is so bad for years and absolutely nothing will make it play like football).

I don't need more time with this, in fact I don't need more than the 10 seconds it takes to view this. The gameplay is shit, end of story.
 

rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
I too played the 10 hrs trial version,gave it 2-3,could have quit after 30 min that's how bad it is.
will I binge a 10 ep 5 season series when I after one episode discover that it's garbage?
bad acting,shitty script, cliché story?
nope,same thing here!.

i can easily say,if my EA play subscription weren't included in my game pass I'd cancel it asap now that they've removed the only great/good/playable FIFA games (15-16-17-18).
and I won't spend a penny buying a new FIFA,last one bought was 20,which I enjoyed in periods even though I knew it was crap,it was still "enjoyable".
 

saturator

League 2
27 July 2005
What are the expectations for FIFA 22?
I expect a lot about FIFA 22 :

*Visual :
- Real nextgen graphics with realtime wheather
- Better stadiums with hi res crowds and tunnels
-better HDR : now it's too dark
- more starheads

*Gameplay (more important)
- no more arcadish game, i want full simulation
-better IA with more variations
- Better ball physics
-fixed Bad referees
- create a slider for fouls
- make headers harder, to simple in 21, good in 20
-real players ID for star players
-more animations for all players
-remove skating visual impression
-more inertia
-slowdown the game

*Carrier mode
- comeback of sponsors
-fixed interviews, too boring and sometimes completly out!
- custom stadiums

It will be a good start for FIFA 22!
 

majuh

International
11 December 2010
Please, it's a game for 10 year old boys with access to their parents CC card. I've also spent almost 100 hours trying to mod that other pile of poo, fifa 20. Is that enough time for you to accept other people's opinion? But you're obviously trolling so please do not quote me again.

To any mod/admin: Is there a block function so that you don't see public posts from certain people? (edit: Well, I tried the 'ignore' link that pops up, let's see).
Very amusing that the guy that is permanently trolling around in this thread without even playing the damn game is accusing others of trolling. Your problem is that you consider this an "opinion", while I would consider this an unhealthy love-hate relationship. You seem to make your hate on FIFA a part of your identity.

The sale of FUT packs is about the most obvious appeal to those who want instant gratification and it's where they make the vast majority of their profit. To say FIFA 21 isn't for those seeking instant gratification is hilariously wrong. They directly target those people as it's so lucrative.


If this isn't "instant gratification" then what is? He's not even playing the game (the football part) and gets this worked up about it. This video has almost 3M views and there's countless popular videos like this from the last decade. I've known people who use the mobile app to open packs on their lunch break and reacting similarly to this because they bought a lucky pack.

That's the main part of the game, the instant gratification casino. The football part is a dull as dishwater generic online action game. The lack of resemblance to football or relevance of realistic tactics/strategy if anything broadens the appeal beyond football.

You can watch/play no real life football but be great at FIFA just because you have good gamepad skills and reaction time/timing.

Having no concept of how football is actually played probably helps your level in FIFA as you wouldn't be trying to do the stuff that you would on a real football pitch, or instinctively not trying stuff you wouldn't. You would only do what the "meta" dictates is the most effective way to win at FIFA.

Ironically it seems like the only way to enjoy FIFA offline is to be terrible enough at it that the dogshit AI offers any kind of resistance whatsoever. So learning to play the game better would only make the single player content worse. The opposite of delayed gratification.
Do you play FUT? The chance of a pack opening like this happening to you is close to zero, so there's no instant gratification happening there most of the time. The mode has become incredibly time-gated. If you want to complete objectives for mediocre players, they want you to play like 30 friendly matches. Just compare that to PES where you are regularly gifted free spins upon login. Another example: FUT doesn't have daily login bonuses. MyClub and PES Mobile appeal way more to the instant gratification crowd than modern FUT. Of course both games are targeting whales, but that's not instant gratification in effect.
 

rojofa

Premiership
15 September 2017
I never mentioned PES once in my post, I don't give a shit about it being worse or not, so any response mentioning it is irrelevant. Your contributions are largely "PES bad FIFA good". One being worse doesn't make the other automatically good or worthy of any time or praise whatsoever. Choosing between FUT or MyClub is like choosing whether you want Kim Jong-un or Robert Mugabe as your leader. How about neither, and not trying to extoll the virtues of the slightly less shitty one at any opportunity?

Those pack openings are unlikely, sure, he probably streamed for hours and spent several thousand pounds to put together an edited 15 minute video like that, but that's the good thing about gambling (for EA) - you don't have to actually give the reward very often, you just need the suspense during the elaborate pack opening animation where it feels like a possibility and that in itself becomes an attraction/addiction. Something reinforced by the existence of videos like the one above... "That could be me! If I just open a few more packs...".

People dump money in for the chance at that gratification, that's why gambling is such a profitable industry. Taking longer to pay out a "jackpot" doesn't mean it's for a more sophisticated crowd not looking for instant gratification. It just means the people are being taken for bigger mugs and being fleeced of their cash more efficiently. The time-gating and terrible odds are decisions to exploit people and drive profits, not to create a balanced game mode with depth.
 
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majuh

International
11 December 2010
Your contributions are largely "PES bad FIFA good".
That's wrong. Just because I defend EA from unfair criticism doesn't mean that I'm giving them a free pass on everything else. Life isn't just black and white, you know?

Those pack openings are unlikely, sure, he probably streamed for hours and spent several thousand pounds to put together an edited 15 minute video like that, but that's the good thing about gambling (for EA) - you don't have to actually give the reward very often, you just need the suspense during the elaborate pack opening animation where it feels like a possibility and that in itself becomes an attraction/addiction. Something reinforced by the existence of videos like the one above... "That could be me! If I just open a few more packs...".

People dump money in for the chance at that gratification, that's why gambling is such a profitable industry. Taking longer to pay out a "jackpot" doesn't mean it's for a more sophisticated crowd not looking for instant gratification. It just means the people are being taken for bigger mugs and being fleeced of their cash more efficiently. The time-gating and terrible odds are decisions to exploit people and drive profits, not to create a balanced game mode with depth.
That's all true, but it's not instant gratification in effect because it's literally not instant.

People on Spotify skip songs after 10 seconds because the intro is too boring. As a result, the intros are only 5 seconds long on average now: That's instant gratification.

People buy a video game but stop playing it after 10 minutes because the tutorial is too boring. As a result, video games need to be piss easy now: That's instant gratification.

People play 50 matches each week and spend 5 hours on pulling packs in FUT until they finally get a TotS player: That's not instant gratification, that's casino gambling.

When you think about it, it's quite unfathomable why FUT has become the phenomenon it is. The whole mode is actually inaccessible as hell. Nothing is explained ingame, you need to look up everything on the internet instead. That makes it even more baffling why other games with a much better onboarding process like PES aren't able to reproduce that success.
 

hitmanuk

International
23 October 2002
uk
It seems the evo-web summer madness is starting.
I think the madness is always here its just the seasons that change

Normally starts about now about the upcoming games release, then its the debate on its shit or brilliant, then the patches discussions /placebos start around Oct/Nov. Then it dwindles to how good past football games where from WE6 to FIFA 14 or whatever - this is where i am in the madness - just bought FIFA 14 for a pound, realized how good it was compared to 18,19.,20,21 and then re installed PES 17 which i think is the best in modern times - definitely losing it
 

rojofa

Premiership
15 September 2017
That's wrong. Just because I defend EA from unfair criticism doesn't mean that I'm giving them a free pass on everything else. Life isn't just black and white, you know?


That's all true, but it's not instant gratification in effect because it's literally not instant.

People on Spotify skip songs after 10 seconds because the intro is too boring. As a result, the intros are only 5 seconds long on average now: That's instant gratification.

People buy a video game but stop playing it after 10 minutes because the tutorial is too boring. As a result, video games need to be piss easy now: That's instant gratification.

People play 50 matches each week and spend 5 hours on pulling packs in FUT until they finally get a TotS player: That's not instant gratification, that's casino gambling.

When you think about it, it's quite unfathomable why FUT has become the phenomenon it is. The whole mode is actually inaccessible as hell. Nothing is explained ingame, you need to look up everything on the internet instead. That makes it even more baffling why other games with a much better onboarding process like PES aren't able to reproduce that success.
You don't just defend them from unfair criticism, you come up with something to "defend" loads of legitimate issues as well, or suggest it's because of the way people are playing or that they dislike the game because they were seeking "instant gratification". Like manmachine thinking the game was shit in the first hour for legitimate gameplay reasons (like the video posted above walking through world class AI defence) that are not solved, if anything exacerbated, by becoming more proficient at the game. Clearly nothing to do with seeking instant gratification. Seen similarly stupid responses when people complain about the braindead "1v1" teammate defensive AI.

Totally unnecessary, passive aggressive BS jumping to the game and EA's defence for no reason. Also cramming in comparison to PES in response to posts that don't mention it, as if being a bit less shit than PES in a certain aspect is a plus point for FIFA that makes it worth playing. Criticise something about FUT "MyClub is worse".

And this constant "you're trolling, you don't even play the game" bollocks. Of course many people here don't play the game, we want a decent sim-like experience and think 21 is shite for a plethora of good reasons. That doesn't mean we forfeit the ability to talk about the game, the series or football games in general, something we all want to see return to a good state and are passionate about. Venting about and discussing the negative aspects is still on topic whether you like it or not.

The instant gratification stuff is semantics really. You click the button to open a pack, you instantly get the rush that a gambler seeks, which itself is the entertainment for many people in this game. People play slot machines for the same reason. As soon as you spin the wheel you immediately have that suspense. Perhaps "gratification" isn't the perfect word, it causes just as much misery, but the instant part is true.

You either play enough matches to gain the coins to buy the packs/players from the market, complete SBCs etc or you dump enough FIFA points (real cash) in to pack the players directly or accumulate the coins instantly from quick selling/auctioning to accelerate the process to as fast as your money allows. The faster people want gratification, the faster EA empties their wallets.
 
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Flipper the Priest

Harder.Better.Faster.Stromer.
15 July 2003
Scotland
I think the madness is always here its just the seasons that change

Normally starts about now about the upcoming games release, then its the debate on its shit or brilliant, then the patches discussions /placebos start around Oct/Nov. Then it dwindles to how good past football games where from WE6 to FIFA 14 or whatever - this is where i am in the madness - just bought FIFA 14 for a pound, realized how good it was compared to 18,19.,20,21 and then re installed PES 17 which i think is the best in modern times - definitely losing it

Pretty much it. It was kinda always like that, even way back when, but there was a lull after Christmas because you were either in or out.

The golden era was the current era, FIFA chat was but a dusty recess of PES Fan or PES Insight, and data packs and updates weren't around to keep the discussion of the latest game burning.

After a few months you were pretty much left with the editing section beavering away, and everyone else debating who was going to win Big Brother.
 

majuh

International
11 December 2010
You don't just defend them from unfair criticism, you come up with something to "defend" loads of legitimate issues as well, or suggest it's because of the way people are playing or that they dislike the game because they were seeking "instant gratification". Like manmachine thinking the game was shit in the first hour for legitimate gameplay reasons (like the video posted above walking through world class AI defence) that are not solved, if anything exacerbated, by becoming more proficient at the game. Clearly nothing to do with seeking instant gratification. Seen similarly stupid responses when people complain about the braindead "1v1" teammate defensive AI.
Wrong. That video is obviously not representative of the game, and everybody that plays the game knows that. Apart from that, define "legitimate issues": A big part of the community doesn't see stuff like 1vs1 as legitimate issues. That's primarily the view of the Evo-Web bubble, you don't see that in other communities.

And this constant "you're trolling, you don't even play the game" bollocks. Of course many people here don't play the game, we want a decent sim-like experience and think 21 is shite for a plethora of good reasons. That doesn't mean we forfeit the ability to talk about the game, the series or football games in general, something we all want to see return to a good state and are passionate about. Venting about and discussing the negative aspects is still on topic whether you like it or not.
Why is nobody talking about that plethora of good reasons then? This "discussion" thread is literally devoid of gameplay discussion. You need to visit other places like the OS slider thread or /r/SeriousFIFA/ if you want to know how gameplay discussion looks like.

The instant gratification stuff is semantics really. You click the button to open a pack, you instantly get the rush that a gambler seeks, which itself is the entertainment for many people in this game. People play slot machines for the same reason. As soon as you spin the wheel you immediately have that suspense. Perhaps "gratification" isn't the perfect word, it causes just as much misery, but the instant part is true.

You either play enough matches to gain the coins to buy the packs/players from the market, complete SBCs etc or you dump enough FIFA points (real cash) in to pack the players directly or accumulate the coins instantly from quick selling/auctioning to accelerate the process to as fast as your money allows. The faster people want gratification, the faster EA empties their wallets.
A thought experiment: What would happen if microtransactions were banned? Do you really think gameplay would shift into the direction that the Evo-Web bubble wants to see? The point is that most people in this place do not approach this game with an open mind. They are not willing to learn the new mechanics, they are not willing to change their perspective. That's what I mean with instant gratification: "My first match in this game doesn't play like FIFA 16 with legacy defending, so it must be baaaaad. I better directly uninstall it and shit all over it in my favorite forums." FUT is not the reason that the gameplay developed into this direction, and the implication that the elitists around here know better what's good and what's bad about the game than the FUT players spending god knows how many hours with the game is just laughable. No, FUT is not a casual mode and most people there don't seek instant gratification because the mode is not built around that concept.
 

Mathgamer

League 2
11 April 2016
All of our new EA SPORTS games in FY22 are designed for next-gen console platforms, including FIFA, Madden, NHL and EA SPORTS PGA Tour, our return to golf that is set for Q4 of this year. - Andrew Wilson

I believe we will not receive the next-gen version on PC ☹️

Look at these metrics

FIFA 21, life to date, has more than 25 million console/PC players. FIFA Ultimate Team™️ players grew 16% year-over-year and FUT matches were up 180%. More than 20 million players played FIFA Ultimate Team in the last year.
 
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rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
Downloaded this again,played a few games with OS sliders,but this is even worse than I remember (career mode).
20 feels so much better in terms of looking and playing like football.
I had 3-4 seasons of 20 and I preferred it over 19,but 21 is unplayable,even with no/few assists.
Not going to shit on anyone for liking this,but for me this is so bad.
Guess 15-16-17 and occasionally 20 is my FIFA options now.
Might even buy a physical copy of 18 now that EA play has removed it
 
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rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
Since this game is free on EA play I decide to give it more than one go,I play on the OS sliders (again) but with a few tweaks in acceleration/shooting/passing and first touch error.
And I'm starting to enjoy it more and more,still not a very good game,but it has it's moments.

They've clearly worked on body adjusting (passing) some ball physics,feels pretty damn good on the ball.
Still feel that the 1v1 defending is a step in the wrong direction Vs every game up to FIFA 20.

But for me,playing on WC difficulty,games could be a bit to easy,and LEG and above just feels like playing Vs machines,the 1v1 (just like I said on Fifa 20) adds an element of difficulty,you can be 2-0 up and screw two attacks by the CPU up,and it's 2-2.
Keeps me on my toes for sure.
Not a very good game,but I'm starting to at least enjoy it,just like I did FIFA 20.

And playing these games are pretty convenient Vs Pes nowadays,it's all there,stadiums atmosphere,really like how much they've put in to Bundesliga which is the league I'm playing.
So,my honest (and changed) opinion on Fifa 21.
 
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shumway

League 2
29 August 2018
Ruhrpott
F95
My biggest gripe on fifa 21, besides all the issues mentioned a thousand times here, are the high scoring games. Normally I play on worldclass, OS sliders with 10 minute halfs and I have an average of at least 5 goals per game. I score too much and I concede to much, especially the numbers of goals in the last 15 minutes are beyond ridiculous.
I tried on legendary (don't like the ai there) and even lowered the halfes to 8 minutes, but it doesn't help. All I want are some scrappy 0-0s here and there instead of goal fests everytime.
 

rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
My biggest gripe on fifa 21, besides all the issues mentioned a thousand times here, are the high scoring games. Normally I play on worldclass, OS sliders with 10 minute halfs and I have an average of at least 5 goals per game. I score too much and I concede to much, especially the numbers of goals in the last 15 minutes are beyond ridiculous.
I tried on legendary (don't like the ai there) and even lowered the halfes to 8 minutes, but it doesn't help. All I want are some scrappy 0-0s here and there instead of goal fests everytime.
I've had three four games last night,2-1 1-1 etc.
Pretty much same settings as you.
Semi shooting?
I can probably score more goals if I really wanted,but I like to build up and control play,plus if I do that,the CPU won't score
 

shumway

League 2
29 August 2018
Ruhrpott
F95
Yes, everything semi except manual lob passes, tactical defending. I have no clue what I'm doing "wrong". But when I lurk in the OS slider forum every now and then, I see some people have the same goal fests like me while others have acceptable results like you. I think it all depends by the style of playing.
 

rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
Yes, everything semi except manual lob passes, tactical defending. I have no clue what I'm doing "wrong". But when I lurk in the OS slider forum every now and then, I see some people have the same goal fests like me while others have acceptable results like you. I think it all depends by the style of playing.
Yeah it's probably a combo of that and weak defending from the CPU.
I have to defend for my life Vs the CPU though.
I'm playing as a bottom team btw, Stuttgart,could also be an explanation.
I've raised passing error for CPU to 60 from 55 btw
 

shumway

League 2
29 August 2018
Ruhrpott
F95
I play mid-table/bottom teams as well. Düsseldorf and Mallorca in my 2 career saves. And I also like to play kick off mode with real match fixtures of the day. Also there I only play lower leagues fixtures, like League One/Two, Austria, Ireland etc. So it's not about the teams. I probably have to tinker with my personal beer slider to change my style of play, even if this shouldn't lower the amount of goals I concede...
 

rockstrongo

World Cup Winner
25 August 2006
Sweden
Hammarby
I play mid-table/bottom teams as well. Düsseldorf and Mallorca in my 2 career saves. And I also like to play kick off mode with real match fixtures of the day. Also there I only play lower leagues fixtures, like League One/Two, Austria, Ireland etc. So it's not about the teams. I probably have to tinker with my personal beer slider to change my style of play, even if this shouldn't lower the amount of goals I concede...
Defending is tricky as hell,I'd prefer the old defending instead of 1v1.
But for me it has added a element of toughness to it,one mistake and your gone.
I did check out some YT tutorials in defending last year when I played FIFA 20,I got beat 4/5/6 goals when I started,but after getting use to the system and learning the defending it became way easier.
Still have to be on my toes though.
Hope you get it sorted pal
 
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